July 27, 200521 yr http://insider.espn.go.com/mlb/columns/sto...yson&id=2108800 A.J. Burnett MARKET REPORT The transactions column may not be heating up much as the trade deadline approaches. But at least the GM poker games are getting better. In one corner, you find the Marlins -- trying to up the ante on Burnett by spreading word everywhere that they may just keep him if they can't get what they want. And now, in another corner, you have their No. 1 dance partner, the White Sox -- turning their attention away from Burnett and toward other areas where they might be able to deal for an impact player or two. The White Sox may not have gotten too far in their furious charges in the direction of Jason Schmidt or Barry Zito. But there were indications Tuesday that they have been working on a potential whopper of a deal with Tampa Bay that could bring them both Danys Baez and Aubrey Huff. And to get them, the White Sox would have to give up at least some of the pitchers they've been speaking to Florida about -- particularly relievers Damaso Marte, Cliff Politte and/or Neal Cotts -- plus other prospects. The White Sox are all about positioning themselves to win the World Series now. And if they can't get a dominating starter, they wouldn't mind adding a power closer. "I know Dustan Hermanson has done a great job," says an official of one team that has been talking with the White Sox. "But he's not striking anybody out. He's getting guys out with a lot of back-door sliders. And if you're a playoff team, he's not a guy you want closing games for you in October." Huff, who has hit better than .300 and slugged over .550 the last four weeks, could be a fit for the White Sox at third base, first base, DH or right field. But even if the White Sox can make this deal, there are indications they are still trying to figure out how they can do it and also trade for Burnett. One executive who has been in contact with the White Sox says they've made it clear that they would only deal their best starting-pitching prospect, Brandon McCarthy, for Burnett or some other top-of-the-rotation starter. McCarthy would still loom as the centerpiece of any trade with Florida. But is he enough? An official of one team that spoke with the Marlins on Tuesday reported that they continue to tell other clubs they've decided not to deal Burnett "unless it's the deal THEY want to make, for the pieces THEY want back." And it seems clear now that the deal they want to make with the White Sox would include both Marte and McCarthy. But the White Sox are reluctant to trade Marte. And even if they did, that package would be hard for Florida to accept unless it can make a separate deal for a veteran starter, such as Pittsburgh's Mark Redman. So as all this percolates, the Red Sox are still expressing interest in Burnett. And one baseball man now rates the Tigers as a dark horse -- if only because the Tigers think they can sign Burnett, either this month or this winter. Among the players it's believed Florida has targeted with Detroit are pitcher Mike Maroth and good-looking rookie outfielder Curtis Granderson (hitting .357 since his July 22 call-up). OK, got all that? We'd still bet on Burnett landing in Chicago this week. But right now, just about anything is possible. Maroth doesn't do much for me, but Granderson is a decent prospect. I'd still rather get one of the White Sox OF prospects, though, than Granderson, if that's what the FO is looking for.
July 27, 200521 yr I like Granderson a lot, he's going to be very good. And he's ready now. And Maroth is a solid lefty, 28 years old. He's just as good as Redman, in my opinion, so we could hold on to whatever we were going to do there. I'm not sure how Granderson fits in the picture if we're keeping Lowell, but I like him more than any one else mentioned in any of these deals. They would need to put something else in to touch the White Sox offer though.
July 27, 200521 yr Acquiring Granderson would have to coincide with a trade of Lowell, yes? I think Beinfest is playing this brilliantly, by the way. I can't remember the last time trade talks have gone on this long. He's waiting for HIS package, so says the article. This makes me very happy. I believe he's learned a lesson from the LA trade of 04.
July 27, 200521 yr Author I believe he's learned a lesson from the LA trade of 04. 875693[/snapback] One can only hope.... And I'd agree that acquiring Granderson doesn't make much sense without trading Lowell, as Hermida is already penciled in as RF next year. Unless one of them can play CF (and the team was willing to jettison Pierre), Lowell would have to be moved to create room for both Granderson (or Anderson from the Sox) and Hermida to play in the OF in 2006, unless one of them (most likely whoever is acquired in a trade) was used as trade bait in the offseason.
July 27, 200521 yr Granderson is looking to be a huge prospect. With the loss of White being a given this offseason, Granderson is looking to be a huge part of the Tigers future. Dombrowski would have to be 100% sure he could sign Burnett if he were to ship off Grandy.
