June 8, 200917 yr Marlins outrighted RHP Hayden Penn to Triple-A New Orleans. Penn was designated for assignment last week after putting up a 7.77 ERA, 2.27 WHIP and 27/20 K/BB ratio in 22 innings for the Marlins. Penn, 24, cleared waivers and has a chance to work on his game in New Orleans. I thought this was significant enough for its own topic. Despite his struggles thus far at the Major League level, I still think he has a chance to put things together at some point. I guess we'll see. At least we didn't just lose him altogether.
June 8, 200917 yr The question is do we have the 40 man roster next season to keep him from being a MILB FA, as this will be his 6th pro season. Obviously depends on how he, and others, do between now and November. I don't remember who all is eligible for the rule 5 this coming off season, I just remember it's a good amount.
June 9, 200917 yr It can't hurt to have him in AAA. Losing him to minor league FA at this point really doesn't cost us anything but if he does start to fulfill his potential we can always bring him back. It's not like our 40 man is ever cramped, seeing as anybody who is effective this year we're just going to get rid of.
June 9, 200917 yr I'd rather give ANY of our young guys a shot again rather than this guy. He is soooooo hittable! I'd take Leroux, Chris Mobley, Cristan Martinez, Carlos Martinez, Todd Doolittle etc. before I would him. Give young hungry players a shot.
June 9, 200917 yr Didn't think anyone would take him. Right now the positive for him is that he's only 24, which means he has lots of time to turn things around for the better.
June 9, 200917 yr The question is do we have the 40 man roster next season to keep him from being a MILB FA, as this will be his 6th pro season. Obviously depends on how he, and others, do between now and November. I don't remember who all is eligible for the rule 5 this coming off season, I just remember it's a good amount. Locks - 27 (bolded are new additions for 2010) Pitcher Locks - Badenhop, Johnson, Leroux, Lindstrom, Meyer, A. Miller, Nolasco, Nunez, Taylor, Trahern, Thompson, Tucker, Vanden Hurk, Volstad, West, Winters Pitcher Locks - Baker, Bonifacio, Coghlan, Cousins, Hayes, Helms, Maybin, Morrison, Ramirez, Raynor, G. Sanchez (Locks If Aren't Chased for Payroll - Amezaga, Cantu, Hermida, Pinto, Ross, Sanchez, Tankeresly, Uggla) Currently on 40 Man but I classify as "whatever" - Carroll, Davidson, De Aza, Ch. Martinez, J. Miller, Sanches, Wood(?) Other Minor Leaguers Eligible and may be protected - Allison, Burns, Field, K. Harvey, Mobley, Penn, Sinkbiel Carroll, Penn, Tank, and Vanden Hurk are the new out of options (and as you can see, I see RVH being a lock), so they have to be on the 25 man roster. I'm also unsure about Ceda being 40 man eligible (I hate figuring out international signings), so that's a "maybe" with him. I'm also not sure if Owens or Rabelo need to be protected, so just other maybes there. -- I think we'll be alright. I can see them keeping maybe 3 arb guys, let's say Carroll, De Aza, K. Harvey (I think he intrigues them enough), and let's say two surprise relievers from everyone else. That puts us at 35. That should be enough for a Rule5 guy, a few 40 man options received for Uggla/whoever else, and maybe a bench vet or two.
June 9, 200917 yr Owens and Rabelo will have to be protected or they'll be FAs. I would think we'd let Rabelo walk and just try to resign him (afterall, look at our catching depth, and be the third string catcher and that's likely as good as it'd get for him), but lot of time between now and November when it comes to Owens. And both have been outrighted, so we wouldn't be able to pull the "Put them on the 40 man so they can't become FAs, but then DFA them later when a trade/signing is made and we need a spot" as they would be able to refuse the MILB assignment. We could pull that with Allison, Burns, Harvey, ect though, just risk losing them to waivers. Thanks for posting it up.
