August 3, 200521 yr :clapping :clapping :clapping :clapping :clapping This is my reaction to this new deal. I ABSOLUTELY LOVE this deal. Miami had a great team last year, and probably could of beat Detroit if they were healthy, but I doubt they could have beaten San Antonio. Now you have an ELITE team, not great anymore. With Walker you get a normal #1/2 option now at # 3. He offensively is an obvious upgrade from Eddie Jones. For the people who think Walker is going to just chuck up shots you are truly foolish. Do you really think Riles didn't bring that subject up???!!!! Please..... He isn't a great defensive player, but now the Heat have a true SF, Eddie was nice, but he is used to playing the 2, not the 3. The Heat do loose a bit defensively, but they still have the 5 million exception.... Jason Williams is also a nice pick-up. His job will be very easy with Miami. Give the ball to Shaq and Wade, and now Walker. I like this deal more not because we get Williams, but because we dont have Wade playing point. I love Wade, he is my favorite player, but has a tendancy to turn the ball over. Also, if I am the Heat, I want Wade to focus on shooting, driving to the basket, and being able to give the outlet pass, not have to do all of that, AND having to worry about bringing the ball up the floor, getting everyone involved, and all the other jobs of a PG. James Posey solidifies the Bench and Andre Emmet, can be good at times with an ability to get to the basket, but needs to improve the jump shot. He also is a CRAZY dunker. In fact,i believe he was on ESPN during a dunk contest a couple of years ago. Cant wait for next season!! IMO, as far as the East goes, 1.Heat 2.Pistons 3. Pacers..Had the Heat last year as the second best team in the Heat, but with the Pistons dropping a little bit (Admin Brown's Departure) and the Heat improving with this trade, they are the team to beat in the East.
August 3, 200521 yr I hate the deal. The Heat were 1 game away from going to the NBA Finals and if Shaq was 100% and Wade wasn't a p***y bitch with a cheap injury, we would have been in the Finals guaran-damn-teed.? No sense in messing up the entire team like this, frankly I think Riley is just making this deal to make a deal, since he can't coach, he's just doing it so he can feel important and be able to take credit for the team if we do actually win the whole thing.? /rant *PUTS ON FLAME SUIT* 886608[/snapback] Wow, I'm ashamed you call yourself a fellow Heat fan. Rants are one thing but this is just a disgrace. We messed up an entire team? I'd like to know how. By trading someone we've been trying to trade for years, by dumping a streaky bench player, or by sending away a player that people just figured out was actually on the Heat? And if Riley is just making a deal to make a deal, why the hell not? It's not like we traded away someone of major importance. So in sumnation, blow me. Anyway, I'm pumped with this deal. I was never a fan of Rasual and EJ had his moments but I shall survive without more of them. I realize 'Toine doesn't have great defense or is the most consistent but it's not to the point that it would essentially hurt our team. He's not even being asked to fulfill a major role, EJ was an asset...not a star. Plus with the addition of JWill, Dwyane can stay at SG so it's perfect. Way to go, Riles. 886663[/snapback] I agree with the last paragraph. And oh my Lord, did you have to serve Accord that badly?? :o
August 3, 200521 yr Some analysis and quotes added to the original AP article: Hours after signing Shaquille O'Neal to a five-year deal, the Heat added three significant pieces to a roster that nearly reached the NBA Finals last season. "We traded a lot, but we got back three quality players," said Heat president Pat Riley. "Antoine Walker is one of the very best multi-faceted, versatile players in this game. ... He is able to handle the ball, pass it, make plays, shoot 3's and rebound the ball. There isn't anyone in this league better at doing that." Walker, a three-time All-Star, figures to become the starting small forward and would be backed up by Posey, one of the league's better defenders. Walker signed a six-year deal worth nearly $53 million with Boston as of the deal's preliminary framework, and agent Mark Bartelstein said he appreciated the Celtics' willingness to help out their longtime forward. "Antoine is thrilled," Bartelstein said. "This was a grueling process trying to put a sign-and-trade together. This took a lot of time and work and energy from a lot of people." Williams would take over as Miami's starting point guard if Damon Jones leaves as a free agent. Jones exits Miami after five years with the