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Players we should trade


JPierre75sbs
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This thread needs to happen July 15thish when Maybin/Volstad/Gaby/Owens/Anibal are ready for the MLB team. Most of those guys will be useful to organizational purposes until then. We should only trade if its to get more value in return.

 

 

Obviously, that is what the ultimate goal is with anybody you trade. But the thing is they need to go. We have holes in 3rd and even at Catcher and way too many pitching prospects. Alot of these guys are taking up space and are already proven to us what they can do. We need to try something new and revamp as much as we can. We traded our core - so lets trade our mediocre guys please.

 

Of course for the best possible deal. Duh.

Well you don't just toss Jacobs, Mitre, Nolasco aside... those are more than capable players, and all 3 do have some upside to them too

 

and why is Kensing and Nestor in your mediocre pile?

 

you don't just toss players with good arms away

 

 

Nestor seems to be in demand somewhat and is not on any top prospect list.

Kensing was brought up too quick, is done as a starter and we have tons of pitching. He's not pitching like a high draft choice, which he was. He needs to be traded while he is still young and we can get some value back in return

 

Jacobs - I used to be ok with, but he's been given enough opportunities and he's proven to just be an injury risk. He doesn't feed off of our park and he can't defend well. He had the lowest OPS of all starting 1st basemen too. We know what his ceiling is - somewhere along the lines of .275 32 HR and a low OPS for such a high HR total. He is what he is. When he came from the Mets, I thought he was more (AVG and OPS wise) but he isn't. We need to see what we can get for him.

 

Mitre is a 4.50 ERA guy and there are plenty of those around.

 

Nolasco is a 4.10 ERA guy and just has that great curveball. He'd make a decent closer but thats not our plans with him here. He needs to go too.

Some of your reasoning is terrible.

 

Nestor is our best bullpen prospect right now. You normally don't see bullpen guys in top 10s to begin with. He's probably in the 2nd 10.

 

Kensing is a solid bullpen arm, there's just no reason to move him. You move guys like Miller and Gardner who pitched over their head.

 

We have no idea what Jacobs' ceiling is because he's been hurt each of his first 2 years. He's probably not worth much, but he can definitely be a guy to put up big numbers at 1b if he can just stay healthy. I have no clue what you think you can get for him though. Nothing worth much. Not only that, who do you want to play first? Hammer? Fine, who plays left then? It's not like Jake is blocking anyone.

 

so Mitre is a 4.50era guy, and there are plenty of those around. Who would want him then if they are so easy to get?

 

Ricky Nolasco has made 40 appearances in the league, how the hell do we know what kind of guy he is?

 

If there was a market, and people wanted these players and would give us something useful, then fine, move them. But their not, and they aren't making any money so for us, it works.

 

How is it terrible? We have tons of bullpen arms and that's not counting the arms we have as starters that will switch to the bullpen.

We do know what Jake's ceiling is. We know his numbers somewhat, and we've seen him for quite sometime now to see his raw abilities. At least I have.

 

We've seen what Ricky can do, and that's enough to sell me that he's not in our long term plans.

 

There are so many players in the MLB and these fit in the middle to maybe even upper middle in hierarchy. I'm sure we can get something at least equal in value.

 

We drafted, traded etc etc for pitching pitching pitching. Most of those pitchers are not top tier prospects anymore (just look where we rank in the BA prospect list overall). What ever happened to trading some of these pitchers for quality hitting? Isn't that partially the reason why we stacked up so much on pitching?

 

so now 2 seasons (Jake) and 1 season (Nolasco) are enough to make judgements on knowing exactly what these guys can do?

 

In all honesty, who do you think the Marlins can get for these players anyway? Certainly not a young catcher

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young guys are not made for the bench. Especially a guy like Andino who has been a starter all his life and thinks hes a badass. It takes a different ballplayer to be a good bench guy. It's a different ballgame being in the dugout.

You are not getting anything for Andino. He has more value to the Marlins to hopefully replace Amezaga next year.

 

Secondly, I understand you want a 3B but why do you want to start a young 3Bs arbitration clock in a non contending year by trading off all undervalued pieces. i.e. You want to move Nolasco when he's shown nothing for a year. Selling low is a terrible idea.

 

The best move for the Marlins is to wait and field the cheapest possible team. They should stopgap 3B for 2008 and then reassess the organizations pitching strength after the year. See how the MLB guys are doing. See how the MiLB guys are doing. See who looks like they are going to make it and who not. Then make a decision to bring someone in who can grow with the team along the same projection path as Hanley/Hermida/Maybin and all the pitchers. i.e. get an incredibly price affordable 3B for the 2010-2012 seasons. Setting off an arbitration clock now while trading your pitching is pretty pointless. This is also why Maybin should start in AA this season and at earliest be called up in July.

 

Don't worry. You'll get your trades. I expect the Marlins to move sometime in the next year Gregg/Uggla/Olsen/Mitre/Amezaga, maybe Cody, maybe one of Jacobs/Willingham, and if possible (if they somehow keep it up) Miller and Gardner. None of that is going to effect our longterm outlook and it will easily net all the remaining pieces this club needs. Just right now is a bad idea.

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This thread needs to happen July 15thish when Maybin/Volstad/Gaby/Owens/Anibal are ready for the MLB team. Most of those guys will be useful to organizational purposes until then. We should only trade if its to get more value in return.

 

 

Obviously, that is what the ultimate goal is with anybody you trade. But the thing is they need to go. We have holes in 3rd and even at Catcher and way too many pitching prospects. Alot of these guys are taking up space and are already proven to us what they can do. We need to try something new and revamp as much as we can. We traded our core - so lets trade our mediocre guys please.

