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http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sports/basebal...0,1858454.story

 

Miami-Dade: Marlins' share key to ballpark deal

BY SARAH TALALAY | South Florida Sun-Sentinel

October 31, 2007

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MIAMI - A panel of Miami-Dade County commissioners gave the go-ahead Tuesday to continue negotiating a deal for a Marlins ballpark at the site of the Orange Bowl, but three commissioners said they will balk if the team lowers the amount it committed to the project earlier this year.

 

Members of the Airport and Tourism Committee said they support building a stadium, but only if the county, city of Miami and team are partners and meet the commitments already pledged. A $490 million ballpark plan was derailed last spring after the state Legislature failed to approve the final piece of funding.

 

Since the University of Miami is moving its football games to Dolphin Stadium next year, the committee is allowing $50 million in general obligation bond funding approved by county voters in 2004 to renovate the Orange Bowl to instead be considered part of the ballpark funding package. But commissioners want a ballpark plan brought to the full commission before making a decision.

 

 

 

 

"If the Marlins come up with less money on the table, you're going to lose this commissioner," Commissioner Carlos Gimenez said.

 

The Marlins have expressed concerns that a ballpark at the Orange Bowl won't be as economically successful as one in downtown, but Marlins President David Samson said Tuesday the team accepts the site. He would not discuss the team's contribution.

 

"We just have to make sure it's a deal that makes sense for everybody," Samson said.

 

Samson called the meeting "another step forward," and he and county officials said talks are continuing. They hope to have a deal in the coming weeks in order to be able to open a ballpark in 2011.

 

Sarah Talalay can be reached at [email protected]

 

 

 

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im now optimistic again, i highly doubt the marlins will lowball the city/county now... especially after what samson said... he would have a different tone if that were the case. selig/dupuy probably let them know that they must do whatever the city wants, because at this point, if it doesnt work out, then its all the ownership's fault.

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im now optimistic again, i highly doubt the marlins will lowball the city/county now... especially after what samson said... he would have a different tone if that were the case. selig/dupuy probably let them know that they must do whatever the city wants, because at this point, if it doesnt work out, then its all the ownership's fault.

 

Whatd Samson say that makes you so optimistic?

 

"We just have to make sure it's a deal that makes sense for everybody," Samson said. ???? THAT?

 

That basically just means they offer less money than expected and Samson says, its in our best interest (makes more sense for us) to not pay as much as originally expected.

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Man, are we so jaded that even when there is blatant good news we shrug it off and say that ownership will screw it up. The answer is yes. While most of you know that I don't live down in S. Fla, it still pains me from afar to see this team to have screwed up and over its fans as much as this. I suggest you all look at it from this perspective: The leprechaun is known for his verbal diarrhea of the mouth and in this case it did not happen. So one of two things happened here and i can't see either being a bad thing. First, the FO knows that its put up or shut time and The leprechaun has been humbled by the tall men in suits or Loria has told him that he needed to keep his mouth shut this time and let the real adults do the business. Either way Samson's lack of reaction when threatened speaks volumes as to what the real story here is. I am not saying get your hopes up again but there may be light at the end of the tunnel finally!

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Man, are we so jaded that even when there is blatant good news we shrug it off and say that ownership will screw it up. The answer is yes. While most of you know that I don't live down in S. Fla, it still pains me from afar to see this team to have screwed up and over its fans as much as this. I suggest you all look at it from this perspective: The leprechaun is known for his verbal diarrhea of the mouth and in this case it did not happen. So one of two things happened here and i can't see either being a bad thing. First, the FO knows that its put up or shut time and The leprechaun has been humbled by the tall men in suits or Loria has told him that he needed to keep his mouth shut this time and let the real adults do the business. Either way Samson's lack of reaction when threatened speaks volumes as to what the real story here is. I am not saying get your hopes up again but there may be light at the end of the tunnel finally!

 

You're totally right. It does look like good news, but we've been so beaten down over years everyone is a cynic. It just seems like the only people that want this team in Miami is MLB. And I think they're telling Loria an co. take the deal or sell the team

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Man, are we so jaded that even when there is blatant good news we shrug it off and say that ownership will screw it up. The answer is yes. While most of you know that I don't live down in S. Fla, it still pains me from afar to see this team to have screwed up and over its fans as much as this. I suggest you all look at it from this perspective: The leprechaun is known for his verbal diarrhea of the mouth and in this case it did not happen. So one of two things happened here and i can't see either being a bad thing. First, the FO knows that its put up or shut time and The leprechaun has been humbled by the tall men in suits or Loria has told him that he needed to keep his mouth shut this time and let the real adults do the business. Either way Samson's lack of reaction when threatened speaks volumes as to what the real story here is. I am not saying get your hopes up again but there may be light at the end of the tunnel finally!

 

You're totally right. It does look like good news, but we've been so beaten down over years everyone is a cynic. It just seems like the only people that want this team in Miami is MLB. And I think they're telling Loria an co. take the deal or sell the team

 

 

 

anybody want to start making guesses of the dimensions they would want to see? id say this is good news...i almost jumped out of my char

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Guest FlummoxedLummox

As things stand now with MLB, there is absolutely no incentive for Loria to contribute a large sum of money to a stadium deal. Between revenue sharing, media contracts and the absurdly low payroll he maintains, the man makes money hand over fist. Engendering support from the fans clearly plays little to no role in his considerations. So, from his perspective, why should he put money into a stadium?

