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Marlins Grumblings

Featured Replies

At this point I don't think anyone should scoff at the Marlins' relocating.

 

scoff, scoff-not that is couldn't happen-but scoff at the very thought of it.

I'm not so sure

 

keeping the over-weight diva

 

is a better idea

 

than keeping the all-effort, all-the-time, all-community guy.

 

 

overweight diva that's career statline matches the statline for Hank Aaron >>>>>>>> Then community guy that career statline matches Steve Avery

 

Is marlin2266 the same guy who was mad that we lost the arby case to Cabs and thought it directly correlated to the loss of some obscure relief pitcher?

  • Author

Montero, Justin Upton and a pitching prospect

Clement, Adam Jones and pitching prospect

Salty and Francour

Braun, Gwynn Jr, and Gallardo (I wish)

Martinez, Pelfrey/humber, and insert catching prospect here

Hughes and Tabata (doubtful)

Martin, Kemp and pitching spec

 

I doubt most of these would happen but not very many teams have elite catching prospects. Ramp could list them better then I could I am sure. But most of them that do wont trade them off (like LAD with Martin) or are in the division like the braves are.

Most of those are nutty...

Montero, Justin Upton and a pitching prospect

Clement, Adam Jones and pitching prospect

Salty and Francour

Braun, Gwynn Jr, and Gallardo (I wish)

Martinez, Pelfrey/humber, and insert catching prospect here

Hughes and Tabata (doubtful)

Martin, Kemp and pitching spec

 

I doubt most of these would happen but not very many teams have elite catching prospects. Ramp could list them better then I could I am sure. But most of them that do wont trade them off (like LAD with Martin) or are in the division like the braves are.

Most of those are nutty...

I know that is why I said I doubt most would happen.

 

Whatever we would get it would need to be a catcher and a CF prospect in it though. I just dont know whom has those 2 prospects to accomidate us.

 

Btw I just say justin Upton's stat-line for AA, dear lord he is a monster!

At this point I don't think anyone should scoff at the Marlins' relocating.

Why not? Where are they going to go?

Many places that lack the potential of Miami provide for equal or better revenues than Dolphins Stadium and the present market does. Oh, and there's that whole not having to deal with the continuous BS factor. I won't throw out names (for obvious reasons), but in a park in which they control the revenues, the relocated Marlins would need less than 12000 fans to produce the same amount of revenue they do here. There's towns that can produce that, and have significant TV markets and business interests to chip in the broadcast rights and sky box revenue teams rely on.

If you're going to trade DW (and I am against for a number of reasons) I think you'd look west and into the AL, teams like the Angels who have a spare personnel to turn our team into a bonafide contender overnight.

 

Right now, until the rotation is solidified though, nothing going to happen.

I'd do that Salty/Francoeur trade. But we wouldn't want to trade within the division (as noted)

Willis has been living off of his reputation and his one 20 game winning season. Other than that, he's been a .500 pitcher. Teams like the Mets or Yankees would take him just because he's a "name player" and might just be dumb enough to give up something really good for him.

Notes: Losing Crawford would be bad move

Story Tools:

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Ken Rosenthal / FOXSports.com

Posted: 14 hours ago

 

If the Devil Rays are thinking about trading left fielder Carl Crawford, they should think again, one rival general manager says.

 

"I don't think they will do it and I don't think they should," the GM says. "He's getting better and better. He's like Grady Sizemore, and he's under a great contract.

 

"He does everything. He plays defense. He steals. He hits home runs. And he will do more and more."

 

Crawford and Hall of Famer Rogers Hornsby are the only players in history to increase their home runs and batting average over five consecutive seasons, minimum 250 at-bats.

 

Only four players exceeded Crawford's combined totals in doubles, triples and homers before age 25 Hall of Famers Joe Medwick, Freddie Lindstrom, Jimmie Foxx and Arky Vaughan.

 

The Devil Rays are considering trading one of their starting outfielders. But they should think twice about moving Carl Crawford. (John Raoux / Associated Press)

 

Only one player exceeded his combined home-run and stolen-base totals Cesar Cedeno.

 

The Rays will listen to offers for all three of their outfielders Crawford, 25; center fielder Rocco Baldelli, 25; and right fielder Delmon Young, 21.

 

But Crawford is a bargain at $4 million this season and $5.25 million next season. His contract also includes an $8.25 million club option for 2009 and a $10 million option for '10.

 

"I wouldn't even consider trading him," the GM says. "Some might say, 'Look at all you could get.' But it doesn't matter what you could get. You know what you have with that guy.