 

Of course for the best possible deal. Duh.

Well you don't just toss Jacobs, Mitre, Nolasco aside... those are more than capable players, and all 3 do have some upside to them too

 

and why is Kensing and Nestor in your mediocre pile?

 

you don't just toss players with good arms away

 

 

Nestor seems to be in demand somewhat and is not on any top prospect list.

Kensing was brought up too quick, is done as a starter and we have tons of pitching. He's not pitching like a high draft choice, which he was. He needs to be traded while he is still young and we can get some value back in return

 

Jacobs - I used to be ok with, but he's been given enough opportunities and he's proven to just be an injury risk. He doesn't feed off of our park and he can't defend well. He had the lowest OPS of all starting 1st basemen too. We know what his ceiling is - somewhere along the lines of .275 32 HR and a low OPS for such a high HR total. He is what he is. When he came from the Mets, I thought he was more (AVG and OPS wise) but he isn't. We need to see what we can get for him.

 

Mitre is a 4.50 ERA guy and there are plenty of those around.

 

Nolasco is a 4.10 ERA guy and just has that great curveball. He'd make a decent closer but thats not our plans with him here. He needs to go too.

Some of your reasoning is terrible.

 

Nestor is our best bullpen prospect right now. You normally don't see bullpen guys in top 10s to begin with. He's probably in the 2nd 10.

 

Kensing is a solid bullpen arm, there's just no reason to move him. You move guys like Miller and Gardner who pitched over their head.

 

We have no idea what Jacobs' ceiling is because he's been hurt each of his first 2 years. He's probably not worth much, but he can definitely be a guy to put up big numbers at 1b if he can just stay healthy. I have no clue what you think you can get for him though. Nothing worth much. Not only that, who do you want to play first? Hammer? Fine, who plays left then? It's not like Jake is blocking anyone.

 

so Mitre is a 4.50era guy, and there are plenty of those around. Who would want him then if they are so easy to get?

 

Ricky Nolasco has made 40 appearances in the league, how the hell do we know what kind of guy he is?

 

If there was a market, and people wanted these players and would give us something useful, then fine, move them. But their not, and they aren't making any money so for us, it works.

 

How is it terrible? We have tons of bullpen arms and that's not counting the arms we have as starters that will switch to the bullpen.

We do know what Jake's ceiling is. We know his numbers somewhat, and we've seen him for quite sometime now to see his raw abilities. At least I have.

 

We've seen what Ricky can do, and that's enough to sell me that he's not in our long term plans.

 

There are so many players in the MLB and these fit in the middle to maybe even upper middle in hierarchy. I'm sure we can get something at least equal in value.

 

We drafted, traded etc etc for pitching pitching pitching. Most of those pitchers are not top tier prospects anymore (just look where we rank in the BA prospect list overall). What ever happened to trading some of these pitchers for quality hitting? Isn't that partially the reason why we stacked up so much on pitching?

 

so now 2 seasons (Jake) and 1 season (Nolasco) are enough to make judgements on knowing exactly what these guys can do?

 

In all honesty, who do you think the Marlins can get for these players anyway? Certainly not a young catcher

 

You don't think the way a player hits the ball, runs, fields, etc is good enough to make judgements? I didn't say Jake would suck ass. I said we know what he can do already. Around 32 HRs, .275 and a low OPS for his high HR total. I didn't say he's worth nothing. I'm just not satisfied with those types of numbers.

 

I think if you package these guys along with others like greg and a nestor, you can definitely net something of value. A young 3rd baseman shouldn't be a problem. Or hell, even younger pitchers that are top 50 prospects in BA, since the highest we have is only 39 right now. It isn't that far off of a reach.

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young guys are not made for the bench. Especially a guy like Andino who has been a starter all his life and thinks hes a badass. It takes a different ballplayer to be a good bench guy. It's a different ballgame being in the dugout.

You are not getting anything for Andino. He has more value to the Marlins to hopefully replace Amezaga next year.

 

Secondly, I understand you want a 3B but why do you want to start a young 3Bs arbitration clock in a non contending year by trading off all undervalued pieces. i.e. You want to move Nolasco when he's shown nothing for a year. Selling low is a terrible idea.

 

The best move for the Marlins is to wait and field the cheapest possible team. They should stopgap 3B for 2008 and then reassess the organizations pitching strength after the year. See how the MLB guys are doing. See how the MiLB guys are doing. See who looks like they are going to make it and who not. Then make a decision to bring someone in who can grow with the team along the same projection path as Hanley/Hermida/Maybin and all the pitchers. i.e. get an incredibly price affordable 3B for the 2010-2012 seasons. Setting off an arbitration clock now while trading your pitching is pretty pointless. This is also why Maybin should start in AA this season and at earliest be called up in July.

 

Don't worry. You'll get your trades. I expect the Marlins to move sometime in the next year Gregg/Uggla/Olsen/Mitre/Amezaga, maybe Cody, maybe one of Jacobs/Willingham, and if possible (if they somehow keep it up) Miller and Gardner. None of that is going to effect our longterm outlook and it will easily net all the remaining pieces this club needs. Just right now is a bad idea.

 

 

How is trading Miller and Gardner a bad idea right now? And since when do you start a players arbitration clock when the team is competitive? There are no certainties that Maybin will excel right away. That's why this year is a rebuilding year. Let players suck now as opposed to later.