July 27, 200521 yr I like this quote for the Marlins: "they continue to tell other clubs they've decided not to deal Burnett 'unless it's the deal THEY want to make, for the pieces THEY want back.'"
July 27, 200521 yr Granderson is not that great of a prospect first of all. If we trade Burnett for Granderson and Maroth then Beinfest really is stupud and the deal will be even worse than what O's offered us. Also tell me how can the Marte, McCarthy dela be better than the Sanchez, Arroyo deal? This is the way I look at: Best prospect in all the deals offer to us? Sanchez Most potential? Sanchez Best MLB player? I would take Arroyo over Marte and Julio so he's my pick as well. I don't know what the Marlins are waiting for especially with the Pirates demanding for Hermida. Im also hearing trading Olsen a possibilty? Why would the FO do this? If tehy did wouldn't you say its retarded? Seriouisly though im almost hoping Clement is out for 3 or 4 weeks and the Red Sox add something else (even if they don't have to) cause the way I see things going now Marlins are about to get raped in a trade and we are going to morgage the futire.
July 27, 200521 yr Granderson is not that great of a prospect first of all. If we trade Burnett for Granderson and Maroth then Beinfest really is stupud and the deal will be even worse than what O's offered us.875948[/snapback] Granderson is a top 50 prospect. Look at what he's done in the majors since his callup. He's major league ready and will only get better.
July 27, 200521 yr Granderson is a top 50 prospect. Look at what he's done in the majors since his callup. He's major league ready and will only get better. He is not a top 50 prospect in any list I have seen he's 24 I think already. Strike out a ton of times(112 K's in AAA) http://www.minorleaguebaseball.com/app/mil...milb&pid=434158 Yea he has good numbers in the majors now but has only had 17 AT BATS!!!!!!!!
July 27, 200521 yr 1. CURTIS GRANDERSON, of? ? ?? Age: 24 Ht: 6-1 Wt: 185 B-T: L-R Drafted: Illinois-Chicago, 2002 (3rd round)?? Signed by: Jerome Cochran?? Background: Granderson proved he could hit in 2002. He finished second in the NCAA Division I batting race with a .483 average, trailing only Rickie Weeks (.495)?who would become the No. 2 overall pick the following year. After signing for $469,000 as a third-round pick, Granderson again finished runner-up for a hitting crown, this time with a .344 average in the short-season New York-Penn League. But for all his hitting ability, scouts weren?t impressed by the rest of his game. Though he skipped a level and had a solid if unspectacular performance at high Class A Lakeland in 2003, he still didn?t win scouts over. Even some Tigers officials began to lose faith in him. But Granderson quickly gained believers with his breakout year at Double-A Erie in 2004. He ranked fourth in RBIs and eighth in batting in the Eastern League, and his other tools all seemed to climb a notch. His September callup made him the first Illinois-Chicago player to reach the majors. Strengths: Granderson is a classic line-drive, gap-to-gap hitter. He has a quick and compact batting stroke, a good grasp of the strike zone and identifies pitches early. He made an adjustment to become more selective upon reaching Double-A, as reflected in his career-best 80 walks. His gap-hitting approach seems tailor-made for Detroit?s spacious Comerica Park. Once labeled as a corner outfielder who wouldn?t have enough power to play every day in the majors, Granderson nearly doubled his previous career high in homers and made defensive strides in center field. He gets good jumps and takes correct routes to the ball. His range is average for center and above average on the corners. Granderson?s arm is accurate, and he?s a smart player who throws to the right base. His makeup and work habits are outstanding, as evidenced by his decision to complete his college degree after signing as a junior. He shows the potential to be a clubhouse leader if he continues to perform on the field. Weaknesses: Granderson isn?t going to produce big-time power. He benefited from playing his home games at Erie?s cozy Jerry Uht Park, though 13 of his 21 homers and 27 of his 48 extra-base hits came on the road. Another rap on Granderson was that many scouts considered him a fringe-average runner who lacked the speed of a true center fielder. Now there are just as many scouts who say that knock is overstated, however, and that his speed may actually rate a tick above average. The Future: With Alex Sanchez arbitration-eligible for the first time, the Tigers likely will be looking for a new center fielder in 2005. Granderson was assigned to the Arizona Fall League to work on his reads in the outfield and is considered a viable option to take over. If the Tigers don?t look outside the organization to address the need, Granderson?s primary competition during the spring will come from Nook Logan and Craig Monroe. If he doesn?t win the everyday job out of spring training, he?ll start the year at Triple-A Toledo. BaseballAmerica.com Now, obviously, Sanchez is a better prospect than him. But how many pitching prospects do we need!? And yeah, he's 24...he's also major league ready, he's not in AA. And he may have 112 AAA strikeouts, but he hit .297/.361/.520 so who cares. If he's gonna hit .300, he can strike out as much as he wants.
