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Players we should trade


JPierre75sbs
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Another thing, you fail to answer my question that I ask you for the 4th time: Do we have any better option right now than to play Maybin?

He is pretty much ready (just about), and we pretty much don't have a choice.

 

You're putting wayyyyyyy too much emphasis on a rookie player and arbitration. Way too much emphasis on that. You're thinking 3 years from now. This club doesn't think like that. We think year to year dude. If we CAN help it, like in Miguel's case where we waited a little and we could afford to do that (that was a veteran team), then you hold out a few weeks to gain an extra year in arbitration. That's the only time you hold a rookie back..

 

But yea, go ahead, just ramble for the 3rd time about putting Maybin in AAA/AA again without addressing anything I just said and bore us all.

 

It is foolish to believe that any club, even the Marlins, does not think longterm.

 

With Maybin and the season the Marlins are likely to have, I have no problem letting him percolate in the minor league for a few months to make sure he is ready for the show. From all reports I've read, he was overmatched after the Tigers called him up late last season.

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Another thing, you fail to answer my question that I ask you for the 4th time: Do we have any better option right now than to play Maybin?

He is pretty much ready (just about), and we pretty much don't have a choice.

 

You're putting wayyyyyyy too much emphasis on a rookie player and arbitration. Way too much emphasis on that. You're thinking 3 years from now. This club doesn't think like that. We think year to year dude. If we CAN help it, like in Miguel's case where we waited a little and we could afford to do that (that was a veteran team), then you hold out a few weeks to gain an extra year in arbitration. That's the only time you hold a rookie back..

 

But yea, go ahead, just ramble for the 3rd time about putting Maybin in AAA/AA again without addressing anything I just said and bore us all.

 

It is foolish to believe that any club, even the Marlins, does not think longterm.

 

With Maybin and the season the Marlins are likely to have, I have no problem letting him percolate in the minor league for a few months to make sure he is ready for the show. From all reports I've read, he was overmatched after the Tigers called him up late last season.

 

 

So you're saying Maybin should start in the Minors?

 

I can almost guarantee he doesn't.

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First of all, I know how arbitration works son. Second of all, I'm not new by any means. I've been reading these forums for the past couple of years as a lurker and I've posted way back when, even when this forum didn't exist and there was only the MLB Marlins forum (when it was good). People here can atest to that. I've tons of arbitration work back in the day, when we used to have real conversations back in 02 and all. Don't ever bring that newbie sh*t to me.

 

Third, I know it doesn't go by age. Duh. I'm saying we're fielding a team that's close together in age and will peak as a team in age, as in contending together as a team with age? Much like the 03 team did? Or did you forget? Your statement of holding back Maybin now, when we have only LESSER options, as I noted before is borderline retarded. Maybin should and WILL get a great amount of AB's at the MLB level this season. That's a fact. We basically have no other option but to run him out there.

 

And what's more ridiculous is saying save him for when we are in contention? What the hell is that about? You don't purposely save rookies for when you are contending? You develop rookies during rebuilding years. Let them work under less pressure and get their kinks out. That was the beauty of the '98 team and you can even throw in the '06 team in there. Derek Lee, AJ Burnettl, Castillo and countless of others didn't just start mashing right away.

But age is irrelevant which you are not grasping. It's service time. It's making the team peak at the same time and you have to combine this on a salary threshold where you can afford the entire team by mixing the guys with multi-million dollar contracts with club controlled players. Try and realize how important this is for the Marlins. You specifically cite 03. Because the Marlins did not have a combination of veterans and huge rookie performers that year.

 

Putting Maybin out opening day is dumb when you can stick him in AA for 3 months and it won't hurt his development because of where he is as a player. You speak as if he won't "work out the kinks" unless he is at the MLB level. That is wrong. Also you are arguing for playing Maybin 3 additional months in a non contending 2008 versus having him under club control for an additional season (Where you would think the Marlins will be very good in the future). That's pretty idiotic. You want to have control over your players for as long as possible. I mean that is obvious. There really is no benefit to playing Maybin right away in 2008 for these reasons. This is also why you'd hope the Marlins let Volstad and G. Hernandez throw in AA/AAA for the first 2+ months of the season so you don't get them started either. Who cares we have no CF on the roster. It's about systematically planning for the future. You're not grasping this.