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I love Coghlan as a prospect, but I don't know what he's done so far to warrant himself a spot as our starting 2B post-Uggla. He's only one year younger than Andino, and Andino just put up a nice season in AAA, coupled with a decent showing in limited action once he got called up. Coghlan's A ball numbers were impressive, but after getting promoted to A+ ball, they were quite similar to Andino's A+ stats. Trading Andino would be asinine.

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I love Coghlan as a prospect, but I don't know what he's done so far to warrant himself a spot as our starting 2B post-Uggla. He's only one year younger than Andino, and Andino just put up a nice season in AAA, coupled with a decent showing in limited action once he got called up. Coghlan's A ball numbers were impressive, but after getting promoted to A+ ball, they were quite similar to Andino's A+ stats. Trading Andino would be asinine.

 

 

lol @ trading Andino would be asinine.

 

Anyways, AAA in the Marlins organization is for mediocre starting pitching and old bullpen guys. AA is where our talent is. AAA holds very little value in this organization.

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young guys are not made for the bench. Especially a guy like Andino who has been a starter all his life and thinks hes a badass. It takes a different ballplayer to be a good bench guy. It's a different ballgame being in the dugout.

You are not getting anything for Andino. He has more value to the Marlins to hopefully replace Amezaga next year.

 

Secondly, I understand you want a 3B but why do you want to start a young 3Bs arbitration clock in a non contending year by trading off all undervalued pieces. i.e. You want to move Nolasco when he's shown nothing for a year. Selling low is a terrible idea.

 

The best move for the Marlins is to wait and field the cheapest possible team. They should stopgap 3B for 2008 and then reassess the organizations pitching strength after the year. See how the MLB guys are doing. See how the MiLB guys are doing. See who looks like they are going to make it and who not. Then make a decision to bring someone in who can grow with the team along the same projection path as Hanley/Hermida/Maybin and all the pitchers. i.e. get an incredibly price affordable 3B for the 2010-2012 seasons. Setting off an arbitration clock now while trading your pitching is pretty pointless. This is also why Maybin should start in AA this season and at earliest be called up in July.

 

Don't worry. You'll get your trades. I expect the Marlins to move sometime in the next year Gregg/Uggla/Olsen/Mitre/Amezaga, maybe Cody, maybe one of Jacobs/Willingham, and if possible (if they somehow keep it up) Miller and Gardner. None of that is going to effect our longterm outlook and it will easily net all the remaining pieces this club needs. Just right now is a bad idea.

 

 

How is trading Miller and Gardner a bad idea right now? And since when do you start a players arbitration clock when the team is competitive? There are no certainties that Maybin will excel right away. That's why this year is a rebuilding year. Let players suck now as opposed to later.

maybin doesnt have as many proffessional at bats where you would want him to make the jump to the majors. its like drafting someone out of high school and saying were going to start you today against josh beckett. you don't want to put the guy in a situation where if he fails horribly he could regress as a ballplayer and take years to make it back to where he was. i didnt notice it but i'm sure someone will mention the tools-stats issue that a guy with tools has the ability to succeed in the majors like hanley did but you cant look at that without looking at the 100s of abercrombies for each hanley and unlike maybin hanley had gotten some abs in the minors

 

as for miller and gardner sell high as in right now

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I love Coghlan as a prospect, but I don't know what he's done so far to warrant himself a spot as our starting 2B post-Uggla. He's only one year younger than Andino, and Andino just put up a nice season in AAA, coupled with a decent showing in limited action once he got called up. Coghlan's A ball numbers were impressive, but after getting promoted to A+ ball, they were quite similar to Andino's A+ stats. Trading Andino would be asinine.

 

 

lol @ trading Andino would be asinine.

 

Anyways, AAA in the Marlins organization is for mediocre starting pitching and old bullpen guys. AA is where our talent is. AAA holds very little value in this organization.

 

Well, there's no real reason for trading him. He's right, Andino is more valuable here than anywhere else. BUT, I also think he's one of if not the most expendable prospect(s) we have.

 

And MarlinsLou, fantastic post above. Very well said.

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young guys are not made for the bench. Especially a guy like Andino who has been a starter all his life and thinks hes a badass. It takes a different ballplayer to be a good bench guy. It's a different ballgame being in the dugout.

You are not getting anything for Andino. He has more value to the Marlins to hopefully replace Amezaga next year.

 

Secondly, I understand you want a 3B but why do you want to start a young 3Bs arbitration clock in a non contending year by trading off all undervalued pieces. i.e. You want to move Nolasco when he's shown nothing for a year. Selling low is a terrible idea.

 

The best move for the Marlins is to wait and field the cheapest possible team. They should stopgap 3B for 2008 and then reassess the organizations pitching strength after the year. See how the MLB guys are doing. See how the MiLB guys are doing. See who looks like they are going to make it and who not. Then make a decision to bring someone in who can grow with the team along the same projection path as Hanley/Hermida/Maybin and all the pitchers. i.e. get an incredibly price affordable 3B for the 2010-2012 seasons. Setting off an arbitration clock now while trading your pitching is pretty pointless. This is also why Maybin should start in AA this season and at earliest be called up in July.

 

Don't worry. You'll get your trades. I expect the Marlins to move sometime in the next year Gregg/Uggla/Olsen/Mitre/Amezaga, maybe Cody, maybe one of Jacobs/Willingham, and if possible (if they somehow keep it up) Miller and Gardner. None of that is going to effect our longterm outlook and it will easily net all the remaining pieces this club needs. Just right now is a bad idea.

