I don't know if it was mentioned anywhere but yesterday Barry Jackson in the Herald quoted city commissioner Sanchez saying the Marlins have reduced their contribution by $30 million to $40 million and that he's losing his patience with the Marlins.

I had heard this same thing. Supposedly originating with Loria and/or MLB. I can understand there feeling of running out of patience. I know that I did years ago when Loria failed to provide the needed 30M gap, with or without MLB's blessing. Here's the only municipality within 100 miles willing to put up millions to buy a rich man a stadium, and he lowers his contribution. That on top of not even attempting to negotiate with Pompano, and sloughing off Hialeah. This may be what's best for the franchise from a money point of view, and the handful of fans around the country can go along, but as a local fan I'm sick with the whole thing. Loria should be boiled in oil, then tarred and feathered and run out of town, first, without getting to witness the same fate for Samson.

I don't know if it was mentioned anywhere but yesterday Barry Jackson in the Herald quoted city commissioner Sanchez saying the Marlins have reduced their contribution by $30 million to $40 million and that he's losing his patience with the Marlins.

i gave up on new ball park issue. if their want go other town GO AHEAD WISE THEM GOOD LUCK IN THEIR NEW CITY

I suppose soon we will know one way or another how this will finally play out , I am jaded and skeptical BUT i still hold onto a sliver of hope that despite everything this will get worked out

I love MB.com

 

:lol

I love MB.com

 

:lol

COOL. BUILD A STADIUM. WITH FREE PARKING

I don't know if it was mentioned anywhere but yesterday Barry Jackson in the Herald quoted city commissioner Sanchez saying the Marlins have reduced their contribution by $30 million to $40 million and that he's losing his patience with the Marlins.

both sides need to move if they want this to get done as much as Loria believes he is holding all the cards , i dont see any other place that is going to give him a 100% public funded stadium , and I dont think he wants his mark on baseball to be the guy who gutted and relocated two teams that is unprecedented and would truly be a black mark on Loria and baseball for allowing Loria to own a team...That said Miami/ Dade need to recognize that that Orange bowl is not the best site and make some more financial concessions to get this done because I dont think they want the Marlins to leave on their watch .

Mr Loria, you are a bad, bad, very bad man!

The more things change the more they remain the same.

Hey Admin, you better find an available Rays-themed web address.

Jerry Del Castillo said on his radio show today (11/27/07) that the City and County continue in negotiations with the Marlins over the stadium. One of the points the politicians are trying to include in the deal is a guarantee that the team won't have a minor league payroll. They want Loria to guarantee a competitive team at least as far as salaries are concerned.

Jerry Del Castillo said on his radio show today (11/27/07) that the City and County continue in negotiations with the Marlins over the stadium. One of the points the politicians are trying to include in the deal is a guarantee that the team won't have a minor league payroll. They want Loria to guarantee a competitive team at least as far as salaries are concerned.

Right, that is something we will never see Loria agree to, or if he does, how would they enforce it-by locking out the Marlins if the payroll goes below the floor. In reality, if MLB does not have a cap or a floor, it would be hard to figure how the landlord can make this one of the lease provisions.

Jerry Del Castillo said on his radio show today (11/27/07) that the City and County continue in negotiations with the Marlins over the stadium. One of the points the politicians are trying to include in the deal is a guarantee that the team won't have a minor league payroll. They want Loria to guarantee a competitive team at least as far as salaries are concerned.

Right, that is something we will never see Loria agree to, or if he does, how would they enforce it-by locking out the Marlins if the payroll goes below the floor. In reality, if MLB does not have a cap or a floor, it would be hard to figure how the landlord can make this one of the lease provisions.

 

 

I am not Loria's biggest fan but the city and or county dont have right to dictate the Marlins payroll , if they think it is low maybe they can kick in 30 million a year for payroll unless they are willing to do that they should shut up . Even when I lived in Miami I didnt know who Jerry Del Castillo is let alone listen too him, but every time someone from this forum post something heard on his show it always turns out to be false . I would be interested if anyone has heard any credible news on the stadium front because this waiting is killing me

Jerry Del Castillo said on his radio show today (11/27/07) that the City and County continue in negotiations with the Marlins over the stadium. One of the points the politicians are trying to include in the deal is a guarantee that the team won't have a minor league payroll. They want Loria to guarantee a competitive team at least as far as salaries are concerned.

That's a hoot! After all the bad news I needed to hear something funny. That is just freakin hysterical! :lol :lol :lol

Jerry Del Castillo said on his radio show today (11/27/07) that the City and County continue in negotiations with the Marlins over the stadium. One of the points the politicians are trying to include in the deal is a guarantee that the team won't have a minor league payroll. They want Loria to guarantee a competitive team at least as far as salaries are concerned.