 

"Crawford to me, is like what Kirby Puckett was in Minnesota. When your best player plays harder than anyone on the team, you've got something special.

 

"Every kid coming up is not going to be as good, but he had better play as hard. That's pretty unique. When you've got it, you don't let it go. As soon as you move a guy like Crawford, you spend the rest of your career looking for one."

 

Baldelli could be another story.

 

The Rays, trying to figure out a solution to Baldelli's hamstring problems, have consulted with the Mets about how they treated shortstop Jose Reyes, who had similar issues earlier in his career.

 

Baldelli should return from the disabled list in time to draw interest by the July 31 non-waiver deadline. His club-friendly contract still could make him a worthwhile risk. He is signed for $750,000 this season and $2.25 million next season, and his deal includes club options for '09, '10 and '11.

 

Mets-cellaneous

 

Mets first baseman Carlos Delgado has hit only three homers four fewer than Damion Easley, who began the season as the team's backup second baseman. Delgado's slow offensive start might be related to the surgery he underwent on his right wrist last Oct. 23. "You never know how long a hand injury is going to take," one Mets official says.

 

Speaking of Easley, he chose the Mets over the Yankees as a free agent last November, intent on reaching the postseason for the first time in his 17-year career. Easley, 37, reasoned that the Mets were one of the two or best three teams in the NL, while the Yankees faced a more difficult path to the playoffs as one of the six or seven best in the AL.

 

Mets manager Willie Randolph also was a factor in Easley's decision; he was Easley's favorite player growing up. Easley would have taken Miguel Cairo's roster spot with the Yankees, offering the team considerably more power. Since the start of the 2004 season, Easley has hit 34 homers in 753 at-bats.

 

Another difference between the Mets and Yankees: Outfield defense, particularly when Endy Chavez is in left and Carlos Gomez in right, effectively giving the Mets three center fielders. Mets shortstop Jose Reyes, one of the fastest players in baseball, says he's not as fast as Gomez.

 

One scout calls Chavez the Mets' John Havlicek, comparing the reserve outfielder to the NBA Hall of Famer who ignited the Celtics as a sixth man early in his career. Chavez, the scout says, is the Mets' best defensive outfielder even ahead of Carlos Beltran, a Gold Glove winner last season.

 

Finally, nearly all of the Mets have shaven their heads as a sign of unity, but chief operating officer Jeff Wilpon remains on the players' hit list. A few of them jokingly tried to get Wilpon to commit to a vintage Mets cut if they swept the Yankees.

 

"It would be a good look for him," third baseman David Wright says. "He used to come down to the clubhouse all the time. Now it's few and far between. He might get grabbed and put in that chair."

 

Angels looking for a hitter

 

Left fielder Reggie Willits' .433 on-base percentage in 122 plate appearances has given the Angels a spark out of the leadoff spot. The team's offense should further improve after left fielder Garret Anderson and second baseman Howie Kendrick come off the disabled list. But club officials say they recognize the importance of adding one more hitter.

 

Third base is the obvious position to upgrade, and the Rockies' Garrett Atkins is among the players on the Angels' wish list. The Angels could part with Class AAA third baseman Brandon Wood in a deal for Atkins, who is under club control through 2010. Rockies Class AAA third baseman Ian Stewart then could move to an outfield corner.

 

Clearly, the Rockies face some major decisions, starting with a potential trade of first baseman Todd Helton. Both Atkins and left fielder Matt Holliday resisted contract extensions last off-season; Atkins becomes eligible for salary arbitration next off-season and Holliday might only be affordable for one more year. Stewart ultimately could replace him.

 

Brave new prospect

 

The Braves' biggest concern is their rotation depth; one scout says they've got a No. 1 starter (John Smoltz), a 1A (Tim Hudson) and three No. 5s. However, the team's decision to release first baseman Craig Wilson to create more playing time for catcher/first baseman Jarrod Saltalamacchia ultimately could lead to a trade for a starter.

 

Saltalamacchia, an elite hitting prospect coveted by many clubs, could be the centerpiece of a deal for a pitcher such as Marlins left-hander Dontrelle Willis, A's righty Rich Harden or one of the Angels' young starters. Then again, the Braves might want to make Saltalamacchia their future first baseman; they'll definitely need his offense if they lose center fielder Andruw Jones as a free agent.

 

Scott Thorman, the Braves' current first baseman, still figures into the equation, at least for now. Manager Bobby Cox relishes Thorman's intensity, and Thorman probably isn't mobile enough to play left field. Of course, Thorman will be less appealing to Cox if he doesn't hit. He had an .877 OPS in April, but is struggling with a .609 OPS in May.

