from the Saturday Palm Beach Post

 

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Spooneybarger calls McKeon 'gutless'

 

 

By Joe Capozzi, Palm Beach Post Staff Writer

Saturday, July 19, 2003

 

 

 

Injured relief pitcher Tim Spooneybarger on Friday called Marlins manager Jack McKeon "gutless" over the handling of Spooneybarger's sore right elbow.

 

"The thing that upset me the most is making it seem like I'm not hurt,'' said Spooneybarger, on the disabled list since June 17.

 

He is angry about comments McKeon said to reporters in early July when the manager was asked when the reliever would return.

 

"I don't know,'' McKeon said at the time. "Ask him. He's the one that says this tingles, that tingles. He's already missed, what, a month?''

 

Spooneybarger, rehabbing in Jupiter last week, kept quiet about his feelings until Friday.

 

"To act like I'm a scrub. Like I don't want to pitch? I'm not hurt?The man can't come talk me and ask me if I'm hurt?''

 

On June 17, team doctors diagnosed him with elbow tendinitis based on a MRI exam taken that day. Still bothered a week later, Spooneybarger visited orthopedic surgeon Dr. James Andrews, who found a strained ligament on the same MRI.

 

"To come out and say, 'this tingles and that tingles,' the MRI said I was fine, that's (crap). I didn't know he was a doctor. You're telling me not to listen to the best orthopedic surgeon in the country who told me I was hurt?' '' Spooneybarger said.

 

"I think it's kind of strange how I've seen three or four or five doctors and they all said my ligament was fine. Then I take the same MRI to Dr. Andrews and my ligament is strained. Who do I listen to?"

 

Spooneybarger recalled a team meeting McKeon called on May 11, his first day as manager. "His opening remarks were 'I'm not gonna talk about anybody in the papers. We can talk face to face.' Well, he hasn't said a word to me and he's bashed me in the paper. I think he's pretty gutless.

 

"I got somebody who I thought would be on my side bashing me. I was leading relievers in baseball at one point in amount of innings pitched and I don't want the ball?''

 

Spooneybarger said he hadn't spoken to McKeon since the team's trip to Arlington, Texas, last month.

 

"I could care less about him. He's got two more months left probably in his career. The guy's 85 (72), on his last leg. I got 20 more years,'' he said.

 

But before Friday's game, and after reporters went to McKeon for reaction to Spooneybarger's comments, the manager met privately with the pitcher.

 

Later, McKeon said he and the reliever patched up their differences. "I don't have any problem with him. I just want to have him back.''

 

Spooneybarger said: "Bottom line is I want to pitch. But I don't want to injure myself so I have to miss a year. Do I push myself... or do I take the advice of the best doctor in the country?''

 

joe_capozzi@pbpost.com

 

Spooney Mouths Off - Palm Beach Post

Nice article....Spooneybarger seems pretty stoic to stand up to McKeon and say all that stuff about his age like that.

No, this is not stoic. Going straight to McKeon and asking him whats up would be stoic. Going though the media to express your displeasure is pretty gutless and childish. This guy is starting to sound like John Rocker-lite, doesnt know when to keep his mouth closed. And people were wondering why he was left off the Braves postseason roster last year.

I think Spooneybarger has a very valid point. All too often in sports these days, we hear about athletes having their injuries downgraded so they can get back out on the field as soon as possible, and they end up jeopardizing their future. I believe a former Jacksonville Jaguar won a lawsuit against the team for forcing him to play with an injury (that ultimately got worse and forced him to retire). Spooneybarger makes a living through baseball, so he has a right to make sure he's not risking his career by playing.

 

I do think his comments regarding McKeon and his age were uncalled for however.

Going though the media to express your displeasure is pretty gutless and childish.

 

But that's exactly what Jack McKeon did.

Im not saying McKeon is any less guilty of this. I just dont think Spooney should be praised for going through the media. To me, its extremely childish on both their parts. Its like when two people get mad at each other and then wont talk to each other, they relay messages through a third person. Except here the third person is making the comments public knowledge.

I don't know,'' McKeon said at the time. "Ask him. He's the one that says this tingles, that tingles. He's already missed, what, a month?''

 

If this comment offends Spooney, then Spooney must feel like part of this is the truth. Lets face it, as soon as McKeon started to use him for more than 1 inning, he started to complain, then ultimately on the DL. From the sound of things, it sounds like the pitchers did what they wanted to before McKeon like staying in the clubhouse during games, etc. Soes Spooney have this in his contract that he can only pitch a certain amount. Spooney is acting like an immature baseball brat, ones similar to McKeon had in Cincy except the guys in CIncy had proved themselves in the ML for 10+yrs. If I remember correctly, McKeon had a great bullpen in Cincy in 99 and 00 with three or four relievers getting a lot of work.

 

If Spooney does come back, he will no longer be the setup man and will be expected to go two innings. his arm motion is fine. MRI is fine but to pacify the athlete/agent, it now could be a sprain. What a freakin baby.

I don't know,'' McKeon said at the time. "Ask him. He's the one that says this tingles, that tingles. He's already missed, what, a month?''

