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The Second Debate


The_Godfather
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I voted for Obama again, fwiw. I think he is doing a great job of making this Obama vs. Bush, not Obama vs. McCain. It's like a boxing match, Obama just keeps throwing the 'Bush' jab, and McCain is not doing a good enough job of getting away from it.

I don't think McCain has mentioned Bush once, in any way. He did, however, say 'my friends' 18 times by my count. :p

 

McCain did a better job this time around, but he seemed pretty agitated. For whatever reason when asked who would he consider to be his Treasury Secretary, he said "Not you, Tom". This is to a guy who is likely going to vote for McCain (based on his comments in the past on NBC/MSNBC).

 

Obama once again came off a lot more presidential. He also struck a major difference between himself and McCain with a question about healthcare, by saying that healthcare was a fundamental right for Americans. McCain, in contrast, said it was a responsibility. He successfully defended the attacks on himself coming from McCain, and then pointed out the problems with McCain's proposals.

 

It was close, but I will give it to Obama for keeping his cool and ignoring the attacks for the most part.

 

Chris Mathews also noted that McCain made no mention of Bill Ayers, who Sarah Palin keeps bringing up in her speeches. He thought that might mean that McCain was uncomfortable with making the accusation that 'Obama pals around with terrorists', as his running mate has. Maybe he does still have a soul.

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I thought McCain was improved over the last debate on his message but stylistically when you compare him alongside Obama he can come off as a little flustered or angry or something. There was a lot of talk that he might really go hard negative on Obama, get into the Reverend Wright stuff, but it didn't happen. I called it even, but with Obama's recent lead in the polls McCain needs more than ties.

 

I must not be very representative in judging these things because in both of them I thought McCain did fine but I keep hearing Obama won both.

 

Godfather I agree that McCain isn't doing nearly enough of the "I'm not Bush" line.

 

As boring as I find these things, and in truth 95% of it is the same boilerplate responses they've been giving for the past several months, I'm trying to put myself in the shoes of someone who hasn't been following this. I think that's a lot of Obama's strategy, to put people at ease with him and "look the part" if you will. He comes off as calm and collected which helps. Doesn't hurt that he mentioned he has Warren Buffett's support, lol.

 

I don't think McCain is doing particularly bad, he's just put in a defensive position on some of these issues because of Bush, and he's not separated himself from W effectively.

 

*On a side note, did I hear McCain announce some idea for the government actually buying all these mortgages up?? This on top of the bailout package? This in between lectures about too much government?

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I thought McCain was improved over the last debate on his message, but stylistically when you compare him alongside Obama he can come off as a little flustered or angry or something. There was a lot of talk that he might really go hard negative on Obama, get into the Reverend Wright stuff, but it didn't happen.

 

 

I thought right away McCain came out angry, I think that was an obvious ploy by his campaign - People are mad right now, let's make McCain mad.

 

 

I called it even, but with Obama's recent lead in the polls McCain needs more than ties.

 

Yea, at this point McCain needs to do something huge/different to gain any type of momentum.

 

Godfather I agree that McCain isn't doing nearly enough of the "I'm not Bush" line.

 

I thought he tried to do it by keep bringing up his friendship with dems like Feingold and Leiberman, but it's just not enough and Obama is not letting up with the 'Bush' jab. That is how he is going to win. "You're George Bush, I'm not"

 

 

 

 

 

 

*On a side note, did I hear McCain announce some idea for the government actually buying all these mortgages up?? This in between lectures about too much government?

 

 

:lol It's so ridiculous it is funny at this point.

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I thought the questions were unoriginal. Very predictable, aside from the last couple questions of the night.

 

OT: What the hell is wrong with McCain's arms? Am I the only one realizing his really awkward arm movements? He looks like a robot when he moves his arms.

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I think there are three things that will come out of this debate that weren't as apparent before.

 

1. How old McCain looks and act. Regardless of his past medical issues from being a POW. His posture and demeanor were that of an extremely elderly man.

 

2. How inspiring and empathetic a speaker Obama is. He is very beleivable and make me think of JFK when he talks about energy independance.