 

Maybe you can think about it in terms of Cabrera and Dontrelle. They were brought up mid year. Their pre-free agency years were basically 04-09. Yet we had them for worthwhile MLB service time in 03. This is what they need to do with Maybin/Volstad/Gaby this year so we have their club controlled rights for 09-11 and overall through 2014. Basically why let them hit arbitration in 2011 when it isn't a big deal to use them right now or not. That is way more important than hitting the ground running in 2008 just because you don't want to see Amezaga/Cody in centerfield for 3 more months or whatever. It's about building for the future. It's the much better course of action.

 

Dude, I see you're the guy in the board that likes to see arguments go absolutely NOWHERE. I said "peak" as a team as in COMPETETIVE wise man. God! Is that so hard to grasp???? When players are more or less the same age, they enter their primes more or less the same age?? This is not hard.

 

Another thing, you fail to answer my question that I ask you for the 4th time: Do we have any better option right now than to play Maybin?

He is pretty much ready (just about), and we pretty much don't have a choice.

 

You're putting wayyyyyyy too much emphasis on a rookie player and arbitration. Way too much emphasis on that. You're thinking 3 years from now. This club doesn't think like that. We think year to year dude. If we CAN help it, like in Miguel's case where we waited a little and we could afford to do that (that was a veteran team), then you hold out a few weeks to gain an extra year in arbitration. That's the only time you hold a rookie back..

 

But yea, go ahead, just ramble for the 3rd time about putting Maybin in AAA/AA again without addressing anything I just said and bore us all.

maybe you don't get this but some players develop at different ages. meaning the peak at different ages. not every players prime year is when he is between 27-29. as for maybin there is no reason to waste his service time when he would be learning the same skills at double-a as he would in the majors. he has no reason to be on the big club when he is our best prospect and we have no chance to compete next year. if we were ready to compete and he was the best option we had he would be starting but there is no reason to cause mental damage when hes hitting .150 over the course of a season when he could be hitting .300 and developing the same skills at the same rate

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Carroll can play CF, as can Cody Ross

 

 

So you're saying these are better options than Maybin?

at this point, probably

 

I mean if Cam goes all Hanley on us and blows up as a rook, that would be sweet

 

but he prob needs some at bats in AA anyway

 

Cody is more than capable, and I'm intrigued by Carroll

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Carroll can play CF, as can Cody Ross

 

 

So you're saying these are better options than Maybin?

at this point, probably

 

I mean if Cam goes all Hanley on us and blows up as a rook, that would be sweet

 

but he prob needs some at bats in AA anyway

 

Cody is more than capable, and I'm intrigued by Carroll

i would like to see what carroll can do too if he does well we just found our left fielder for 09 if he plays like crud what did we lose nothing

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Carroll can play CF, as can Cody Ross

 

 

So you're saying these are better options than Maybin?

at this point, probably

 

I mean if Cam goes all Hanley on us and blows up as a rook, that would be sweet

 

but he prob needs some at bats in AA anyway

 

Cody is more than capable, and I'm intrigued by Carroll

i would like to see what carroll can do too if he does well we just found our left fielder for 09 if he plays like crud what did we lose nothing

 

And if he does well, Willingham to first and Jacobs out the door for a nice little peice could always work...

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Carroll can play CF, as can Cody Ross

 

 

So you're saying these are better options than Maybin?

at this point, probably

 

I mean if Cam goes all Hanley on us and blows up as a rook, that would be sweet

 

but he prob needs some at bats in AA anyway

 

Cody is more than capable, and I'm intrigued by Carroll

 

No doubt that Cody can play a decent centerfield and he has some pop in that bat of his too. If Maybin needs some more time then it's not the end of the world if Cody is out there for '08.