 

Rays: Pitcher or catcher at No.1?

 

Six years ago, the Twins chose catcher Joe Mauer over right-hander Mark Prior with the No. 1 pick in the amateur draft. The Devil Rays currently are engaged in a similar debate as they consider Vanderbilt left-hander David Price and Georgia Tech catcher Matt Wieters for this year's No. 1 pick.

 

The situations aren't completely analogous; the Twins' decision to select Mauer was partly driven by finances, and Wieters is a collegian while Mauer came out of high school. But if the Rays pick Wieters, it will be partly due to the risk of injury with pitchers. Their first-round picks in 2004 and '05, Rice right-handers Jeff Niemann and Wade Townsend, each have undergone major arm surgeries.

 

Picking third in '06, the Rays opted for Long Beach State third baseman Evan Longoria over Washington right-hander Tim Lincecum, who went to the Giants with the 10th choice. Still, Price will be tempting: The Rays are learning how difficult it is to trade position players for pitchers, and they would prefer to avoid signing pitchers in the free-agent market.

 

One other thing: Wieters, following the lead of another Georgia Tech catcher, Jason Varitek, reportedly is represented by agent Scott Boras, a painstaking negotiator. Price is represented by Bo McKinnis.

 

 

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/6834248

Rosenthal seems to have this one anonymous GM who seems obsessed with the Marlins trading Willis. Going on two years now. And what is this, three times in the last week Rosenthal (who is, it seems, perpetually wrong about all manner of things) has had the Fish trading Willis (and the A's, Harden as well) somewhere for someone neither the A's nor the Marlins may or may not need?

 

Yes Saltalamacchia is an excellent prospect and a catcher to boot, but I can't imagine Beinfest trading with Atlanta, especially trading Willis to Atlanta, unless the deal was beyond unbelievable and even then only if the circumstances were such that the Marlins were no longer going to be facing the Braves nineteen times a year.

 

It's the usual "Marlins should trade Willis" because another team wants him dribble. Same anonymous source. Same Ken Rosenthal.

Willis has been living off of his reputation and his one 20 game winning season. Other than that, he's been a .500 pitcher. Teams like the Mets or Yankees would take him just because he's a "name player" and might just be dumb enough to give up something really good for him.

 

yeah that would be really dumb of them. :rolleyes:

  • Author

Willis has been living off of his reputation and his one 20 game winning season. Other than that, he's been a .500 pitcher. Teams like the Mets or Yankees would take him just because he's a "name player" and might just be dumb enough to give up something really good for him.

42-32 not counting his 20 win year

Willis has been living off of his reputation and his one 20 game winning season. Other than that, he's been a .500 pitcher. Teams like the Mets or Yankees would take him just because he's a "name player" and might just be dumb enough to give up something really good for him.

42-32 not counting his 20 win year

 

 

How dare you use "facts" to back up an argument!

For those of you who may have missed 2003 as you kept looking to see if you had sprouted any pubes, Dontrelle was the spark that ignited the fish and carried them to September. He is responsible, more than any other player, for the World Series Championship that year. Sorry if you can't get past the stats, but that's a fact. In 2005, he won 20 games and came in 2nd in Cy Young balloting. In 2004, 2005, 2006, and again this year, he's a valuable leader to a young pitching staff, and the whole team. In a league filled with drones, he's the only player that plays the game like it's a game. Enjoy him for as long as he's on the team. Stop treating the trading of Dontrelle as if it's part of a video game. He's more than just stats. Even I, as much as I love having him on the team, would acept a trade, but it would have to be some absolutely extraordinary package..PLUS another incredible player on top of that.

For those of you who may have missed 2003 as you kept looking to see if you had sprouted any pubes, Dontrelle was the spark that ignited the fish and carried them to September. He is responsible, more than any other player, for the World Series Championship that year. Sorry if you can't get past the stats, but that's a fact. In 2005, he won 20 games and came in 2nd in Cy Young balloting. In 2004, 2005, 2006, and again this year, he's a valuable leader to a young pitching staff, and the whole team. In a league filled with drones, he's the only player that plays the game like it's a game. Enjoy him for as long as he's on the team. Stop treating the trading of Dontrelle as if it's part of a video game. He's more than just stats. Even I, as much as I love having him on the team, would acept a trade, but it would have to be some absolutely extraordinary package..PLUS another incredible player on top of that.

 

 

 

 

My thoughts exactly but I think your wasting your time with the "Id trade Dontrelle in a hearbeat" crowd.

