October 2, 200520 yr Link Palaeontologist Dr David Penney, of the University of Manchester, found the 4cm long by 2cm wide fossil during a visit to a museum in the Dominican Republic. Since the discovery two years ago, he has used droplets of blood in the amber to reveal the age of the specimen. It is thought to be the first time spider blood has been found in amber and scientists hope to extract its DNA. Dr Penney, of the School of Earth, Atmospheric and Environmental Sciences, said he had used the blood droplets to trace how, when and where the spider died. It is a new species from the Filistatidae family commonly found in South America and the Caribbean. Dr Penney believes it was climbing up a tree 20 million years ago when it was hit on the head by fast flowing resin, became engulfed in the resin and died. He claims the shape and position of the blood droplets revealed which direction the spider was travelling in and which of its legs broke first. "It's amazing to think that a single piece of amber with a single spider in it can open up a window into what was going on 20 million years ago," he said. "By analysing the position of the spider's body in relation to the droplets of blood in the amber we are able to determine how it died, which direction it was travelling in and even how fast it was moving." He first saw the fossil during a visit to the Museo del Ambar Dominicano, in Puerto Plata, Dominican Republic. Dr Penney reports his findings in the latest issue of the journal Palaeontology.
October 2, 200520 yr /shared/img/o.gifThe spider is a new species from the Filistatidae family which is commonly found in South America and the Caribbean.
October 2, 200520 yr It's amazing that these guys can just throw out a number like 20 million years old and people will buy it. These people in reality have no freaking clue how old this thing is.
October 2, 200520 yr Kenneth Dodgerson does not care about Dominican spiders! Truer words never spoken
October 2, 200520 yr It's amazing that these guys can just throw out a number like 20 million years old and people will buy it. These people in reality have no freaking clue how old this thing is. Carbon dating FTW I guess you are drinking the Carl Everett Kool-Aid.
October 3, 200520 yr It's amazing that these guys can just throw out a number like 20 million years old and people will buy it. These people in reality have no freaking clue how old this thing is. IMO I think it could be no older than 6,000 years.
October 3, 200520 yr It's amazing that these guys can just throw out a number like 20 million years old and people will buy it. These people in reality have no freaking clue how old this thing is. Carbon dating FTW I guess you are drinking the Carl Everett Kool-Aid. "Dinosaurs, WHAT DINOSAURS!?" If it ain't in the bible it COULDN'T have happened. People who don't believe the Earth is a few billion years old were sent here to test my faith. How brainwashed can you be?
October 3, 200520 yr It's amazing that these guys can just throw out a number like 20 million years old and people will buy it. These people in reality have no freaking clue how old this thing is. Carbon dating FTW I guess you are drinking the Carl Everett Kool-Aid. "Dinosaurs, WHAT DINOSAURS!?" If it ain't in the bible it COULDN'T have happened. People who don't believe the Earth is a few billion years old were sent here to test my faith. How brainwashed can you be? I go by the Bible. I'm brainwashed and proud of it.
October 3, 200520 yr It's amazing that these guys can just throw out a number like 20 million years old and people will buy it. These people in reality have no freaking clue how old this thing is. Carbon dating FTW I guess you are drinking the Carl Everett Kool-Aid. "Dinosaurs, WHAT DINOSAURS!?" If it ain't in the bible it COULDN'T have happened. People who don't believe the Earth is a few billion years old were sent here to test my faith. How brainwashed can you be? I go by the Bible. I'm brainwashed and proud of it. Good way to be.
October 3, 200520 yr Dinosaurs were in the Bible. Carbon dating has alot of factors associated with its method that make it not that reliable.
October 3, 200520 yr The half-life of carbon-14 is about 5,700 years. That means that you can't use carbon dating for things older than 11,000 years. 20 million? I don't know how they estimate that but it's not by carbon dating. Edit: Since the discovery two years ago, he has used droplets of blood in the amber to reveal the age of the specimen. Must've overseen this part. Clears things out because I made myself wonder how the hell they new it was that old.
