I just love how Rays fans are demonized for having their money spending priorities in order (i.e. Food, Bills, and clothes come first). Last night Rays fans proved it's the bad economy the reason they don't attend more game. And the fact they're getting attacked for spending what little money they have in this economy on the essentials instead of baseball is pathetic. Most that have been interviewed in this area have said they're saving for the playoffs. Jeez.

 

 

17,000 is nothing.

 

33,215 saw the Marlins clinch in 2003, and our attendance sucks. That was a Friday though, so lets make it fair. The Tuesday before we clinched the Marlins brought in 25,311. The attendance on that last homestand averaged 29,452.

 

 

There wasn't a recession in 2003.

Nice try but how does that explain that the Rays are performing relatively worse than the other MLB teams? Tampa isn't the only city affected by the recession.

 

Let's assume that overall MLB attendance is down. This is going to affect most (if not all teams), except for those maybe like the Reds who have newly emerged as contenders. Even if the Rays are averaging less because people are "saving," the Rays are still 22nd of 30 relative to all major league clubs. That's inexcusable.

I just love how Rays fans are demonized for having their money spending priorities in order (i.e. Food, Bills, and clothes come first). Last night Rays fans proved it's the bad economy the reason they don't attend more game. And the fact they're getting attacked for spending what little money they have in this economy on the essentials instead of baseball is pathetic. Most that have been interviewed in this area have said they're saving for the playoffs. Jeez.

 

 

17,000 is nothing.

 

33,215 saw the Marlins clinch in 2003, and our attendance sucks. That was a Friday though, so lets make it fair. The Tuesday before we clinched the Marlins brought in 25,311. The attendance on that last homestand averaged 29,452.

 

 

There wasn't a recession in 2003.

 

So how come other playoff bound teams are still drawing much better crowds? They are just as likely as Rays fans to be suffering a bit financially

 

You haven't been paying attention then, look at the Reds and Braves, and if you read/watch the news you read that Tampa Bay is one of the areas that has been hit the worst.

Look I'm done with this, you keep ignoring what I'm saying and I keep repeating myself, so from this point forth, you wanna know why Rays fans don't attend, see signature... :banghead

Not demonized. Just not in a position to complain when payroll is being lowered (especially on a Marlins message board lolol).

 

 

Freedom's a B**** isn't it? And I didn't start the thread, only commented in it.

You missed the point entirely. He's not saying you can't talk about it, he's saying that we've been going through this for longer than you've had a team. We know about attendance. We know about all the reasons not to go, we have more of them than you do. To come and complain about this like you're talking to someone who is in a difference circumstance and to do it like we don't understand is ridiculous.

 

Look I'm done with this, you keep ignoring what I'm saying and I keep repeating myself, so from this point forth, you wanna know why Rays fans don't attend, see signature... :banghead

 

I'm just going one by one.

 

The Economy:

Yeah, I get this, but we're all going through this and it's not an excuse for being worse than many teams in a worse situation. Detroit, for instance, was ranked 4th worst hit by the economy according to the Brookings Institute and is 11th in attendance, while being out of the hunt a while ago. Phoenix was ranked 8th by Brookings and, while being one of the worst teams in the league, was 19th in attendance.

 

The Schedule:

This is stupid. Just a terrible reason. EVERY team plays 162 games, including the 21 teams with better attendance.

 

The Trop:

Not good enough. It's boring, it's sh*tty, it's drab, but it's not nearly a good enough reason not to go watch one of the best teams in baseball.

 

Also, noone is ignoring you, we just don't agree with your reasoning and we're mostly backing it up. If anyone is ignoring anything, it's the other way around.

Look I'm done with this, you keep ignoring what I'm saying and I keep repeating myself, so from this point forth, you wanna know why Rays fans don't attend, see signature... :banghead

 

 

 

Wow...did you write that?

Seriously, the schedule? Last I checked, every team plays 162 games (not 160 as the article stated, btw).

 

The only legit excuse is the crappy dome, and it's really not legit. The stadium sucks, but at least there's no weather excuse because of the dome.

Look I'm done with this, you keep ignoring what I'm saying and I keep repeating myself, so from this point forth, you wanna know why Rays fans don't attend, see signature... :banghead

 

 

 

Wow...did you write that?

Seriously, the schedule? Last I checked, every team plays 162 games (not 160 as the article stated, btw).

 

The only legit excuse is the crappy dome, and it's really not legit. The stadium sucks, but at least there's no weather excuse because of the dome.

 

No I didn't found it linked to on a Rays blog.

Why is it so hard to admit that perhaps Rays fans just aren't that loyal? Is it really that painful for you to say?

 

A lot of people here certainly criticize the Marlins' attendance and I wouldn't say we betray our team by doing so. I myself have repeatedly voiced the opinion here that the "threat of rain" excuse is probably too overstated. I genuinely believe that the Marlins haven't cultivated a good fanbase yet and I'm not afraid to say it.

 

I never understood why people need to be unflinching optimists for teams. People do the same for political parties and I never understood that either.

Why is it so hard to admit that perhaps Rays fans just aren't that loyal? Is it really that painful for you to say?

