Why we won't be soooo bad next year..

[AAS]

Catcher - Josh Willingham. When I saw him in 2004 I thought he had a reallly good swing. When he got out, it was on line drives. He also has power, maybe 17 homeruns?

1st - Mike Jacobs. Seems impressive, may give you RBIS and homeruns similiar to what Lowell did in 2004

2nd - No idea?

SS - Hanley Ramirez. Better than Agon IMO. So we are improving there.. seems to have speed + power

3rd - Miggy - no need to explain him

Left - No idea? I wish we still had Conine

Center - Gathright. Replaces Pierre and is prob. faster.. is he a good hitter though?

Right - Hermida. Impressive. Has power..

 

Rotation

Willis, Olsen, Vargas, Moehler, Johnson.. or other new guys we aquired.. its flexible

My only concern is most of those guys only last like 5 innings, they do good they just throw too many pitches. ANd we all know our bullpen cant save games. But Olsen & Vargas are impressive, they just don't last longer than like 5-6 innings?

 

Bullpen will stink no matter what.. lol

 

I think we will be able to compete better in 07 and 08 b/c we have the best prospects who will get better as the yr goes on..

[Lefty]

Is that a lineup, or just a positional chart?

[The Marlin Man]

if we have gathwright then we prob wont have olsen

 

quite simply, we have no idea how this team will play next year, we have no history to base our decision on outside of dontrelle and miggy

 

just have to wait till the season starts

[TSwift25]

This team will be very very bad next year. That's not to say overachievment isn't possible or that we will lose 100 games.

 

We're going to be bad, we could rival the '98 team as the worst in franchise history, but we're going to be good again relatively soon.

[MarlinatPenn]

This team will be very very bad next year. That's not to say overachievment isn't possible or that we will lose 100 games.

 

We're going to be bad, we could rival the '98 team as the worst in franchise history, but we're going to be good again relatively soon.

 

bad yes, but not '98 level either... 98 team didn't have Dontrelle pitching every fifth game or hitters like Cabrera and Hermida at the heart... they'll win more than 1998 I'm confident, but well under .500 for sure.

[Marlins2003]

With the Dodgers apparently having signed or about to sign Sanders, Lofton and Garciaparra, and Dioner Navarro penciled in as their starting catcher (Alomar as the backup) two players who the Marlins might be interested in may be non-tendered - Hee Seop Choi and Jason Phillips.

 

In a perfect world I'm not sure I'd mention either one but the one thing I remember about Choi was how hard he hit the ball (when he hit the ball). I maintain no Marlin, including Carlos Delgado, ever hit homeruns harder than Hee Seop Choi.

 

And rather than handing over 1B to Jacobs no questions asked (I have no idea what Stokes situation is) there might be some value in bringing back Choi to compete for the job.

 

While Phillips isn't going to be anyone's first choice as your everyday catcher, he does call a good game and would allow Willingham to play everyday in left and still be mentored on catching by picking up a game or two a week. Furthermore, both Choi and Phillips would be available at near the ML minimum.

 

I can hear the naysayers now but I thought they were both worth a mention.

[wilksthequaker]

This team will be very very bad next year. That's not to say overachievment isn't possible or that we will lose 100 games.

 

We're going to be bad, we could rival the '98 team as the worst in franchise history, but we're going to be good again relatively soon.

 

bad yes, but not '98 level either... 98 team didn't have Dontrelle pitching every fifth game or hitters like Cabrera and Hermida at the heart... they'll win more than 1998 I'm confident, but well under .500 for sure.

 

We did start the season with some decent guys in Sheff and Bonilla, and don't take Dontrelle for granted. Check out how Livan's stats started sucking when the team started doing likewise.

[prinmemito]

With the Dodgers apparently having signed or about to sign Sanders, Lofton and Garciaparra, and Dioner Navarro penciled in as their starting catcher (Alomar as the backup) two players who the Marlins might be interested in may be non-tendered - Hee Seop Choi and Jason Phillips.

 

In a perfect world I'm not sure I'd mention either one but the one thing I remember about Choi was how hard he hit the ball (when he hit the ball). I maintain no Marlin, including Carlos Delgado, ever hit homeruns harder than Hee Seop Choi.

 

And rather than handing over 1B to Jacobs no questions asked (I have no idea what Stokes situation is) there might be some value in bringing back Choi to compete for the job.

 

While Phillips isn't going to be anyone's first choice as your everyday catcher, he does call a good game and would allow Willingham to play everyday in left and still be mentored on catching by picking up a game or two a week. Furthermore, both Choi and Phillips would be available at near the ML minimum.

 

I can hear the naysayers now but I thought they were both worth a mention.

