Since financials are so hard to understand even with a degree in the field, how one interprets a report like this is going to be heavily influenced by any bias coming in:

 

If you are anti-Loria, you see the recent profits and declare the team profitable in the longterm and that means the team should increase spending (and lower that profit)

 

If you are pro-Loria, you see the loses incurred before those profits and the fact that no business wants to run at a loss rather than a profit and say that Loria has been doing the best he can.

 

What one really should do is to take the profits, take the losses, add them together for total profit for this team since Loria took over then compare that to other teams.

 

So what if the Marlins make X amount of profit if most other teams make X+Y in profit? That means the Marlins, while "making" money, would still be a small market team and can't afford to spend like other teams. If the average profit margin of a MLB team is above the profit margin of the Marlins, then they can't afford to take risks on players, sign them to big deals, because if something happens to the revenue stream (let's say another poor lease or luxury boxes don't sell), then the room for error is less.

 

A friend once said this: "When you play with numbers, all you get are more numbers." It is hard to tell what exactly is going on, and even then, how that relates to MLB as a whole.

I feel cheated...AGAIN..as a fan. LORIA and SAMSON lied for years about keeping the payroll low, about making money. They denied that they were saving up money to pay for their contribution to the stadium. They lied. It is what it it and it stinks. And the Cody dump, just to save a few bucks, hurts. Giving away a clubhouse leader who could mentor along our promising youngsters. Reprehensible.

 

 

In what world is being in debt making money? As far as how the numbers have been explained here, the marlins have been a negative investment.

 

Also, while Cody was a gamer he was extremely streaky and quite replaceable. I'll always remember him for taking a ball in the face and giving max effort, but the team decided to move forward without him. I wouldn't have liked to see our younger guys taking his approach at the plate, for what it's worth. Too many unproductive outs.

Talking about financials, is Logan Morrison making a jibe at the organisation in his most recent tweet:

 

This is the longest cab ride of my life. Y don't they put us up n something closer to the field? Bet money is involved some how

Talking about financials, is Logan Morrison making a jibe at the organisation in his most recent tweet:

 

This is the longest cab ride of my life. Y don't they put us up n something closer to the field? Bet money is involved some how

 

 

I think its a jibe, but I think its a pretty generic one. Most employees would complain in that style about accomodations.

Like i say, it is one of the reasons i cancel my season tickets and i don't care when some people bow to the FO and make excues for them, i don't have to, until they spend the money making the team better i will not renew my season tickets, end of story. thank you.

Burn them all!!!

Get the Torches and Pitchforks!!!!

Leaked documents turn Marlins from stingy to greedy: http://bit.ly/9xeXsy

 

Isn't it a bit disingenuous to ignore the timeperiod where they were losing money and only point at the market correction, where they were trying to make their money back?

 

Oh I gave it back to him, go see my comments. What an a**wipe that guy is. He mentioned Chicago so many times, its not hard to see he is a bitter Cubs fan, still P.O.'d about 2003. :lol

Like i say, it is one of the reasons i cancel my season tickets and i don't care when some people bow to the FO and make excues for them, i don't have to, until they spend the money making the team better i will not renew my season tickets, end of story. thank you.

 

 

 

 

:|

Since financials are so hard to understand even with a degree in the field, how one interprets a report like this is going to be heavily influenced by any bias coming in:

 

If you are anti-Loria, you see the recent profits and declare the team profitable in the longterm and that means the team should increase spending (and lower that profit)

 

If you are pro-Loria, you see the loses incurred before those profits and the fact that no business wants to run at a loss rather than a profit and say that Loria has been doing the best he can.

 

What one really should do is to take the profits, take the losses, add them together for total profit for this team since Loria took over then compare that to other teams.

 

So what if the Marlins make X amount of profit if most other teams make X+Y in profit? That means the Marlins, while "making" money, would still be a small market team and can't afford to spend like other teams. If the average profit margin of a MLB team is above the profit margin of the Marlins, then they can't afford to take risks on players, sign them to big deals, because if something happens to the revenue stream (let's say another poor lease or luxury boxes don't sell), then the room for error is less.

 

A friend once said this: "When you play with numbers, all you get are more numbers." It is hard to tell what exactly is going on, and even then, how that relates to MLB as a whole.

 

 

Yes, depending on what you want to defend you can stop short and not read through the whole document and try to defend your stand. And it does make more sense to compare with other teams to see how the Marlins fare against like teams.

 

For three people, me, myself and I, I'm glad I saw them. I often wanted to see the financials just out of curiousity sake because I'm in accounting. And also to know whether what I was hearing from Loria and/or Samson were true. I came away with a much different perspective. For a alot of time I've been anti-Loria and/or anti-Samson. Well, I can't say that anymore. I still may not like some of the things they do (like get rid of Cody because he is one of my favorites), and I still may disagree in the future in how they price/handle the new stadium, but I do know they weren't blowing huge smoke screens on these financials. I respect the partnership more for what they are trying to do, and it has made me much more PRO-MARLINS!!!

