If you look at just errors it tells you that Willy was ok in LF, while anyone who watched the games objectively saw that he was a stumbling bumbling fielder. I believe my lying eyes and not the stats. I love him offensively, but defensively he's meh.

 

 

Your lying eyes are only slightly more reliable than error stats, range is a much more telling stat. Cabrera, outside of his awful April (I think it was because he was fat), was just fine at 3B this year.

 

All that said... I still think the team should just cut to the chase and get a CF like Crawford.

 

I don't think you Crawford guys are getting it. Even though Crawford would be a cheaper option technically, theoretically A-Rod would be the much better financial option.

 

Why? Because the second Alex Rodiriguez exchanges navy pinstripes for teal pinstripes, I guarantee you that this team makes back every dime they dish out for him. Crawford, on the other hand, would be neither as helpful to this team on the field nor would anyone in South Florida come to games just to see him play as they would with A-Rod. He would he be every bit as marketable as Flash and Shaq. Not to mention I think you are all vastly underestimating his star power. Do you remember how many asses Pudge put in the seats? And when we actually won, they kept coming. If A-Rod was in our lineup opening day, and we played as expected (90+ win season), I guarantee we draw nearly 2 million. South Florida will come to see a winning team, and they will most certainly come to see Miguel Cabrera and Alex Rodriguez hit next to each other.

 

And reguarding our defense, Miguel is a fine third baseman. Hanley has played centerfield in winter ball before, so he is not exactly clueless as to how to approach the position. And our outfield defense would NOT be horrible. You did not see the real Jeremy Hermida last season, both offensively or defensively. He is a great fielder with a very good arm.

There is alot of them. Granderson (not available), Reed (busted last year but could be had cheap good glove), Anderson (CWS, not great last year but could be had).

 

Then there is the expensive top prospects. Chris Young (wouldcost us JJ/Olsen/Sanchez/Willis type), Baldelli (a SP+), Crawford (Willis +), etc etc.

 

There are others too but really most of them would cost a good sum for prospects.

 

There is old guys like lofton and edmonds but they are stop gaps and expensive and would rather go to a top rated team they believe has a better chance.

 

CF is a hard position to find a good one. Personally I would love a Baldelli or Chris Young there and would give up something nice to get one. But then we still need the big bat to protect miggy honestly.

Do you remember how many asses Pudge put in the seats?

 

 

Umm...5?

 

We were bottom 5 attendance in '03 as well.

If you look at just errors it tells you that Willy was ok in LF, while anyone who watched the games objectively saw that he was a stumbling bumbling fielder. I believe my lying eyes and not the stats. I love him offensively, but defensively he's meh.

 

 

Your lying eyes are only slightly more reliable than error stats, range is a much more telling stat. Cabrera, outside of his awful April (I think it was because he was fat), was just fine at 3B this year.

 

All that said... I still think the team should just cut to the chase and get a CF like Crawford.

 

I don't think you Crawford guys are getting it. Even though Crawford would be a cheaper option technically, theoretically A-Rod would be the much better financial option.

 

Why? Because the second Alex Rodiriguez exchanges navy pinstripes for teal pinstripes, I guarantee you that this team makes back every dime they dish out for him. Crawford, on the other hand, would be neither as helpful to this team on the field nor would anyone in South Florida come to games just to see him play as they would with A-Rod. He would he be every bit as marketable as Flash and Shaq. Not to mention I think you are all vastly underestimating his star power. Do you remember how many asses Pudge put in the seats? And when we actually won, they kept coming. If A-Rod was in our lineup opening day, and we played as expected (90+ win season), I guarantee we draw nearly 2 million. South Florida will come to see a winning team, and they will most certainly come to see Miguel Cabrera and Alex Rodriguez hit next to each other.

 

And reguarding our defense, Miguel is a fine third baseman. Hanley has played centerfield in winter ball before, so he is not exactly clueless as to how to approach the position. And our outfield defense would NOT be horrible. You did not see the real Jeremy Hermida last season, both offensively or defensively. He is a great fielder with a very good arm.

 

 

The other sad part is Carl Crawford would cost us about the same, if not more in trade then Alex Rodriquez would.

 

The D-Rays would want Willis + a prospect or two more for him. They have no reason to trade him and are shopping him in a sellers market. Arod is more of a buyers market where we would be buying low. Crawford is coming off of the best numbers of his career and they honestly believe he is the next Beltran a 30-50 type guy every year. A complete 5 tool player.

Do you remember how many asses Pudge put in the seats?

 

 

Umm...5?