 

 

How is trading Miller and Gardner a bad idea right now? And since when do you start a players arbitration clock when the team is competitive? There are no certainties that Maybin will excel right away. That's why this year is a rebuilding year. Let players suck now as opposed to later.

maybin doesnt have as many proffessional at bats where you would want him to make the jump to the majors. its like drafting someone out of high school and saying were going to start you today against josh beckett. you don't want to put the guy in a situation where if he fails horribly he could regress as a ballplayer and take years to make it back to where he was. i didnt notice it but i'm sure someone will mention the tools-stats issue that a guy with tools has the ability to succeed in the majors like hanley did but you cant look at that without looking at the 100s of abercrombies for each hanley and unlike maybin hanley had gotten some abs in the minors

 

as for miller and gardner sell high as in right now

 

 

I agree up to a certain extent, but the truth is we got Maybin for this yr one way or the other. Maybe we bring him up in May or maybe right away, but he is our starting CF this season.

 

And don't ever bring up Abercombie with Hanley's or Maybin's name in the same sentence ever in your life again.

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young guys are not made for the bench. Especially a guy like Andino who has been a starter all his life and thinks hes a badass. It takes a different ballplayer to be a good bench guy. It's a different ballgame being in the dugout.

You are not getting anything for Andino. He has more value to the Marlins to hopefully replace Amezaga next year.

 

Secondly, I understand you want a 3B but why do you want to start a young 3Bs arbitration clock in a non contending year by trading off all undervalued pieces. i.e. You want to move Nolasco when he's shown nothing for a year. Selling low is a terrible idea.

 

The best move for the Marlins is to wait and field the cheapest possible team. They should stopgap 3B for 2008 and then reassess the organizations pitching strength after the year. See how the MLB guys are doing. See how the MiLB guys are doing. See who looks like they are going to make it and who not. Then make a decision to bring someone in who can grow with the team along the same projection path as Hanley/Hermida/Maybin and all the pitchers. i.e. get an incredibly price affordable 3B for the 2010-2012 seasons. Setting off an arbitration clock now while trading your pitching is pretty pointless. This is also why Maybin should start in AA this season and at earliest be called up in July.

 

Don't worry. You'll get your trades. I expect the Marlins to move sometime in the next year Gregg/Uggla/Olsen/Mitre/Amezaga, maybe Cody, maybe one of Jacobs/Willingham, and if possible (if they somehow keep it up) Miller and Gardner. None of that is going to effect our longterm outlook and it will easily net all the remaining pieces this club needs. Just right now is a bad idea.

 

 

How is trading Miller and Gardner a bad idea right now? And since when do you start a players arbitration clock when the team is competitive? There are no certainties that Maybin will excel right away. That's why this year is a rebuilding year. Let players suck now as opposed to later.

maybin doesnt have as many proffessional at bats where you would want him to make the jump to the majors. its like drafting someone out of high school and saying were going to start you today against josh beckett. you don't want to put the guy in a situation where if he fails horribly he could regress as a ballplayer and take years to make it back to where he was. i didnt notice it but i'm sure someone will mention the tools-stats issue that a guy with tools has the ability to succeed in the majors like hanley did but you cant look at that without looking at the 100s of abercrombies for each hanley and unlike maybin hanley had gotten some abs in the minors

 

as for miller and gardner sell high as in right now

don't ever bring up Abercombie with Hanley's or Maybin's name in the same sentence ever in your life again.

 

 

His intentions were right. I mean, how many guys are out there with five tools like these guys that fail opposed to succeeding?

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young guys are not made for the bench. Especially a guy like Andino who has been a starter all his life and thinks hes a badass. It takes a different ballplayer to be a good bench guy. It's a different ballgame being in the dugout.

You are not getting anything for Andino. He has more value to the Marlins to hopefully replace Amezaga next year.

 

Secondly, I understand you want a 3B but why do you want to start a young 3Bs arbitration clock in a non contending year by trading off all undervalued pieces. i.e. You want to move Nolasco when he's shown nothing for a year. Selling low is a terrible idea.

 

The best move for the Marlins is to wait and field the cheapest possible team. They should stopgap 3B for 2008 and then reassess the organizations pitching strength after the year. See how the MLB guys are doing. See how the MiLB guys are doing. See who looks like they are going to make it and who not. Then make a decision to bring someone in who can grow with the team along the same projection path as Hanley/Hermida/Maybin and all the pitchers. i.e. get an incredibly price affordable 3B for the 2010-2012 seasons. Setting off an arbitration clock now while trading your pitching is pretty pointless. This is also why Maybin should start in AA this season and at earliest be called up in July.

 

Don't worry. You'll get your trades. I expect the Marlins to move sometime in the next year Gregg/Uggla/Olsen/Mitre/Amezaga, maybe Cody, maybe one of Jacobs/Willingham, and if possible (if they somehow keep it up) Miller and Gardner. None of that is going to effect our longterm outlook and it will easily net all the remaining pieces this club needs. Just right now is a bad idea.

 

 

How is trading Miller and Gardner a bad idea right now? And since when do you start a players arbitration clock when the team is competitive? There are no certainties that Maybin will excel right away. That's why this year is a rebuilding year. Let players suck now as opposed to later.

maybin doesnt have as many proffessional at bats where you would want him to make the jump to the majors. its like drafting someone out of high school and saying were going to start you today against josh beckett. you don't want to put the guy in a situation where if he fails horribly he could regress as a ballplayer and take years to make it back to where he was. i didnt notice it but i'm sure someone will mention the tools-stats issue that a guy with tools has the ability to succeed in the majors like hanley did but you cant look at that without looking at the 100s of abercrombies for each hanley and unlike maybin hanley had gotten some abs in the minors

 

as for miller and gardner sell high as in right now

mentioning Maybin in the same breath as Reggie makes me sad

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young guys are not made for the bench. Especially a guy like Andino who has been a starter all his life and thinks hes a badass. It takes a different ballplayer to be a good bench guy. It's a different ballgame being in the dugout.