 

 

I would be in favor of Phillips. After all, he did do pretty well in 2003. At the very least he'll give us an average to above average catcher with MLB experience. I am not so sure about Choi, though. We already have a lefty first baseman... I am not sure he can add anything. If we can get another righty utility infielder capable of playing first base I think that's a better move. Choi's problem, IMO, is simply that he has a long looping swing. I am not sure he can get around on the inside fastball. He's a great OBP guy, though, that's for sure.

[TSwift25]

I love Choi, he's goofy awkward and hit the loudest homeruns I've ever heard (I can still see the bomb he hit against Philly :drool ).

 

If Jacobs can play left-field...then this is a no-brainer, he almost has to be picked up.

 

I looked at the defensive numbers provided, and Jacobs' fielding percentage was actually marginally worse last year than Delgado's, so I see no real benefit to keeping Jacobs at first-base when we have a glaring need in the outfield that he can (hopefully) fill.

 

Having Willingham, Choi and Hermida in the same lineup would probably give us the most balanced OBP lineup we've had in some time...

[Rydawg]

I'm all for Choi and Phillips. The more competition the better. Besides, Choi might find his stroke and if he does, look out. Phillips can handle the pitchers well, and give us an option to move Willingham to the OF if needed.

[AAS]

i want willingham as catcher. i think hes a good hitter. and i think we can competer next year which is REALLY good cuz a lot of teams will stink for the next 50 years no matter what (CUBS, for example)

[PBMarlin]

With the Dodgers apparently having signed or about to sign Sanders, Lofton and Garciaparra, and Dioner Navarro penciled in as their starting catcher (Alomar as the backup) two players who the Marlins might be interested in may be non-tendered - Hee Seop Choi and Jason Phillips.

 

In a perfect world I'm not sure I'd mention either one but the one thing I remember about Choi was how hard he hit the ball (when he hit the ball). I maintain no Marlin, including Carlos Delgado, ever hit homeruns harder than Hee Seop Choi.

 

And rather than handing over 1B to Jacobs no questions asked (I have no idea what Stokes situation is) there might be some value in bringing back Choi to compete for the job.

 

While Phillips isn't going to be anyone's first choice as your everyday catcher, he does call a good game and would allow Willingham to play everyday in left and still be mentored on catching by picking up a game or two a week. Furthermore, both Choi and Phillips would be available at near the ML minimum.

 

I can hear the naysayers now but I thought they were both worth a mention.

 

 

I saw the report that Garciaparra might play 1B and wondered what would happen to Choi. Sure it would be good to have him vie for 1B or be a left-handed pinch hitter with power. I didn't realize Phillips might be available. He's performed in the past so would have more upside than Treanor if Willingham doesn't work out behind the dish.

 

Doesn't Choi have one more year before arbitration? Phillips would be arbitration eligible this year?

[CyggyMarlin]

I wonder how much improved the offense might be in '06... How many games in '05 did the Marlins score 2 runs or less with the line-up they had? '06 can't be much worse

[champkind]

This team will be very very bad next year. That's not to say overachievment isn't possible or that we will lose 100 games.

 

We're going to be bad, we could rival the '98 team as the worst in franchise history, but we're going to be good again relatively soon.

 

 

I think you underestimating our squad. Cabrera and Hermedia should be two tough outs...and it's hard to think we won't have 4 guys who put up the same production as Lowell,Pierre,LoDuca,and SeaBass. That's not exactly murder's row we're replacing. If we get solid seasons out of jacobs and josh that's 4 solid hitters, and if we manage to trade for a legit CF'er we are looking at about the same production as we got last year.

 

This team could remind us alot of the old Expo teams which to the outside observer seemed to be just Vlady and Vidro with a bunch of no names and a young but talented pitching staff.

 

I think we might win 100-105 games.....by Sept

[Brandman316]

This team will be very very bad next year. That's not to say overachievment isn't possible or that we will lose 100 games.

 

We're going to be bad, we could rival the '98 team as the worst in franchise history, but we're going to be good again relatively soon.

 

 

I think you underestimating our squad. Cabrera and Hermedia should be two tough outs...and it's hard to think we won't have 4 guys who put up the same production as Lowell,Pierre,LoDuca,and SeaBass. That's not exactly murder's row we're replacing. If we get solid seasons out of jacobs and josh that's 4 solid hitters, and if we manage to trade for a legit CF'er we are looking at about the same production as we got last year.

 

This team could remind us alot of the old Expo teams which to the outside observer seemed to be just Vlady and Vidro with a bunch of no names and a young but talented pitching staff.

