Should the Marlins reconsider trading Dontrelle Willis?

[TSwift25]

I think if we get a stadium deal in the near future, both players should be kept, long-term. If we don't get a stadium deal, then both players should be kept for the next 2 years. But, as The Don says, it's crazy talk. If we don't get a stadium deal, I see both being traded. With this ownership group they're not willing to only make 10M a year, which they'd make if they kept both. They want to make 30-40M a year, like last year.

 

Except that, consider this, if they don't get a stadium this time with MLB involved, they assuredly will be gone and the franchise worth more (to a new city) with Willis and Cabrera than without. If you were Portland (example) and you were the city fathers deciding how much they'd pony up for a new stadium, don't you think bringing in two stars like we're talking would be a driving force in selling it in the community?

 

I do. Somehow, regardless of how good Olsen is, he just doesn't and probably will not have for several years the star power of DW. And Miggy, is about to become one of the biggest stars in the game. The franchise is worth more, in almost any scenario with them then not.

 

Star power's inconsequential when talking about luring a major league franchise...it's a major league franchise, that's more than enough.

 

 

 

 

 

 

As for the notion that this team wouldn't be substantially better this year with Willis than without, well, I just don't agree.

 

When push comes to shove, you're looking at a staff of 12 guys being asked to pitch 1,458 regular season innings. Even if Dontrelle's shown an inability to be consistent, he's shown an ability to eat up innings, and with Olsen, JJ and Sanchez all having serious red flags for next year for one reason or another (huge IP jump, injury/effectiveness issues), we're going to need to look at someone to shoulder the load.

 

However, I do understand the reasoning that as is, we're at best a .500 team, so what good is someone like Dontrelle who probably holds more value through trade than he'd return over the next two seasons (salary factored in).

[futuremarlinsgm]

I know that no one here probably wants to trade Dontrelle Willis.

There is a small faction who would not be against trading Dontrelle Willis

 

I too am part of that "small" faction. I think it would make a tremendous amount of sense.

[Fishfan79]

Look if a team came out of nowhere and offered a Dumb offer of overpayment it would be hard to say no.

 

TB offering up Crawford for him? That fills CF for us for a long time.

Arizona offering Justin Upton and Montero and a pitching spec

Seattle offering Clement, Adam Jones and a prospect

 

 

Something absolutely foolish but amazing offer it would be next to impossible to say no to. Otherwise I dont see us moving him.

[The_Punisher]

I seriously doubt Miguel Cabrera will wear any other uniform other than teal during his major league career, same I thought of Vlad with the Expos, but I sure hope we find the deep pockets to lock him up.

[rferry]

If we don't get a stadium deal, I see both being traded. With this ownership group they're not willing to only make 10M a year, which they'd make if they kept both. They want to make 30-40M a year, like last year.

The most likely reason why this ownership would trade them is because they believe the acquisitions from trade would contribute as much if not more to the team's ability to provide a quality product than their remaining pre-free agency eligibility WHICH I SHOULD REMIND EVERYONE IS AFTER THE 2009 SEASON. This ownership has never been afraid to disappoint it's existing fan base, but hardly for reasons directly related to its profits.

 

I disagree. A city like Portland would jump on the Marlins no matter what names were on the back of the uniforms.

Very true. Speaking from experience, I view former Expos players with suspicion and don't even tell the more fervent Nats fans about anything dating back to Montreal.

In this hypothetical argument, the Marlins will be supported by fans in a new city because it's baseball and it's new. While they'll be supported by the municipal officials by coming and their willingness to contribute to the project.

[Marlins2003]

...Very true. Speaking from experience, I view former Expos players with suspicion and don't even tell the more fervent Nats fans about anything dating back to Montreal.

In this hypothetical argument, the Marlins will be supported by fans in a new city because it's baseball and it's new. While they'll be supported by the municipal officials by coming and their willingness to contribute to the project.

 

I was actually thinking about it from a completely different perspective, that of financier or bond underwriter, and the franchise would be worth more, even though we (fans) look at Cabrera and Willis' contracts as liabilities, from an accounting standpoint (the way contracts are depreciated unique to MLB), the net effect is the franchise is worth more with them than not with them. I wasn't so much concerned about "fan" support as I was "voter" support to get what ever referendums would be needed to be passed to allow for municipal financing (tax-free bonds), and the franchise pledged against the bonds in case of default.

 

What is keeping Miami at the table right now is one thing, their share of the distribution of the Professional Sports Franchise Tax, a subset of the bed tax on vacationers, which significantly closes the funding gap. The problem with Hialeah is they don't get a piece of this pie and its been accruing money for 10-15 years. Most other cities don't have this mechanism in place. While there are things Hialeah can do (as in the future) this $$ already exists.

