October 15, 200421 yr all i gotta say is if he's going to leave, we better trade him so we can get something back.
October 15, 200421 yr I do not like the direction this team is going in whatsoever 592764[/snapback] same
October 15, 200421 yr HOW THE F*** DOES THIS STUFF GO PUBLIC?!?!?!?! Last winter everyone in the world knew we were going to trade or release Encarnacion and Redman!!! We got crap for Encarnacion and barely lucked out with Redman (then again, in retrospect of the LA and Arizona deals Beinfest may have undervalued Bill Murphy). WAY TO HURT YOUR LEVERAGE IN NEGOTIATIONS IDIOTS!!!! You know what really sucks about all this? Not the package we'll get back. Not the fact there's very very few lefty OF bats on the FA market. Or that it's the wrong year to add yet another infielder to the FA/trade market. Not that we're losing Mr. Marlin #2. Not that we're losing a player that ranks among the best at his position. Or that our offense just went from pitiful to abysmal. It's that next year LoDuca will be sitting behind the plate and Encarnacion in right for THREE MILLION MORE THAN LOWELL! F***ING USELESS PIECES OF CRAP! F***ING BEINFEST! F***ING LORIA! F***ING SAMSON! IF YOU'RE GOING TO GET RID OF YOUR SECOND BEST PLAYER ATLEAST DO SO TO CLEAR SALARY FOR BETTER PLAYERS!!! BUT NOOO YOU WANT TO KEEP JUAN ENCARNACION AND PAUL LODUCA!!!! ENCARNACION AND LODUCA?!?! WTF?!?!
October 15, 200421 yr loria is about ready to turn the marlins into montreal expos south. this is not good.
October 15, 200421 yr I'll say it again: IF LOWELL WAS GOING TO WALK ANYWAY, THEN THE FRONT OFFICE COULDN'T DO ANYTHING TO PREVENT THIS. This is not a leak which cuts the legs out of negotiations. This has the all the earmarks of full-scale spin, with the management trying to cover their butts for the loss of a popular player. I understand the anger, and I share it, but there are certain inevitabilities we have to face.
October 15, 200421 yr Don't jump to conclusions. We know Lowell met with management last week. Perhaps he expressed his desire to test the market. Perhaps we were going to lose him anyway. There's no reason to assume that the FO is hanging him out to dry. 592751[/snapback] If he did, he wouldn't have found a better contract. There's way too many quality infielders on the market for him to get as good of a contract. Short of Steinbrenner or Moreno falling in love with him, he would have been back for atleast one more year. This is not a salary dump. The payroll will remain the same, if not increase. Instead of Lowell at $8 million, we'll have LoDuca and Encarnacion for eleven to twelve million.
October 15, 200421 yr good rant rferry. If we dont get a Beltran or a Drew out of this Marlin nation has the right to be very suspicious and upset.
October 15, 200421 yr loria needs to get other partners in this or he'll be bankrupt and the marlins would have a 20 million dollar payroll by 2007.
October 15, 200421 yr loria needs to get other partners in this or he'll be bankrupt and the marlins would have a 20 million dollar payroll by 2007. 592853[/snapback] 99% of owners, regardless of the personal wealth, would already have the Marlins at a $20M payroll.
October 15, 200421 yr I do not like the direction this team is going in whatsoever 592764[/snapback] same 592788[/snapback] I gotta agree, this team isn't going in the right direction, ticket prices up, Lowell out? Chances of me getting season tickets are slowly dying. I might even go to less games this year than last.
October 15, 200421 yr HOW THE F*** DOES THIS STUFF GO PUBLIC?!?!?!?! Last winter everyone in the world knew we were going to trade or release Encarnacion and Redman!!! We got crap for Encarnacion and barely lucked out with Redman (then again, in retrospect of the LA and Arizona deals Beinfest may have undervalued Bill Murphy). WAY TO HURT YOUR LEVERAGE IN NEGOTIATIONS IDIOTS!!!! You know what really sucks about all this? Not the package we'll get back. Not the fact there's very very few lefty OF bats on the FA market. Or that it's the wrong year to add yet another infielder to the FA/trade market. Not that we're losing Mr. Marlin #2. Not that we're losing a player that ranks among the best at his position. Or that our offense just went from pitiful to abysmal. It's that next year LoDuca will be sitting behind the plate and Encarnacion in right for THREE MILLION MORE THAN LOWELL! F***ING USELESS PIECES OF CRAP! F***ING BEINFEST! F***ING LORIA! F***ING SAMSON! IF YOU'RE GOING TO GET RID OF YOUR SECOND BEST PLAYER ATLEAST DO SO TO CLEAR SALARY FOR BETTER PLAYERS!!! BUT NOOO YOU WANT TO KEEP JUAN ENCARNACION AND PAUL LODUCA!!!! ENCARNACION AND LODUCA?!?! WTF?!?! 592798[/snapback] I couldn't agree more.