 

I think we might win 100-105 games.....by Sept

 

I dont know about that win total, but I think the Marlins are gonna surprise a lot of people. I truly believe the marlins have a legit shot of being at .500. Lets be honest, last year was probably the most underanchieving team i have ever seen in sports. Even though we had players who were well known within the baseball communtiy (Loduca, Lowell, Pierre, Gonzalez) they did not perform anywhere near they should have. Really as far as offense, only Cabrera, Delgado, and maybe Castillo lived up to their expectations. I think Gathright will be a nice addition offesively if we acquire him and is a must on defense at Dolphins Stadium. I think we will probably also see 1 or 2 more deals like this one to acquire young hitters. Pitching Prospects are a hot commodity in baseball and the Marlins have an abundance of talent. Sure the Marlins want to use these pitching prospects as future players in their rotation, but they wont use all of them and they mainly acquired these pitching prospects so they could make trades like the Gathright trade. This team is already lightyears ahead of where the '98 team was. There are always surpires in baseball, I mean who actually thought the Braves would win the NL East title again this year, yet their young players guided them to another title. Should be a good year next year.

[TarHeel324]

this is the kind of team that could either stay around .500 or lose 100 games. it all depends on how well our young guys play

[JetsMania]

This team will be very very bad next year. That's not to say overachievment isn't possible or that we will lose 100 games.

 

We're going to be bad, we could rival the '98 team as the worst in franchise history, but we're going to be good again relatively soon.

 

 

I think you underestimating our squad. Cabrera and Hermedia should be two tough outs...and it's hard to think we won't have 4 guys who put up the same production as Lowell,Pierre,LoDuca,and SeaBass. That's not exactly murder's row we're replacing. If we get solid seasons out of jacobs and josh that's 4 solid hitters, and if we manage to trade for a legit CF'er we are looking at about the same production as we got last year.

 

This team could remind us alot of the old Expo teams which to the outside observer seemed to be just Vlady and Vidro with a bunch of no names and a young but talented pitching staff.

 

I think we might win 100-105 games.....by Sept

 

 

you forgot to say of 2007

[Marlins2003]

Doesn't Choi have one more year before arbitration? Phillips would be arbitration eligible this year?

 

 

PB, there have been literally dozens of articles that refer to the Dodgers potentially not tendering a contract to Choi, for example:

 

"Tuesday is the deadline to tender contracts and the Dodgers have a pair of arbitration-eligible former starters who are out of jobs. The club is not expected to tender a contract to catcher Jason Phillips and could choose the same route with first baseman Hee-Seop Choi."

 

http://losangeles.dodgers.mlb.com/NASApp/m...xt=.jsp&c_id=la

[FutureGM]

Be prepared for this team to lose 100 games. Our team in 1998 probably had more experience, at least until the Mike Piazza deal. They still lost 108 games anyway. From what I remember of watching that team, the majority of our problems were due to awful pitching, and lack of pitching experience. Our biggest weakness this year, at least as the team stands right now, is pitching experience, especially in the bullpen. That leads me to believe that 58-62 wins is a likely total for this season.

[PBMarlin]

Doesn't Choi have one more year before arbitration? Phillips would be arbitration eligible this year?

 

 

PB, there have been literally dozens of articles that refer to the Dodgers potentially not tendering a contract to Choi, for example:

 

"Tuesday is the deadline to tender contracts and the Dodgers have a pair of arbitration-eligible former starters who are out of jobs. The club is not expected to tender a contract to catcher Jason Phillips and could choose the same route with first baseman Hee-Seop Choi."

 

http://losangeles.dodgers.mlb.com/NASApp/m...xt=.jsp&c_id=la

 

Thanks '03. I saw he only appeared in 80 games in '03 so was uncertain if he spent some time in the minors.....or just rode the pine for 1/2 the season. Apparently it was the latter.

[rferry]

I think we have improved over the past year in more areas than we have not. Many may not know their names or their statistics posted 3-5 years ago, but in my estimation of their ability right now, we are better atleast a few positions and will likely be better at others by the end of the season. I expect the bullpen to be much improved with the infusion of young fresh flexible arms and new manager dictating their pitching regime (gosh knows a recent catcher like Girardi won't be abusing his bullpen catcher and backup). As long as they avoid the problems of the 04-05 teams, which I imagine they would as for the most part they're young ethusiatic rookies playing managed by a young ethusiatic rookie, they'll surpass most people's expectations.

[rferry]

Re: Choi, Phillips

 

I'm excited to see the list of non-tenders this year. Last year's turned out pretty well. (Remember Fick, 03? ) Choi and/or Phillips would be a good signing as Jacobs and Willingham's future may not lay at first base and cather.

[Guest Juanky]

I'd be happy with a return from Hee Seop Choi and a moving of Jacobs (if he can indeed play LF). It would make my Choi jersey mean something again :lol

[Marlins2003]

Since I'm often accused of being the chief apologist here for the Marlins organization let me say it will be very telling how the FO views the upcoming season, and in my eyes it will be perceived very negatively, if Beinfest and company don't immediately pounce on Choi, Phillips and Aurilia tomorrow morning.