Heat. "I spoke to him and he's appreciative of the five great years he's had in Miami," agent Leon Rose said. "He's proud that he's helped build something, although it's unfortunate that he won't be able to see it to fruition. But he wishes the organization nothing but the best." Riley wished the three players leaving Miami well, especially Jones, whom he called "the consummate professional through thick and thin." "I know he had fun and he was a major part of this," Riley said. "But in order to get something good back, you have to give up something good going out. I wish him nothing but the best." Memphis acquired Borchardt earlier Tuesday in a deal in which Sacramento got Bonzi Wells from the Grizzlies in exchange for guard Bobby Jackson and Ostertag. The Hornets did not give up any players under contract in the megatrade, which was approved by league officials late Tuesday night. "Our cap flexibility is what allowed us to get these two players as part of this deal," Hornets general manager Allan Bristow said. "We were able to acquire two young, quality players while only giving up the rights to a player who has never appeared in a Hornets uniform." Walker, who averaged 19.1 points and nine rebounds last season for Atlanta and Boston, will be a welcome addition to the Heat, said forward Udonis Haslem -- who formally signed his $30.7 million, five-year deal Tuesday. "We're two different players and we can bring two different things to the table," Haslem said, a few hours before the trade got done. "If we put that together, we should have a pretty good tandem." Miami reached Game 7 of the Eastern Conference finals this past season -- even though O'Neal and Dwyane Wade were both hurt at the time. And not only was Jones a starter on that team, he was the Heat's best perimeter defender -- a role that Heat president Pat Riley and coach Stan Van Gundy have long valued. Jones, a career 16.4-point-per-game scorer, averaged 12.7 in the regular season and 13.7 in the playoffs as Miami's third option. "Eddie Jones is an All-Star caliber player who has had a terrific NBA career. He is a great 3-point shooter who will make an immediate impact on our offense, while also serving as a solid defender in the backcourt. We look forward to Eddie finishing his NBA career in Memphis," Grizzlies president Jerry West said. Williams averaged 10.1 points and 5.6 assists for the Grizzlies last season. Riley likened his playmaking ability to Steve Nash and Jason Kidd. "He is a very athletic, quick, explosive scorer and has great experience," Riley said. "One of the reasons why we are making the trade is that we haven't had anyone here like that since Tim Hardaway left." Posey was limited to 50 games this past season because of injuries, and only 18 starts. He averaged 8.1 points and 4.4 rebounds. The trade capped a flurry of activity by the Heat -- who moved quickly once the league's moratorium on player signings expired Tuesday at noon ET. O'Neal was signed to a $100 million contract; the move was expected, although the contract was considerably smaller than what O'Neal figured to command. Haslem said the team has full confidence in whatever personnel choices Riley and general manager Randy Pfund make. "Since I've been here, they've made great decisions," Haslem said. "And I'm sure they'll make the right decision here." http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2122976
August 3, 200521 yr oh and NO ONE calls my man a p***y bitch with a cheap injury! 886673[/snapback] Come on, rib injuries aren't that bad. They just limit range of motion and make it almost impossible to breathe. Wade only had what, 25 in game 7? :plain
August 3, 200521 yr Shaq at 100 for 5 is a steal, but I can guarantee he isn't going to play all 5 of those years. He will play 3 or 4 of them and win a title, maybe two.? Great deal though, the Heat have SOME wiggle room with the cap now despite still having the big man around. 885696[/snapback] explain how? the heat will be over the cap for many many years like most teams in this league. 886473[/snapback] Shaq was being paid 30 mil per year, took a paycut of 10 per year to stay around. Eddie was going to make 15 mil. Posey makes 6 mil, JWill makes 9. That equals Eddie. Antoine makes 6-7. We lose Butler, Woods salary. We still will be under the luxury tax and thats how it works.
August 3, 200521 yr oh and NO ONE calls my man a p***y bitch with a cheap injury! 886673[/snapback] Come on, rib injuries aren't that bad. They just limit range of motion and make it almost impossible to breathe. Wade only had what, 25 in game 7? :plain 886674[/snapback] I do believe it was the trainer's decision about Wade not playing, not Wade.
