Actually, now that I think about it, even though Beltran doesn't have a great arm, he'd have the best arm in that OF, so go figure.

 

From what I've seen, Miguel has a better pure arm than Beltran. Beltran is much better all-around defender, but Miguel is getting respect from baserunners.

yea, Cabs arm is better but Beltran is more accurate

The rent a player idea is hard to deal with but if it results in a repeat championship... it would be worth it IMO anyway. Of course there is no way to know it'll work.

I'm with you that if Rent A Player=World Title, it's worth it.

 

But like you said, it's no guarantee. If the Marlins had a very good and deep system, I'd say getting a rent a player like Beltran might be worth a shot, but to get him, you'd have to give up what's left in your less than stellar system, and the Marlins need at least a decent system, since they aren't the Yanks or Red Sox and can't go out and spend a trillion dollars to replenish the roster in the offseason.

 

Also, like Farmer Fran said, keeping the pitching together should be this teams FIRST concern.

to be honest, besides Willingham, Hermida would be the only guy I wouldnt be happy about if we moved him

 

most of the guys probably dont have a spot in our rotation anyway

I hate Scott Boras...

 

:pullhair

Beltran Stats

 

I was just looking at Beltran's numbers and look at the difference between Beltran's numbers, home and away. Take it for what it's worth I just thought it was very interesting.

Miami's system is unique, we will always stock up with young, little known Latin players (Castillo, Gonzalez, Cabrera, Yorman). We don't always need number 1 pick type prospects. If Stokes and a guy like Scott Olsen (who I like a lot) were to be dealt for a possible Division title, I wouldn't cry about it. We have a window now, and we have to take it. If we eventually end up losing some of the young arms we have, we'll likely restock with prospects in the process. So to go for it all now is kind of a win-win.

Last season for Uggie we traded away out 3rd, 6th and 10th top prospect according to BA. Beltran I believe would be even costlier.

 

They want a 3rd baseman, catcher and pitcher. Maybe we could include Jason Grimsley into the deal.

 

Joe Dillion, Scott Olson, Josh Willingham and Abraham Nunez. Would that do it?

to be honest, besides Willingham, Hermida would be the only guy I wouldnt be happy about if we moved him

 

most of the guys probably dont have a spot in our rotation anyway

I agree, our team seems to be pretty set as far as position players go.

 

Hermida will replace Conine (or perhaps Pierre if we get Beltran to come and sign, but those are two big ifs).

 

Choi or Stokes at first, Lowell Cabrera and Castillo, probably Gonzalez probably Pierre (I only say probably because their contracts end soon).

 

In my mind our biggest needs are at catcher and a lesser need at SS, neither of those positions will be filled from within meaning that "giving up the farm" does not necessarily mean we're giving up our future. Prospects without a position on the big club are only valuable to other teams...

Today's NY Times quotes Royal GM Allard Baird - says he is talking with four teams. His primary need is for a catcher and third baseman in return. I'd don't see how the Marlins can address these needs. Who do we have to deal - Ramon Castro and Joe Dillon?

 

The Yanks May Prefer a Pitcher Over Beltran

 

LOS ANGELES, June 20 - The Kansas City Royals are prepared to trade Carlos Beltran, their star center fielder, at any time, and the Yankees are among the leading candidates to make a deal for him. The question is whether they want to acquire him.

 

"If I match up, I'm ready to deal," Royals General Manager Allard Baird said in a telephone interview Sunday.

 

Most Yankees officials say they believe the team's most pressing need is pitching, and the Yankees scout Jim Benedict was in Pittsburgh on Sunday to watch the Seattle Mariners' Freddy Garcia for the second start in a row.

 

But with the Boston Red Sox also pursuing Beltran, the Yankees' principal owner, George Steinbrenner, could order his officials to get him. The Yankees have the prospects the Royals are seeking.

 

"I'm looking more at the third base and catching positions at the upper levels," Baird said. "When we start to look a month or a month and a half from now, then we would open it up a little."

 

But Baird would like to act quickly, and for now, he said, he is focused on four interested teams that have a catcher and third baseman to deal. Baird would not name the teams, but it was clear that two were the Red Sox and the Yankees. He watched the Red Sox play in San Francisco on Saturday.

 

Considering what he wants in a trade, Baird probably kept a close eye on Red Sox third baseman Kevin Youkilis. The Red Sox could also offer their Class AAA catcher, Kelly Shoppach. Youkilis has hit .271 as a fill-in for the injured Bill Mueller.

 

The Yankees do not have a major league-ready catcher or third baseman to offer the Royals. But the Royals, like the Mariners, have scouted the Yankees' Class AA Trenton affiliate. The Yankees' best prospect is Trenton catcher Dioner Navarro, and the Yankees recently shifted a highly regarded Trenton infielder, Robinson Cano, to third base so the Royals could see him there.