July 27, 200521 yr Now, obviously, Sanchez is a better prospect than him. But how many pitching prospects do we need!? And yeah, he's 24...he's also major league ready, he's not in AA. And he may have 112 AAA strikeouts, but he hit .297/.361/.520 so who cares. If he's gonna hit .300, he can strike out as much as he wants. Well Josh Williangham has like night and day better # tha him and hasn't gotten a fair chance what makes you think Granderson will? Why do we need a major league ready OF now? where would he play? how can u say he is ready after only like 20 at bats? Also that many K's in AAA don't translate well to the major's. Another thing you never have to much pitching, Look how loaded with pitching the Cubs minor league system was a couple of years ago and what has that gotten them? Guzman(hurt), Jones(traded), Blasko(hurt and scuffling), Brownlie(scuffling), Sisco(Royals Rule 5 Draft). Anibal Sanchez potential- 1,2,3 starter Chris Granderson potential- league average Arroyo > Maroth as well
July 27, 200521 yr As for Willingham...Granderson can actually play in the field. I still don't take a whole lot of stock in those strikeouts when he's hitting like he he is an his OBP is over .350. The only time I can't stand tons of strikeouts is when you're hitting .230 and you're in a major RBI spot in the lineup. And if you want to get techincal on the ready thing, fine, he's proven he's worth of an extended major league look. I fail to see what the Cubs pitching has to with us. What Cubs pitcher doesn't get hurt? We have a logjam of pitchers in AA, I just don't see the point in acquiring more. Like Shamrock said, you would think if we were to acquire Granderson, Lowell would eventually be moved, either now or in the off-season. And I disagree on the league average personally. I've seen him play a couple times here and I've been very impressed.
July 27, 200521 yr Guys, this is pointless. AJ will not get dealt to the Tigers. They'd be nuts to give up the farm to get him when they're really playing for '06 at this point. Not to say they won't throw buckets of cash at him in the offseason, but it just isn't happening, especially when it seems we have to be absolutely bowled over by an offer to trade AJ...at least at this stage.
July 27, 200521 yr I believe he's learned a lesson from the LA trade of 04. 875693[/snapback] One can only hope.... And I'd agree that acquiring Granderson doesn't make much sense without trading Lowell, as Hermida is already penciled in as RF next year. Unless one of them can play CF (and the team was willing to jettison Pierre), Lowell would have to be moved to create room for both Granderson (or Anderson from the Sox) and Hermida to play in the OF in 2006, unless one of them (most likely whoever is acquired in a trade) was used as trade bait in the offseason. 875716[/snapback] the la trade was awesome, what is wrong wit u people, we traded away a 1st baseman that had so many holes in his swing and an out-of-shape pitcher that gets injuried alot, in return we got an awesome catcher, a RF, and a good reliever, the only thing he did wrong ever was not signing pudge and lee and went for lo duke and delgado. i kno pudge wanted to much but pudge and lee are making about wat delgado and lo duca are making. :plain
July 27, 200521 yr I believe he's learned a lesson from the LA trade of 04. 875693[/snapback] One can only hope.... And I'd agree that acquiring Granderson doesn't make much sense without trading Lowell, as Hermida is already penciled in as RF next year. Unless one of them can play CF (and the team was willing to jettison Pierre), Lowell would have to be moved to create room for both Granderson (or Anderson from the Sox) and Hermida to play in the OF in 2006, unless one of them (most likely whoever is acquired in a trade) was used as trade bait in the offseason. 875716[/snapback] the la trade was awesome, what is wrong wit u people... 876130[/snapback] What is wrong with your reading comprehension? Shamrock was talking about with how the market was handled and manipulated prior to any serious trade talks.