You are not getting anything for Andino. He has more value to the Marlins to hopefully replace Amezaga next year.

 

Secondly, I understand you want a 3B but why do you want to start a young 3Bs arbitration clock in a non contending year by trading off all undervalued pieces. i.e. You want to move Nolasco when he's shown nothing for a year. Selling low is a terrible idea.

 

The best move for the Marlins is to wait and field the cheapest possible team. They should stopgap 3B for 2008 and then reassess the organizations pitching strength after the year. See how the MLB guys are doing. See how the MiLB guys are doing. See who looks like they are going to make it and who not. Then make a decision to bring someone in who can grow with the team along the same projection path as Hanley/Hermida/Maybin and all the pitchers. i.e. get an incredibly price affordable 3B for the 2010-2012 seasons. Setting off an arbitration clock now while trading your pitching is pretty pointless. This is also why Maybin should start in AA this season and at earliest be called up in July.

 

Don't worry. You'll get your trades. I expect the Marlins to move sometime in the next year Gregg/Uggla/Olsen/Mitre/Amezaga, maybe Cody, maybe one of Jacobs/Willingham, and if possible (if they somehow keep it up) Miller and Gardner. None of that is going to effect our longterm outlook and it will easily net all the remaining pieces this club needs. Just right now is a bad idea.

 

 

How is trading Miller and Gardner a bad idea right now? And since when do you start a players arbitration clock when the team is competitive? There are no certainties that Maybin will excel right away. That's why this year is a rebuilding year. Let players suck now as opposed to later.

maybin doesnt have as many proffessional at bats where you would want him to make the jump to the majors. its like drafting someone out of high school and saying were going to start you today against josh beckett. you don't want to put the guy in a situation where if he fails horribly he could regress as a ballplayer and take years to make it back to where he was. i didnt notice it but i'm sure someone will mention the tools-stats issue that a guy with tools has the ability to succeed in the majors like hanley did but you cant look at that without looking at the 100s of abercrombies for each hanley and unlike maybin hanley had gotten some abs in the minors

 

as for miller and gardner sell high as in right now

don't ever bring up Abercombie with Hanley's or Maybin's name in the same sentence ever in your life again.

 

 

His intentions were right. I mean, how many guys are out there with five tools like these guys that fail opposed to succeeding?

how many of them dominated A ball like he did, and was so well thought of that Detroit brought him up at age 20?

 

there is no comparison

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young guys are not made for the bench. Especially a guy like Andino who has been a starter all his life and thinks hes a badass. It takes a different ballplayer to be a good bench guy. It's a different ballgame being in the dugout.

You are not getting anything for Andino. He has more value to the Marlins to hopefully replace Amezaga next year.

 

Secondly, I understand you want a 3B but why do you want to start a young 3Bs arbitration clock in a non contending year by trading off all undervalued pieces. i.e. You want to move Nolasco when he's shown nothing for a year. Selling low is a terrible idea.

 

The best move for the Marlins is to wait and field the cheapest possible team. They should stopgap 3B for 2008 and then reassess the organizations pitching strength after the year. See how the MLB guys are doing. See how the MiLB guys are doing. See who looks like they are going to make it and who not. Then make a decision to bring someone in who can grow with the team along the same projection path as Hanley/Hermida/Maybin and all the pitchers. i.e. get an incredibly price affordable 3B for the 2010-2012 seasons. Setting off an arbitration clock now while trading your pitching is pretty pointless. This is also why Maybin should start in AA this season and at earliest be called up in July.

 

Don't worry. You'll get your trades. I expect the Marlins to move sometime in the next year Gregg/Uggla/Olsen/Mitre/Amezaga, maybe Cody, maybe one of Jacobs/Willingham, and if possible (if they somehow keep it up) Miller and Gardner. None of that is going to effect our longterm outlook and it will easily net all the remaining pieces this club needs. Just right now is a bad idea.

 

 

How is trading Miller and Gardner a bad idea right now? And since when do you start a players arbitration clock when the team is competitive? There are no certainties that Maybin will excel right away. That's why this year is a rebuilding year. Let players suck now as opposed to later.

maybin doesnt have as many proffessional at bats where you would want him to make the jump to the majors. its like drafting someone out of high school and saying were going to start you today against josh beckett. you don't want to put the guy in a situation where if he fails horribly he could regress as a ballplayer and take years to make it back to where he was. i didnt notice it but i'm sure someone will mention the tools-stats issue that a guy with tools has the ability to succeed in the majors like hanley did but you cant look at that without looking at the 100s of abercrombies for each hanley and unlike maybin hanley had gotten some abs in the minors

 

as for miller and gardner sell high as in right now

don't ever bring up Abercombie with Hanley's or Maybin's name in the same sentence ever in your life again.

 

 

His intentions were right. I mean, how many guys are out there with five tools like these guys that fail opposed to succeeding?

how many of them dominated A ball like he did, and was so well thought of that Detroit brought him up at age 20?

 

there is no comparison

 

Are you lacking reading comprehension? I never said anything about comparing Reggie Ambercromsuck and Maybin... Maybin is Miguel Cabrera stuck in Hanley Ramirez's body.