[champkind]

If this organization trades Dontrelle it had better strike gold on the players acquired. We all want this team to succeed. If trading Dontrelle makes us better than so be it. Is Tampa going to give us Upton and Badelli? Is Arizona going to pay a king's ransom (which better include Chris Young) ? It better be a trade like that...otherwise why look to trade a great pitcher who you control for 3 full seasons.

 

And I wonder if most people realize what it would take to sign Miggy now. Would 10 yrs/100 million get it done? (i mean now) It might not, hard as that is to believe. We had better start throwing out contract numbers to him sooner rather than later. If he hits FA he will get a bigger deal than A-Rod's punk ass.

[Backin2008]

If the Marlins offered Cabrera 10 years, $100 million......he would laugh in their face.

[SHUfishfan]

I really don't think we trade Willis unless another team is willing to make a mistake...Cabrera is untouchable in my opinion but Willis i'd move if a team is gonna overspend to get him.

[Hammerhead]

I really don't think we trade Willis unless another team is willing to make a mistake...Cabrera is untouchable in my opinion but Willis i'd move if a team is gonna overspend to get him.

I think the point everyone here is trying to make is that if this team is to move from South Florida, we trade Willis while his stock is sky high. Which is a damn good idea and one that I would support.

[TheDon]

This team isnt going anywhere.

 

If the Marlins get re-located out of South Florida I'll take a 6 month ban.

 

 

 

 

Book it.

[Hammerhead]

This team isnt going anywhere.

 

If the Marlins get re-located out of South Florida I'll take a 6 month ban.

 

 

 

 

Book it.

I really don't think so either but the possibility is still there. Even if the Marlins don't move, I wouldn't be against the right trade for Willis.

[Shamrock]

If the Marlins offered Cabrera 10 years, $100 million......he would laugh in their face.

because he's worth way more than 10MM per year.

[Fishfan79]

If willis is traded this year or next year it is not for money concerns it is for the offer we get is higher by a good degree then his current value to the team. It is that simple folks. He wont be moved because we have to, he would be moved because what we got would be too good to pass up.

[pierremvp1]

This team isnt going anywhere.

 

If the Marlins get re-located out of South Florida I'll take a 6 month ban.

 

 

 

 

Book it.

I agree. When I talk about a stadium deal(or lack of), I don't mean to imply that the lack of a stadium deal means they move. Where would they go? A place like Portland is going to be harder to finance a full public handout deal, like Loria would like here(or anywhere). There's few markets, and what markets there are are going to want some real money from Loria, not just the cloud of rent money. If they don't get a stadium deal done they'll likely wind up staying in Joe Robbie stadium in a limbo situation. But if they are stuck in Joe Robbie, where they can't make money unless they field a team with a payroll under 40 Million, then it would make sense to trade both Willis and Cabrera, and any other player that would command a salary of 25% of the total team payroll.

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Stop with these self-imposed ban threats Don. One of them(not this one) is going to come back and bite you in the A##. And I think most of us like your posts.

[Out of the Past]

I agree. When I talk about a stadium deal(or lack of), I don't mean to imply that the lack of a stadium deal means they move. Where would they go? A place like Portland is going to be harder to finance a full public handout deal, like Loria would like here(or anywhere). There's few markets, and what markets there are are going to want some real money from Loria, not just the cloud of rent money. If they don't get a stadium deal done they'll likely wind up staying in Joe Robbie stadium in a limbo situation. But if they are stuck in Joe Robbie, where they can't make money unless they field a team with a payroll under 40 Million, then it would make sense to trade both Willis and Cabrera, and any other player that would command a salary of 25% of the total team payroll.

That's exactly how I see it.

[champkind]

If the Marlins offered Cabrera 10 years, $100 million......he would laugh in their face.

because he's worth way more than 10MM per year.

 

 

Obviously the idea of a guaranteed deal does have value. I wonder what it would really take to lock him up. If Chase Utley gets 85mill than Miguel gets......anyone? anyone?

[TheDon]

This team isnt going anywhere.

 

If the Marlins get re-located out of South Florida I'll take a 6 month ban.

 

 

 

 

Book it.

I agree. When I talk about a stadium deal(or lack of), I don't mean to imply that the lack of a stadium deal means they move. Where would they go? A place like Portland is going to be harder to finance a full public handout deal, like Loria would like here(or anywhere). There's few markets, and what markets there are are going to want some real money from Loria, not just the cloud of rent money. If they don't get a stadium deal done they'll likely wind up staying in Joe Robbie stadium in a limbo situation. But if they are stuck in Joe Robbie, where they can't make money unless they field a team with a payroll under 40 Million, then it would make sense to trade both Willis and Cabrera, and any other player that would command a salary of 25% of the total team payroll.

.

.

Stop with these self-imposed ban threats Don. One of them(not this one) is going to come back and bite you in the A##. And I think most of us like your posts.

 

 

 

 

Im an action guy I can't help it.............. :shifty