Since financials are so hard to understand even with a degree in the field, how one interprets a report like this is going to be heavily influenced by any bias coming in

 

Actually financial statements like these are designed to be understood by the common person that invests the appropriate time to read, understand and compare them. And when a CPA validates them you can be certain that they're prepared in respect to the industry guidelines. Sure you gain better insight with the more information you have (which is why insider trading is frowned upon.) However, it should be little problem for the common person to check their bias and get to the facts. In fact, that's exactly what financial statements are intended for. Placing all companies against an equal measuring stick to present just the facts.

 

You don't have to be anti or pro-Loria to see that these statements prove the Marlins' past statements. The local revenues suck, they incurred lots of debt, took huge yearly losses, have used recent profits to pay down debt and invested heavily into the stadium. That's the facts as revealed by the statement.

 

Now what you get is some ridiculous standards some fans have. "They should be okay with losing money" "They should invest more out of their own pocket books" "Another owner would have done it" "I expect all my $7 sodas to pay for Miguel Cabrera's salary."

 

In reality, those $7 sodas sum up to close to nothing net. Revenue sharing receipts were responsible for an astonishing 33-34% of the team's revenues! The team is practically on welfare. That "true profit" of $5 and $29 million in 2009 and 2008 would have been losses of $39 and $19 million without the revenue sharing checks. That's shocking.

This goes beyond mere money. We're all fans of the team, and this is a sport, a diversion, fun, for us all. We sit and watch every game all year. Wouldn't it have made for happier times, a more pleasant diversion, more fun, .......if LORIA had ponied up the money for some semblance of a bullpen. Just asking for maybe 5 million more a year to have gone to payroll. That still leaves a healthy profit. And it keeps the fans, the franchises biggest asset, in better spirits.

Like i say, it is one of the reasons i cancel my season tickets and i don't care when some people bow to the FO and make excues for them, i don't have to, until they spend the money making the team better i will not renew my season tickets, end of story. thank you.

 

 

If your idea of an excuse is "we can't spend money on player X right now because we're trying to recover from debt incurred trying to run this team" so be it. Just forgive me for having trouble understanding why you're lashing out at the FO in light of this information. They aren't the pirates brass, you know.

In all actuality, these financial statements show that Loria cannotreally afford this team. I understand that the club is barely making a profit. However, it shows that Loria does not have the deep pockets needed to acquire players without having to rely on the club to earn its keep. In other words, without the profit that he is accumulating from the club to pay for itself, he cannot contribute enough money to payroll to make us contenders. He did it after 03, and then spent years trying to make up for the money he spent.

After reviewing these financials, at least two things are clear: 1) the FO did turn $49M worth of profit in the past two years, and 2) the partnership is still $61M in the red even after the two years of profit. Which begs one lingering question: exactly how much in losses did Loria and the partnership carry over from the Montreal days? If a goodly chunk of that 61M was lost while operating as the Marlins, then I can't be too upset by the recent attempts to recoup losses. I agree that Loria and co is entitled to make a profit, and I don't agree that he should spend his own personal fortune just to try to win championships. A baseball team is a business, not a hobby for rich people.

 

If, however, the lion's share was lost operating as Les Expos, then I think we should all be outraged that Loria is using South Florida to recoup his losses incurred in Montreal. MLB was obviously privy to the financials back then, and should never have allowed any ownership group who'd lost so much money in Montreal to take the reins of another team. But who knows? We may never know the truth.

In all actuality, these financial statements show that Loria cannotreally afford this team. I understand that the club is barely making a profit. However, it shows that Loria does not have the deep pockets needed to acquire players without having to rely on the club to earn its keep. In other words, without the profit that he is accumulating from the club to pay for itself, he cannot contribute enough money to payroll to make us contenders. He did it after 03, and then spent years trying to make up for the money he spent.

 

 

 

 

Wrong. It's a business. He bought it. Therefore, he can afford the team.

 

He doesn't have to run this team at a deficit just to please the fans. Other teams spend because they have high enough profits to support it (or, more aptly, their expectations of profit when they spend said money on payroll are [still] high enough to justify the [additional] spending).

Talking about financials, is Logan Morrison making a jibe at the organisation in his most recent tweet:

 

This is the longest cab ride of my life. Y don't they put us up n something closer to the field? Bet money is involved some how

 

 

LOL

 

What a whiny brat. I'd be pissed about this if I were the Marlins. He shouldn't be making disparaging comments about his employer in a public forum.

In all actuality, these financial statements show that Loria cannotreally afford this team. I understand that the club is barely making a profit. However, it shows that Loria does not have the deep pockets needed to acquire players without having to rely on the club to earn its keep. In other words, without the profit that he is accumulating from the club to pay for itself, he cannot contribute enough money to payroll to make us contenders. He did it after 03, and then spent years trying to make up for the money he spent.

 

 

 

 

Wrong. It's a business. He bought it. Therefore, he can afford the team.

 

He doesn't have to run this team at a deficit just to please the fans. Other teams spend because they have high enough profits to support it (or, more aptly, their expectations of profit when they spend said money on payroll are [still] high enough to justify the [additional] spending).

