I wasnt being factitious

thats all good you support the marlins but what they needed was people in the seats and your money in their pockets of which out of state fans provide neither unless you have the goodwill to buy season tickets and then keep them at home to look at.

 

consider yourself good fans if you wish but you have no right of dishing out and complaining about poor attendance or poor fans in the area because you arent helping the cause in any way shape or form

 

Did I say any of the fans in South Florida were poor, no, did I dish out abuse to anyone, no. The point of the post was to look on the positive aspects of next year given all the negativity on the board. I will still stay up and watch the games and pay for them, so in some small way I will be contributing to the Marlins. I am looking forward to seeing a young side next year with great potential, fair enough I don't have to sit around until the 9th inning of a blowout, but I do have to go to work/lectures the next morning without falling asleep.

 

I wasnt being factitious

thats all good you support the marlins but what they needed was people in the seats and your money in their pockets of which out of state fans provide neither unless you have the goodwill to buy season tickets and then keep them at home to look at.

 

consider yourself good fans if you wish but you have no right of dishing out and complaining about poor attendance or poor fans in the area because you arent helping the cause in any way shape or form

 

Did I say any of the fans in South Florida were poor, no, did I dish out abuse to anyone, no. The point of the post was to look on the positive aspects of next year given all the negativity on the board. I will still stay up and watch the games and pay for them, so in some small way I will be contributing to the Marlins. I am looking forward to seeing a young side next year with great potential, fair enough I don't have to sit around until the 9th inning of a blowout, but I do have to go to work/lectures the next morning without falling asleep.

 

I didnt mean to hate on you cause if I lived way far thats the same i could do at best

but the fact is what the out of state fans do means nothing when it comes to keeping the team here

what matters is what the season holders think and the potential season ticket holders feel. they will drive the future of the team

I honestly don't think a ticket sales is what makes the Marlins (or any team) the financial sense to stay in a market, or that the people in position to help finance a stadium would have listened to rising season ticket sales over the people that regularly contact them about such issues, whether that be Mr. Nimby, Mr. Developer or Mr. Bribery.

Very exciting team to watch next year. Just wonderring, what's our starting rotation for next year look like after the trade with the Cubs?

 

 

At this point we're looking at something like:

 

 

Dontrelle

Vargas

Olsen

Johnson

Mitre

 

They could also start Petit or give him another year in the minors. They may bring back Brian Moehler as well.

Maybe I'm crazy but I think this team has a chance at the .500

 

We're likely to see improvement on offense at C, 3B/LF, SS and CF. Possibly RF too. Jacobs is at 1B. The club isn't done making moves, and we could end up with a productive 2B, LF and CF. The defense will improve. We ranked 27th in defensive effiency last year. With these fresh legs and energy, that will rise. The pitching is weak in aces, but strong in depth. We have talent, now it's up to Beinfest to compliment them. And Girardi to get them to play as best as they can and win.

 

 

 

This is what still gets me juiced. It's not unreasonable to project that we could actually be better at a few positions, if not right away then relatively quickly. Pitching will be tough, but there are so many pitching prospects competing for spots in '06 or '07, if even a few of them pan out we'll be stacked with good young arms.

 

Which is how they began to rebuild the team after the '97 firesale.

Dempster, Beckett, Penny, Burnett, Clement, etc.

An entire team, all growing up together. Think of last year's Indians or an even more clear cut example would be the Chicago Bulls in the NBA.

 

The entire team is young. Everyone knows they all have talent, but they are going to make rookie mistakes. But every week, once a night or so, you'll probably see something special that reveals the talent that is underneath.

 

To me, that's exciting to watch.

 

Who's with me on that?

 

 

An even better example would be the 1998/1999 Florida Marlins who turned into the 2003 Florida Marlins

An entire team, all growing up together. Think of last year's Indians or an even more clear cut example would be the Chicago Bulls in the NBA.

 

The entire team is young. Everyone knows they all have talent, but they are going to make rookie mistakes. But every week, once a night or so, you'll probably see something special that reveals the talent that is underneath.

 

To me, that's exciting to watch.

 

Who's with me on that?

 

 

Ya I am dying to see over 100 losses

Very exciting team to watch next year. Just wonderring, what's our starting rotation for next year look like after the trade with the Cubs?

 

 

At this point we're looking at something like:

 

 

Dontrelle

Vargas

Olsen

Johnson

Mitre

 

They could also start Petit or give him another year in the minors. They may bring back Brian Moehler as well.

