July 23, 200917 yr People have being saying that since start #1. And he's still continually put way too many balls down the middle of the plate. As far as your second part, OPS against, covers everything, he's not doing well. His WHIP is 1.22 which is a better indicator OPS isnt everything. Hes doing well
July 23, 200917 yr Right, and we all knew he was going to have his struggles this year...because he seemed to magically escape trouble that he got into last year. The Marlins can't go on holding only certain guys accountable. Guys like Bonifacio and Volstad get a free pass when they struggle. Others get sent to the minors. I'm sure Volstad will be a solid 3 in the future, but that's not what we're discussing here.
July 23, 200917 yr How is WHIP, a stat that views every hit as the same, better than OPS against? You're saying a single is the same as a home run?
July 23, 200917 yr How is WHIP, a stat that views every hit as the same, better than OPS against? You're saying a single is the same as a home run? No a home run is worse but he hasnt been giving up many other bad pitch hits like 3 doubles and 4 other singles in a game which would give 3 or 4 more runs. That would really be bad
July 23, 200917 yr How is WHIP, a stat that views every hit as the same, better than OPS against? You're saying a single is the same as a home run? No a home run is worse but he hasnt been giving up many other bad pitch hits like 3 doubles and 4 other singles in a game which would give 3 or 4 more runs. That would really be bad Also what would be worse a quality start of--- 6 inns 5 hits 2 runs 2 homers or 6 inns 7 hits 3 runs 0 homers.
July 23, 200917 yr How is WHIP, a stat that views every hit as the same, better than OPS against? You're saying a single is the same as a home run? Too bad there's no TBIP (total bases.) Or maybe there is, somewhere in obscure-statistics-land.
July 23, 200917 yr How is WHIP, a stat that views every hit as the same, better than OPS against? You're saying a single is the same as a home run? No a home run is worse but he hasnt been giving up many other bad pitch hits like 3 doubles and 4 other singles in a game which would give 3 or 4 more runs. That would really be bad Also what would be worse a quality start of--- 6 inns 5 hits 2 runs 2 homers or 6 inns 7 hits 3 runs 0 homers. You're basically saying Volstad is fine and comping up with arbitrary numbers that are worse than what he's doing. Yeah, giving up 2 runs is better than giving up 3 runs. ok? What does that have to do with the fact he's giving up a lot of HRs? I really don't understand the exercise of making up numbers and saying "if he did this he'd be worse!." I mean, what does numbers you make up have anythign to do with what he's doing on the field?
July 23, 200917 yr How is WHIP, a stat that views every hit as the same, better than OPS against? You're saying a single is the same as a home run? Too bad there's no TBIP (total bases.) Or maybe there is, somewhere in obscure-statistics-land. Actually, there are stats that show which pitchers are good at limiting extra base hits.
July 23, 200917 yr How is WHIP, a stat that views every hit as the same, better than OPS against? You're saying a single is the same as a home run? Too bad there's no TBIP (total bases.) Or maybe there is, somewhere in obscure-statistics-land. Well, SLG is basically that. Batting stats against are just like batting stats for a hitter. And they're very good to use. OPS against would be the best way to see how hard a pitcher is getting hit. SLG would show power but it could be BABIP-induced, so it'd be better to look at ISO (SLG minus AVG) to see how bad the power numbers are against him.
July 23, 200917 yr How is WHIP, a stat that views every hit as the same, better than OPS against? You're saying a single is the same as a home run? No a home run is worse but he hasnt been giving up many other bad pitch hits like 3 doubles and 4 other singles in a game which would give 3 or 4 more runs. That would really be bad Also what would be worse a quality start of--- 6 inns 5 hits 2 runs 2 homers or 6 inns 7 hits 3 runs 0 homers. This works both ways... What would you prefer? A quality start of 6 innings 3 hits 3 runs 3 homers or 6 innings 6 hits 0 runs and 0 homers?
July 23, 200917 yr theres no way that you can say halladay isnt better than lincecum. timmy is absolutely nasty but putting up numbers like that in the al east is unreal English: Tim Linecum is better than Roy Halladay Spanish*: Tim Lincecum es mejor que Roy Halladay German*: Tim Lincecum ist besser als Roy Halladay **Translations may be somewhat off I giggled. Well done. Btdubs , Miller23, check out Dan Haren's 1st half/2nd half splits if you haven't already. They're pretty stunning. He also has a BABIP .063 higher in the second half.