 

If this comment offends Spooney, then Spooney must feel like part of this is the truth. Lets face it, as soon as McKeon started to use him for more than 1 inning, he started to complain, then ultimately on the DL. From the sound of things, it sounds like the pitchers did what they wanted to before McKeon like staying in the clubhouse during games, etc. Soes Spooney have this in his contract that he can only pitch a certain amount. Spooney is acting like an immature baseball brat, ones similar to McKeon had in Cincy except the guys in CIncy had proved themselves in the ML for 10+yrs. If I remember correctly, McKeon had a great bullpen in Cincy in 99 and 00 with three or four relievers getting a lot of work.

 

If Spooney does come back, he will no longer be the setup man and will be expected to go two innings. his arm motion is fine. MRI is fine but to pacify the athlete/agent, it now could be a sprain. What a freakin baby.

 

Great post! My sense is that Spooney's comments have a bit to do with Urbina being the new setup guy. McKeon was clearly saying to the kid, if you don't want to or can't pitch, I'm finding someone who can. No doubt he has a problem, but to go after McKeon as viciously as he did was unconscionable. Certainly is reminds me of the problem he had with Mazzone when he was in Atlanta.

 

Is there a behavioral problem here? I tend to think so.

This is a very good thread, great posts all around. You know I am excited when we start integrating philosophical belief systems into baseball!

 

The questions seem to be, who is right here? Neither, both McKeon and Spoon should have discussed this with one another without the media. The question though, is why?

 

It seems that McKeon was visibly frustrated without having Spoon. I dont know when the question was asked him, but what if some reporter asked McKeon 'where is Spoon' after the Marlins blew a late lead with their bullpen? Frustration certainly would have tainted his mind...

 

I think it is interesting how some of you suggest that the pitchers in the clubhouse were acting like spoiled brats previous to McKeon's arrival. I think that is very true. But the other interesting thing here is, and this is a very troubling trend, the doctor vs. organization argument. Did the doctors for the Marlins mis-diagnose Spoon? If so, what were their intentions? Or did Dr. Andrews, in his bid to make more $$, stretch the information to his benefit? This could be a bitter conflict that has caused many problems for our young staff and their health. They might not trust team doctors and are more willing to go with outside sources who just want to make a buck and please their new clients in an effort to obtain more business.

MRI is a modern technique used to detect these types of injuries. The bottom line is about the desire to be the best. Obviously, McKeon feels like this staff could be the best if they put their minds to it. With his experience and connections within the baseball environment, he would not be pushing guys out there if the medical doctors cleared him. Does Spooney have the desire and fortitude to be the best? Scott Williamson from the Reds in 99 went through a similar ordeal with McKeon when McKeon questioned his "guts." Sure he eventually hurt his arm but not because overuse but because of his mechanics. Most arms are hurt prior to getting to the ML not during the ML. With his previous issues in Atlanta, he is quietly developing a reputation as a pitcher who does have what it takes to be a consistent top-notch pitcher.

 

What was even funnier was his comment "Spooneybarger said: "Bottom line is I want to pitch. But I don't want to injure myself so I have to miss a year. Do I push myself... or do I take the advice of the best doctor in the country?''

 

For goodness sake, Andrews said it was a strain! I bet every pitcher has a strain at some point from just throwing and soreness. If McKeon was accurate about the lifestyle of the pitching staff before he got there, then I bet Spooney is feeling the effects of another Spring Training type of discomfort.

 

Stay on the DL and milk it, Spooney. We have Urbina now and combined with Looper have a good closing group. Add a strong LH setup guy and we could easily go 7-9 with these guys. Spooney, your days as a setup have diminished...Long reliever at best until you prove you got what it takes.

Spoony sounds like a child. Talk about overreacting. No wonder the Braves coaches had problems with him. McKeon's comments weren't anything over-the-top, just trying to get the kid back on the mound as soon as possible. Meanwhile Spoony says the coach is "on his last leg" and "probably has only 2 months left in his career". A-hole.

 

Whatever, it's probably just the injury that's frustrating him...

I'm sick of seeing these players complain to the media. Work out your problems with the person you have a problem with. As far as I'm concerned Spooney you can take your time cuz we don't need you that bad anymore.

Soft a$$ spooney can't even step up and talk with a 72 yr. old man.

Tim is acting very unprofessional. You don't take your problems to the media.

 

Jack Mckeon was in the wrong as well. There is no need for this kind of distraction.

 

Spooney needs to get the aid he needs for his injury and return to help this club. Fighting with the manager solves nothing.

As much as I like Spooney, he is not making me happy. Jack is going to win Tim, face it. Be professional and talk to him in private, not call him names in a newspaper.

Hey Spooneybarger, cry me a river... :boo-woo

it says they 'patched' up their differences..... lets hope so

 

and Spooney better come back soon

I'm sick of seeing these players complain to the media. Work out your problems with the person you have a problem with. As far as I'm concerned Spooney you can take your time cuz we don't need you that bad anymore.

Soft a$$ spooney can't even step up and talk with a 72 yr. old man.

 

As much as I like Spooney, he is not making me happy. Jack is going to win Tim, face it. Be professional and talk to him in private, not call him names in a newspaper.

 

I find all these comments incredibly ironic, considering it was McKeon who first decided to vent his frustrations to the media instead of Spooneybarger himself. Some of you have said McKeon is also at fault, but 90% of this thread is just Spooney-bashing.

 

If what Spooneybarger said is true, that McKeon promised never to talk about anyone in the papers, then McKeon flat out lied to his players. Doesn't anyone find something wrong with that?