August 3, 200521 yr Shaq at 100 for 5 is a steal, but I can guarantee he isn't going to play all 5 of those years. He will play 3 or 4 of them and win a title, maybe two. Great deal though, the Heat have SOME wiggle room with the cap now despite still having the big man around. 885696[/snapback] explain how? the heat will be over the cap for many many years like most teams in this league. 886473[/snapback] Shaq was being paid 30 mil per year, took a paycut of 10 per year to stay around. Eddie was going to make 15 mil. Posey makes 6 mil, JWill makes 9. That equals Eddie. Antoine makes 6-7. We lose Butler, Woods salary. We still will be under the luxury tax and thats how it works. 886678[/snapback] still over the cap which is my point exactly. sure if craig had said luxury tax your post would have made sense, but then again i wouldnt have said what i said. the heat are over the cap with shaq making 20 million or 30 million. regarding the cap, it really doesnt matter.
August 3, 200521 yr :clapping :clapping :clapping :clapping :clapping This is my reaction to this new deal. I ABSOLUTELY LOVE this deal. Miami had a great team last year, and probably could of beat Detroit if they were healthy, but I doubt they could have beaten San Antonio. Now you have an ELITE team, not great anymore. With Walker you get a normal #1/2 option now at # 3. He offensively is an obvious upgrade from Eddie Jones. For the people who think Walker is going to just chuck up shots you are truly foolish. Do you really think Riles didn't bring that subject up???!!!! Please..... He isn't a great defensive player, but now the Heat have a true SF, Eddie was nice, but he is used to playing the 2, not the 3. The Heat do loose a bit defensively, but they still have the 5 million exception.... Jason Williams is also a nice pick-up. His job will be very easy with Miami. Give the ball to Shaq and Wade, and now Walker. I like this deal more not because we get Williams, but because we dont have Wade playing point. I love Wade, he is my favorite player, but has a tendancy to turn the ball over. Also, if I am the Heat, I want Wade to focus on shooting, driving to the basket, and being able to give the outlet pass, not have to do all of that, AND having to worry about bringing the ball up the floor, getting everyone involved, and all the other jobs of a PG. James Posey solidifies the Bench and Andre Emmet, can be good at times with an ability to get to the basket, but needs to improve the jump shot. He also is a CRAZY dunker. In fact,i believe he was on ESPN during a dunk contest a couple of years ago. 886665[/snapback] I totally agree, we have built a great supporting cast around our two stars. We can't be spoiled and ask for much more.
August 3, 200521 yr all we really need is a back up pg and were set, hopefully dj resigns with us, cant wait till next season!
August 3, 200521 yr Here is my view on the trade: Great deal by Riley. Were we a rib injury away from being the Eastern Conference Champs? Maybe. But what caused us to not have a chance really. We had nobody to step up and score when Wade got hurt and Shaq was nicked up. Most championship teams have at least 3 options and we really only had two. Walker will fill the role of Jamal Mashburn back in the days when the Heat had Zo and Hardaway. He can shoot the 3, post-up, rebound, bring the ball up and will be asked to play a supporting role. Having a legit third options will allow us to free up Flash and Shaq more, and hurt teams more when they chose to double on them. While Walker's defense is nothing to write home about, neither was Odom's before Riley helped out. Riley's track record of fixing players up and getting the most out of them speaks for itself. Odom and Hardaway were both "finished" and gambles when he took them on and we all know how they turned out. At 6'8'', 245 walker is a big SF who can shoot the 3 and bring the ball up as well as bang down low, and this is very important. JWill could be a great asset. He has pinned to play with Shaq and Shaq loves him. He is quick, something we have not had a PG since the days of Timmy. If you remember, Chauncey and the Pistons could double Wade down easier because they knew Damon did not have the quickness or skills to create his own shot, something JWill can do easily. While he has had off-court problems, nobody has ever questioned his passing ability and basketball skills. On a team with Shaq, Wade, and Walker he might easily flourish and become a very good PG. Posey is a great asset when healthy. He is very long and athletic at 6'8'', 215 and can play either the 2 or the 3. He is very physical on defense and is a great perimeter defender. He can also stroke the 3 on offense, something important when Shaq is on your team. Additionally, he is a great FT shooter, something we desperately need. Rasaul Butler was a nice bench player, Eddie was good but we all wanted him traded and his better days were behind him. The only player I am sad to see go is Qyntel Woods, because he still has a chance to become a very good player...he certainly has he talent to. We still might add Michael Finley too. Supposedly he and Wade share an agent and Wade is trying to get him down here. In the end, we did very well and we have utlimately in my eyes, become the favorites now heading into next year.
