“Hanley is going to be Hanley,� Helms said. “There are some things with Hanley we just kind of have to deal with, as far as I guess the showboat stuff. It’s not going to change. We’ve tried to, but it’s not. But the way he’s approached his at-bats, the way he’s approached his defense, the way he’s come to the field every day and not really bothered anybody, standing upon himself, I’ve definitely seen a big difference [since McKeon took over].�

 

Helms said that when the Marlins were in Texas last month, he had a conversation with veteran umpire Joe West about Ramirez and his change in attitude. “Joe West said if this kid plays 162 games with 100 percent heart, he’ll be a Hall of Famer. And it’s true. He’s that good,� Helms said.

 

“Hanley is one of these guys where he’ll always need that guy to keep him where he needs to be. Not all of us can self-motivate ourselves.�

 

http://www.miamihera...-impressed.html

 

Why do reporters continue to seek out this player's opinion? Why does anyone credit this player with veteran leadership?

 

If there is an actual veteran ballplayer on this team that we should hear from, it's our 2012 starting center fielder, Mike Cameron.

 

I will not ever understand how this player feels it is appropriate to speak about another player, who is infinitely more talented and has already accomplished more than him in his entire career. The player who shall not be named has 692 hits in thirteen seasons. The other is starting his second thousand in his sixth season.

 

We all know how good Hanley is. Is there anything more un-leader-like than making underhanded comments at a teammate, criticizing his attitude and mental ability, and cleaning it all up with a comment that everybody already knows to be true?

 

And this all coming from a player who does not contribute on the field, and has essentially been earning charity for the last three seasons. Those back-to-back home runs with Joe Borchard in Baltimore in 2006 are a long way in the past.

He's just saying what everyone has been saying for the past couple of years.

 

And don't forget that he's been here since Hanley was a rookie aside from a season or two, so he may know him best out of the current players.

Coming from him, given what he does on the team, it's so far beyond comical that he would say it. There's an awe inspiring lack of self-awareness with this player.

He's just saying whats true. You can have all the talent and success in the world but don't be surprised when people talk about you when your an asshole. Hanley is to old to be acting like a hot shot. I would expect it from a 18-22 year old. Not a 27 year old at this point that has struggled the majority of the year. He has supposedly been knocked back a few notches but judging by Helms quotes, he still has somethings to change.

 

Like I said on another Hanley post, I can tolerate and like his game when he's good but dont act like a child when your batting below .200

If Joe West tried not being a di*k 100% of the time for all 162 games he would be a slightly below average umpire instead of completely awful.

Say what you will about Uncle Wes' career and veteran leadership, but I don't disagree with anything he said. Despite Hanley's immense talents, he's still yet to embrace the leadership role despite the Marlins being "his" team.

Coming from him, given what he does on the team, it's so far beyond comical that he would say it. There's an awe inspiring lack of self-awareness with this player.

 

 

He's not criticizing Hanley's talent, though. It's his attitude.

 

Despite how much Helms sucks, he handles himself much more properly than Hanley, I'm sure. Like a professional :mischief .

Helms knows our local writers are enamored with him so he gets away with saying the stupidest things because he knows he'll go unchallenged.

Coming from him, given what he does on the team, it's so far beyond comical that he would say it. There's an awe inspiring lack of self-awareness with this player.

 

 

He's not criticizing Hanley's talent, though. It's his attitude.

 

Despite how much Helms sucks, he handles himself much more properly than Hanley, I'm sure. Like a professional :mischief .

 

it is unprofessional to criticize and call out another player, especially when he is playing well now. acting like a professional from the bench doesnt do much.

Since I'm in California I really don't see all the team reports or pick up the little tidbits of information others do on here, but I was under the impression that Hanley's attitude has improved this year as compared to years past. Are there specific examples of showboating that Hanley does? From what I've gathered most people complain about him carrying his bat a few steps down the first base line, but he explained it as helping him to remember to follow through. True or not its been working so I'm not going to complain about that.

you don't have to be a good player to be a good coach. He is speaking with a coach's mentality. He sees a situation, and is not afraid to speak his mind on the situation. I know a lot of people on here think that because he sucks as a player, his coaching potential hit the crapper....this is not the case at all.