July 27, 200521 yr Author I believe he's learned a lesson from the LA trade of 04. 875693[/snapback] One can only hope.... And I'd agree that acquiring Granderson doesn't make much sense without trading Lowell, as Hermida is already penciled in as RF next year. Unless one of them can play CF (and the team was willing to jettison Pierre), Lowell would have to be moved to create room for both Granderson (or Anderson from the Sox) and Hermida to play in the OF in 2006, unless one of them (most likely whoever is acquired in a trade) was used as trade bait in the offseason. 875716[/snapback] the la trade was awesome, what is wrong wit u people, we traded away a 1st baseman that had so many holes in his swing and an out-of-shape pitcher that gets injuried alot, in return we got an awesome catcher, a RF, and a good reliever, the only thing he did wrong ever was not signing pudge and lee and went for lo duke and delgado. i kno pudge wanted to much but pudge and lee are making about wat delgado and lo duca are making. :plain 876130[/snapback] Wow. I might have disagreed with the LA trade, but that's not what I was talking about when referencing Shamrock's post at all. That trade is over and done with and there's no sense bitching about it anymore, because it doesn't do much good and sparks up way too much of an angry divide over it to engage in a civil conversation for the most part (as you so eloquently proved with your defense of the trade). Beinfest handled the way he shopped Penny much differently (and worse, IMO) than the way he is handling the Burnett-a-palooza - specifically, he's actually trying to create a market for Burnett by using the media et al, which is just about the opposite of what he did with Penny. How much did you hear from the mainstream media about Brad Penny being on the block as compared to A.J. Burnett? Not even close to what's been put out there about Burnett, which could have helped in depressing Penny's value compared to the return Beinfest could have received had he more aggressively shopped Penny with the help of the media and other sources.
July 27, 200521 yr I believe he's learned a lesson from the LA trade of 04. 875693[/snapback] One can only hope.... And I'd agree that acquiring Granderson doesn't make much sense without trading Lowell, as Hermida is already penciled in as RF next year. Unless one of them can play CF (and the team was willing to jettison Pierre), Lowell would have to be moved to create room for both Granderson (or Anderson from the Sox) and Hermida to play in the OF in 2006, unless one of them (most likely whoever is acquired in a trade) was used as trade bait in the offseason. 875716[/snapback] the la trade was awesome, what is wrong wit u people, we traded away a 1st baseman that had so many holes in his swing and an out-of-shape pitcher that gets injuried alot, in return we got an awesome catcher, a RF, and a good reliever, the only thing he did wrong ever was not signing pudge and lee and went for lo duke and delgado. i kno pudge wanted to much but pudge and lee are making about wat delgado and lo duca are making. :plain 876130[/snapback] Wow. I might have disagreed with the LA trade, but that's not what I was talking about when referencing Shamrock's post at all. That trade is over and done with and there's no sense bitching about it anymore, because it doesn't do much good and sparks up way too much of an angry divide over it to engage in a civil conversation for the most part (as you so eloquently proved with your defense of the trade). Beinfest handled the way he shopped Penny much differently (and worse, IMO) than the way he is handling the Burnett-a-palooza - specifically, he's actually trying to create a market for Burnett by using the media et al, which is just about the opposite of what he did with Penny. How much did you hear from the mainstream media about Brad Penny being on the block as compared to A.J. Burnett? Not even close to what's been put out there about Burnett, which could have helped in depressing Penny's value compared to the return Beinfest could have received had he more aggressively shopped Penny with the help of the media and other sources. 876174[/snapback] well w/e all i know is that if it never happened we would not be as good.
July 27, 200521 yr I dont see a middle relief or closer help in there. Watching that game last night I think it is obvious that is our need for this ball club. IF we are gonna trade AJ we really need to get some middle relief badly back along with a starter. Now, I dont see that happening so. I think we will keep AJ and make a trade for a closer/middle relief.