 

We were bottom 5 attendance in '03 as well.

 

Reguardless, we were WELL above our attendance figure from 2002.

You did not see the real Jeremy Hermida last season, both offensively or defensively. He is a great fielder with a very good arm.

 

no he isnt.

Do you remember how many asses Pudge put in the seats?

 

 

Umm...5?

 

We were bottom 5 attendance in '03 as well.

 

Reguardless, we were WELL above our attendance figure from 2002.

 

I don't know how you can say that.

 

Is bottom 5 WELL above bottom 3?

Do you remember how many asses Pudge put in the seats?

 

 

Umm...5?

 

We were bottom 5 attendance in '03 as well.

 

Reguardless, we were WELL above our attendance figure from 2002.

 

I don't know how you can say that.

 

Is bottom 5 WELL above bottom 3?

I think he means per game

Do you remember how many asses Pudge put in the seats?

 

 

Umm...5?

 

We were bottom 5 attendance in '03 as well.

 

Reguardless, we were WELL above our attendance figure from 2002.

 

I don't know how you can say that.

 

Is bottom 5 WELL above bottom 3?

 

Go find the difference in our actual attendance from 2002 to 2003 and tell me there was not a huge jump.

You did not see the real Jeremy Hermida last season, both offensively or defensively. He is a great fielder with a very good arm.

 

no he isnt.

 

His hip was bad this year, if healthy he's fine.

You did not see the real Jeremy Hermida last season, both offensively or defensively. He is a great fielder with a very good arm.

 

no he isnt.

 

His hip was bad this year, if healthy he's fine.

no argument about him being fine out there... but he isnt that good either

Hanley has played CF before in winter ball. Hanley would be more than capable in CF.

 

 

Just because you repeat something will be so over and over again doesn't mean it will be so. There is no track record at all to base this assumption on. Only athletic ability. Athletic ability doesn't insure success. He may be successful (and if the Marlins pull off this trade I hope he is successful in CF) but no one should count on it. We may be in for an equivalent of this years Abercrombie/Amezaga defense... if not worse. No one can say for sure.

Hanley has played CF before in winter ball. Hanley would be more than capable in CF.

 

 

Just because you repeat something will be so over and over again doesn't mean it will be so. There is no track record at all to base this assumption on. Only athletic ability. Athletic ability doesn't insure success. He may be successful (and if the Marlins pull off this trade I hope he is successful in CF) but no one should count on it. We may be in for an equivalent of this years Abercrombie/Amezaga defense... if not worse. No one can say for sure.

Anyone who just watches Hanley in the field can tell he should make a painless transition to CF. He has fantastic baseball instincts. There wouldnt this idea of moving him to CF if people didnt think he could be more than adequate out there

Hanley has played CF before in winter ball. Hanley would be more than capable in CF.

 

 

Just because you repeat something will be so over and over again doesn't mean it will be so. There is no track record at all to base this assumption on. Only athletic ability. Athletic ability doesn't insure success. He may be successful (and if the Marlins pull off this trade I hope he is successful in CF) but no one should count on it. We may be in for an equivalent of this years Abercrombie/Amezaga defense... if not worse. No one can say for sure.

Anyone who just watches Hanley in the field can tell he should make a painless transition to CF. He has fantastic baseball instincts. There wouldnt this idea of moving him to CF if people didnt think he could be more than adequate out there

 

Were those fantastic baseball instincts the reason he had the 3rd worst fielding percentage among NL shortstops and the worst zone rating among NL shortstops? Personally, I would rather see him concentrate on improving his fielding abilities at the position he has been working on the longest rather than trying to learn a completely new position at the big league level. At least at SS he has shown the ability to make some amazing plays and turning the double play. He is still young enough to improve on making the routine plays (where he had the most problems this year). A whole new position? Who knows.

Seriously wow I really dont understand how someone cant be in favor of trading for A-rod.

 

We are talking potentially the GREATEST PLAYER in the history of baseball. He was also like a .370 postseason hitter before his last 2 series so I hate the unclutch comments.

 

Im not taking any credit away from Willis because hes a great pitcher but you cant but you cant even put them in the same sentence.

 

A-rod comes here and he will hit 50 HR and drive in 140 like he did for Texas and for the Yanks last season. Remember AL pitching is much better than the NL pitching so who knows what could happen.

Arlington is a hitter's park. I seriously doubt A-Rod would hit 50 HR playing in our park. Don't get me wrong, he'll knock the cover off some balls, but I don't see 50 HR's happening. I do think he'd give the club a ton of press and sell some more tickets. If the Yankees would pay a sizeable chunk of his salary there's no reason not to do it.