Right, that is something we will never see Loria agree to, or if he does, how would they enforce it-by locking out the Marlins if the payroll goes below the floor. In reality, if MLB does not have a cap or a floor, it would be hard to figure how the landlord can make this one of the lease provisions.

 

 

I am not Loria's biggest fan but the city and or county dont have right to dictate the Marlins payroll , if they think it is low maybe they can kick in 30 million a year for payroll unless they are willing to do that they should shut up . Even when I lived in Miami I didnt know who Jerry Del Castillo is let alone listen too him, but every time someone from this forum post something heard on his show it always turns out to be false . I would be interested if anyone has heard any credible news on the stadium front because this waiting is killing me

Maybe, but the city is ponying up millions to pay for a new stadium for Loria's private business. I see no problem attaching such strings to government handouts. If Loria received a new stadium and then went ahead and fielded a team with a payroll similar to the past few years, he should be run out of town by mobs with torches and pitchforks.

I don't think the city / county should do a deal without payroll strings. Other teams have cut payroll after getting new stadiums and given Loria's track record I wouldn't be surprised if he did it as well.

Is there any way to force loria out of the ownership and sell the team to say mark cuban, that would be nice

I don't think the city / county should do a deal without payroll strings. Other teams have cut payroll after getting new stadiums and given Loria's track record I wouldn't be surprised if he did it as well.

Name them. The only ones I can think of were after salary increases and as part of rebuilding plans (Brewers). Frankly, good for teams investing in something besides million dollar 30-something reserves and talentless middle relievers with names. Weeks, Fielder and Hardy are awesome regardless of their pay rate.

The Brewers opened the new stadium in the '01 season. Here are their payroll figures:

'00 - $35.8 M

'01 - $45.0 M

'02 - $50.3 M

'03 - $40.6 M

'04 - $27.5 M

 

The Pirates opened the new stadium in the '01 season. Here are their payroll figures:

'00 - $26.6 M

'01 - $57.8 M

'02 - $42.3 M

'03 - $54.8 M

'04 - $32.2 M

 

In the '07 season they were 4th from the bottom in payroll.

 

There are several teams with new stadiums taht are towards the bottom of MLB in total payroll. The widely accepted assumption, even by many Loria haters, is that a new stadium will turn us into mid-level payroll team allowing us to keep the Cabreras and Hanleys. In my opinion that's a ridiculous assumption to make.

The Brewers opened the new stadium in the '01 season. Here are their payroll figures:

'00 - $35.8 M

'01 - $45.0 M

'02 - $50.3 M

'03 - $40.6 M

'04 - $27.5 M

 

The Pirates opened the new stadium in the '01 season. Here are their payroll figures:

'00 - $26.6 M

'01 - $57.8 M

'02 - $42.3 M

'03 - $54.8 M

'04 - $32.2 M

 

In the '07 season they were 4th from the bottom in payroll.

 

There are several teams with new stadiums taht are towards the bottom of MLB in total payroll. The widely accepted assumption, even by many Loria haters, is that a new stadium will turn us into mid-level payroll team allowing us to keep the Cabreras and Hanleys. In my opinion that's a ridiculous assumption to make.

I rarely dabble in business talk, but can somebody compare media markets of Miami/South Florida to Milwaukee and Pittsburgh. Can we get a general population and TV deal impact where it is very likely the Marlins will become mid-market overnight (as of course, confidence will be restored (or created?) towards baseball to an extent never seen in Miami with a firm commitment to the team to stay here for 30+ years). Right, so Miami probably kills those two cities right away. I do not feel they are analogous even though they received new stadiums and kept payroll "low."

 

Now add in the Marlins have an awesome young core that's a lot better then Milwaukee 00 and Pittsbugh 01, and should be a .500+ team by 09, and could get a hell of a lot better very fast depending on how many of the pitchers develop into reasonable expectations. This satisfies the other part of this town where they only come if you're good. If payroll were to be low, it would be after an initial 3-4 year boom when it isn't new anymore and the team is just flailing. Not right away. I maintain the Field of Dreams stance towards all ballpark news. Hope the City of Miami figures it out one of these days.

The Brewers opened the new stadium in the '01 season. Here are their payroll figures:

'00 - $35.8 M

'01 - $45.0 M

'02 - $50.3 M

'03 - $40.6 M

'04 - $27.5 M

 

The Pirates opened the new stadium in the '01 season. Here are their payroll figures:

'00 - $26.6 M

'01 - $57.8 M

'02 - $42.3 M

'03 - $54.8 M

'04 - $32.2 M

 

In the '07 season they were 4th from the bottom in payroll.

