August 5, 201015 yr Simple, like the title says, what is your lineup, rotation and back end of the bullpen for the start of next year? Mine is: Maybin- CF Coghlan- 3B Hanley- SS Stanton- RF Uggla- 2B Morrison- LF Gaby- 1B Paulino/ Baker- C Pitcher To me that is a good blend of power, speed, and finesse with a lot less k's then what we have been used to for the last 4 or so years. Also, unlike our lineup for most of this year we have a good blend of righties and lefties especially when Baker plays. Rotation is: JJ Nolasco Anibal West Volstad Not much of a difference so no explanation needed. Hopefully Andrew Miller surprises though and learns how to throw strikes and makes us find a spot for him. My back-end of the bullpen: Closer- Nunez Set-Up- Hensley Set-Up-Ceda Not much new there either. I love Ceda though if he is healthy. What's your's? That's the exact same team I'd put out there, with probably starting off Ceda/Marinez in middle relief and Badenhop/Sanches remaining our guys in long relief. I've not totally been sold to Maybin being the long term solution, but next year we have no choice but to try it out. So you guys are saying no trades. No FA signings. Basically that Beinfest and Hill take the year off. Not buying into it. This thread is about 7 months too early. Well you can't predict injuries before the season. There isn't as much work for Beinfest and Hill next year imo. At most we may do a Robertson and get a veteran arm for the rotation and keep West/Volstad out. The big change will be in the bullpen, but considering we have nearly every player on our roster not named Cody Ross under team control for next season, this team really shouldn't change all that much. The big changes came with the call ups this year in Stanton/Morrison/West/Sanchez to prominent roles. And next year Maybin's gonna be called up (or this September) and Coghlan is gonna be moved to 3B. I think that's quite enough change. This team doesn't need a complete overhaul every year, and this year an overhaul isn't needed. Oh, and our bench will look a lot different next year.
August 5, 201015 yr I'd love for Maybin to come and be an asset in this lineup next season. Just a high obp (380 +) guy who scores runs, and steals bases along with good defense in CF is what we need from him. Pending how things go in ST I'd be headin in with a Lineup of Coghlan 3B Sanchez 1B Ramirez SS Uggla 2B Stanton RF Morrison LF Sanchez 1B Baker/Paulino C Maybin CF Bench Murphy Bonifacio Carroll FA Baker/Paulino Rotation J.J. FA/Trade (Would Love James Shields or Matt Garza) Nolasco Volstad Sanchez/Miller/West/FA Bullpen is looking better but we need to either secure Ohman or sign another proven bullpen arm to add to Hensley, Nunez, Badenhop, Sanches, Veras, Ceda, Marinez, Sanabia and whoever else will compete for a bullpen spot.
August 5, 201015 yr I agree with MMP in that I'd want stanton batting 5th and not 4th. With Uggla's high OBP, I'd like him to be on base for Big Poppa Pump.
August 5, 201015 yr Yeah if Uggla and Hanley can get on base ahead of Giancarlo he could be looking at an 100 + RBI season.
August 5, 201015 yr I agree with MMP in that I'd want stanton batting 5th and not 4th. With Uggla's high OBP, I'd like him to be on base for Big Poppa Pump. Although Uggla has a good OBP I think whoever hits behind him may not necessarily have as many runners on as you think because such as high percentage of Uggla's OBP comes from his homers and obviously if Uggla hits a homer the next guy wont have anyone on base.
August 5, 201015 yr Well that's not necessarily true. Daniel has 110 Hits and 55 Walks this season with a .368 OBP. 24 of those hits are HRs which is about 20 % so the other 80 + percent of the hits he'll be on base. Then addidng walks only 14 Pecent of his OBP (not including any HBP) are from HRs and the other 86 % of the time he has the chance to get driven in by Gicancarlo which could turn into ample RBI's for Mike if he continues to improve like he has over the past month.
August 5, 201015 yr I agree with MMP in that I'd want stanton batting 5th and not 4th. With Uggla's high OBP, I'd like him to be on base for Big Poppa Pump. Although Uggla has a good OBP I think whoever hits behind him may not necessarily have as many runners on as you think because such as high percentage of Uggla's OBP comes from his homers and obviously if Uggla hits a homer the next guy wont have anyone on base. And that's a problem?
August 5, 201015 yr I agree with MMP in that I'd want stanton batting 5th and not 4th. With Uggla's high OBP, I'd like him to be on base for Big Poppa Pump. Although Uggla has a good OBP I think whoever hits behind him may not necessarily have as many runners on as you think because such as high percentage of Uggla's OBP comes from his homers and obviously if Uggla hits a homer the next guy wont have anyone on base. And that's a problem? Home runs are never a problem. Noone on this board appreciates home runs more than I do. However, if the goal is to have Big Poppa Pump hit with a lot of runners on base then putting Uggla in front of him is not the best idea. If he hits 4th behind a guy like Hanley he would have more runners on than hitting behind a guy like Uggla. This year Uggla's non-homer OBP is .315 and since the '08 season it's .310 and those non-homer OBP numbers are pretty close to league average (excluding pitchers).