October 15, 200421 yr "I think the entire issue here is that Lowell does not want to play next season on a one year deal if the stadium negotiations negate the last two years of the deal. He wants more financial security. The marlins probably do not want to extend him and that is the reason you are hearing rumblings from lowell's camp that he will test free agency." From my earlier post which was ignored.
October 15, 200421 yr HOW THE F*** DOES THIS STUFF GO PUBLIC?!?!?!?! Last winter everyone in the world knew we were going to trade or release Encarnacion and Redman!!! We got crap for Encarnacion and barely lucked out with Redman (then again, in retrospect of the LA and Arizona deals Beinfest may have undervalued Bill Murphy). WAY TO HURT YOUR LEVERAGE IN NEGOTIATIONS IDIOTS!!!! You know what really sucks about all this? Not the package we'll get back. Not the fact there's very very few lefty OF bats on the FA market. Or that it's the wrong year to add yet another infielder to the FA/trade market. Not that we're losing Mr. Marlin #2. Not that we're losing a player that ranks among the best at his position. Or that our offense just went from pitiful to abysmal. It's that next year LoDuca will be sitting behind the plate and Encarnacion in right for THREE MILLION MORE THAN LOWELL! F***ING USELESS PIECES OF CRAP! F***ING BEINFEST! F***ING LORIA! F***ING SAMSON! IF YOU'RE GOING TO GET RID OF YOUR SECOND BEST PLAYER ATLEAST DO SO TO CLEAR SALARY FOR BETTER PLAYERS!!! BUT NOOO YOU WANT TO KEEP JUAN ENCARNACION AND PAUL LODUCA!!!! ENCARNACION AND LODUCA?!?! WTF?!?! 592798[/snapback] Take a step back: Lo Duca doesn't have a contract for next year, his value is on par with what we got for Encarnacion/Lee/Redman last year, Encarnacion isn't someone we want to have, but can't get rid of, and Lowell is replaceable (in theory) because Cabrera plays third better than he plays left. So I guess you could say that if we get equal value in return, we're making a smart decision...but we know we can't get equal value in return because we can't afford it. My beef isn't trading Lowell, it's the fact that we're 100% committed to higher prices with a lower payroll and less competitive team. Face it, there's no way we get Drew or Delgado or Beltran, so our lineup is likely to include Aguila in left, possibly Wilson at second (I think Luis' days are numbered too, unfortunately), and likely Kensing/Small/Messenger/Bump as our 4 or 5 or both. Not to mention that this time last year Lowell could have been had for an arbitration offer (he wasn't a 6 year FA) and Pudge could have been retained, meaning an almost 100% guarantee we make the playoffs in 2004. I can't tell you how angry I am that we made Lowell our franchise player, now we're looking to dump him for payroll flexibility when there's little to no chance we keep Pavano, or get a left handed left fielder that we can afford and is effective. Can someone explain to me what the f*** our front office is thinking? Twice in two years we're going to dump franchise players, and get markedly worse in doing so. Write it down, by February, we're going to want Loria out of town like it's Montreal all over again.
October 15, 200421 yr "I think the entire issue here is that Lowell does not want to play next season on a one year deal if the stadium negotiations negate the last two years of the deal. He wants more financial security. The marlins probably do not want to extend him and that is the reason you are hearing rumblings from lowell's camp that he will test free agency." From my earlier post which was ignored. 592893[/snapback] The fact is, that this team is heading in the wrong direction and the Front Office putting this clause into Lowell's contract last offseason was a sign of things to come for this team. It's starting to look like it's not going to be a pretty offseason, and losing our 2nd best hitter would be a terrible way to start it.
October 15, 200421 yr Why do you take ever attempt to blast Loria for doing something many other owners would refuse to do: putting a competitive team out there at the expense of profits. Explain how trading Lowell means they're cutting payroll? If I remember Lee, Pudge, Redman, Encarnacion and others left last winter and by April payroll was higher than it was the previous October. More likely we'll have LoDuca behind the plate, Encarnacion and a Hollandsworth-type character in the outfield and an overpaid Pavano.