July 23, 200917 yr How is WHIP, a stat that views every hit as the same, better than OPS against? You're saying a single is the same as a home run? No a home run is worse but he hasnt been giving up many other bad pitch hits like 3 doubles and 4 other singles in a game which would give 3 or 4 more runs. That would really be bad Also what would be worse a quality start of--- 6 inns 5 hits 2 runs 2 homers or 6 inns 7 hits 3 runs 0 homers. You're basically saying Volstad is fine and comping up with arbitrary numbers that are worse than what he's doing. Yeah, giving up 2 runs is better than giving up 3 runs. ok? What does that have to do with the fact he's giving up a lot of HRs? I really don't understand the exercise of making up numbers and saying "if he did this he'd be worse!." I mean, what does numbers you make up have anythign to do with what he's doing on the field? Because several times the only runs he gave up were homers in a game. Im not defending homers they are not good. West has 12 homers in AA in 46 inns and projected to Volstad 120 inns that is close to 30 homers to Volstads 20. ouch
July 23, 200917 yr How is WHIP, a stat that views every hit as the same, better than OPS against? You're saying a single is the same as a home run? No a home run is worse but he hasnt been giving up many other bad pitch hits like 3 doubles and 4 other singles in a game which would give 3 or 4 more runs. That would really be bad Also what would be worse a quality start of--- 6 inns 5 hits 2 runs 2 homers or 6 inns 7 hits 3 runs 0 homers. This works both ways... What would you prefer? A quality start of 6 innings 3 hits 3 runs 3 homers or 6 innings 6 hits 0 runs and 0 homers? Of course 0 runs is best quality start, but it doesnt "work both ways" here as Im talking about a quality start where runs are given up. You want to give up as few runs as possible for your team no matter how you do it.
July 23, 200917 yr Back to Andrew Miller.... Why is it that Volstad is allowed to learn at the major league level, and no one else is? Hell, even Nolasco got sent to the minors when he pitched poorly. Not Volstad, though. West? Too early. Miller? Pffft...who has the patience? Because other than 2 bad starts Cards and Sox when he pitched "wrong" he's pitching well, not poorly. Many quality starts. Good WHIP, H/9, K/9, BB/9 , BAA, and poised. Also, if we did send him down who would replace him? That, coupled with the fact that Volstad pitched adequately (or better) last year means he gets to stick around the Big Show. Ricky was sent down because he was out and out horrible. What did he have, something like an ERA near or over 9? West was essentially a spot starter that performed his job well for a few starts, then started to come apart near the end. So time to call up another spotter. Miller, on the other hand, doesn't have the same consistency for being "good" that Volstad had last year (doesn't have the history, however brief, of being consistent). With Volstad, you can at least fall back on 2008 as a showcase of how he can perform.
July 23, 200917 yr Back to Andrew Miller.... Why is it that Volstad is allowed to learn at the major league level, and no one else is? Hell, even Nolasco got sent to the minors when he pitched poorly. Not Volstad, though. West? Too early. Miller? Pffft...who has the patience? Because Volstad really wouldn't have learned anything from going back to AAA. Nolasco just need a rejuvenation. Miller seriously needs some consistency and command. But Volstad is really just having major league growing pains and he's just going through that phase where young pitchers have to adjust to the fact that the league his figured him out. And he can't do that in AAA.
July 23, 200917 yr Well, SLG is basically that. Batting stats against are just like batting stats for a hitter. And they're very good to use. OPS against would be the best way to see how hard a pitcher is getting hit. SLG would show power but it could be BABIP-induced, so it'd be better to look at ISO (SLG minus AVG) to see how bad the power numbers are against him. Yeah, I know about the 'against' stats. Even though I'm not a big stats guy when it comes to baseball, stats (to round a whole bunch of stuff up under one heading) is a big part of trading, something I've been doing for 40 years. Still, it's a little surprising that WHIP hasn't been refined a little further on a per-IP basis. Total bases (or whatever measure) would be no big deal to calculate. Not that WHIP is even at all well known outside of the few who really care. Regardless, I always appreciate your posts and insights. :thumbup
July 23, 200917 yr Well, SLG is basically that. Batting stats against are just like batting stats for a hitter. And they're very good to use. OPS against would be the best way to see how hard a pitcher is getting hit. SLG would show power but it could be BABIP-induced, so it'd be better to look at ISO (SLG minus AVG) to see how bad the power numbers are against him. Yeah, I know about the 'against' stats. Even though I'm not a big stats guy when it comes to baseball, stats (to round a whole bunch of stuff up under one heading) is a big part of trading, something I've been doing for 40 years. Still, it's a little surprising that WHIP hasn't been refined a little further on a per-IP basis. Total bases (or whatever measure) would be no big deal to calculate. Not that WHIP is even at all well known outside of the few who really care. Regardless, I always appreciate your posts and insights. :thumbup I'm not sure I would call TBIP more refined, at least not always. 2 walks and a single is nearly always worse than a triple (from the pitcher's point of view). 2 doubles is worse than a HR, etc.