 

3. How much McCain will regret referring to Obama as "That One". Regardless of the intent, it was a condiscending remark and made me angry by hearing it.

 

 

Ok ok I thought of a 4th.

 

4. John was pitifully petty tonight and it stunk of desperation IMO

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I thought the questions were unoriginal. Very predictable, aside from the last couple questions of the night.

 

OT: What the hell is wrong with McCain's arms? Am I the only one realizing his really awkward arm movements? He looks like a robot when he moves his arms.

 

It is a result of having his shoulders broken due to torture while in the Vietnamese POW camp. They broke them at the beginning and they healed wrong.

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I thought the questions were unoriginal. Very predictable, aside from the last couple questions of the night.

 

OT: What the hell is wrong with McCain's arms? Am I the only one realizing his really awkward arm movements? He looks like a robot when he moves his arms.

 

It is a result of having his shoulders broken due to torture while in the Vietnamese POW camp. They broke them at the beginning and they healed wrong.

 

Thanks. I had no idea.

It seemed like McCain came out bitter, from the start, or something. He was throwing little insults at Obama, from the beginning, it seemed. Then again, McCain had more pressure on him, tonight...trying to sway voters his way.

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I must've missed the "One" comment.

 

 

Agree with Erick though, the questions offered nothing new. Not that they answer the questions anyway.

 

Irish is right, to anyone who's been following this stuff it was pretty much a snoozer.

 

I almost want to blame the moderator, or the questions, or the format or something.

 

 

Or instead of trying to squeeze 30 questions in with 1 minute answers where all they can manage is a soundbite, how about an entire debate on healthcare? An entire debate on the economy? An entire debate on the war?

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I would just like to point out the poll choices "Tie" and "Neither" sort of contradict each other... I mean you cant have two losers... they can sort of both just do terrible... but someone will always do better.

 

 

I would have called it a tie up until the moment I saw John McCain refuse to shake Barack Obama's hand, and instead he offered his wife's hand for Obama to shake. Now it's not a big deal to me, but you know the media will grab that one and stretch it inside out.

 

EDIT: Am I the only one who noticed this? Obama sent his arm out for a handshake and McCain pointed towards his wife instead of shaking it.

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I think there are three things that will come out of this debate that weren't as apparent before.

 

1. How old McCain looks and act. Regardless of his past medical issues from being a POW. His posture and demeanor were that of an extremely elderly man.

 

2. How inspiring and empathetic a speaker Obama is. He is very beleivable and make me think of JFK when he talks about energy independance.

 

3. How much McCain will regret referring to Obama as "That One". Regardless of the intent, it was a condiscending remark and made me angry by hearing it.

 

 

Ok ok I thought of a 4th.

 

4. John was pitifully petty tonight and it stunk of desperation IMO

 

I agree with this assessment. Seeing them walk on the same stage together, and walking close and around each other, McCain looked tired, hunched over, and was breathing loudly. Obama was tall, well spoken, and on top of his game. I really thought he looked more presidential.

 

I also cringed at the "that one" comment. We will see how its covered, but it really did come off condescending.

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Yeah, the "That One" comment was really pathetic.

 

John McCain knows he is a sitting duck in this election. All the polls have his popularity decreasing at an alarming rate. His actions last night corresponded with the "politics as usual" that he preaches AGAINST. The American people want to hear about how their next president is going to save them from this crisis we are in, not petty remarks about the other candidate.

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In all of this, I thought McCain missed out on a chance for a quick jab when Obama talked about the loose banking laws in Delaware.

"That's how in banking it works," said Obama. "Everybody goes to Delaware, because they've got... pretty loose laws when it comes to things like credit cards. And in that situation, what happens is... that the protections you have, the consumer protections that you need, you're not going to have available to you."

 

McCain should have said, "oh, you mean the Joe Biden's state". Otherwise, pretty tame stuff last night.

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McCain is coming off frustrated. I mean, "That one"? John McCain is better than that.

 

Also, my father who doesn't particularly like Obama, kept saying how McCain came of like "[his] father", not telling us how he was going to solve the problems in this country but sounded more like he was lecturing everybody about how he was the smart one who knew what to do and he was the only one who could do it.