 

What this tactic speaks to is MLB's unwillingness to put any actual pressure on the organization, as they are the only ones with sufficient leverage to force Loria's hand in any way.

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What I understand will happen is one of two scenarios. The Marlins cap their contribution to the $205 million (or what it 215 ???) number and are no longer held to covering overruns, or a diminished contribution with all three parties sharing in cost overrun, or somewhere in that mix.

 

Are those two options acceptable to the city and county? They sound like fair options to me considering this is the site that the city and county want.

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Guest iFesta Touch

What I understand will happen is one of two scenarios. The Marlins cap their contribution to the $205 million (or what it 215 ???) number and are no longer held to covering overruns, or a diminished contribution with all three parties sharing in cost overrun, or somewhere in that mix.

 

If the Marlins were any smart they would go with Scenario A because it actually starts construction. All Scenario B does is prolong an exhausted issue and quite possibly kill any type of deal in South Fla.

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I think Marlins2003 is right that the Marlins won't be offering to pay for cost overruns. And like fawouls' said, this makes sense as it's the city and county that chose this awful site, not the Marlins. If the Marlins offer $205M or $215M they are being very generous.

Fixed.

 

And it'll be a lot better than many teams, that's for sure.

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I think Marlins2003 is right that the Marlins won't be offering to pay for cost overruns. And like fawouls' said, this makes sense as it's the city and county that chose this awful site, not the Marlins. If the Marlins offer $205K or $215K they are being very generous.

It makes no sense for the city and county to cover cost overruns. All along the Marlins have agreed to cover the overruns including during the previous version of the OB stadium. This is just another way of reducing their contribution.

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I think Marlins2003 is right that the Marlins won't be offering to pay for cost overruns. And like fawouls' said, this makes sense as it's the city and county that chose this awful site, not the Marlins. If the Marlins offer $205K or $215K they are being very generous.

It makes no sense for the city and county to cover cost overruns. All along the Marlins have agreed to cover the overruns including during the previous version of the OB stadium. This is just another way of reducing their contribution.

And this goes back to my belief that Loria will say anything along the way that sounds conciliatory, but with the belief that something will happen that will allow him to back off and find fault with someone other than himself. And if there is truth to the story about the extra revenue from MLB.com, then may the witches of halloween boil up a brew of filth for this ownership and baby stepson.

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im now optimistic again, i highly doubt the marlins will lowball the city/county now... especially after what samson said... he would have a different tone if that were the case. selig/dupuy probably let them know that they must do whatever the city wants, because at this point, if it doesnt work out, then its all the ownership's fault.

 

Whatd Samson say that makes you so optimistic?

 

"We just have to make sure it's a deal that makes sense for everybody," Samson said. ???? THAT?

 

That basically just means they offer less money than expected and Samson says, its in our best interest (makes more sense for us) to not pay as much as originally expected.

 

its more of what he didnt say. the fact that he didnt mention the contribution at all gives no indication that they will balk. they know what will happen if they do.

 

also "just have to make sure" indicates to me that he likely believes that they can live with the terms, they "just have to make sure" that they are acceptable.

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It makes no sense for the city and county to cover cost overruns. All along the Marlins have agreed to cover the overruns including during the previous version of the OB stadium. This is just another way of reducing their contribution.

The previous version of the OB stadium was based on a $60 million state subsidy, revenue from a parking garage, and a less expensive stadium. You are comparing apples to oranges.

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It makes no sense for the city and county to cover cost overruns. All along the Marlins have agreed to cover the overruns including during the previous version of the OB stadium. This is just another way of reducing their contribution.

The previous version of the OB stadium was based on a $60 million state subsidy, revenue from a parking garage, and a less expensive stadium. You are comparing apples to oranges.

So your point is that the city and county should cover the $30 million (not $60 million) state subsidy and that the city and county should cover all the increases in the construction costs over the past 3 yaers? I hope the city and county leaders are not as stupid as you want them to be.

 

On the parking garage, IIRC, in the previous OB deal the parking garage would be pay for itself with the parking revenues.. the Marlins were not getting the parking revenues.

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So your point is that the city and county should cover the $30 million (not $60 million) state subsidy and that the city and county should cover all the increases in the construction costs over the past 3 yaers? I hope the city and county leaders are not as stupid as you want them to be.

I thought the state subsidy was $2 million per year for 30 years.

I only think the city and county should cover all the increases in costs because they are insisting on a terrible site. If they were sane and moved downtown, then I'd say all parties should contribute equally because it benefits all. The OB site benefits no one so only the fools who demand it be there should be paying.

 

On the parking garage, IIRC, in the previous OB deal the parking garage would be pay for itself with the parking revenues.. the Marlins were not getting the parking revenues.

You may be right, my memory on this is a bit vague. If so, I retract saying that parking revenue is an difference.

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Kinda bummed I had to read Tin Boy's name again. But at least something is getting done. Alot more than any other ownership has done here. Of course IF the deal is finalized many here will be saying it got done despite this ownership group. Some folks will never be happy until the Marlins install a private line in their home and call them to see what they should do at every step.

I still hate the site, but at least it's a site. Guess I'll have to learn to live with it.

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