 

And while it's one thing to debate the value of trading away some of their new corps of pitchers for a Gathright and/or a Gomes, here's three bonafide major leaguers who could be had without any compensation and for little $$$ and without committing to lengthy contracts.

 

For about a million and a half dollars (roughly $400k each to Choi and Phillips, and about $700,000 or so for Aurilia) they have a chance to make this team significantly better, and quickly. Sitting idly by and letting these guys slip through their fingers would be in my estimation a huge mistake.

 

Perhaps there will be better players set free that Beinfest will target instead, and if so, great, but it's time to start making some moves.

 

To me, number one is Jason Phillips, who I believe is the perfect cheap solution at catcher that can still allow for Willingham (mentored by Girardi) to get playing time and keep Treanor in the fold as backup. If the Marlins are contemplating using John Baker as anything other than their AAA catcher we're in for a long, season. Phillips at least knows how to shut down a running game and works well with pitchers.

 

Aurilia can play all three infield skill positions and would give kids like Uggla and Ramirez the time to mature into ML ballplayers. He's frustrated as hell with the Reds FO who have just signed Womack and Freel and wants an opportunity to play everyday. Between SS and 2B with the Fish I could see him playing 120+ games next season. And the guy can still hit, not like Looie to be sure but if he can do anything near what he did last season (.280, 14Hrs, .343 w/runners in scoring position) he could make a difference next season.

 

Choi. I've already said my piece about Choi. With the possible exception of Gary Sheffield, no Marlin, including Carlos Delgado, ever hit the ball harder and further than Choi. For $400k you have to be crazy not to take a chance on the guy.

 

Now maybe Choi will be offered a contract in LA and maybe Aurilia will be offered a reasonable enough contract by the Reds to stay but the Marlins ought to be in there trying to acquire these guys right up until the moment they sign with their respective teams. I'm not one who usually or casually says they (the Marlins organization) owe the fans anything after a World Championship and fielding two subsequent competitive teams, but not going after these guys, or players equal to or better, starting right now, will be a real slap in the face to Marlins fans whether they be in South Florida or Iowa or wherever.

 

So Admin, it's time to deliver on what you said to us last week. Put together a truly competitive team starting at 12:01am tomorrow and don't let us down.

[DcFishFan]

Since I'm often accused of being the chief apologist here for the Marlins organization let me say it will be very telling how the FO views the upcoming season, and in my eyes it will be perceived very negatively, if Beinfest and company don't immediately pounce on Choi, Phillips and Aurilia tomorrow morning.

 

And while it's one thing to debate the value of trading away some of their new corps of pitchers for a Gathright and/or a Gomes, here's three bonafide major leaguers who could be had without any compensation and for little $$$ and without committing to lengthy contracts.

 

For about a million and a half dollars (roughly $400k each to Choi and Phillips, and about $700,000 or so for Aurilia) they have a chance to make this team significantly better, and quickly. Sitting idly by and letting these guys slip through their fingers would be in my estimation a huge mistake.

 

Perhaps there will be better players set free that Beinfest will target instead, and if so, great, but it's time to start making some moves.

 

To me, number one is Jason Phillips, who I believe is the perfect cheap solution at catcher that can still allow for Willingham (mentored by Girardi) to get playing time and keep Treanor in the fold as backup. If the Marlins are contemplating using John Baker as anything other than their AAA catcher we're in for a long, season. Phillips at least knows how to shut down a running game and works well with pitchers.

 

Aurilia can play all three infield skill positions and would give kids like Uggla and Ramirez the time to mature into ML ballplayers. He's frustrated as hell with the Reds FO who have just signed Womack and Freel and wants an opportunity to play everyday. Between SS and 2B with the Fish I could see him playing 120+ games next season. And the guy can still hit, not like Looie to be sure but if he can do anything near what he did last season (.280, 14Hrs, .343 w/runners in scoring position) he could make a difference next season.

 

Choi. I've already said my piece about Choi. With the possible exception of Gary Sheffield, no Marlin, including Carlos Delgado, ever hit the ball harder and further than Choi. For $400k you have to be crazy not to take a chance on the guy.

 

Now maybe Choi will be offered a contract in LA and maybe Aurilia will be offered a reasonable enough contract by the Reds to stay but the Marlins ought to be in there trying to acquire these guys right up until the moment they sign with their respective teams. I'm not one to usually or casually says they (the Marlins organization) owe the fans anything after a World Championship and fielding two subsequent competitive teams, but not going after these guys, or players equal to or better, starting right now, will be a real slap in the face to Marlins fans whether they be in South Florida or Iowa or wherever.

 

So Admin, it's time to deliver on what you said to us last week. Put together a truly competitive team starting at 12:01am tomorrow and don't let us down.

 

 

Good post, 03

:thumbup