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97marlin
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Adeiny Hechavarria, was touted as one of the leagues best defenders. Described to be skilled in every way a short stop should be skilled defensively. I have watched him do things that look to the eye to be very impressive, but his defensive value is at best non-existent. I was hoping someone might explain to me why Hechavarria is so bad from a statistical perspective, and if we can expect him to improve?

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I think it's his range that affects his ratings- I know others disagree.

 

My opinion is he gets to balls he shouldn't get to, and it causes issues with his throwing of his put out rate. He might be better served letting a ball or two going past him and looking like a routine play for the LF and CF then a nice play for the SS.

 

I mean, Brett Lawrie was considered the greatest defensive third baseman in MLB histor according to one of the rating systems (UZR?). Reason being, he made routine plays on the 1b side of 2b- not because of ability, but because of defensive shifts

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This Grantland article on Jeter I think is relevant to Adieny regarding range and metrics etc. http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/9603949/the-tragedy-derek-jeter-defense

 

Defensive metrics are just fine and I don't think Adeiny has had a good year defensively. I think he will improve, but will he improve to the point where his horrific bat becomes acceptable? Probably not.

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I think it's his range that affects his ratings- I know others disagree.

 

My opinion is he gets to balls he shouldn't get to, and it causes issues with his throwing of his put out rate. He might be better served letting a ball or two going past him and looking like a routine play for the LF and CF then a nice play for the SS.

 

I mean, Brett Lawrie was considered the greatest defensive third baseman in MLB histor according to one of the rating systems (UZR?). Reason being, he made routine plays on the 1b side of 2b- not because of ability, but because of defensive shifts

 

 

I don't think you understand how defensive metrics work.

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I think it's his range that affects his ratings- I know others disagree.

 

My opinion is he gets to balls he shouldn't get to, and it causes issues with his throwing of his put out rate. He might be better served letting a ball or two going past him and looking like a routine play for the LF and CF then a nice play for the SS.

 

I mean, Brett Lawrie was considered the greatest defensive third baseman in MLB histor according to one of the rating systems (UZR?). Reason being, he made routine plays on the 1b side of 2b- not because of ability, but because of defensive shifts

 

I don't think you understand how defensive metrics work.I probably don't- but I do remember an article on Brett Lawrie stating he "broke" the system with his shift plays

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Adeiny Hechavarria, was touted as one of the leagues best defenders. Described to be skilled in every way a short stop should be skilled defensively. I have watched him do things that look to the eye to be very impressive, but his defensive value is at best non-existent. I was hoping someone might explain to me why Hechavarria is so bad from a statistical perspective, and if we can expect him to improve?

 

 

Defensive #'s vary from year to year. It wouldn't surprise me if his defensive #'s looked better next year. The problem is that he is the worst offensive player in baseball and that's probably not changing any time soon. The guy sucks.

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Adeiny Hechavarria, was touted as one of the leagues best defenders. Described to be skilled in every way a short stop should be skilled defensively. I have watched him do things that look to the eye to be very impressive, but his defensive value is at best non-existent. I was hoping someone might explain to me why Hechavarria is so bad from a statistical perspective, and if we can expect him to improve?

 

 

Defensive #'s vary from year to year. It wouldn't surprise me if his defensive #'s looked better next year. The problem is that he is the worst offensive player in baseball and that's probably not changing any time soon. The guy sucks.

 

 

With his current offensive production he would need to be the greatest defensive shortstop of all time to provide this team any sort of value

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Cliff Floyd DID call him a great hitter last night.

 

Cliff Floyd also said that the season has been frustrating because if the team would've just won half of its close games, they could be in contention for the wild card!

 

As bad as the team is, at least they're not the analysts.

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Cliff Floyd DID call him a great hitter last night.

 

Cliff Floyd also said that the season has been frustrating because if the team would've just won half of its close games, they could be in contention for the wild card!

 

As bad as the team is, at least they're not the analysts.

 

 

LOL WUT?

 

He must think Ed Lucas is babe ruth.

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Cliff Floyd DID call him a great hitter last night.

 

Cliff Floyd also said that the season has been frustrating because if the team would've just won half of its close games, they could be in contention for the wild card!

 

As bad as the team is, at least they're not the analysts.

 

 

LOL WUT?

 

He must think Ed Lucas is babe ruth.

 

 

Well, the league DID have to adjust to him.

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Cliff Floyd DID call him a great hitter last night.

 

Cliff Floyd also said that the season has been frustrating because if the team would've just won half of its close games, they could be in contention for the wild card!

 

As bad as the team is, at least they're not the analysts.

 

 

LOL WUT?

 

He must think Ed Lucas is babe ruth.