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young guys are not made for the bench. Especially a guy like Andino who has been a starter all his life and thinks hes a badass. It takes a different ballplayer to be a good bench guy. It's a different ballgame being in the dugout.

You are not getting anything for Andino. He has more value to the Marlins to hopefully replace Amezaga next year.

 

Secondly, I understand you want a 3B but why do you want to start a young 3Bs arbitration clock in a non contending year by trading off all undervalued pieces. i.e. You want to move Nolasco when he's shown nothing for a year. Selling low is a terrible idea.

 

The best move for the Marlins is to wait and field the cheapest possible team. They should stopgap 3B for 2008 and then reassess the organizations pitching strength after the year. See how the MLB guys are doing. See how the MiLB guys are doing. See who looks like they are going to make it and who not. Then make a decision to bring someone in who can grow with the team along the same projection path as Hanley/Hermida/Maybin and all the pitchers. i.e. get an incredibly price affordable 3B for the 2010-2012 seasons. Setting off an arbitration clock now while trading your pitching is pretty pointless. This is also why Maybin should start in AA this season and at earliest be called up in July.

 

Don't worry. You'll get your trades. I expect the Marlins to move sometime in the next year Gregg/Uggla/Olsen/Mitre/Amezaga, maybe Cody, maybe one of Jacobs/Willingham, and if possible (if they somehow keep it up) Miller and Gardner. None of that is going to effect our longterm outlook and it will easily net all the remaining pieces this club needs. Just right now is a bad idea.

 

 

How is trading Miller and Gardner a bad idea right now? And since when do you start a players arbitration clock when the team is competitive? There are no certainties that Maybin will excel right away. That's why this year is a rebuilding year. Let players suck now as opposed to later.

maybin doesnt have as many proffessional at bats where you would want him to make the jump to the majors. its like drafting someone out of high school and saying were going to start you today against josh beckett. you don't want to put the guy in a situation where if he fails horribly he could regress as a ballplayer and take years to make it back to where he was. i didnt notice it but i'm sure someone will mention the tools-stats issue that a guy with tools has the ability to succeed in the majors like hanley did but you cant look at that without looking at the 100s of abercrombies for each hanley and unlike maybin hanley had gotten some abs in the minors

 

as for miller and gardner sell high as in right now

don't ever bring up Abercombie with Hanley's or Maybin's name in the same sentence ever in your life again.

 

 

His intentions were right. I mean, how many guys are out there with five tools like these guys that fail opposed to succeeding?

how many of them dominated A ball like he did, and was so well thought of that Detroit brought him up at age 20?

 

there is no comparison

 

Are you lacking reading comprehension? I never said anything about comparing Reggie Ambercromsuck and Maybin... Maybin is Miguel Cabrera stuck in Hanley Ramirez's body.

 

Find somebody else with 5 tools to compare him with...

 

like Ken Griffey Jr.

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young guys are not made for the bench. Especially a guy like Andino who has been a starter all his life and thinks hes a badass. It takes a different ballplayer to be a good bench guy. It's a different ballgame being in the dugout.

You are not getting anything for Andino. He has more value to the Marlins to hopefully replace Amezaga next year.

 

Secondly, I understand you want a 3B but why do you want to start a young 3Bs arbitration clock in a non contending year by trading off all undervalued pieces. i.e. You want to move Nolasco when he's shown nothing for a year. Selling low is a terrible idea.

 

The best move for the Marlins is to wait and field the cheapest possible team. They should stopgap 3B for 2008 and then reassess the organizations pitching strength after the year. See how the MLB guys are doing. See how the MiLB guys are doing. See who looks like they are going to make it and who not. Then make a decision to bring someone in who can grow with the team along the same projection path as Hanley/Hermida/Maybin and all the pitchers. i.e. get an incredibly price affordable 3B for the 2010-2012 seasons. Setting off an arbitration clock now while trading your pitching is pretty pointless. This is also why Maybin should start in AA this season and at earliest be called up in July.

 

Don't worry. You'll get your trades. I expect the Marlins to move sometime in the next year Gregg/Uggla/Olsen/Mitre/Amezaga, maybe Cody, maybe one of Jacobs/Willingham, and if possible (if they somehow keep it up) Miller and Gardner. None of that is going to effect our longterm outlook and it will easily net all the remaining pieces this club needs. Just right now is a bad idea.

How is trading Miller and Gardner a bad idea right now? And since when do you start a players arbitration clock when the team is competitive? There are no certainties that Maybin will excel right away. That's why this year is a rebuilding year. Let players suck now as opposed to later.

Because no one will give you anything for Miller or Gardner because they were taken off the scrap heap and are not proven. If they survive to July that would be amazing. It's not that they shouldn't sell high. It's more of they can't sell high. Those two are destined for June trades if they can last a bit longer. It's important to remember baseball isn't your playstation in this regard.

 

Secondly, you obviously don't understand a timeline approach of creating a team that will peak at the same time so your second thought is irrelevant. This isn't a knock on your intelligence. You are just overly excited to make moves now after the huge trade versus looking at the big picture. Getting a solid young 3B now threatens other players arbitration down the road. Also they just don't flat out need a young 3B right now and especially not at the expense of trading a significant piece to get one. By all means try to buy low on Andy Marte but that's about it. The best move is to wait for all the pitching to get MLB ready - then decide what to do with all of it. Which is a fantastic problem I'm looking forward too. Because that's when we'll get the third basemen and the catcher.