August 3, 200521 yr Shaq at 100 for 5 is a steal, but I can guarantee he isn't going to play all 5 of those years. He will play 3 or 4 of them and win a title, maybe two.? Great deal though, the Heat have SOME wiggle room with the cap now despite still having the big man around. 885696[/snapback] explain how? the heat will be over the cap for many many years like most teams in this league. 886473[/snapback] Shaq was being paid 30 mil per year, took a paycut of 10 per year to stay around. Eddie was going to make 15 mil. Posey makes 6 mil, JWill makes 9. That equals Eddie. Antoine makes 6-7. We lose Butler, Woods salary. We still will be under the luxury tax and thats how it works. 886678[/snapback] still over the cap which is my point exactly. sure if craig had said luxury tax your post would have made sense, but then again i wouldnt have said what i said. the heat are over the cap with shaq making 20 million or 30 million. regarding the cap, it really doesnt matter. 886683[/snapback] Yeah. Cap doesn't really matter much these days with the mid-level and all. Luxury tax seems to be the biggest thing for teams already established as firm contenders.
August 3, 200521 yr I like the trade ... the locker room could get a little funky due to all the weird personalities now in it: JWill, Shaq, Toine. But its awesome :thumbup but to Das whos keeps bragging about the European players in the league and the Spurs how about the grizzlies with the two spaniards Pau Gasol and Raul Lopez I like the grizz a lot more now ... they are gonna KILL the spanish market and could only benefit from this trade go Memphis !!! and of course go HEAT!!!
August 3, 200521 yr all we really need is a back up pg and were set, hopefully dj resigns with us, cant wait till next season! 886700[/snapback] I really doubt DJ will resign. His opting out already made the point that he's looking for more money and he wouldn't be starting? Pfft, I think we can kiss him goodbye.
August 3, 200521 yr I like the trade ... the locker room could get a little funky due to all the weird personalities now in it: JWill, Shaq, Toine. But its awesome :thumbup but to Das whos keeps bragging about the European players in the league and the Spurs how about the grizzlies with the two spaniards Pau Gasol and Raul Lopez I like the grizz a lot more now ... they are gonna KILL the spanish market and could only benefit from this trade go Memphis !!! and of course go HEAT!!! 886720[/snapback] pau gasol is a great player. i have heard that lopez has already signed with a team over in europe though, he was obviously never going to do anything in utah so they dumped him..... now regarding this trade, I just really dont like Walker's game. I think he will largely bring down the Heat in all ways. Sure he can score, anyone with as many touches as him will score some. He doesnt play hard, he doesnt play defense, he fails to show up in big games. If I'm Miami, I run with Eddie Jones. With Shaq and Wade you dont really 'need' another big scorer. And Eddie Jones can still score if you really force him to put up a ton of shots. On top of that, Eddie was an above average perimeter defender. Those dont grow on the tree you know. Now I'm not sure of Wade's defensive prowess...but if you are running with a starting lineup of JWill, Wade, Walker, Haslem, and Shaq...you are putting a hell of a lot of pressure on Shaq defensively because JWill and Walker quite frankly dont play defense. If Miami were simply getting JWill, this wouldnt be a bad deal. But I really think picking up Walker will be a bad deal. Then again I could be wrong, but I look back to Walker and his Dallas days as proof that this wont be the best of deals for the Heat. If Posey is healthy though, he will be hte star of this trade. That you can book, kid plays with energy and is a tenacious defender. The rest is a bunch of who cares for the heat at this point.