I know Olsen has tons of potential, I'm not disputing that. If Petit is more physically mature, though, I'd rather him get the nod. Olsen's frame seems too frail to withstand a full MLB season. I'd rather see him have a chance to fill out a bit before we subject him to a 162 game season, and expecting him to pitch 200+ innings.

 

Well here's another idea that just came to me: maybe we'll have a starting rotation of six pitchers? Start Dontrelle on a normal schedule every five days, then rotate one of the others in and out of another five man rotation. That way we won't jeopardize our young guys' arms, by not forcing them to throw a full MLB schedule.

 

So it would look something like this:

 

1. Willis

2. Vargas

3. Olsen

4. Mitre

5. Johnson

 

6. Willis

7. Petit

8. Vargas

9. Olsen

10. Mitre

 

11. Willis

12. Johnson

13. Petit

14. Vargas

15. Olsen

 

16. Willis

17. Mitre

18. Johnson

19. Petit

20. Vargas

 

21. Willis

22. Olsen

23. Mitre

24. Johnson

25. Petit

 

26. Willis

27. Vargas

28. Olsen

29. Mitre

30. Johnson

 

(the pitchers could obviously be different if you, for instance, want Sanchez or Hernandez to start instead of someone else)

 

In this way, Willis is able to start every 5th day. All the other pitchers start every seventh day. It's a little strange, I know, but I worry about having so many young pitchers thrown into the fire that way. I realize this makes the bullpen situation a little iffy, but maybe we can dip into our starting rotation in relief situations ala a "swing-man". It's a crazy idea, I know, let me know what you all think.

I was pretty depressed and frustrated after the Castillo trade. For a few days following that, I couldn't even imagine watching this team again.

 

But after the fog cleared, and I took a closer look at the players we have, I do think that it will be an exciting time, and that to watch these guys grow into (hopeful) studs is going to be great. We won't compete next year, but the games will be fun with all these youngn's. I think, legitimately, '07 is a possibility, folks.

 

 

All these guys we got are not ready yet, but with more time in the minors and a bit of time later in the regular season, they should be ready for next season.

It will be terrible to take these kids off the 4-day rest they've known for much of the time they've been pitching and will eventually have to accept at the major league level. If the innings are getting to them, start taking them out early, or send them to the bullpen, minors or DL.

It will be terrible to take these kids off the 4-day rest they've known for much of the time they've been pitching and will eventually have to accept at the major league level. If the innings are getting to them, start taking them out early, or send them to the bullpen, minors or DL.

 

Well we know Train/Vargas/Mitre can handle it. But ya, if Johnson, Olsen, Petit or whoever else is there can't handle the innings, then stick them in the bullpen and call up someone else. And since they all have a ton of options left, we can rotate as much as we'd like.

I'm looking forward to next year, but I'm biased because I look forward to baseball every season. If the kids pan out, this is going to be an exciting team to watch grow.

I'm pumped for next year

I'm kinda looking forward to watching a young team. Last season was as frustrating as any I can remember. At least this year my expectations won't be as high and I can enjoy watching the young guys get better.

 

But ... going to the games when the Mets, Cubs, or Braves are in town will be tough. Those fans are loud, obnoxious, often drunk, and do everything they can to ruin the game for the Marlins fans. Think how bad they'll be when they really do outnumber us in the stands.

I'm kinda looking forward to watching a young team. Last season was as frustrating as any I can remember. At least this year my expectations won't be as high and I can enjoy watching the young guys get better.

 

But ... going to the games when the Mets, Cubs, or Braves are in town will be tough. Those fans are loud, obnoxious, often drunk, and do everything they can to ruin the game for the Marlins fans. Think how bad they'll be when they really do outnumber us in the stands.

 

Good point. Especially the Mets -- now that they got Delgado, they're really gonna rub it in.

Though I cannot say I am pumped about next year and have been very upset by the moves made this offseason, the new Marlins team is starting to grow on me a little bit. I am still interested in seeing what final form the team will take. One thing is certain, I will still attend home games next season if for no other reason than the fact it may be one of the last seasons the Marlins play in South Florida.

An entire team, all growing up together. Think of last year's Indians or an even more clear cut example would be the Chicago Bulls in the NBA.

 

The entire team is young. Everyone knows they all have talent, but they are going to make rookie mistakes. But every week, once a night or so, you'll probably see something special that reveals the talent that is underneath.

 

To me, that's exciting to watch.

 

Who's with me on that?