October 15, 200421 yr HOW THE F*** DOES THIS STUFF GO PUBLIC?!?!?!?! Last winter everyone in the world knew we were going to trade or release Encarnacion and Redman!!! We got crap for Encarnacion and barely lucked out with Redman (then again, in retrospect of the LA and Arizona deals Beinfest may have undervalued Bill Murphy). WAY TO HURT YOUR LEVERAGE IN NEGOTIATIONS IDIOTS!!!! You know what really sucks about all this? Not the package we'll get back. Not the fact there's very very few lefty OF bats on the FA market. Or that it's the wrong year to add yet another infielder to the FA/trade market. Not that we're losing Mr. Marlin #2. Not that we're losing a player that ranks among the best at his position. Or that our offense just went from pitiful to abysmal. It's that next year LoDuca will be sitting behind the plate and Encarnacion in right for THREE MILLION MORE THAN LOWELL! F***ING USELESS PIECES OF CRAP! F***ING BEINFEST! F***ING LORIA! F***ING SAMSON! IF YOU'RE GOING TO GET RID OF YOUR SECOND BEST PLAYER ATLEAST DO SO TO CLEAR SALARY FOR BETTER PLAYERS!!! BUT NOOO YOU WANT TO KEEP JUAN ENCARNACION AND PAUL LODUCA!!!! ENCARNACION AND LODUCA?!?! WTF?!?! 592798[/snapback] Take a step back: Lo Duca doesn't have a contract for next year, his value is on par with what we got for Encarnacion/Lee/Redman last year, Encarnacion isn't someone we want to have, but can't get rid of, and Lowell is replaceable (in theory) because Cabrera plays third better than he plays left. So I guess you could say that if we get equal value in return, we're making a smart decision...but we know we can't get equal value in return because we can't afford it. My beef isn't trading Lowell, it's the fact that we're 100% committed to higher prices with a lower payroll and less competitive team. Face it, there's no way we get Drew or Delgado or Beltran, so our lineup is likely to include Aguila in left, possibly Wilson at second (I think Luis' days are numbered too, unfortunately), and likely Kensing/Small/Messenger/Bump as our 4 or 5 or both. Not to mention that this time last year Lowell could have been had for an arbitration offer (he wasn't a 6 year FA) and Pudge could have been retained, meaning an almost 100% guarantee we make the playoffs in 2004. I can't tell you how angry I am that we made Lowell our franchise player, now we're looking to dump him for payroll flexibility when there's little to no chance we keep Pavano, or get a left handed left fielder that we can afford and is effective. Can someone explain to me what the f*** our front office is thinking? Twice in two years we're going to dump franchise players, and get markedly worse in doing so. Write it down, by February, we're going to want Loria out of town like it's Montreal all over again. 592895[/snapback] I agree for the most part, they had their priorities wrong. However, I'm not ready to call the FO as going on the wrong direction. I'll give them the benefit of the doubt for now. The priority is to make a Stadium deal happend and start building ASAP, I don't care if they have to cut payroll in half to make that happend.
October 15, 200421 yr Why do you take ever attempt to blast Loria for doing something many other owners would refuse to do: putting a competitive team out there at the expense of profits. Explain how trading Lowell means they're cutting payroll? If I remember Lee, Pudge, Redman, Encarnacion and others left last winter and by April payroll was higher than it was the previous October. 592907[/snapback] Wait a minute, Loria knew what he was getting into. The team had 8+ years of history when he took over, fan behaviour was known. If he wants to built a successful sports franchise in South Florida, he will have to invest and take loses for some time.
October 15, 200421 yr Why do you take ever attempt to blast Loria for doing something many other owners would refuse to do: putting a competitive team out there at the expense of profits. Explain how trading Lowell means they're cutting payroll? If I remember Lee, Pudge, Redman, Encarnacion and others left last winter and by April payroll was higher than it was the previous October. 592907[/snapback] Why does Loria give me a chance to blast him with every move? Lowell cannot be allowed to leave after we made him our franchise player. It's as simple as that. We're not talking ARod here, his contract is affordable for any team that wants to be competitive, it's not impeding our payroll, hell, he isn't even our highest paid player (Hampton). And if you really want to get nit picky about it, fine, Lowell's departure may mean that payroll stays stagnant, but it means we're less competitive this coming season.
October 15, 200421 yr Why do you take ever attempt to blast Loria for doing something many other owners would refuse to do: putting a competitive team out there at the expense of profits. Explain how trading Lowell means they're cutting payroll? If I remember Lee, Pudge, Redman, Encarnacion and others left last winter and by April payroll was higher than it was the previous October. 592907[/snapback] Wait a minute, Loria knew what he was getting into. The team had 8+ years of history when he took over, fan behaviour was known. If he wants to built a successful sports franchise in South Florida, he will have to invest and take loses for some time. 592912[/snapback] :notworthy
October 15, 200421 yr Why do you take ever attempt to blast Loria for doing something many other owners would refuse to do: putting a competitive team out there at the expense of profits. Explain how trading Lowell means they're cutting payroll? If I remember Lee, Pudge, Redman, Encarnacion and others left last winter and by April payroll was higher than it was the previous October. 592907[/snapback] Wait a minute, Loria knew what he was getting into. The team had 8+ years of history when he took over, fan behaviour was known. If he wants to built a successful sports franchise in South Florida, he will have to invest and take loses for some time. 592912[/snapback] Yep, and John Henry knew too. Where is he now? Where will Loria go? What about the next owner? Will he have the patience of Loria or Henry? What will his spending habits be? And what about the owner after that?
October 15, 200421 yr And if you really want to get nit picky about it, fine, Lowell's departure may mean that payroll stays stagnant, but it means we're less competitive this coming season. 592916[/snapback] So it's an issue of constructing a team and poor orgnizational philosophy, not Loria's unwillingness to spend money.
October 15, 200421 yr Get a stadium NOW or relocate this team to a place that can actually put people in the stands.
October 15, 200421 yr Get a stadium NOW or relocate this team to a place that can actually put people in the stands. 592940[/snapback] It's not the fans. It's not the city. It's the lease. P.S. That UM cheerleader to the right of your sig is short.
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