 

 

Well, the league DID have to adjust to him.

 

 

 

 

But he has since adjusted to the league's adjustments...

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Cliff Floyd DID call him a great hitter last night.

 

Cliff Floyd also said that the season has been frustrating because if the team would've just won half of its close games, they could be in contention for the wild card!

 

As bad as the team is, at least they're not the analysts.

 

 

yeah I loved that one. Hey just win some of those games you lost & you'd have a better record guys.

 

no way he said Hech is a great hitter though, I can't believe that.

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I get the feeling those guys browse these boards and just enjoy trolling us. I'll never forget that post game show where Rich (with a grin) publically asked Preston to work with them in the booth the next day; this was around the time everyone here was freaking out over Preston's commentating

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Cliff Floyd DID call him a great hitter last night.

 

Cliff Floyd also said that the season has been frustrating because if the team would've just won half of its close games, they could be in contention for the wild card!

 

As bad as the team is, at least they're not the analysts.

 

 

yeah I loved that one. Hey just win some of those games you lost & you'd have a better record guys.

 

no way he said Hech is a great hitter though, I can't believe that.

 

 

He did. It's difficult to notice sometimes because he doesn't really emphasize his words much, but he something like "that was a bad play. You got a great hitter in Hechavarria and you can score from second anyway..." Hech was hitting when Ruggiano was picked off in the 6th inning so they were "analyzing" it.

 

According to Cliff, the Marlins have a lot of talent and they just don't know how to win yet...

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I think it's his range that affects his ratings- I know others disagree.

 

My opinion is he gets to balls he shouldn't get to, and it causes issues with his throwing of his put out rate. He might be better served letting a ball or two going past him and looking like a routine play for the LF and CF then a nice play for the SS.

 

I mean, Brett Lawrie was considered the greatest defensive third baseman in MLB histor according to one of the rating systems (UZR?). Reason being, he made routine plays on the 1b side of 2b- not because of ability, but because of defensive shifts

 

I don't think you understand how defensive metrics work.I probably don't- but I do remember an article on Brett Lawrie stating he "broke" the system with his shift plays

 

 

 

 

I don't see how that really has much to do with Hechavarria.

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I get the feeling those guys browse these boards and just enjoy trolling us. I'll never forget that post game show where Rich (with a grin) publically asked Preston to work with them in the booth the next day; this was around the time everyone here was freaking out over Preston's commentating

 

 

Remember that some douche registered here just to post in that Preston Wilson thread awhile ago? He made one post defending Wilson and then vanished.

 

That had to be someone working for FS Florida if not Rich or Tommy.

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I get the feeling those guys browse these boards and just enjoy trolling us. I'll never forget that post game show where Rich (with a grin) publically asked Preston to work with them in the booth the next day; this was around the time everyone here was freaking out over Preston's commentating

 

 

Remember that some douche registered here just to post in that Preston Wilson thread awhile ago? He made one post defending Wilson and then vanished.

 

That had to be someone working for FS Florida if not Rich or Tommy.

 

 

I vaguely remember it, but not really. It does sound like it was someone from FS Florida though

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Even if you ignore UZR/WAR, it needs to be acknowledged that Hechavarria botched a lot of plays this season that the average SS should make.

 

I think that he will ultimately emerge as an above average defender when he gets more experience and accumulates a larger sample size, but the defense will never be good enough for his terrible bat.

 

He's basically a -2 WAR player right now. If the bat (worst in baseball) stays the same, Hechavarria will have to become Ozzie Smith to be worth a damn.

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Even if you ignore UZR/WAR, it needs to be acknowledged that Hechavarria botched a lot of plays this season that the average SS should make.

 

I think that he will ultimately emerge as an above average defender when he gets more experience and accumulates a larger sample size, but the defense will never be good enough for his terrible bat.

 

He's basically a -2 WAR player right now. If the bat (worst in baseball) stays the same, Hechavarria will have to become Ozzie Smith to be worth a damn.

 

 

I think even if he was ozzie smith on defense because of his bat he would only be a 1-2 war guy at best.

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Even if you ignore UZR/WAR, it needs to be acknowledged that Hechavarria botched a lot of plays this season that the average SS should make.

 

I think that he will ultimately emerge as an above average defender when he gets more experience and accumulates a larger sample size, but the defense will never be good enough for his terrible bat.

 

He's basically a -2 WAR player right now. If the bat (worst in baseball) stays the same, Hechavarria will have to become Ozzie Smith to be worth a damn.

 

 

I think even if he was ozzie smith on defense because of his bat he would only be a 1-2 war guy at best.

 

 

And that would be when he's in his prime as a batter.

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