 

Wrong. It was given to him in a shady backroom deal.

Anyone have a media guide handy?

 

I bet they probably stay somewhere in Manhattan, hence being away from Citi Field. What a travesty that is.

 

However, I think Morrison might be trying to be satirical so it's all good.

After reviewing these financials, at least two things are clear: 1) the FO did turn $49M worth of profit in the past two years, and 2) the partnership is still $61M in the red even after the two years of profit. Which begs one lingering question: exactly how much in losses did Loria and the partnership carry over from the Montreal days? If a goodly chunk of that 61M was lost while operating as the Marlins, then I can't be too upset by the recent attempts to recoup losses. I agree that Loria and co is entitled to make a profit, and I don't agree that he should spend his own personal fortune just to try to win championships. A baseball team is a business, not a hobby for rich people.

 

If, however, the lion's share was lost operating as Les Expos, then I think we should all be outraged that Loria is using South Florida to recoup his losses incurred in Montreal. MLB was obviously privy to the financials back then, and should never have allowed any ownership group who'd lost so much money in Montreal to take the reins of another team. But who knows? We may never know the truth.

 

 

I'm going to repeat what "..." said, because it's important and people don't seem to [always] be keeping this in mind:

 

The large amount of money he has invested in this team could, nearly risk-free, yield tremendous elsewhere of at least $5 million ++ per year, possible $7 million+, even with the terrible interest rates we currently have.

Anyone have a media guide handy?

 

I bet they probably stay somewhere in Manhattan, hence being away from Citi Field. What a travesty that is.

 

However, I think Morrison might be trying to be satirical so it's all good.

 

 

I haven't heard him speak much, so I'm inclined to not believe that until proven otherwise.

 

But if he is being satirical, then :lol.

Anyone have a media guide handy?

 

I bet they probably stay somewhere in Manhattan, hence being away from Citi Field. What a travesty that is.

 

However, I think Morrison might be trying to be satirical so it's all good.

 

Hilton New York near Carnegie Hall and Central Park.

After reviewing these financials, at least two things are clear: 1) the FO did turn $49M worth of profit in the past two years, and 2) the partnership is still $61M in the red even after the two years of profit. Which begs one lingering question: exactly how much in losses did Loria and the partnership carry over from the Montreal days? If a goodly chunk of that 61M was lost while operating as the Marlins, then I can't be too upset by the recent attempts to recoup losses. I agree that Loria and co is entitled to make a profit, and I don't agree that he should spend his own personal fortune just to try to win championships. A baseball team is a business, not a hobby for rich people.

 

If, however, the lion's share was lost operating as Les Expos, then I think we should all be outraged that Loria is using South Florida to recoup his losses incurred in Montreal. MLB was obviously privy to the financials back then, and should never have allowed any ownership group who'd lost so much money in Montreal to take the reins of another team. But who knows? We may never know the truth.

 

 

I'm going to repeat what "..." said, because it's important and people don't seem to [always] be keeping this in mind:

 

The large amount of money he has invested in this team could, nearly risk-free, yield tremendous elsewhere of at least $5 million ++ per year, possible $7 million+, even with the terrible interest rates we currently have.

I think you are missing the point.

 

He's saying that if a large portion of that debt is tied to Loria's failed investment in Montreal, it should be disconcerting to a Marlins fan to see the FO carrying that liability. Any ownership group could have come in and bought the team from Henry and got the shaft with local revenue, but would not have the extra burden of that Montreal debt.

 

He raises a good point and one has to wonder about how much of that red is trying to recover from the losses in Montreal. The Marlins could have fared better if an ownership group bought the franchise without that baggage.

This goes beyond mere money. We're all fans of the team, and this is a sport, a diversion, fun, for us all. We sit and watch every game all year. Wouldn't it have made for happier times, a more pleasant diversion, more fun, .......if LORIA had ponied up the money for some semblance of a bullpen. Just asking for maybe 5 million more a year to have gone to payroll. That still leaves a healthy profit. And it keeps the fans, the franchises biggest asset, in better spirits.

 

The payroll went up about $10M after a year when they only made $3.9M in profit.

Anyone have a media guide handy?

 

I bet they probably stay somewhere in Manhattan, hence being away from Citi Field. What a travesty that is.

 

However, I think Morrison might be trying to be satirical so it's all good.

 

The only hotels(motels) around CITI Field are the ones that charge by the hour.

I'm certain that they stay in Manhattan in a nice hotel.

Logan Morrison either made a poor joke, or more likely he's never experienced life(and traffic) in the big city.

Next trip, maybe they can put Logan up in one of the by-the-hour motels.

Anyone have a media guide handy?

 

I bet they probably stay somewhere in Manhattan, hence being away from Citi Field. What a travesty that is.

 

However, I think Morrison might be trying to be satirical so it's all good.

 

Hilton New York near Carnegie Hall and Central Park.

:lol

 

Thanks for coming through in the clutch.

 

I bet that cab ride feels a lot longer going to the stadium than it does leaving the stadium. Logan was surely joking.