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Carroll can play CF, as can Cody Ross

 

 

So you're saying these are better options than Maybin?

at this point, probably

 

I mean if Cam goes all Hanley on us and blows up as a rook, that would be sweet

 

but he prob needs some at bats in AA anyway

 

Cody is more than capable, and I'm intrigued by Carroll

i would like to see what carroll can do too if he does well we just found our left fielder for 09 if he plays like crud what did we lose nothing

 

And if he does well, Willingham to first and Jacobs out the door for a nice little peice could always work...

exactly or if we like the left handed bat at first we can keep jacobs. not starting maybin can open up more doors then starting maybin and could ultimately lead to a far superior team

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Carroll can play CF, as can Cody Ross

 

 

So you're saying these are better options than Maybin?

at this point, probably

 

I mean if Cam goes all Hanley on us and blows up as a rook, that would be sweet

 

but he prob needs some at bats in AA anyway

 

Cody is more than capable, and I'm intrigued by Carroll

 

No doubt that Cody can play a decent centerfield and he has some pop in that bat of his too. If Maybin needs some more time then it's not the end of the world if Cody is out there for '08.

 

If all goes well, maybe Ross can learn how to hit righties, too. If that were to happen... Hello, 30 homers.

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Carroll can play CF, as can Cody Ross

 

 

So you're saying these are better options than Maybin?

at this point, probably

 

I mean if Cam goes all Hanley on us and blows up as a rook, that would be sweet

 

but he prob needs some at bats in AA anyway

 

Cody is more than capable, and I'm intrigued by Carroll

 

No doubt that Cody can play a decent centerfield and he has some pop in that bat of his too. If Maybin needs some more time then it's not the end of the world if Cody is out there for '08.

 

If all goes well, maybe Ross can learn how to hit righties, too. If that were to happen... Hello, 30 homers.

Cody wouldn't stay healthy enough anyway

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Carroll can play CF, as can Cody Ross

 

 

So you're saying these are better options than Maybin?

at this point, probably

 

I mean if Cam goes all Hanley on us and blows up as a rook, that would be sweet

 

but he prob needs some at bats in AA anyway

 

Cody is more than capable, and I'm intrigued by Carroll

i would like to see what carroll can do too if he does well we just found our left fielder for 09 if he plays like crud what did we lose nothing

 

 

Carroll is a joke.

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If you guys think Cody Ross is going to hit 30 hrs, you've got some issues.

 

I can't believe all you guys think Cameron Maybin is not going to get a good amount of playing time this season at the MLB level. That's what you guys are saying here.

it's not that we believe he is not going to get a good amount of playing time this season in the majors, its that we believe he should start the year in the minors

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Carroll can play CF, as can Cody Ross

 

 

So you're saying these are better options than Maybin?

at this point, probably

 

I mean if Cam goes all Hanley on us and blows up as a rook, that would be sweet

 

but he prob needs some at bats in AA anyway

 

Cody is more than capable, and I'm intrigued by Carroll

 

No doubt that Cody can play a decent centerfield and he has some pop in that bat of his too. If Maybin needs some more time then it's not the end of the world if Cody is out there for '08.

 

If all goes well, maybe Ross can learn how to hit righties, too. If that were to happen... Hello, 30 homers.

 

sure as hell would be fun to see what ross could do in a full season with 500+ at-bats.

Just for fun, here would be his numbers from last season projected (roughly) into a full season: 36 homeruns, 117 RBI's, 105 runs scored, 57 doubles, 174 hits and about 60 walks.

 

sure they wouldn't be exact considering I projected a hot streak of 173 at-bats but dam.....

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If you guys think Cody Ross is going to hit 30 hrs, you've got some issues.