For those of you who may have missed 2003 as you kept looking to see if you had sprouted any pubes, Dontrelle was the spark that ignited the fish and carried them to September. He is responsible, more than any other player, for the World Series Championship that year. Sorry if you can't get past the stats, but that's a fact. In 2005, he won 20 games and came in 2nd in Cy Young balloting. In 2004, 2005, 2006, and again this year, he's a valuable leader to a young pitching staff, and the whole team. In a league filled with drones, he's the only player that plays the game like it's a game. Enjoy him for as long as he's on the team. Stop treating the trading of Dontrelle as if it's part of a video game. He's more than just stats. Even I, as much as I love having him on the team, would acept a trade, but it would have to be some absolutely extraordinary package..PLUS another incredible player on top of that.

 

 

 

 

My thoughts exactly but I think your wasting your time with the "Id trade Dontrelle in a hearbeat" crowd.

I know. But maybe I can win them over 1 at a time. :thumbup

  • Author

For those of you who may have missed 2003 as you kept looking to see if you had sprouted any pubes, Dontrelle was the spark that ignited the fish and carried them to September. He is responsible, more than any other player, for the World Series Championship that year. Sorry if you can't get past the stats, but that's a fact. In 2005, he won 20 games and came in 2nd in Cy Young balloting. In 2004, 2005, 2006, and again this year, he's a valuable leader to a young pitching staff, and the whole team. In a league filled with drones, he's the only player that plays the game like it's a game. Enjoy him for as long as he's on the team. Stop treating the trading of Dontrelle as if it's part of a video game. He's more than just stats. Even I, as much as I love having him on the team, would acept a trade, but it would have to be some absolutely extraordinary package..PLUS another incredible player on top of that.

Major yawn right there. That was the epitome of a team effort WS. You can look at every single player and say he is just as responsible as the next.

 

Anyway, if the Marlins are blown away with an offer for Willis, they need to move him because he isn't going to be here long term. That and we could use a young catcher and CF(or SS if Hanley eventually moves out there)

Things turned around as soon as Dontrelle was brought up in 2003. I remember it like it was yesterday.

Trade talk: Former Mets General Manager Steve Phillips said on a Miami radio station that he expects Dontrelle Willis to attract more interest than any pitcher in baseball for the next two months from teams seeking to make a trade before the non-waiver trading deadline.

 

Willis has generated trade rumors each of the past two summers. Phillips said he expected the Marlins to "listen" and not "shop" Willis.

 

"I'm tired of people talking about it," owner Jeffrey Loria was quoted saying in The New York Times. "I don't care what other people think. He's pitching for us and we're happy to have him. I have no interest in discussing other people's interest in our players."

 

http://www.palmbeachpost.com/marlins/conte...notes_0525.html

  • Author

"I'm tired of people talking about it," owner Jeffrey Loria was quoted saying in The New York Times. "I don't care what other people think. He's pitching for us and we're happy to have him. I have no interest in discussing other people's interest in our players."

Here's an idea then. SIGN HIM AND CABS LONG TERM!

 

:banghead

Whether signed long-term or not, speculation over Cabrera and Willis moving on won't stop neither will the thought of the Marlins as a farm club for the other 29 teams.

"I'm tired of people talking about it," owner Jeffrey Loria was quoted saying in The New York Times. "I don't care what other people think. He's pitching for us and we're happy to have him. I have no interest in discussing other people's interest in our players."

Here's an idea then. SIGN HIM AND CABS LONG TERM!

 

:banghead

 

IMO the chances of them being dealt outweighs the chances of them getting signed long term.

Things turned around as soon as Dontrelle was brought up in 2003. I remember it like it was yesterday.

 

LOL Things turned around as soon as Trader Jack was added. I remember it like it was yesterday.

DTrain was a member of a team effort. To even think he was the biggest reason we won that title is blind fandom and an insult to everyone else on that team. Like the best DP combo in baseball at that time. Or Lowell. Or Josh. Or Lee. Or Miggy. Or Pudge. Or... The list goes on all the way through the front office and the minor leagues for readying players for the big time.

I like DTrain just fine. But to exaggerate his greatness and ignoring his off times is as insane as exaggerating the weaknesses of other players and ignoring their pluses.

 

Some of you are sounding ridiculous.

 

Almost as bad as bringing back Juan Pierre because "he has heart."

 

Gag.

 

I would gag too if we had a lead off hitter batting .305 with 65 SBs and a walk/K ratio of 55/35 on the year. Weak arm and all.

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