August 3, 200521 yr Simply, I think this trade makes the team worse, and it seems uncharacteristic of Riley. The heat were the best offensive team in the nba last year, and they didn't need more offense. They needed better perimeter defense, rebounding, athleticism, and size at the guard/small forward position. Both Walker and Williams are defensive liabilities. Though Walker does add rebounding, which is important considering that Haslem is undersized, he is slow, unathletic, and struggles to cover quick small forwards. Williams is a poor on-the-ball defender and is a small point guard. The heat need a big point guard who can cover 2-guards who are too tall or possibly too active for wade to cover. Walker, however, is an excellent addition offensively. He is a very versatile offensive player who can be the consistent third scoring option both inside and out that Jones could not consistently be. Williams, in my mind, is the exact opposite of what we need in a point guard. We don't need someone to penetrate and create shots, Wade does that. We need an unselfish, technically sound ball handler, who can run the offense without getting in the way and hit open jump shots. Williams dribbles too much, is not fundamentally sound, too flashy, and a poor perimeter shooter percentage wise. He will try to create too much. This trade ruins team chemistry, which unlike in baseball, does lead to wins. It replaces a key role player in Eddie Jones with two guys who are notorious for being unable to play their role. Offensively, there simply will not be enough shots to go around. I fear that the great team offense we had last year will deteriorate into individual play. We lose balance between playmakers and role players, which is incredibly important. Also, our weakness, team defense especially perimeter defense, now becomes a gaping whole. This is fine against bad to mediocre teams, but against a technically solid, well-coached team (a la the Spurs and Pistons) could become a disaster. I probably hated Eddie Jones more than anyone in South Florida, but with the evolution of team, I fundamentally disagreed with trading him. He was precisely what the Heat needed at the 2-guard (not the 3). He is one of the best on-the-ball defenders. He is quick and athletic, and, except for early last year, is a consistent perimeter shooter. His three point shooting percentage is always near the top of the league. As long as Eddie need not be relied upon as the focal point of the offense, he was able to stretch opposing defenses and catch them off-guard. Most importantly, he was a lock-down defender. Perhaps, we just wanted to dump Jones salary. But we took on 6 years of Walker. There is no way that Walker stays productive when he is 34 and 35, so we will be stuck with an Eddie Jones contract 4 years from now. I would have preferred just doing the Walker part of the deal, which had nothing to do with Eddie Jones. Jones was traded for Williams and Posey. I feel the best team would have been with Walker and Jones. I am surprised that Riley who stresses length, athleticism, traditional fundamentals, and most importantly defense would do this trade. I am particularly surprised by his comment that Williams gives us playmaking at point guard we haven't since Hardaway, considering that the Heat have the best playmaking guard in the league in Wade. I hope that Riley is not trying to change his style because the league is changing. Just because no one in the west, except for the spurs, plays defense, does not mean that heat should follow that trend. I guess in all... I am just shocked and disappointed.