 

There are several teams with new stadiums taht are towards the bottom of MLB in total payroll. The widely accepted assumption, even by many Loria haters, is that a new stadium will turn us into mid-level payroll team allowing us to keep the Cabreras and Hanleys. In my opinion that's a ridiculous assumption to make.

I rarely dabble in business talk, but can somebody compare media markets of Miami/South Florida to Milwaukee and Pittsburgh. Can we get a general population and TV deal impact where it is very likely the Marlins will become mid-market overnight (as of course, confidence will be restored (or created?) towards baseball to an extent never seen in Miami with a firm commitment to the team to stay here for 30+ years). Right, so Miami probably kills those two cities right away. I do not feel they are analogous even though they received new stadiums and kept payroll "low."

 

Now add in the Marlins have an awesome young core that's a lot better then Milwaukee 00 and Pittsbugh 01, and should be a .500+ team by 09, and could get a hell of a lot better very fast depending on how many of the pitchers develop into reasonable expectations. This satisfies the other part of this town where they only come if you're good. If payroll were to be low, it would be after an initial 3-4 year boom when it isn't new anymore and the team is just flailing. Not right away. I maintain the Field of Dreams stance towards all ballpark news. Hope the City of Miami figures it out one of these days.

I'm sure Loria will generate more revenues than some of the other owners with new stadiums but I wouldn't assume the additional revenues will result in additional payroll. I don't trust Loria.

 

============

 

In '07 the average team payroll was $82.6 M. The Brewers were 14% below the average. The Reds were 17% below the average. The Padres were 30% below the average. The Pirates were 53% below the average.

The Brewers opened the new stadium in the '01 season. Here are their payroll figures:

'00 - $35.8 M

'01 - $45.0 M

'02 - $50.3 M

'03 - $40.6 M

'04 - $27.5 M

 

The Pirates opened the new stadium in the '01 season. Here are their payroll figures:

'00 - $26.6 M

'01 - $57.8 M

'02 - $42.3 M

'03 - $54.8 M

'04 - $32.2 M

 

In the '07 season they were 4th from the bottom in payroll.

 

There are several teams with new stadiums taht are towards the bottom of MLB in total payroll. The widely accepted assumption, even by many Loria haters, is that a new stadium will turn us into mid-level payroll team allowing us to keep the Cabreras and Hanleys. In my opinion that's a ridiculous assumption to make.

I may be wrong, but I believe that you can add San Diego, Arizona, and Seattle to the list. In fact RFerry, I'd ask you to supply a list of teams that raised payroll by more than 33% average in the 5 years after the opening of a new stadium.

I mainly just hope that we get a stadium, but I have no illusions that Loria will raise payroll signifigantly. I expect that he'll operate in the manner he's operated in by and large since he's been the owner. Start with a relatively low payroll, but be willing to spend a bit to add pieces to a contending team. That seems to be a good business model.

Perhaps I'm missing something in those figures and those of other teams cited, but I see an initial investment that trailed off due to 1. reduced revenue potential by reduced attendance, 2. rebuilding for the sake of winning.

 

The only argument you can make is Pittsburgh, and in their case, they're on the hook for a significant contribution, saw attendance drop very shortly after opening and are in perpetual rebuilding.

 

If you're trying to prove that teams make their most significant investments coinciding with the opening of a new stadium, congratulations. You've won the common sense awatd. A new stadium attracts many new fans that allow for greater investment and is the opportune time to build a fan base. If you're trying to prove that owners cut payroll and worthwhile investments below what they can afford to gain undue profits, then you have a hard argument to make. In operating a professional sport team, owners stand to gain more by expanding their revenue sources than cutting payroll.

If you're trying to prove that owners cut payroll and worthwhile investments below what they can afford to gain undue profits, then you have a hard argument to make. In operating a professional sport team, owners stand to gain more by expanding their revenue sources than cutting payroll.

That's one way of doing it. The other way, the painful one for fans, and the one you refuse to understand, is that an owner can increase his profits by simply slashing payroll to minimum levels as was the case with the '06 Marlins. By Loria slashing payroll by $45 million he improved his bottom line from a loss position to a $43 million profit.

The City/County have a right to dictate business management of the Marlins.

 

They are investing public dollars on the team in any potential deal and having the Marlins cut payroll would negatively impact the revenues coming into a new ballpark if fans are too disgusted with the team to attend games.