Coming from him, given what he does on the team, it's so far beyond comical that he would say it. There's an awe inspiring lack of self-awareness with this player.

 

 

He's not criticizing Hanley's talent, though. It's his attitude.

 

Despite how much Helms sucks, he handles himself much more properly than Hanley, I'm sure. Like a professional :mischief .

 

it is unprofessional to criticize and call out another player, especially when he is playing well now. acting like a professional from the bench doesnt do much.

There is also something called constructive criticism. In order to make it past high school baseball, you have to be able to handle constructive criticism.

Coming from him, given what he does on the team, it's so far beyond comical that he would say it. There's an awe inspiring lack of self-awareness with this player.

 

 

He's not criticizing Hanley's talent, though. It's his attitude.

 

Despite how much Helms sucks, he handles himself much more properly than Hanley, I'm sure. Like a professional :mischief .

 

it is unprofessional to criticize and call out another player, especially when he is playing well now. acting like a professional from the bench doesnt do much.

There is also something called constructive criticism. In order to make it past high school baseball, you have to be able to handle constructive criticism.

 

Yes.

 

But why does this get aired out to the media? Say it to him every day, every 15 minutes in the clubhouse or in private, but direct quotes to a reporter?

Coming from him, given what he does on the team, it's so far beyond comical that he would say it. There's an awe inspiring lack of self-awareness with this player.

 

 

He's not criticizing Hanley's talent, though. It's his attitude.

 

Despite how much Helms sucks, he handles himself much more properly than Hanley, I'm sure. Like a professional :mischief .

 

it is unprofessional to criticize and call out another player, especially when he is playing well now. acting like a professional from the bench doesnt do much.

There is also something called constructive criticism. In order to make it past high school baseball, you have to be able to handle constructive criticism.DON'T TALK CRAP ABOUT YOUR TEAMMATES IN THE MEDIA.

This is rather simple, really. Helms can say this in the clubhouse, but shut up to the media.

Coming from him, given what he does on the team, it's so far beyond comical that he would say it. There's an awe inspiring lack of self-awareness with this player.

 

 

He's not criticizing Hanley's talent, though. It's his attitude.

 

Despite how much Helms sucks, he handles himself much more properly than Hanley, I'm sure. Like a professional :mischief .

 

it is unprofessional to criticize and call out another player, especially when he is playing well now. acting like a professional from the bench doesnt do much.

There is also something called constructive criticism. In order to make it past high school baseball, you have to be able to handle constructive criticism.

He isn't criticizing his play, swing, or even defense. He's whining about mannerisms. People are different but everyone wants Hanley to fit into this stupid mold. Get over it. Is he really hurting your feeling by holding onto a bat for 3 seconds?

 

The artist formerly known as Uncle Wes actually said its a good thing just that Hanley "has not really bothered anybody." Wow

you don't have to be a good player to be a good coach. He is speaking with a coach's mentality. He sees a situation, and is not afraid to speak his mind on the situation. I know a lot of people on here think that because he sucks as a player, his coaching potential hit the crapper....this is not the case at all.

 

 

he should be afraid to speak his mind to the media like that with his production and career.

 

most great coaches were not very good pros.

 

maybe he's auditioning to be the Braves third base coach.

Coming from him, given what he does on the team, it's so far beyond comical that he would say it. There's an awe inspiring lack of self-awareness with this player.

 

 

He's not criticizing Hanley's talent, though. It's his attitude.

 

Despite how much Helms sucks, he handles himself much more properly than Hanley, I'm sure. Like a professional :mischief .

 

it is unprofessional to criticize and call out another player, especially when he is playing well now. acting like a professional from the bench doesnt do much.

There is also something called constructive criticism. In order to make it past high school baseball, you have to be able to handle constructive criticism.

He isn't criticizing his play, swing, or even defense. He's whining about mannerisms. People are different but everyone wants Hanley to fit into this stupid mold. Get over it. Is he really hurting your feeling by holding onto a bat for 3 seconds?

