DogFish

IMO, rferry makes some great points. Read closely.....there is a lot said in his post that are of extreme importance to any "boss" with the foremost being respect.

In the 5 years of Loria's reign of terror, we'll have gone through 3 managers (Torborg, McKeon, Girardi). All of whom were forced out. Beinfest was the one that had the biggest problems with Torborg and McKeon, not Loria. Not true at all. Did they always agree, NO, but the bottom line was it was time for them to go on to other things. In McKeon's case, I assume that he still is in contact with Loria, Beinfest on a regular basis.

The outcome of games would be the same!

Passion has been right on from the beginning. These guys have maintained their innocence from the beginning just no one believed them.

I agree. If anyone could scan the pics, it would be great. I am sure Admin, the mod, has an address. If not, he would know where to get it. dont forget the pre-addressed evelope.

I do think that Girardi was deceived. He expected to be taking over a winning ball club from Jack McKeon, but as it turns out, Jack left at the right time. I really also believe that the decision to destroy the team happened rather quickly, and has to have been a result of a power change in the Marlins' FO. It doesn't make any sense that Loria would change his strategy so suddenly if he was still in charge. Jack left one year too late, but IMO, Giradi was not deceived. Everyone knew, including many on this forum, that Lowell would try to be packaged together. Whether it was Burnette/Lowell during the summer or ?/Lowell in the off-season, it was going to have to be proven pitcher to force someone to take Lowell's contract. Just looking at this team, we all had a feeling that Lowell gone Enc gone Conine gone Jones gone AGon gone Mota gone and combine with lack of "D" at 1B, I was not surprised at this move either. This team is just going through a turnover like the Indians did a few years ago. This move will pay off for Loria

I agree. Loria trusted Jack too long. In 2004 and 2005, the Marlins had the talent to win the NL East, but underacheived significantly. We can also be thankful to Bill Robinson. To that point, as Jack had more influence on the coaching staff around him, the more lackadaisical team play became. Clubhouse energy was on the constant decline throughout 2004 and 2005. Jack didn't have the foresight to surround himself with youthful, energetic men that could balance his old and experienced ways. and I bet he tried but there were a lot of factors involved (money being just one of them). You really think he didnt want a Ozzie-like personality (Latin and energetic)?

There is a person behind all of those bunts and bad bullpen management! (lol)

Did some of his moves not work? OK 7 games Did some of his moves work? Ok lets say 3- 5 (-2) Sounds like your mom raised a Catholic "jackass" as well (Jack1)

Hey guys. It does not matter anymore. There is backstabbing everywhere. McKeon always seemed to have faith in both of them even though they struggled mightily (even to a fault as TSwift said about Beckett). These were the guys he had faith in. If they were the unnamed sources, then they should be ashamed. One of his faults was that he did trust the guys who were part of the 2003 with the notion that they knew how to win. This is a profession. People like the person but not always everything they do. Time will tell though. Younger blood with the coaching staff could help or could adversely affect the performance of some. I think David Hydes article says it the best...there are a lot more problems in the clubhouse with respect of the game than most people can imagine.

PB, They tried but were unsuccessful. They wanted an experienced, reputable Latino bench coach (Cookie Rojas). FYI, Hill, Robinson and Cox were all holdovers and not McKeon coaches.

Collectively as a team, over-rated Certain individuals - underperformed Overall though not sure expectations of 2004 were as great as 2005. We lost some talent in from 2003 team that could not replace.

he supposedly bench Enc before todays game for showing up late...

Today is the day. It is over! His days as Marlins manager are over but dont think for a minute, he will surface somewhere else on an interim basis...maybe even as early as next year.

Well so far, he fits in quite well.