June 9, 200917 yr Owens and Rabelo will have to be protected or they'll be FAs. I would think we'd let Rabelo walk and just try to resign him (afterall, look at our catching depth, and be the third string catcher and that's likely as good as it'd get for him), but lot of time between now and November when it comes to Owens. And both have been outrighted, so we wouldn't be able to pull the "Put them on the 40 man so they can't become FAs, but then DFA them later when a trade/signing is made and we need a spot" as they would be able to refuse the MILB assignment. We could pull that with Allison, Burns, Harvey, ect though, just risk losing them to waivers. Thanks for posting it up. I kinda agree that Rabelo is outta here! Baker and Paulino are SOLID! Hayes has looked very good. Rabelo just doesnt fit anymore
June 9, 200917 yr Owens and Rabelo will have to be protected or they'll be FAs. I would think we'd let Rabelo walk and just try to resign him (afterall, look at our catching depth, and be the third string catcher and that's likely as good as it'd get for him), but lot of time between now and November when it comes to Owens. And both have been outrighted, so we wouldn't be able to pull the "Put them on the 40 man so they can't become FAs, but then DFA them later when a trade/signing is made and we need a spot" as they would be able to refuse the MILB assignment. We could pull that with Allison, Burns, Harvey, ect though, just risk losing them to waivers. Thanks for posting it up. Yea that sounds right. The "tough" decisions are all going to be on whatever relievers, not even Cruz level, keep as the last few spots. I'm not to worried about this. If guys want to perform, we have room for them.
June 9, 200917 yr The question is do we have the 40 man roster next season to keep him from being a MILB FA, as this will be his 6th pro season. Obviously depends on how he, and others, do between now and November. I don't remember who all is eligible for the rule 5 this coming off season, I just remember it's a good amount. Locks - 27 (bolded are new additions for 2010) Pitcher Locks - Badenhop, Johnson, Leroux, Lindstrom, Meyer, A. Miller, Nolasco, Nunez, Taylor, Trahern, Thompson, Tucker, Vanden Hurk, Volstad, West, Winters Pitcher Locks - Baker, Bonifacio, Coghlan, Cousins, Hayes, Helms, Maybin, Morrison, Ramirez, Raynor, G. Sanchez (Locks If Aren't Chased for Payroll - Amezaga, Cantu, Hermida, Pinto, Ross, Sanchez, Tankeresly, Uggla) Currently on 40 Man but I classify as "whatever" - Carroll, Davidson, De Aza, Ch. Martinez, J. Miller, Sanches, Wood(?) Other Minor Leaguers Eligible and may be protected - Allison, Burns, Field, K. Harvey, Mobley, Penn, Sinkbiel Carroll, Penn, Tank, and Vanden Hurk are the new out of options (and as you can see, I see RVH being a lock), so they have to be on the 25 man roster. I'm also unsure about Ceda being 40 man eligible (I hate figuring out international signings), so that's a "maybe" with him. I'm also not sure if Owens or Rabelo need to be protected, so just other maybes there. -- I think we'll be alright. I can see them keeping maybe 3 arb guys, let's say Carroll, De Aza, K. Harvey (I think he intrigues them enough), and let's say two surprise relievers from everyone else. That puts us at 35. That should be enough for a Rule5 guy, a few 40 man options received for Uggla/whoever else, and maybe a bench vet or two. I like that we get to keep Penn in the minors for at least this year... Maybe more I think he has a good future a head of him he's just a late bloomer. But when that guy puts it together he should be something special...Oh, and Rabelo did NOTHING while he was here, and did NOTHING in the minors for us... That guy might never be on a major league team again. What a terrible ball player... Wait this team likes bad Players (bonifacio) so yea next year Rabelo will be our starting Catcher. lol
June 9, 200917 yr Owens and Rabelo will have to be protected or they'll be FAs. I would think we'd let Rabelo walk and just try to resign him (afterall, look at our catching depth, and be the third string catcher and that's likely as good as it'd get for him), but lot of time between now and November when it comes to Owens. And both have been outrighted, so we wouldn't be able to pull the "Put them on the 40 man so they can't become FAs, but then DFA them later when a trade/signing is made and we need a spot" as they would be able to refuse the MILB assignment. We could pull that with Allison, Burns, Harvey, ect though, just risk losing them to waivers. Thanks for posting it up. I kinda agree that Rabelo is outta here! Baker and Paulino are SOLID! Hayes has looked very good. Rabelo just doesnt fit anymore Paulino isn't going to be resigned, and Davis/Langley are garbage. We're going to need another catcher, whether it's a FA signing or acquiring a youngster. Just something to think about in the future.