 

A lot of people here certainly criticize the Marlins' attendance and I wouldn't say we betray our team by doing so. I myself have repeatedly voiced the opinion here that the "threat of rain" excuse is probably too overstated. I genuinely believe that the Marlins haven't cultivated a good fanbase yet and I'm not afraid to say it.

 

I never understood why people need to be unflinching optimists for teams. People do the same for political parties and I never understood that either.

 

 

Because it simply isn't true. it takes more than reading Peter Gammons and ESPN to get all the facts. Do a search on Google. Read this blog. People are highly loyal to the Rays. What I don't get is why having you priorities straight is grounds for having your sports team taken away.

Because either

 

1) The owners lose mass amount of money, so then the team will just fold down the road

 

or 2) The owners get rid of players making any sort of amount of money, which in turn gives a team that isn't very good, which in turn does not bring in fans, and trading players then makes current fans unhappy, which lowers the fan base, which lowers attendance even more, which lowers payroll even more, repeat process

 

Don't look at it is as a fan, look at it realistically. Say it's "OK" because the fans care! is completely ignoring the actual franchise and what it takes to substain it. Fans have priorities strait? Good for them. And...who cares? What does that have to do with the team being unable to financially sustain themselves?

 

Any fan of the Marlins or Rays complaining about payroll just make me laugh. With the leaked financial documents, it just shows how f***ed those two teams are (Well, hopefully were in the case of the Marlins with the new stadium).

Why is it so hard to admit that perhaps Rays fans just aren't that loyal? Is it really that painful for you to say?

 

A lot of people here certainly criticize the Marlins' attendance and I wouldn't say we betray our team by doing so. I myself have repeatedly voiced the opinion here that the "threat of rain" excuse is probably too overstated. I genuinely believe that the Marlins haven't cultivated a good fanbase yet and I'm not afraid to say it.

 

I never understood why people need to be unflinching optimists for teams. People do the same for political parties and I never understood that either.

 

 

Agreed and agreed.

 

I think it's a cultural thing. Some places baseball is just more popular. That doesn't mean it's hopeless for everyone else; It can take a long time for a sports team to become culturally enriched within a geographic location.

 

Like someone already said, if all of a sudden the entire Rays organization moved to Pittsburgh and played in PNC Park (or if the Pirates themselves would play better), they would sell out pretty much every night. People go out and get drunk in Wrigley Field regardless of how the Cubs are doing. And since St. Petersburg is a crappy place for baseball, people aren't gonna go to The Trop to get drunk regardless of how the Rays are doing. If anything, being in the same division as the Yankees and the Red Sox greatly inflates the Ray's attendance. It's no surprise that the "embarrassing 10,000 fans in the stands" from David Price's tweet was during an Orioles series.

Why is it so hard to admit that perhaps Rays fans just aren't that loyal? Is it really that painful for you to say?

 

A lot of people here certainly criticize the Marlins' attendance and I wouldn't say we betray our team by doing so. I myself have repeatedly voiced the opinion here that the "threat of rain" excuse is probably too overstated. I genuinely believe that the Marlins haven't cultivated a good fanbase yet and I'm not afraid to say it.

 

I never understood why people need to be unflinching optimists for teams. People do the same for political parties and I never understood that either.

 

 

Because it simply isn't true. it takes more than reading Peter Gammons and ESPN to get all the facts. Do a search on Google. Read this blog. People are highly loyal to the Rays. What I don't get is why having you priorities straight is grounds for having your sports team taken away.

Does it take more than reading Evan Longora and David Price to get all the facts?

 

It is true. The fans aren't good enough to go out there.

 

Look, just because there are some loyal Rays fans that have a blog doesn't mean that the fanbase in general is the same way. The Marlins are in, I will say again, the same position. The fans on here are hugely loyal, die hard fans. This is the biggest, non-MLB or ESPN run team specific forum around. (Wow that sounds specific.) Does that mean that the Marlins have some great fanbase? No.

 

Your fanbase isn't good enough. You don't show up. All the reasons you gave apply to other franchises with teams that aren't nearly as good and they overcome it because they have good fanbases. The Rays (and the Marlins) do not.

 

This isn't about how much the fans like the team anyways. It's about showing up. If you don't show up, I don't care if you have 100,000 people who tattoo Raymond on their heads, it's about showing up. If you don't show up and vote with your wallet, you have absolutely no say in how much money the owners should spend. They shouldn't fit the bill because the fans don't show up.

Well-said Rab

If the Rays didnt play the Yankees and Red Sox 18 times a year at home, their attendance would be right where ours is.

 

I never thought Id say this, but theres a actually a city with a worse baseball fanbase than miami and not suprisingly its another florida city. Miami has a terrible fanbase but people down here do get on the bandwagon.

If the Rays didnt play the Yankees and Red Sox 18 times a year at home, their attendance would be right where ours is.

 

I never thought Id say this, but theres a actually a city with a worse baseball fanbase than miami and not suprisingly its another florida city. Miami has a terrible fanbase but people down here do get on the bandwagon.