 

Baird, who is also shopping third baseman Joe Randa, said he had been encouraged by the interest level of other teams in his players. While he is ready to deal for a third baseman and a catcher right now, he said he would broaden his search if Beltran were not traded soon.

 

"I'm going to be patient," Baird said. "It's either matching up to my needs now, or I'll just wait until the end and be in a maximum-trade-value mode where I get prospects across the board."

 

Complicating a potential trade for Beltran is that his agent, Scott Boras, plans to shop Beltran on the free-agent market this winter. The Yankees have an increasingly comfortable relationship with Boras and say they believe they would have a good chance of signing him this winter. Boras also represents Yankees center fielder Bernie Williams, who would switch to designated hitter if the team acquires Beltran.

 

The Yankees' championship teams were built around pitching, and despite Steinbrenner's fascination with elite offensive players, the team seems more likely to acquire a starter before the July 31 deadline.

Last season for Uggie we traded away out 3rd, 6th and 10th top prospect according to BA. Beltran I believe would be even costlier.

 

They want a 3rd baseman, catcher and pitcher. Maybe we could include Jason Grimsley into the deal.

 

Joe Dillion, Scott Olson, Josh Willingham and Abraham Nunez. Would that do it?

No it wouldn't. Joe Dillon has no trade value, and Abe Nunez used to have trade value, until he proved what he's worth.

 

It would take something like. Scott Olsen, Jason Stokes, Josh Willingham, one of our young relievers at AAA (Neu, Gracesqui, Bump). and probably one more mid-level prospect.

Joe Dillion, Scott Olson, Josh Willingham and Abraham Nunez. Would that do it?

I'd include Ray Castro in any deal with KC.

Last season for Uggie we traded away out 3rd, 6th and 10th top prospect according to BA. Beltran I believe would be even costlier.

 

They want a 3rd baseman, catcher and pitcher. Maybe we could include Jason Grimsley into the deal.

 

Joe Dillion, Scott Olson, Josh Willingham and Abraham Nunez. Would that do it?

Urbina was a little different because we initiated the talks (he wasn't being shopped as actively as Beltran), so we ended up slightly overpaying prospect wise.

 

 

Either way, here's what the NYTimes says about Beltran (to the Yanks and in general):

 

"I'm looking more at the third base and catching positions at the upper levels," Baird said. "When we start to look a month or a month and a half from now, then we would open it up a little."

 

But Baird would like to act quickly, and for now, he said, he is focused on four interested teams that have a catcher and third baseman to deal. Baird would not name the teams, but it was clear that two were the Red Sox and the Yankees. He watched the Red Sox play in San Francisco on Saturday.

 

Considering what he wants in a trade, Baird probably kept a close eye on Red Sox third baseman Kevin Youkilis. The Red Sox could also offer their Class AAA catcher, Kelly Shoppach. Youkilis has hit .271 as a fill-in for the injured Bill Mueller.

 

The Yankees do not have a major league-ready catcher or third baseman to offer the Royals. But the Royals, like the Mariners, have scouted the Yankees' Class AA Trenton affiliate. The Yankees' best prospect is Trenton catcher Dioner Navarro, and the Yankees recently shifted a highly regarded Trenton infielder, Robinson Cano, to third base so the Royals could see him there.

 

Baird, who is also shopping third baseman Joe Randa, said he had been encouraged by the interest level of other teams in his players. While he is ready to deal for a third baseman and a catcher right now, he said he would broaden his search if Beltran were not traded soon.

 

"I'm going to be patient," Baird said. "It's either matching up to my needs now, or I'll just wait until the end and be in a maximum-trade-value mode where I get prospects across the board."

 

Complicating a potential trade for Beltran is that his agent, Scott Boras, plans to shop Beltran on the free-agent market this winter. The Yankees have an increasingly comfortable relationship with Boras and say they believe they would have a good chance of signing him this winter.

 

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/06/21/sports/b.../21beltran.html

 

I know that the rent-a-player thing is kinda touchy, but honestly, the more BorASS threatens to shop Beltran on the open market, the more it helps us. Of the teams interested, only the Yanks have no limit when spending and they don't have the prospects to outbid anyone. Navarro is good, but he's an NY prospect, they hype may be greater than the substance, same with Cano.

 

Anyway, my line of thinking is if BorASS makes it painfully clear to all the teams interested in trading for Beltran that he wants $100 mil for 5 years or he's going to hit the FA market then all the teams shy away from offering a lot from the farm system (except the Yankees who don't have a whole lot to offer anyway). Anything offered from our system will likely be greater than the Yankees offer, so if the Royals go to a "best offer" scenario, we may win by default. Just something to think about...