August 5, 201015 yr This year Uggla has a higher OBP than Hanley but the guy hitting behind Hanley has had him on base 150 times in 455 PAs while the guy hitting behing Uggla has had him on base "only" 142 times in 451 PAs.
August 5, 201015 yr The shape of the lineup will depend greatly on whether Maybin can fix his sh*t. With that said, I wouldn't want him batting 8th. That spot, to me, should always belong to a patient hitter who can draw a walk and take pitches (Baker) or a guy who doesn't K or BB much (Paulino.) The catching duo we have now fits fine there. Having a guy like Maybin, who a pitcher can strike out while working around is not the greatest idea. If he its 7th and gets on base for Baker/Paulino, we have a nicer shot of scoring because of his speed and ability to steal.
August 5, 201015 yr I agree with MMP in that I'd want stanton batting 5th and not 4th. With Uggla's high OBP, I'd like him to be on base for Big Poppa Pump. Although Uggla has a good OBP I think whoever hits behind him may not necessarily have as many runners on as you think because such as high percentage of Uggla's OBP comes from his homers and obviously if Uggla hits a homer the next guy wont have anyone on base. And that's a problem? Home runs are never a problem. Noone on this board appreciates home runs more than I do. However, if the goal is to have Big Poppa Pump hit with a lot of runners on base then putting Uggla in front of him is not the best idea. If he hits 4th behind a guy like Hanley he would have more runners on than hitting behind a guy like Uggla. This year Uggla's non-homer OBP is .315 and since the '08 season it's .310 and those non-homer OBP numbers are pretty close to league average (excluding pitchers). Veery eenteresting :mis2
August 6, 201015 yr I know this may sound crazy, but trade Gaby for a legit young #2 SP. With Gaby outperforming his expectations, his trade value is higher than it may ever be. Move Logan to 1st, where he is much more comfortable, leave Coghlan in LF, and sign a top notch veteran 3B (Not a Wes Helms type...we need all-star caliber). Clearly the starting rotation we have right now will not get us to the playoffs. We need to move everybody behind JJ down a spot. NEW starting pitching is the key. Praying for Volstad/West/Miller to be legit is not the answer.
August 6, 201015 yr Yeah I'd love to deal gaby for a Shields, Garza, Haren, Carnona but it won't happern.
August 6, 201015 yr Ramirez Coghlan Sanchez Stanton Uggla That's hitters 1-5. We'll get an idea about Morrison over the balance of this season. Cody just isn't looking like a threat at the plate anymore. Maybin does not appear to be an option. Paulino looks okay at times, but it would be nice to have a better bat there. Baker? We can't know. In Nolasco, Sanchez and JJohnson, the Marlins have three solid starters. The rest of the rotation will be a competition for the forseeable future. Ramirez belongs at the top of the order. He gets on base as much as anyone I believe and is much faster once he's there. It's nice to have some power in that spot too. I have already heard multiple references to the fact that Coghlan is an ideal two hitter ... leftiness a big plus. Sanchez is looking more and more like Edgar Martinez to me. He's a three hitter for the next five or ten years. Stanton is the team's superstar ... you can already see it. Folks like Uggla. He gives you pop at a position that most teams don't get it. However, if you are going to move him from second to third defensively, just get rid of him. While he is a great bat at second, he would rate as mediocre at third.
August 6, 201015 yr If Hanley bats leadoff to start next season when Coghlans healthy or Maybin is there ill write a strongly worded letter.
August 7, 201015 yr IMO when Maybin is inserted back in the line up, he should hit 9th. For one, we already have a capable lead off hitter (Coghlan) that puts up a good OBP and has decent speed For two, we have three #2 hitters (Gaby, Logan, and Baker). The less of these in the middle of the order, where power is important to drive in runs and instead have their high OBP in front of our SLG guys, the better. For three, Maybin has yet to show the ability to put up a good OBP, which is the most important thing for lead off. His career OBP is just .311, and as of now, we probably should still expect around a .700 OPS next season until he proves otherwise. So why 9 instead of 8? Because his speed is still an incredible asset. Now these are theoretica" runs, so obviously can't be taken 100%, but it's still better than nothing. Going by Baseball Prospectus' EQBRR, which assigns runs to: -SB, CS, and Pick offs -Advancing bases on ground balls/bunts -Advancing bases on fly balls -Advancing bases on hits -Advancing bases on passed balls and wild pitches (So i.e. the ability to go from first to third on a single, this is where you get credit for it) In his career, he's at 6.4 runs in about 75% of a seasons worth of base running opportunities. This puts him at around 9 runs in a full season, or about one win alone with his legs. I really don't like having him hit 8th with the pitcher up next who'll just bunt him over. He needs to be in front of guys where he's speed can then be best utilized. I'd much prefer to see something along the lines of Coghlan Gaby Hanley Uggla Stanton Logan Baker Pitcher Maybin Fredi talked about hitting Boni 9th last year, but it never materialized. And I doubt it happens now. But I'd love for it to happen. And while I personally don't believe in line up protection, if you are one to put stock in that, it allows him to still be at the bottom of the order while being protected by Coghlan. If Maybin proves he can put up at least a, say, .340 OBP, then sure, move him to lead off. Until then I'd prefer him hitting 9th.