 

In all of this, I thought McCain missed out on a chance for a quick jab when Obama talked about the loose banking laws in Delaware.

"That's how in banking it works," said Obama. "Everybody goes to Delaware, because they've got... pretty loose laws when it comes to things like credit cards. And in that situation, what happens is... that the protections you have, the consumer protections that you need, you're not going to have available to you."

 

McCain should have said, "oh, you mean the Joe Biden's state". Otherwise, pretty tame stuff last night.

Yeah, I really thought that was coming after Obama mentioned Delaware. Never did though.

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Obama won hands down...I don't think anything can stop Obama winning this election. I'm pretty sure he will win on a landslide. McCain looked tired and just brought to the table the same things that haven't worked for the last 2 - 3 weeks.

 

Either the a) McCain camp expected a different debate, b) McCain is not listening to his campaign leadership and acting on his own c) or, the campaign is completely clueless

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the debate was boring, neither said anything new or useful. McCain made the mortgage buy up comment, but thats all BS anyway. Obama still hasn't said he will cut anything he still hasn't said how he will lower taxes, he still hasn't said how is going ot do anything really. He is just going to it all. I feel like I am at a High School election. As President I promise to do this, this and this. Come on, both candidates are joke and this election is a joke. I just feel bad for democrats taking over at such a sh*tty time, because it will be 4 and done. Remember the Carter years?

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the debate was boring, neither said anything new or useful. McCain made the mortgage buy up comment, but thats all BS anyway. Obama still hasn't said he will cut anything he still hasn't said how he will lower taxes, he still hasn't said how is going ot do anything really. He is just going to it all. I feel like I am at a High School election. As President I promise to do this, this and this. Come on, both candidates are joke and this election is a joke. I just feel bad for democrats taking over at such a sh*tty time, because it will be 4 and done. Remember the Carter years?

 

feel bad for the Dems? I'm terrified of what a dominated dem Congress with Peolosi, Reid and Obama at the pres. will do.. There will be change, big change.....We may be fundamentally a different country after two years.

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I'm horrified as well but it look like that's what the majority of the people want so we have to live with it and get used to it. Welcome to epoch of governemt doing for us what we're not willing to do for ourselves. McCain's one chance is to raise doubts about Obama's judgment and the way to do that is to bring up his links to the bigot, the crook and the terrorist without the media cleanser but McCain blew it.

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I thought the questions were unoriginal. Very predictable, aside from the last couple questions of the night.

 

OT: What the hell is wrong with McCain's arms? Am I the only one realizing his really awkward arm movements? He looks like a robot when he moves his arms.

 

 

His arms were never set correctly after they were broken during vietnam while he was a prisoner

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I remember four years ago (especially on this site) how everyone was talking about John Kerry ahead in the polls and that don't bother Kerry will win, look how that turned out. I am still waiting for election day when it really counts.

 

I believe Barrack Hussein Obama mentioned 95% tax cuts. Interesting, how is he going to pay for all the programs with only 5% contributing? (please correct me if I am wrong but I do believe he said that 95%)

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I remember four years ago (especially on this site) how everyone was talking about John Kerry ahead in the polls and that don't bother Kerry will win, look how that turned out. I am still waiting for election day when it really counts.

 

I believe Barrack Hussein Obama mentioned 95% tax cuts. Interesting, how is he going to pay for all the programs with only 5% contributing? (please correct me if I am wrong but I do believe he said that 95%)

well he says he'll raise taxes on the ones making over $250k and he says he'll give a tax cut to everyone else. I guess the ones making under $250k make up the 95%. He's dishonest because somewhere between 33% and 40% of taxpayers don't pay any taxes at all and you can't cut something that doesn't exist in the first place (i.e. taxes for peolple who don't pay any). What he's actually doing is using the tax code to distribute welfare. Shameful and dishonest. My guess is his tax cut for the middle class promise is BS and will raise taxes on them the second he gets in office but will keep his welfare through the tax code promise for the poor.

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