October 3, 200520 yr If anyone finds the exact method that was used to date this spider please post. I made myself curious as hell now, and I don't understand exactly what they did with the blood to tell it was 20 million years old. Found this little bit: Potassium 40 to Argon 40 (half-life = 1,300,000,000 years) - this method is very often used to date rock less than 60 million years old. Carbon 14 to Nitrogen 14 (half-life = 5,570 years)--- There are 3 forms (isotopes) of carbon occuring in nature: Carbon 12 (accounts for 99%), Carbon 13 (accounts for 1%), and Carbon 14 (accounts for less than 1%). While alive, plants and animals incorporate these isotopes of carbon into their tissues at the ratio found in the atmosphere. Upon death, the Carbon 14 in their tissues begins to decay. By measuring the remaining amount of Carbon 14, the age of the fossil can be determined. This method can be used to date material ranging in age from a few hundred years to about 50,000 years. The use of Carbon 14 permits the determination of age directly a fossil. For fossils greater than 50,000 years old, the age of the fossil is found indirectly by determing the age of the rock associated with the fossil. Carbon 14 dating has a dating range of several hundred years before present to 50,000 years before present. So I assume they looked at the surrounding rock and used potassium-argon dating. Why the blood?!? Edit: Amino-acid dating Amino-acid dating is based upon the principle that amino acids which make up proteins change when an organism dies. The proteins produced by an orgamism when it is alive almost entirely consists of amino acids in a "left-handed" configuration. After death, amino acids begin to invert to their "right-handed" configuration. This process is called racemization . In fossils, an equilibrium ratio is eventually reached. The time needed to reach this equilibrium depends mainly upon temperature and secondarily on the species of the organism. Once the absolute date for a region is determined using radiometric dating and the temperature history of a region is established, amino-acid dating can be used to determine the age of a fossil. In the example of marine mollusks, the ratio for the amino acid isoleucine increases from nearly zero in modern shells to an equilibrium value of 1.30 +/- 0.05. At 10 degrees centigrade, it takes about 2 million years to reach equilibrium. At minus 10 degrees centigrade, it takes 20 million years to reach equilibrium. Maybe this?
October 3, 200520 yr Dinosaurs were in the Bible. Dinosaurs are mentioned in the book of Job. If you refer to 'Behemoth': The Hebrew word is the plural-intensive of the word translated "beast" or "cattle." The plural may indicate a large grass-eating beast like the rhinoceros or the elephant. or 'Leviathan': This word is a transliteration of the Hebrew. It means "their mourning." The animal could have been a giant species of the crocodile or an extinct animal, or a fictional one. Used in context: "Let them curse it that curse the day, who are ready to arouse leviathan." If reference was to sorcery, Job may have used the idea for poetic color. In ancient mythology a great dragon was thought to be the enemy of sun and moon and to have power over eclipses. Hardly dinosaurs, but to each their own interpretation.
October 3, 200520 yr "By his neesings a light doth shine, and his eyes are like the eyelids of the morning." "Out of his mouth go burning lamps, and sparks of fire leap out." It kinda sounds like a dragon A tree expert at University of Arizona said this about the Behemoth in Job 40:17 "17 He moveth his tail like a cedar: the sinews of his stones are wrapped together. " In the Middle East, there are several species of trees that would qualify for "cedar" status. Basically, any juniper-like tree can be called a cedar. However, the tree most likely referred to is the famous well-known species called "Cedrus libani", or "cedar-of-Lebanon," a beautiful and stately tree that grows in the Middle East. These trees can be quite large! I worked on cross-sections from one tree that were about 1.5 meters in diameter. The tree can attain heights greater than 40 meters with a diameter greater than 3 meters! The tree is a favorite nursery tree and is now planted all over the world, even many here in Tucson, Arizona. Henri D. Grissino-Mayer Laboratory of Tree-Ring Research The University of Arizona Tucson, Arizona 85721 USA
October 3, 200520 yr You're assuming there weren't trees and plants that existed then that don't exist now? and "sparks of fire leap out"? did dinosaurs breath fire now? anyway Sanro it could've been any one of the isotopes you mentioned. Potassium 40 perhaps.
October 3, 200520 yr I looked around a bit and from what I've seen I think they used the Amino-acid dating method-using the spider's blood that was conserved in the amber. Patassium 40 could only be used if there are volcanic rocks involved I believe.
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