August 7, 201015 yr I basically agree with everything. Although, I would love if we acquired a legit number two, push Nolasco and Sanchez down, and make Miller/West/Volstad battle each other for the number 5 spot. I would like this
August 7, 201015 yr Simple, like the title says, what is your lineup, rotation and back end of the bullpen for the start of next year? Mine is: Maybin- CF Coghlan- 3B Hanley- SS Stanton- RF Uggla- 2B Morrison- LF Gaby- 1B Paulino/ Baker- C Pitcher To me that is a good blend of power, speed, and finesse with a lot less k's then what we have been used to for the last 4 or so years. Also, unlike our lineup for most of this year we have a good blend of righties and lefties especially when Baker plays. Rotation is: JJ Nolasco Anibal West Volstad Not much of a difference so no explanation needed. Hopefully Andrew Miller surprises though and learns how to throw strikes and makes us find a spot for him. My back-end of the bullpen: Closer- Nunez Set-Up- Hensley Set-Up-Ceda Not much new there either. I love Ceda though if he is healthy. What's your's? That's the exact same team I'd put out there, with probably starting off Ceda/Marinez in middle relief and Badenhop/Sanches remaining our guys in long relief. I've not totally been sold to Maybin being the long term solution, but next year we have no choice but to try it out. So you guys are saying no trades. No FA signings. Basically that Beinfest and Hill take the year off. Not buying into it. This thread is about 7 months too early. Well you can't predict injuries before the season. There isn't as much work for Beinfest and Hill next year imo. At most we may do a Robertson and get a veteran arm for the rotation and keep West/Volstad out. The big change will be in the bullpen, but considering we have nearly every player on our roster not named Cody Ross under team control for next season, this team really shouldn't change all that much. The big changes came with the call ups this year in Stanton/Morrison/West/Sanchez to prominent roles. And next year Maybin's gonna be called up (or this September) and Coghlan is gonna be moved to 3B. I think that's quite enough change. This team doesn't need a complete overhaul every year, and this year an overhaul isn't needed. Oh, and our bench will look a lot different next year. We need far more than just one more SP. And you did say the pen. But ya gotta remember, you have to give to recieve. I'm not talking complete overhaul. But putting players where they are the best defensively and trading players that fill a defensive spot because of their bat is/should going to happen. Hopefully sooner rather than later. Defense wins championships. At the same time you don't want to lose guys like Hanley or Uggla. But there are plenty of teams that would take a bat that is under club control and give you a good return in arms. Fans may not like the names leaving, but....... And I do agree. Our bench will look different next year.
August 7, 201015 yr IF WE TRADE GABY WE'LL IMPROVE HE SUCKS!! But I'm sure I'm just putting words in your mouth here...... Just say it, and maybe give an idea what you think he can/should be traded for instead of these much-less-abstract-than-you-think posts.
August 7, 201015 yr NNY has a great point there. Having Maybin batting 9th could both create more run scoring opportunities with a double leadoff man but also it could create some more RBI opportunities. Let's say the LoMo and Baker/Paulino leadoff the inning by getting on base, we then have the pitcher to try to bunt them over, if successful that's 2nd and 3rd 1 Out for Maybin which is an easy RBI oppurtunity and should result in a run with a decent hit ball in play or you can even go with a safety squeeze if needed. I like the Idea and it could be good for the offense, we just need to make sure our pitchers can handle the bat well.
August 7, 201015 yr IF WE TRADE GABY WE'LL IMPROVE HE SUCKS!! But I'm sure I'm just putting words in your mouth here...... Just say it, and maybe give an idea what you think he can/should be traded for instead of these much-less-abstract-than-you-think posts. Probably get Garza and an middle infield prospect from Tampa Bay.
August 7, 201015 yr Tampa Bay needs a 1B next year and they have money issues as well. Gaby is real cheap for two years and pretty cheap for two more. Garza gets expensive and is expendable considering the pitchers that TB has ready for the bigs. Replacing the salaries of Garza and Pena might let TB keep Crawford.
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