 

I can't believe all you guys think Cameron Maybin is not going to get a good amount of playing time this season at the MLB level. That's what you guys are saying here.

it's not that we believe he is not going to get a good amount of playing time this season in the majors, its that we believe he should start the year in the minors

 

 

Due to our circumstances, he most likely isn't. That's what I've been saying all along. Yea he's raw and probably needs a little more seasoning... I understand that, but that most likely won't be the case. He's going to get a good amount of AB's this season. That's what I was saying. Arbitration, etc etc is irrelevant. Cameron Maybin will get at least 200 AB's this season. Book it.

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If you guys think Cody Ross is going to hit 30 hrs, you've got some issues.

 

I can't believe all you guys think Cameron Maybin is not going to get a good amount of playing time this season at the MLB level. That's what you guys are saying here.

it's not that we believe he is not going to get a good amount of playing time this season in the majors, its that we believe he should start the year in the minors

 

you never know how he's going to turn out, but the last thing you want to do is rush a 21 year-old up to the majors when he's not ready and shatter his confidence. Of course, it could turn out he's another hanley or cabrera and he's more than ready, but based on his numbers last year we'll have to wait for spring training.

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The point Lou is trying to make (an extremely good and accurate one) is that it makes no sense to start Maybin in the bigs in terms of contract status and team level of competition.

 

It does more good to the team to put a Ross or a Carroll or Amezaga out in CF for the time being since the Marlins aren't competing this year. It only improves his confidence and game, extending is tenure for when the team actually needs him. He is 20 years old for christ sake and struggled in his limited ABs last season. There is no reason to start him in CF opening day.

 

 

Your extremely crass mode of discourse is very consistent with your complete lack of knowledge of the game.

 

 

I understand that... But that's not a good enough reason to hold him back right now.

 

Cameron Maybin WILL get 200+ AB's this season.

 

20 years old or not, arbitration 3 years from now or not, he will get 200+ AB's.

 

Do you disagree about that?

 

You guys beat around the bush and don't get to the point.

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Carroll can play CF, as can Cody Ross

 

 

So you're saying these are better options than Maybin?

at this point, probably

 

I mean if Cam goes all Hanley on us and blows up as a rook, that would be sweet

 

but he prob needs some at bats in AA anyway

 

Cody is more than capable, and I'm intrigued by Carroll

i would like to see what carroll can do too if he does well we just found our left fielder for 09 if he plays like crud what did we lose nothing

 

Carroll is a joke.

.849 ops in 100abs in carolina and .958 ops in 318 abs with the topes last season ya he is a joke

 

ramp brett was drafted as a third baseman any chance we see him return there next season?

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So in conclusion everybody thinks

 

Cody Ross will hit 36 HR's

 

and Cameron Maybin won't see the light of day in the majors because of arbitration purposes 2-3 years from now and he has Carroll and Ross blocking him + he's not ready.

 

/endconclusion

 

nope, I was just making a point about Ross's power potential if he played a full season. The point is that if Maybin is not ready, then it's not like we have a giant hole in center. Ross can give us a decent amount of production as long as he stays healthy and puts up similar numbers with consistency.

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Carroll can play CF, as can Cody Ross

 

 

So you're saying these are better options than Maybin?

at this point, probably

 

I mean if Cam goes all Hanley on us and blows up as a rook, that would be sweet

 

but he prob needs some at bats in AA anyway

 

Cody is more than capable, and I'm intrigued by Carroll

i would like to see what carroll can do too if he does well we just found our left fielder for 09 if he plays like crud what did we lose nothing

 

Carroll is a joke.

.849 ops in 100abs in carolina and .958 ops in 318 abs with the topes last season ya he is a joke

 

ramp brett was drafted as a third baseman any chance we see him return there next season?

 

Please, let's not talk about Carroll here... He has no future... with anybody.

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200 ABs is not starting him on opening day or even at the all-star break. What's your point?

 

He could very well get 200 or so ABs this season (certainly not 600), but even then I wouldn't have a problem if he doesn't even get called up at all. There is no reason to rush him to the major league level.

 

:thumbup :notworthy :thumbup

 

thank-you, that's all we're trying to say.

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