June 9, 200917 yr The question is do we have the 40 man roster next season to keep him from being a MILB FA, as this will be his 6th pro season. Obviously depends on how he, and others, do between now and November. I don't remember who all is eligible for the rule 5 this coming off season, I just remember it's a good amount. Locks - 27 (bolded are new additions for 2010) Pitcher Locks - Badenhop, Johnson, Leroux, Lindstrom, Meyer, A. Miller, Nolasco, Nunez, Taylor, Trahern, Thompson, Tucker, Vanden Hurk, Volstad, West, Winters Pitcher Locks - Baker, Bonifacio, Coghlan, Cousins, Hayes, Helms, Maybin, Morrison, Ramirez, Raynor, G. Sanchez (Locks If Aren't Chased for Payroll - Amezaga, Cantu, Hermida, Pinto, Ross, Sanchez, Tankeresly, Uggla) Currently on 40 Man but I classify as "whatever" - Carroll, Davidson, De Aza, Ch. Martinez, J. Miller, Sanches, Wood(?) Other Minor Leaguers Eligible and may be protected - Allison, Burns, Field, K. Harvey, Mobley, Penn, Sinkbiel Carroll, Penn, Tank, and Vanden Hurk are the new out of options (and as you can see, I see RVH being a lock), so they have to be on the 25 man roster. I'm also unsure about Ceda being 40 man eligible (I hate figuring out international signings), so that's a "maybe" with him. I'm also not sure if Owens or Rabelo need to be protected, so just other maybes there. -- I think we'll be alright. I can see them keeping maybe 3 arb guys, let's say Carroll, De Aza, K. Harvey (I think he intrigues them enough), and let's say two surprise relievers from everyone else. That puts us at 35. That should be enough for a Rule5 guy, a few 40 man options received for Uggla/whoever else, and maybe a bench vet or two. When do relievers like Lindstrom go to arbritration? Isn't it after this year? I'm under the impression all of our relievers only have 1 year on their contract...
June 9, 200917 yr When do relievers like Lindstrom go to arbritration? Isn't it after this year? I'm under the impression all of our relievers only have 1 year on their contract... Calero will be a FA. Surprisingly enough, Proctor will have 6th year arbitration. (He will have 5.010 full seasons after 2009's DL stint). Lindstrom, Nunez, and Pinto will enter arbitration for the first time. Not sure about Tank (2.022 days). If it's MLB DL, absolutely enters Arb next year. If not, I believe he has 1 option left to toil in AAA for 2010. Badenhop (likely super 2, entered season with 1 year service time, will get most of this year it seems) will enter arbitration in 2011. Meyer (.106 days), Vanden Hurk (.118 days), and Sanches (.137 days entering 2009, could sneak into 2011 super 2, but doubtful) will enter arbitration in 2012. We are historically past this year's Super 2 deadline, so anyone called up now with relatively no playing time (Tucker, Ceda, etc) or has nominal playing time (Leroux, Ch. Martinez, Wood), would be looking at 2013 first year arbitration. And that's assuming constant MLB time 2010-2012. Penn falls into this category as well.
June 10, 200917 yr Wow. Surprised he cleared. I am aswell, thought a team that needed pitching would like a guy that can spot start or throw 3 inning out of the pen.
June 10, 200917 yr Wow. Surprised he cleared. I am aswell, thought a team that needed pitching would like a guy that can spot start or throw 3 inning out of the pen. It's not that hard to find a sh*tty mopup guy as good as he has been.