July 27, 200521 yr Granderson is not that great of a prospect first of all. If we trade Burnett for Granderson and Maroth then Beinfest really is stupud and the deal will be even worse than what O's offered us. Also tell me how can the Marte, McCarthy dela be better than the Sanchez, Arroyo deal? This is the way I look at: Best prospect in all the deals offer to us? Sanchez Most potential? Sanchez Best MLB player? I would take Arroyo over Marte and Julio so he's my pick as well. I don't know what the Marlins are waiting for especially with the Pirates demanding for Hermida. Im also hearing trading Olsen a possibilty? Why would the FO do this? If tehy did wouldn't you say its retarded? Seriouisly though im almost hoping Clement is out for 3 or 4 weeks and the Red Sox add something else (even if they don't have to) cause the way I see things going now Marlins are about to get raped in a trade and we are going to morgage the futire. 875948[/snapback] I dont see why the Red Sox would have any extra incentive to make a better deal for Burnett, unless Burnett can pitch in Arroyos spot and Clements spot, which he obviously cant. Plus we have Papelbon in AAA who can come in and start. I dont see why the Marlins insist on the White Sox offer over the Red Sox. If they insist on getting a MR and a SP why wouldnt they just take Arroyo and deal him for a MR whos a hell of alot better than Marte? Plus Sanchez > McCarthy so if you could get a better SP prospect and a SP who, if they wanted, they could trade for a top CL why wouldnt they do it?
July 27, 200521 yr well w/e all i know is that if it never happened we would not be as good. 876179[/snapback] OMG! LEAVE THIS SITE IMMEDIATELY! YOU ARE BEYOND HELP!
July 27, 200521 yr I like Willingham A LOT. But he is overrated as far as a prospect is concerned. Albuquerque- everybody hits. Dillon and Willingham's stats are inflated there.
July 27, 200521 yr Granderson is not that great of a prospect first of all. If we trade Burnett for Granderson and Maroth then Beinfest really is stupud and the deal will be even worse than what O's offered us. Also tell me how can the Marte, McCarthy dela be better than the Sanchez, Arroyo deal? This is the way I look at: Best prospect in all the deals offer to us? Sanchez Most potential? Sanchez Best MLB player? I would take Arroyo over Marte and Julio so he's my pick as well. I don't know what the Marlins are waiting for especially with the Pirates demanding for Hermida. Im also hearing trading Olsen a possibilty? Why would the FO do this? If tehy did wouldn't you say its retarded? Seriouisly though im almost hoping Clement is out for 3 or 4 weeks and the Red Sox add something else (even if they don't have to) cause the way I see things going now Marlins are about to get raped in a trade and we are going to morgage the futire. 875948[/snapback] I dont see why the Red Sox would have any extra incentive to make a better deal for Burnett, unless Burnett can pitch in Arroyos spot and Clements spot, which he obviously cant. Plus we have Papelbon in AAA who can come in and start. I dont see why the Marlins insist on the White Sox offer over the Red Sox. If they insist on getting a MR and a SP why wouldnt they just take Arroyo and deal him for a MR whos a hell of alot better than Marte? Plus Sanchez > McCarthy so if you could get a better SP prospect and a SP who, if they wanted, they could trade for a top CL why wouldnt they do it? 876215[/snapback] We've already given you all the logical reasons, so at this point I can only add that they won't do it simply to aggravate you.
July 27, 200521 yr Granderson is not that great of a prospect first of all. If we trade Burnett for Granderson and Maroth then Beinfest really is stupud and the deal will be even worse than what O's offered us. Also tell me how can the Marte, McCarthy dela be better than the Sanchez, Arroyo deal? This is the way I look at: Best prospect in all the deals offer to us? Sanchez Most potential? Sanchez Best MLB player? I would take Arroyo over Marte and Julio so he's my pick as well. I don't know what the Marlins are waiting for especially with the Pirates demanding for Hermida. Im also hearing trading Olsen a possibilty? Why would the FO do this? If tehy did wouldn't you say its retarded? Seriouisly though im almost hoping Clement is out for 3 or 4 weeks and the Red Sox add something else (even if they don't have to) cause the way I see things going now Marlins are about to get raped in a trade and we are going to morgage the futire. 875948[/snapback] I dont see why the Red Sox would have any extra incentive to make a better deal for Burnett, unless Burnett can pitch in Arroyos spot and Clements spot, which he obviously cant. Plus we have Papelbon in AAA who can come in and start. I dont see why the Marlins insist on the White Sox offer over the Red Sox. If they insist on getting a MR and a SP why wouldnt they just take Arroyo and deal him for a MR whos a hell of alot better than Marte? Plus Sanchez > McCarthy so if you could get a better SP prospect and a SP who, if they wanted, they could trade for a top CL why wouldnt they do it? 876215[/snapback] We've already given you all the logical reasons, so at this point I can only add that they won't do it simply to aggravate you. 876491[/snapback] No really tell me why the Marlins prefer the White Sox package over the Red Sox?
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