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young guys are not made for the bench. Especially a guy like Andino who has been a starter all his life and thinks hes a badass. It takes a different ballplayer to be a good bench guy. It's a different ballgame being in the dugout.

You are not getting anything for Andino. He has more value to the Marlins to hopefully replace Amezaga next year.

 

Secondly, I understand you want a 3B but why do you want to start a young 3Bs arbitration clock in a non contending year by trading off all undervalued pieces. i.e. You want to move Nolasco when he's shown nothing for a year. Selling low is a terrible idea.

 

The best move for the Marlins is to wait and field the cheapest possible team. They should stopgap 3B for 2008 and then reassess the organizations pitching strength after the year. See how the MLB guys are doing. See how the MiLB guys are doing. See who looks like they are going to make it and who not. Then make a decision to bring someone in who can grow with the team along the same projection path as Hanley/Hermida/Maybin and all the pitchers. i.e. get an incredibly price affordable 3B for the 2010-2012 seasons. Setting off an arbitration clock now while trading your pitching is pretty pointless. This is also why Maybin should start in AA this season and at earliest be called up in July.

 

Don't worry. You'll get your trades. I expect the Marlins to move sometime in the next year Gregg/Uggla/Olsen/Mitre/Amezaga, maybe Cody, maybe one of Jacobs/Willingham, and if possible (if they somehow keep it up) Miller and Gardner. None of that is going to effect our longterm outlook and it will easily net all the remaining pieces this club needs. Just right now is a bad idea.

How is trading Miller and Gardner a bad idea right now? And since when do you start a players arbitration clock when the team is competitive? There are no certainties that Maybin will excel right away. That's why this year is a rebuilding year. Let players suck now as opposed to later.

Because no one will give you anything for Miller or Gardner because they were taken off the scrap heap and are not proven. If they survive to July that would be amazing. It's not that they shouldn't sell high. It's more of they can't sell high. Those two are destined for June trades if they can last a bit longer. It's important to remember baseball isn't your playstation in this regard.

 

Secondly, you obviously don't understand a timeline approach of creating a team that will peak at the same time so your second thought is irrelevant. This isn't a knock on your intelligence. You are just overly excited to make moves now after the huge trade versus looking at the big picture. Getting a solid young 3B now threatens other players arbitration down the road. Also they just don't flat out need a young 3B right now and especially not at the expense of trading a significant piece to get one. By all means try to buy low on Andy Marte but that's about it. The best move is to wait for all the pitching to get MLB ready - then decide what to do with all of it. Which is a fantastic problem I'm looking forward too. Because that's when we'll get the third basemen and the catcher.

 

 

None of our Minor league prospects are sexy like an Andrew Miller. That's not a good thing.

 

I think you're the one that doesn't understand the arbitration thing??? Creating a team that will peak at the same time?? They're all more or less the same age? We're already doing this. Holding back a player during a rebuilding year when we have lesser options is rather dumb don't you think?

 

This timeline approach won't save you much with Maybin. He should get a significant amount of PT this season, one way or another. We went through this in '98 and '06. You're putting too much thought into arbitration for a rookie player right now.

 

 

About Gardner and Miller - we have no choice really. This is the highest they will be at. That's the point. Whether it get's us alot or a little - it should get us something, and that's what matters.

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young guys are not made for the bench. Especially a guy like Andino who has been a starter all his life and thinks hes a badass. It takes a different ballplayer to be a good bench guy. It's a different ballgame being in the dugout.

You are not getting anything for Andino. He has more value to the Marlins to hopefully replace Amezaga next year.

 

Secondly, I understand you want a 3B but why do you want to start a young 3Bs arbitration clock in a non contending year by trading off all undervalued pieces. i.e. You want to move Nolasco when he's shown nothing for a year. Selling low is a terrible idea.

 

The best move for the Marlins is to wait and field the cheapest possible team. They should stopgap 3B for 2008 and then reassess the organizations pitching strength after the year. See how the MLB guys are doing. See how the MiLB guys are doing. See who looks like they are going to make it and who not. Then make a decision to bring someone in who can grow with the team along the same projection path as Hanley/Hermida/Maybin and all the pitchers. i.e. get an incredibly price affordable 3B for the 2010-2012 seasons. Setting off an arbitration clock now while trading your pitching is pretty pointless. This is also why Maybin should start in AA this season and at earliest be called up in July.

 

Don't worry. You'll get your trades. I expect the Marlins to move sometime in the next year Gregg/Uggla/Olsen/Mitre/Amezaga, maybe Cody, maybe one of Jacobs/Willingham, and if possible (if they somehow keep it up) Miller and Gardner. None of that is going to effect our longterm outlook and it will easily net all the remaining pieces this club needs. Just right now is a bad idea.

 

 

How is trading Miller and Gardner a bad idea right now? And since when do you start a players arbitration clock when the team is competitive? There are no certainties that Maybin will excel right away. That's why this year is a rebuilding year. Let players suck now as opposed to later.

maybin doesnt have as many proffessional at bats where you would want him to make the jump to the majors. its like drafting someone out of high school and saying were going to start you today against josh beckett. you don't want to put the guy in a situation where if he fails horribly he could regress as a ballplayer and take years to make it back to where he was. i didnt notice it but i'm sure someone will mention the tools-stats issue that a guy with tools has the ability to succeed in the majors like hanley did but you cant look at that without looking at the 100s of abercrombies for each hanley and unlike maybin hanley had gotten some abs in the minors

 

as for miller and gardner sell high as in right now

don't ever bring up Abercombie with Hanley's or Maybin's name in the same sentence ever in your life again.