June 10, 200917 yr When do relievers like Lindstrom go to arbritration? Isn't it after this year? I'm under the impression all of our relievers only have 1 year on their contract... Calero will be a FA. Surprisingly enough, Proctor will have 6th year arbitration. (He will have 5.010 full seasons after 2009's DL stint). Lindstrom, Nunez, and Pinto will enter arbitration for the first time. Not sure about Tank (2.022 days). If it's MLB DL, absolutely enters Arb next year. If not, I believe he has 1 option left to toil in AAA for 2010. Badenhop (likely super 2, entered season with 1 year service time, will get most of this year it seems) will enter arbitration in 2011. Meyer (.106 days), Vanden Hurk (.118 days), and Sanches (.137 days entering 2009, could sneak into 2011 super 2, but doubtful) will enter arbitration in 2012. We are historically past this year's Super 2 deadline, so anyone called up now with relatively no playing time (Tucker, Ceda, etc) or has nominal playing time (Leroux, Ch. Martinez, Wood), would be looking at 2013 first year arbitration. And that's assuming constant MLB time 2010-2012. Penn falls into this category as well. Regarding Lindstrom...wouldn't he get a Kevin Gregg-like payday, assuming he gets a certain amount of saves (say a # of 30)? Not saying that's the case b/c I'm not 100% certain on this, but if this is the case, why would we want Lindstrom back next year (with the team budget the way it is)?
June 10, 200917 yr It's probably to early to tell because we don;t know where he'll end the year in a number of pitching categories that might be important in the arbitration process. And since it's his first year in arby he's certainly not going to get huge money Here's Gregg's first couple of years of arb # 1 year/$2.5M (2008) * re-signed by Florida 1/18/08 (avoided arbitration) # 1 year/$0.575M (2007) * signed 2/07 (lost arbitration, $0.7M-$0.575M) So his first year of arb he asked for $700k got $575k. Let's say today's dollars that a $850k - a million dollars, maybe less depending what effect of the economy has in the arb process. Looks affordable to me for at least two more years if Gregg is the model.
June 10, 200917 yr Gregg wasn't a closer though his first year of arbitration. And we can't use Gregg's second year because you can't compare 1st year of arbitration (in Lindstrom's case) to 2nd year of arbitration (in Gregg's case). Lindstrom will probably be around 2m
June 10, 200917 yr Gregg wasn't a closer though his first year of arbitration. And we can't use Gregg's second year because you can't compare 1st year of arbitration (in Lindstrom's case) to 2nd year of arbitration (in Gregg's case). Lindstrom will probably be around 2m Yeah, I was thinking the same thing. And I don't want Lindstrom back for a near 2 mill.
June 10, 200917 yr If Lindstrom fails to put up good numbers by the end of this year, I wouldn't want him back for 2 million either. But If he does, he might be a steal at 2 million. So we'll see.
June 10, 200917 yr If Lindstrom fails to put up good numbers by the end of this year, I wouldn't want him back for 2 million either. But If he does, he might be a steal at 2 million. So we'll see. A steal is getting a career solid reliever like Kiko Calero for what we got him for. This is no steal. The Marlins operate differently than other teams, and Lindstrom is very replaceable, to say the least.
June 10, 200917 yr If Lindstrom fails to put up good numbers by the end of this year, I wouldn't want him back for 2 million either. But If he does, he might be a steal at 2 million. So we'll see. A steal is getting a career solid reliever like Kiko Calero for what we got him for. This is no steal. The Marlins operate differently from other teams, and Lindstrom is very replaceable, to say the least. I said IF he puts up good numbers, he'll be a steal at 2 million. If he doesn't, then obviously he'll be replaceable.
June 10, 200917 yr If Lindstrom fails to put up good numbers by the end of this year, I wouldn't want him back for 2 million either. But If he does, he might be a steal at 2 million. So we'll see. A steal is getting a career solid reliever like Kiko Calero for what we got him for. This is no steal. The Marlins operate differently from other teams, and Lindstrom is very replaceable, to say the least. I said IF he puts up good numbers, he'll be a steal at 2 million. If he doesn't, then obviously he'll be replaceable. Since when do the Marlins pay 2 million for a reliever? Quite frankly, I'm still surprised they gave Helms what they gave him (worst contract on the team, btw). For one, Lindstrom is nothing more than average. He's also going to be 30 next year...not an exactly an age for potential/huge upside excitement anymore.
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