 

Well, we do have the Mets, though the attendance for them has fallen the last two years since they've been bad.

If the Rays didnt play the Yankees and Red Sox 18 times a year at home, their attendance would be right where ours is.

 

I never thought Id say this, but theres a actually a city with a worse baseball fanbase than miami and not suprisingly its another florida city. Miami has a terrible fanbase but people down here do get on the bandwagon.

 

Well, we do have the Mets, though the attendance for them has fallen the last two years since they've been bad.

 

Eh the Mets arent even close to the draw the Yankees or the Red Sox are. We do get the Cubs though for one series a year.

According to Forbes.com the Tampa metropolitan area is the 10th worst hit area in this recession so don't ever tell me it's hitting this hard everywhere else. That's not true, facts say otherwise.

Detroit has a major league baseball team that has been mediocre this season. They were harder hit by that recession, and they have higher attendance.

San Diego was harder hit by the recession, and has had a comparable team to Tampa. Their attendance is better.

 

Blaming it on the recession is silly.

Detroit has a major league baseball team that has been mediocre this season. They were harder hit by that recession, and they have higher attendance.

San Diego was harder hit by the recession, and has had a comparable team to Tampa. Their attendance is better.

 

Blaming it on the recession is silly.

 

 

No it's not, just because people in other areas have extra money to spend doesn't mean everyone does, and it was proven Wednesday that it was the recession.

Detroit has a major league baseball team that has been mediocre this season. They were harder hit by that recession, and they have higher attendance.

San Diego was harder hit by the recession, and has had a comparable team to Tampa. Their attendance is better.

 

Blaming it on the recession is silly.

 

 

No it's not, just because people in other areas have extra money to spend doesn't mean everyone does, and it was proven Wednesday that it was the recession.

No it wasn't. Going to one game where 50% of the tickets are free is "proving it"? Because they gave away 20,000 tickets and still didn't sell out? That's proving it? The fans aren't good enough to pay their way into the stadium, that's the point. Going for free is easy. You give away 20,000 tickets to one game anywhere, even down here, and you'll see similar attendance figures.

 

Also, you're completely ignoring people at this point, right? Other places have been hit HARDER by the recession and have better attendance. That said, I did find a nice video on Forbes where they were claiming that sports were "recession proof".

 

(Also, can we go back to the whole thing that we understand perfectly because we're in the exact situation?)

 

 

BUT THIS IS ALL IRRELEVANT! As long as the fans don't show up (WITH MONEY), even if it's because the entire metropolitan area is too busy doing volunteer work while being on welfare themselves, they can't expect the ownership to outspend them. Why are people so willing to spend $70M dollars of someone else's money when they aren't willing to spend $12 bucks to go to a game?

 

That's as if I went into Best Buy, asked for a big screen but said "Sorry, I can't pay for it, I don't have the money", and then got mad when they didn't give it to me.

This is all going in circles.

According to Forbes.com the Tampa metropolitan area is the 10th worst hit area in this recession so don't ever tell me it's hitting this hard everywhere else. That's not true, facts say otherwise.

 

 

 

How much do tickets cost at Tropicana Field? I'm willing to bet that it's about the same cost as dinner and a movie. I'm sure you know of tons of people going out to do that tonight. When recession hits, people don't just stay home and stare at a wall. They may cut their entertainment expenses, but it's safe to say that baseball in Florida is still a relatively cheap form of entertainment.

 

From my perspective, I'd rather go see Catfish in theatres and then eat at Fuddruckers (like I'm doing today) and probably waste about 20 dollars than drive to BFE and watch a Marlins game live when I can just listen to it on the radio while driving to where I need to go. Personally, my problem with the stadium is getting there. I hate driving in general. I hate parking there. I hate the lines and fights people get into when leaving. It's not a fun experience for me. I consider myself a loyal Marlins fan, but I don't go to more than 5 or 6 games a season. Just because you're loyal doesn't mean you're at every game. With that said, just because you say TB has tons of loyal fans doesn't mean that payroll should rise if they don't show up to games (like me.)

This is all going in circles.

 

That's only because he keeps saying "NANANANANA I CAN'T HEAR YOU".

Detroit has a major league baseball team that has been mediocre this season. They were harder hit by that recession, and they have higher attendance.

San Diego was harder hit by the recession, and has had a comparable team to Tampa. Their attendance is better.

 

Blaming it on the recession is silly.

 

 

No it's not, just because people in other areas have extra money to spend doesn't mean everyone does, and it was proven Wednesday that it was the recession.

 

Ok, then if Tampa doesn't have the disposable income to support a team during a recession when other franchises do, then Tampa shouldn't have a team. It's that simple. Other areas were hit just as hard if not harder by the recession and are still managing to support their teams at better levels.

 

That's the reality you don't want to accept. If you have to keep coming up with reasons why the city not only will not, but CAN NOT, support this team, then the team shouldn't be in that city.

You guys are missing the point...many people DON'T go to dinner and a movie cause they can't afford it. People can't just crap out money, jeez. So you can't judge one area on another area, the economy differs.

So then the Tampa area cannot support the Rays, and they should be contracted.