July 23, 200917 yr theres no way that you can say halladay isnt better than lincecum. timmy is absolutely nasty but putting up numbers like that in the al east is unreal English: Tim Linecum is better than Roy Halladay Spanish*: Tim Lincecum es mejor que Roy Halladay German*: Tim Lincecum ist besser als Roy Halladay **Translations may be somewhat off I giggled. Well done. Btdubs , Miller23, check out Dan Haren's 1st half/2nd half splits if you haven't already. They're pretty stunning. He also has a BABIP .063 higher in the second half. I'm not sure what you are trying to say here? If you are trying to imply that he is unlucky, I disagree. It's extremely unlikely that he has had a consistently higher 2nd half BABIP-against in basically every year of his career. That seems like more than bad luck. It looks like he's simply been hit harder in the 2nd half. I'm not sure where to find his Line Drive % stats, though. Baseball reference didn't have them, or at least I didn't see them there.
July 23, 200917 yr Well, SLG is basically that. Batting stats against are just like batting stats for a hitter. And they're very good to use. OPS against would be the best way to see how hard a pitcher is getting hit. SLG would show power but it could be BABIP-induced, so it'd be better to look at ISO (SLG minus AVG) to see how bad the power numbers are against him. Yeah, I know about the 'against' stats. Even though I'm not a big stats guy when it comes to baseball, stats (to round a whole bunch of stuff up under one heading) is a big part of trading, something I've been doing for 40 years. Still, it's a little surprising that WHIP hasn't been refined a little further on a per-IP basis. Total bases (or whatever measure) would be no big deal to calculate. Not that WHIP is even at all well known outside of the few who really care. Regardless, I always appreciate your posts and insights. :thumbup I'm not sure I would call TBIP more refined, at least not always. 2 walks and a single is nearly always worse than a triple (from the pitcher's point of view). 2 doubles is worse than a HR, etc. I was about to post something similar but I realized you had already said it and much better than I could have.
July 23, 200917 yr Volstad really hasn't struggled for an extended period of time.... say 4 or 5 starts in a row the way Miller's had at times, and how Ricky had earlier this season. Sure he's not as good as last season, but he hasn't been a mess either.
July 23, 200917 yr I'm not sure what you are trying to say here? If you are trying to imply that he is unlucky, I disagree. It's extremely unlikely that he has had a consistently higher 2nd half BABIP-against in basically every year of his career. That seems like more than bad luck. It looks like he's simply been hit harder in the 2nd half. I'm not sure where to find his Line Drive % stats, though. Baseball reference didn't have them, or at least I didn't see them there. His Line Drive % is 20.7 % according to Hardballtimes.com. That is for the 2009 season so far. If you're looking at his career Line Drive % in the second half, then sorry, lol.
July 24, 200917 yr I'm not sure what you are trying to say here? If you are trying to imply that he is unlucky, I disagree. It's extremely unlikely that he has had a consistently higher 2nd half BABIP-against in basically every year of his career. That seems like more than bad luck. It looks like he's simply been hit harder in the 2nd half. I'm not sure where to find his Line Drive % stats, though. Baseball reference didn't have them, or at least I didn't see them there. His Line Drive % is 20.7 % according to Hardballtimes.com. That is for the 2009 season so far. If you're looking at his career Line Drive % in the second half, then sorry, lol. Yeah, looking for the 1st/2nd half splits. That seems pretty high, by the way, no? Nny?
July 24, 200917 yr Um, you could use baseball reference's game logs. Select the games in the first half and write down the LD%, do the same for second half, do it for every year, add them up and divide by the amount of years. An easier way might be Fangraphs, import the game logs into Excel and let a formula do the work. Would also be more accurate Either way the only way is to it manually.
July 24, 200917 yr Um, you could use baseball reference's game logs. Select the games in the first half and write down the LD%, do the same for second half, do it for every year, add them up and divide by the amount of years. An easier way might be Fangraphs, import the game logs into Excel and let a formula do the work. Would also be more accurate Either way the only way is to it manually. For the splits, or for the whole year?
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