 

 

His intentions were right. I mean, how many guys are out there with five tools like these guys that fail opposed to succeeding?

how many of them dominated A ball like he did, and was so well thought of that Detroit brought him up at age 20?

 

there is no comparison

 

Are you lacking reading comprehension? I never said anything about comparing Reggie Ambercromsuck and Maybin... Maybin is Miguel Cabrera stuck in Hanley Ramirez's body.

He most certainly is not Miguel Cabrera either

 

stop with these silly comparisons

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young guys are not made for the bench. Especially a guy like Andino who has been a starter all his life and thinks hes a badass. It takes a different ballplayer to be a good bench guy. It's a different ballgame being in the dugout.

You are not getting anything for Andino. He has more value to the Marlins to hopefully replace Amezaga next year.

 

Secondly, I understand you want a 3B but why do you want to start a young 3Bs arbitration clock in a non contending year by trading off all undervalued pieces. i.e. You want to move Nolasco when he's shown nothing for a year. Selling low is a terrible idea.

 

The best move for the Marlins is to wait and field the cheapest possible team. They should stopgap 3B for 2008 and then reassess the organizations pitching strength after the year. See how the MLB guys are doing. See how the MiLB guys are doing. See who looks like they are going to make it and who not. Then make a decision to bring someone in who can grow with the team along the same projection path as Hanley/Hermida/Maybin and all the pitchers. i.e. get an incredibly price affordable 3B for the 2010-2012 seasons. Setting off an arbitration clock now while trading your pitching is pretty pointless. This is also why Maybin should start in AA this season and at earliest be called up in July.

 

Don't worry. You'll get your trades. I expect the Marlins to move sometime in the next year Gregg/Uggla/Olsen/Mitre/Amezaga, maybe Cody, maybe one of Jacobs/Willingham, and if possible (if they somehow keep it up) Miller and Gardner. None of that is going to effect our longterm outlook and it will easily net all the remaining pieces this club needs. Just right now is a bad idea.

 

 

How is trading Miller and Gardner a bad idea right now? And since when do you start a players arbitration clock when the team is competitive? There are no certainties that Maybin will excel right away. That's why this year is a rebuilding year. Let players suck now as opposed to later.

maybin doesnt have as many proffessional at bats where you would want him to make the jump to the majors. its like drafting someone out of high school and saying were going to start you today against josh beckett. you don't want to put the guy in a situation where if he fails horribly he could regress as a ballplayer and take years to make it back to where he was. i didnt notice it but i'm sure someone will mention the tools-stats issue that a guy with tools has the ability to succeed in the majors like hanley did but you cant look at that without looking at the 100s of abercrombies for each hanley and unlike maybin hanley had gotten some abs in the minors

 

as for miller and gardner sell high as in right now

don't ever bring up Abercombie with Hanley's or Maybin's name in the same sentence ever in your life again.

 

 

His intentions were right. I mean, how many guys are out there with five tools like these guys that fail opposed to succeeding?

how many of them dominated A ball like he did, and was so well thought of that Detroit brought him up at age 20?

 

there is no comparison

 

Are you lacking reading comprehension? I never said anything about comparing Reggie Ambercromsuck and Maybin... Maybin is Miguel Cabrera stuck in Hanley Ramirez's body.

He most certainly is not Miguel Cabrera either

 

stop with these silly comparisons

 

By that comparison I meant being ready to be a full-time major league ballplayer by the age of 20.

 

Sorry, should have added that.

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None of our Minor league prospects are sexy like an Andrew Miller. That's not a good thing.

yea but it's not like Miller isn't a top 10 or so pitching prospect

 

 

dont get what youre trying to say

 

He's saying HOW many teams can say they have an Andrew Miller in their system?

 

Next to none.

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None of our Minor league prospects are sexy like an Andrew Miller. That's not a good thing.

yea but it's not like Miller isn't a top 10 or so pitching prospect

 

 

dont get what youre trying to say

 

He's saying HOW many teams can say they have an Andrew Miller in their system?

 

Next to none.

 

 

But out of all the pitchers we drafted in the first round the past couple of years, our highest prospect is a #39. and the next one after that is a wide margin from 39. That's not good.

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cabrera dominated double-A pitching for half a season and spent 3 and a half years in the minors before being called up

maybin dominated double-A pitching for 26 plate appearences and struck out 6 times in and spent less then 2 years in the minors before being called up

ya theres a similarity they were 20 when called up thats it

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None of our Minor league prospects are sexy like an Andrew Miller. That's not a good thing.

yea but it's not like Miller isn't a top 10 or so pitching prospect

 

 

dont get what youre trying to say

 

He's saying HOW many teams can say they have an Andrew Miller in their system?

 

Next to none.

 

 

But out of all the pitchers we drafted in the first round the past couple of years, our highest prospect is a #39. and the next one after that is a wide margin from 39. That's not good.

injuries and busts happen if sean west was healthy last season it wouldnt be suprising to see him up with volstad

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None of our Minor league prospects are sexy like an Andrew Miller. That's not a good thing.

yea but it's not like Miller isn't a top 10 or so pitching prospect

 

 

dont get what youre trying to say

 

He's saying HOW many teams can say they have an Andrew Miller in their system?

 

Next to none.

 

 

But out of all the pitchers we drafted in the first round the past couple of years, our highest prospect is a #39. and the next one after that is a wide margin from 39. That's not good.

injuries and busts happen if sean west was healthy last season it wouldnt be suprising to see him up with volstad

 

 

That's what happens when you draft so many pitchers in early rounds....

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