One thing this optimist finds interesting: Josh Willingham satisfies the 3rd base, catcher, and upper-level designations by himself. Not saying that he would be the only guy, or even the centerpiece of a deal. But he would definitely be useful to the Royals.

One thing this optimist finds interesting: Josh Willingham satisfies the 3rd base, catcher, and upper-level designations by himself. Not saying that he would be the only guy, or even the centerpiece of a deal. But he would definitely be useful to the Royals.

Great point!

? Kansas City center fielder Carlos Beltran remains the subject of trade speculation because the Royals have long acknowledged they won't be able to outbid other teams when he becomes a free agent after the season. But don't look for the Marlins to go after him.

 

Team sources say the front office hasn't even called the Royals because he is too expensive.

 

http://www.palmbeachpost.com/sports/conten...9752cc003b.html

 

 

Mike Berandino < Joe Capozzi

so now we have 2 different stories

 

wonderful

Beltran plays at Kaufman Stadium most of the time and that park is fair, but favors hitters more than pitchers. His defense this year has resulted in 5 assists and 3 errors. He has taken part in 1 DP.

When it comes to Berardino you have to consider he is still waging war against the Fish and like with Vlad and others, he loves to set up (in the minds of readers who don't know better) the Marlins to fail, i.e., Beltran, Vlad, etc.

 

Look at his columns when we went to to Detroit and subsequently. His most recent column on the ex-patriot Marlins pitchers traded for Mark Redman sends the message to readers that the Marlins FO ineptly gave away the ranch for a one year guy and are now paying the price.

 

Until proven otherwise the best thing to do with a Berardino rumor is to ignore it or even better, expect the opposite.

Last season for Uggie we traded away out 3rd, 6th and 10th top prospect according to BA. Beltran I believe would be even costlier.

 

They want a 3rd baseman, catcher and pitcher. Maybe we could include Jason Grimsley into the deal.

 

Joe Dillion, Scott Olson, Josh Willingham and Abraham Nunez. Would that do it?

No it wouldn't. Joe Dillon has no trade value, and Abe Nunez used to have trade value, until he proved what he's worth.

 

It would take something like. Scott Olsen, Jason Stokes, Josh Willingham, one of our young relievers at AAA (Neu, Gracesqui, Bump). and probably one more mid-level prospect. I agree with you, but after the Finley fiasco I figured I'd enter in slowly

JP in left? Is that practical? How strong is Beltran defensively compared to JP?

I 'll assume his arm is far better. In this dream scenario - would we be better off leaving JP in CF, switching Cabs back to left and putting Beltran in right?

 

:mischief2

Am I the only one who remebers Cabrera not being very good in left last year? He had his fair share of mistakes there too.

 

 

 

Sorry if I'm not going to partake in this quest to rent an overrated player just to make a statement that we're still buyers or willing to take risks or something. It's simply not worth it and we could get by with less.

If we do trade for Beltran I don't want to resign him.

I am guessing Boras ends up selling Beltran to the Yanks in the offseason anyways, so I doubt he will be re-signed by whoever trades for him.

 

With that said, I hope the Marlins don't trade for Beltran, I am not a fan of "sell the farm for a rent-a-player" at all. Win now, worry about next year while shining up your nice new World Series ring.

When it comes to Berardino you have to consider he is still waging war against the Fish and like with Vlad and others, he loves to set up (in the minds of readers who don't know better) the Marlins to fail, i.e., Beltran, Vlad, etc.

 

Look at his columns when we went to to Detroit and subsequently. His most recent column on the ex-patriot Marlins pitchers traded for Mark Redman sends the message to readers that the Marlins FO ineptly gave away the ranch for a one year guy and are now paying the price.

 

Until proven otherwise the best thing to do with a Berardino rumor is to ignore it or even better, expect the opposite.

The Marlins ineptly gave away too much and are now paying the price?

 

If that price is tens of thousands of dollars per World Series ring, he's right.

 

Bernadino is an idiot.

Where is Beltran from? Is there any chance of signing him to a three year deal? Can we use some of that "Vlad" money? Please tell me Boras is not his agent...

 

 

:headscratch

Beltran's from Puerto Rico.

 

 

If we trade for this guy, we better sign him. I don't think our FO is stupid enough to jeopardize the future of this franchise by renting an OF for a couple of months. If they are, I staunchly oppose this trade!

Sorry if I'm not going to partake in this quest to rent an overrated player just to make a statement that we're still buyers or willing to take risks or something. It's simply not worth it and we could get by with less.

How about Raul Ibanez???