Funnily enough, it went without notice that he stopped doing that "bat pose" for a while this season while trying to work sh*t out. Eventually, the coaches told him he had to start doing it again, because it's part of his swinging motion. He's been ridiculous since he brought it back.

Holding the bat 3 seconds doesnt bother me and never will,, its the stuff that effects the team, and there has been documented cases of it over the past few years.

 

Helms was/is wrong for going to the media with Beef but what he says is true.

I can put up with Hanley having some personality and self-pride, The showboating is fine when the team is winning or your doing good. Just don't let your attitude effect your play negatively for the team. Im sure most people can agree with that.

Maybe im old fashioned but I like my athletes to be pissing off the other team with his antics, not his own team.

Just saying, what if Wes didn't "go" to the media, but they asked him the question. Doesn't that change your perception of all this?

Are there specific examples of showboating that Hanley does?

 

 

Acting like a sprinkler head when he gets an extra base hit.

Dude, Squall Your putting words in my mouth while ignoring others.

 

I said and i quote "its the stuff that effects the team, and there has been documented cases of it over the past few years. " and then down i said "Just don't let your attitude effect your play negatively for the team." I commenting on how it effects the teams morale and not just the play."

 

But just for example of "play", last year he booted the ball then half assed ran to it. Big story, im sure we havent forgot that one.

For my original example, there has been multiple issues with hanleys attitude inside the clubhouse regardless of how big they are, they were there and they got out from many different names on the team. http://sportsillustr...irez/index.html

Blog piece but contains the quotes and context for the incident. Dont read for the authors opinion.

 

 

About ignoring some of my comments,

"I can put up with Hanley having some personality and self-pride, The showboating is fine when the team is winning or your doing good. "

 

I just said in that comment that i can put up with the showboating. I never once mentioned anything about Hanley being a "leader" because personally i dont care for him to be one.You may have just been using that for an example so forgive me if I took it as anything other then that. I just want him to perform on a level he is capable of performing with all that talent. He has struggled the majority of this year which all great players go through, ill give him that.

Just saying, what if Wes didn't "go" to the media, but they asked him the question. Doesn't that change your perception of all this?

 

 

As i already stated, Wes was wrong for saying anything, but lets not forget that during the incident I specifically used, Hanley calls out the rest of his teammates and blast the manager to the press. I sure hope there isnt a double standard there.

 

And for the record, I do not have a problem with the sprinkler head move because hanley is doing well.

Are there specific examples of showboating that Hanley does?

 

 

Acting like a sprinkler head when he gets an extra base hit.

Didn't he come out and say its a dedication to his mother who used to attend games" but now that she's gone back home he does it for a young fan as well? I can see how people take it as showboating without knowing context. I just believe what happened in years past is past and he has shown an effort to mature this year and there aren't really examples of him being this guy with a bad attitude towards teammates, opponents, or whoever else people say.

Wes Helms shouldn't be saying anything about Hanley Ramirez. Helms is a terrible baseball player who has had one good season in his life. I think he's a little jealous that no matter how hard he plays every game, he will never put up good numbers with a full season of at bats as a starting player.

Are there specific examples of showboating that Hanley does?

 

 

Acting like a sprinkler head when he gets an extra base hit.

Didn't he come out and say its a dedication to his mother who used to attend games" but now that she's gone back home he does it for a young fan as well? I can see how people take it as showboating without knowing context. I just believe what happened in years past is past and he has shown an effort to mature this year and there aren't really examples of him being this guy with a bad attitude towards teammates, opponents, or whoever else people say.

 

Yeah he did, which is why I have no problem with it. Even if he didnt have a reason, as long as he was playing well, i couldnt give to craps about it. There are points you can pick from the start of the season, such as the Lomo cast issue with Hanley not signing it for charity and others, but when it boils down to it, Its all an opinion issue. Each person is going to have an different view point. Hanley was wrong or Lomo is wrong, its a matter of personal opinion.

 

His teammates came out at the beginning of the year and said he was showing signs of trying to get along better with everyone else, which was great news. I follow the Heralds Fish Bytes blog which is where alot of my information comes from.