Guys can't we just trade Jacobs for bullpen pieces, Put willingham at 1st base, trade for arod, place him at third base and move Miguelito back to left field?

 

close... ARod at SS :thumbup

 

Good idea, but where do we place Hanley.

CF

 

I'd be willing to try it out, but if it doesn't work, than what do we do? Willy to 1st, jacobs out the door? Cabrera to left field, hanley back at short, and AROD playing 3rd base?

Is Ramp saying Hermida is not a very good ballplayer overall, or just not that good in the field?

Is Ramp saying Hermida is not a very good ballplayer overall, or just not that good in the field?

 

field

 

 

 

 

Hanley has played CF before in winter ball. Hanley would be more than capable in CF.

 

 

Just because you repeat something will be so over and over again doesn't mean it will be so. There is no track record at all to base this assumption on. Only athletic ability. Athletic ability doesn't insure success. He may be successful (and if the Marlins pull off this trade I hope he is successful in CF) but no one should count on it. We may be in for an equivalent of this years Abercrombie/Amezaga defense... if not worse. No one can say for sure.

Anyone who just watches Hanley in the field can tell he should make a painless transition to CF. He has fantastic baseball instincts. There wouldnt this idea of moving him to CF if people didnt think he could be more than adequate out there

 

Were those fantastic baseball instincts the reason he had the 3rd worst fielding percentage among NL shortstops and the worst zone rating among NL shortstops? Personally, I would rather see him concentrate on improving his fielding abilities at the position he has been working on the longest rather than trying to learn a completely new position at the big league level. At least at SS he has shown the ability to make some amazing plays and turning the double play. He is still young enough to improve on making the routine plays (where he had the most problems this year). A whole new position? Who knows.

You'd rather have him at SS and thats fine. Give me ARod and Ill take my chances with Hanley in CF.

Is Ramp saying Hermida is not a very good ballplayer overall, or just not that good in the field?

 

field

 

:thumbup check.

 

I havent really read completely through this discussion, but why was Hermida brought up in the first place? And I always thought I heard he was a plus defender.

Were those fantastic baseball instincts the reason he had the 3rd worst fielding percentage among NL shortstops and the worst zone rating among NL shortstops?

 

 

Obviously if he had the lowest zone rating, it holds zero credibility.

Is Ramp saying Hermida is not a very good ballplayer overall, or just not that good in the field?

 

field

 

:thumbup check.

 

I havent really read completely through this discussion, but why was Hermida brought up in the first place? And I always thought I heard he was a plus defender.

Never been considered a plus defender. He has an average arm, and takes bad routes to balls. He'll get better in time I think/hope.

 

Hermida was brought up because we were discussing how weak our OF defense, I think

You did not see the real Jeremy Hermida last season, both offensively or defensively. He is a great fielder with a very good arm.

 

no he isnt.

 

His hip was bad this year, if healthy he's fine.

no argument about him being fine out there... but he isnt that good either

 

He's not going to win any gold gloves, but he should be average +

Were those fantastic baseball instincts the reason he had the 3rd worst fielding percentage among NL shortstops and the worst zone rating among NL shortstops?

 

 

Obviously if he had the lowest zone rating, it holds zero credibility.

zone rating is an extremely flawed metric

Question for Lou or someone else...

 

I think DTrain has 3 more arbitration years and ARod has 4 years left in his Yankee contract. My question is if we were to sign DTrain to a 4 year contract how much money are we looking at? I guess I'm trying to determine how much ARod money the Yankees need to eat to make ARod and DTrain a wash money wise.

 

 

I would say we could sign a 4 year contract anywhere from $35-$45 million. $35 would be a "Marlins discount" type of deal, $45 should be a sure thing, but we may never know the answer if the Marlins trade Dontrelle before even making him an offer.

If the Yankees eat $25 million of ARod's contract then ARod would cost us about the same as what DTrain would cost us. The $25 million is a lot of money but the Rangers are eating more than that.

I think it's gonna happen

 

 

Buster Olney sure made it sound (at least the way I was listening) that we could get him for less than Dontrelle.

 

"2 young pitchers, ideally to slot in behind Wang in the rotation."

 

JJ, Nolasco and one of the fab 5 to get the money down? :whistle (Hey, I can dream).

 

Dude, you can't give up our good young pitching for A-Rod. That is a HUGE mistake. :thumbdown He's a cursed player, trouble just seems to follow him around. I wouldn't do it in a million years. Pitching is so hard to come by, and hitters can always be developed.