 

 

Not me, and I can think rationally. I did the "entire team growing up" thing for 6 years before 2003 happened. I survived a personal record of 5 wins and 35 losses in games I attended in 1998 and I can tell you there is nothing exciting in seeing your team become a failed experiment of a single A team. And if we had a competitive team you would have no reason to expect "special things" happening in a more meaningful way. All that rebuilding crap, or "building for the future" BS, or "market correction" stupidity is just another excuse for the reality of this sport: you, the fan, are totally expendable.

 

I will go to the games. I will watch them on TV until I start screaming and my wife threatens with the couch. I will follow them. But don't tell me that I need to agree with your definition of having fun watching this joke of a team in order to be labeled "rational".

 

 

 

I agree with you. I don't know why people are convinced that this is a good thing because its really not. Of course there is a very good silver lining but players like Beckett and Delgado don't grow on tree. I wonder what things will be like when certain players who were sure things start struggling. How badly did people want to dump Derek Lee because he wasnt clutch? How will people react when our pitching no longer shuts people down for stretches at a time? Having to start all over with those S. Florida fans who now have another reason not to follow this team is going to suck too.

 

That said, its a little easier than last time because we still have Miggy and Dtrain. Hermida is looking like he could seriously produce also. We have a TON of pitching prospects and some of them are bound to do something.

I do have my season tickets and cant wait for the season to start! Baseball is baseball... The Marlins are young and are going to have some firepower... A Will to Win, I think! Really excited to see Hermida win ROOKIE OF THE YEAR too!

Oh I wouldn't say that anyone thinks this is all a "good thing", I think it's more along the lines that some of us are just trying to make the best of a sh*tty situation.

 

I will go to the games. I will watch them on TV until I start screaming and my wife threatens with the couch. I will follow them. But don't tell me that I need to agree with your definition of having fun watching this joke of a team in order to be labeled "rational".

 

good lord man where did anyone say that? do whatever you want, no one's telling you what to do.

they will be alot more fun to watch than last year's squad

I'll go on record as not excited. I found it a lot more exciting to watch Carlos Delgado, Juan Pierre, Luis Castillo, etc, than to watch a bunch of overmatched young players. Are they supposed to be exciting just because they're young? Because that's not what gets me excited. Good baseball gets me excited. Basehits, home runs, a good pitching performance, a great defensive play. We're going to see a lot less of that good stuff this year.

 

You may see flashes of talent that gets you excited for the future, but those will be brief glimpses in the midst of a very bleak season.

 

You guys are probably going to get sick of me before long, if I keep bringing this stuff up, but I'm not going to sit here and make a bunch of stuff up just to fit in. This team is going to suck, and many of you will probably be sick of watching them by the end of May.

I'd rather watch a bunch of "overmatched young players" who go balls out every night than watch a bunch of underperforming, overpaid vets who drag ass everynight that just go through the motions... who ended up having the same record as the Brewers (who our teams resembles this year)

I'd rather watch a bunch of "overmatched young players" who go balls out every night than watch a bunch of underperforming, overpaid vets who drag ass everynight that just go through the motions... who ended up having the same record as the Brewers (who our teams resembles this year)

 

 

I don't really buy into the idea that our guys weren't going all out last year. And the only guy that comes to mind as truly overpaid was Lowell, who was probably trying harder than anyone. I think a lot of that was just a bunch of hooey that we constructed to explain why the team wasn't performing as well as we thought they should. I mean if they were all dragging ass last year, why are we sad to see them go?

I'm rational. I've been a fan since the beginning. The firesale of 97-98 didn't affect my feelings as a fan. I love baseball and I'm not influenced in my fandom by the team having to be championship quality. I think I went to as many games in 1998 and 1999 as I did in 1997. And I had just as much fun in 98 and 99 as I did in 97. If you're a fan of baseball you'll watch any team that's fielded. And in 1998 and 1999 it was interesting to watch the beginnings of the evolution of what became the 2003 championship team. What's different now is that I knew that the team that I was watching in 1998 would still be in town 5 years down the road. Now, I find it impossible to root for players that are on a team that looks like better than a 50-50 shot to be GONE within 3 years. Who cares if Mitre becomes the next Burnett. Or Hanley Ramirez the next Renteria. It's likely they'll all be playing elsewhere by then.

.

.

.

Unless they reach some miracle deal to stay in town, next year will not be fun to watch, no matter how hard they play, and no matter what the record is. It will be sad to watch. At least for a SoFla fan. For you out of market fans, your support is appreciated, and life goes on unchanged for you.

Id be excited to see this lineup

 

C- Willy

1B- Jacobs

2B- Graffanino

SS- HanRam

3B- Cabrera

LF- Aguila

CF- Gathright

RF- Hermida