August 3, 200521 yr I like the trade ... the locker room could get a little funky due to all the weird personalities now in it: JWill, Shaq, Toine. But its awesome :thumbup but to Das whos keeps bragging about the European players in the league and the Spurs how about the grizzlies with the two spaniards Pau Gasol and Raul Lopez I like the grizz a lot more now ... they are gonna KILL the spanish market and could only benefit from this trade go Memphis !!! and of course go HEAT!!! 886720[/snapback] pau gasol is a great player. i have heard that lopez has already signed with a team over in europe though, he was obviously never going to do anything in utah so they dumped him..... now regarding this trade, I just really dont like Walker's game. I think he will largely bring down the Heat in all ways. Sure he can score, anyone with as many touches as him will score some. He doesnt play hard, he doesnt play defense, he fails to show up in big games. If I'm Miami, I run with Eddie Jones. With Shaq and Wade you dont really 'need' another big scorer. And Eddie Jones can still score if you really force him to put up a ton of shots. On top of that, Eddie was an above average perimeter defender. Those dont grow on the tree you know. Now I'm not sure of Wade's defensive prowess...but if you are running with a starting lineup of JWill, Wade, Walker, Haslem, and Shaq...you are putting a hell of a lot of pressure on Shaq defensively because JWill and Walker quite frankly dont play defense. If Miami were simply getting JWill, this wouldnt be a bad deal. But I really think picking up Walker will be a bad deal. Then again I could be wrong, but I look back to Walker and his Dallas days as proof that this wont be the best of deals for the Heat. If Posey is healthy though, he will be hte star of this trade. That you can book, kid plays with energy and is a tenacious defender. The rest is a bunch of who cares for the heat at this point. 886737[/snapback] Quite frankly, since when did we consider Damon Jones a good defensive player??? He didn't play defense at all!!! Sure you lose some defensive skills with Walker replacing Jones, but you gain some defense with Williams replacing Damon Jones. Considering this, why is there all of the sudden so much pressure on Shaq defensively if you are only loosing your defense at one position in the starting lineup and gaining some at point guard?! And you yourself said Posey is a good defender... Wade's defense will probably be improving so I dont expect for this team to be TOO bad at D, they will probably be decent, and they still can make some moves this off season to help with the D. As far as Walker goes, lets not judge how well he can do not being the number 1/2 option in just 1 year, especially when he was in Dallas where he goes from being the number one guy in Boston to the number 4/5 guy in Dallas. A switch like that is tough for a player to go through. Just look at Eddie who struggled from moving from the 1/2 option to the third go-to-option on the team.
August 3, 200521 yr I hate the deal. The Heat were 1 game away from going to the NBA Finals and if Shaq was 100% and Wade wasn't a p***y bitch with a cheap injury, we would have been in the Finals guaran-damn-teed.? No sense in messing up the entire team like this, frankly I think Riley is just making this deal to make a deal, since he can't coach, he's just doing it so he can feel important and be able to take credit for the team if we do actually win the whole thing.? /rant *PUTS ON FLAME SUIT* 886608[/snapback] Wow, I'm ashamed you call yourself a fellow Heat fan. Rants are one thing but this is just a disgrace. We messed up an entire team? I'd like to know how. By trading someone we've been trying to trade for years, by dumping a streaky bench player, or by sending away a player that people just figured out was actually on the Heat? And if Riley is just making a deal to make a deal, why the hell not? It's not like we traded away someone of major importance. So in sumnation, blow me. Anyway, I'm pumped with this deal. I was never a fan of Rasual and EJ had his moments but I shall survive without more of them. I realize 'Toine doesn't have great defense or is the most consistent but it's not to the point that it would essentially hurt our team. He's not even being asked to fulfill a major role, EJ was an asset...not a star. Plus with the addition of JWill, Dwyane can stay at SG so it's perfect. Way to go, Riles. 886663[/snapback] I agree with the last paragraph. And oh my Lord, did you have to serve Accord that badly?? :o 886667[/snapback] lemme ask accord this where the hell was eddie jones at in the end of game 7?what did he do in game 6 of the eastern confrence semi finals?yeah he shot the ball and ended up out of bounds and we lost.he needed to go i think we would have hell of a team with this deal.
August 3, 200521 yr Well outside of Sheff#1 who had an unhealthy obsession with RJ, I don'y really see how you can knock this deal. Most of the anaylis that was already posted was dead on, their is little one can do to knock this in my eyes.
August 3, 200521 yr When I heard the Heat were involved in the largest trade in NBA history, I panicked, because why mess with a team that had the best record in the East already last year. But when I saw the players we got and who we sent packing, it doesn't look bad at all!
August 3, 200521 yr The Heat were 1 game away from going to the NBA Finals and if Shaq was 100% and Wade wasn't a p***y bitch with a cheap injury when you need to take a shot to the ribs to help put the pain away i wouldnt call that a p***y injury by any stretch. especially the way D relies on his flexibility and movement. thats funny you said that but its also wrong
August 3, 200521 yr haha, J-Dub is on the heat. my favorite player in the NBA until Udonis came around. 886594[/snapback] 2 Gators. now we just need to pick up Teddy Dupay for backup point. :mischief
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