July 13, 201115 yr I would give C.J. Wilson 4 years, $50 million in a heartbeat. He's not only a very good pitcher but also a lefty. You wouldn't get him for that. That may indeed be true. I still would, though. :lol I'm looking forward to Lou's workup. If ... is right though, I would have little problem giving almost all of that extra money to C.J. Wilson. He just seems like such a perfect fit for this team. I wonder if they're going to try to give Anibal a long-term deal at this point. We probably won't even get a discount now, which sucks.
July 13, 201115 yr What? I can't tell if you're joking or not. Kuroda has been better than Nolasco is since joining MLB and it would not surprise me if he outperforms Nolasco until he's 39. The numbers over 2008-2011 are pretty conclusive on this, so I don't see what the problem is.
July 13, 201115 yr What? I can't tell if you're joking or not. Kuroda has been better than Nolasco is since joining MLB and it would not surprise me if he outperforms Nolasco until he's 39. The numbers over 2008-2011 are pretty conclusive on this, so I don't see what the problem is. The part about asians aging differently than white people do. I'm not really sure where that's coming from, at least not in baseball.
July 13, 201115 yr What? I can't tell if you're joking or not. Kuroda has been better than Nolasco is since joining MLB and it would not surprise me if he outperforms Nolasco until he's 39. The numbers over 2008-2011 are pretty conclusive on this, so I don't see what the problem is. The part about asians aging differently than white people do. I'm not really sure where that's coming from, at least not in baseball. Oh, well that part was meant to be more of a joke. However, I am serious when I mean that Kuroda could outperform him over the duration of Nolasco's contract.
July 13, 201115 yr if we are to raise in payroll as the articles say i could possibly see the FO wait till the offseason and possibly overpay a good player like Wilson
July 13, 201115 yr if we are to raise in payroll as the articles say i could possibly see the FO wait till the offseason and possibly overprice a good player like Wilson But lets add Wilson/Bedard not subtract Nolasco (I heard talk about trading Nolasco for Wilson which would make no sense and would be pointless)
July 13, 201115 yr Never mind CJ Wilson is giving up runs galore in the ASG. Bedard, ftw. CJ WIlson could give up 15 runs in the ASG and I'd still take him over Bedard.
July 13, 201115 yr are the Marlins really going to start having a major league payroll next year? I mean, I know they spent 7mil on Vazquez this year, but I don't believe this team will shell out big money. The average MLB payroll is about 80 million. They have consistently said they expect to be an average payroll team in the new park. Do you have a link? Here are a few: Loria 2008: "You all know how much I love winning and how dedicated I am to the team and to the city," Loria said. "I've stepped up when I've had to step up before and I will do it in the future, but we've got to get close to getting into that stadium." http://articles.sun-...anley-ramirez/2 Loria 2008: "Down the road, absolutely," Loria said of a bump in payroll. "I think that's what we've been categorized as -- a middle-market team. It's all going to be a function of the revenues that we generate. If we have a bigger base than we anticipate, then that will go back into payroll." http://florida.marli...t=.jsp&c_id=fla Loria 2009: "Eventually, when we're situated in the new stadium, revenues will be spent on increasing the payroll," Loria said. http://www.usatoday....-approval_N.htm Samson 2006: We don’t let our people here call Miami a small-market team. The Florida Marlins are not a small-market team. We’re a low-revenue team and we’ve got to cure that. One way to cure this is to make sure we play in a place that’s a baseball-only facility with a roof that has air conditioning so people will want to come and enjoy a night out no matter what the weather is. http://www.bizofbase...id=38&Itemid=35 Samson 2009: "Our expenses will always match our revenue. Certainly with the increased revenues we expect from the new ballpark, we would expect to be certainly a middle-of-the-pack industry average payroll but only time will tell." http://www.sportsbus...park-Opens.aspx Samson 2009: "This is not a small-market team," Samson said. "It has been a low-revenue team. Miami and its surrounding counties to me are at least a mid- to above-average market. If we can get the revenue that should go along with that size market, then we certainly should be at least in the mid-range." http://www.wsvn.com/...ports/MI111768/ Samson 2010: "Our business is that our payroll … we don't make any money any year from a cash standpoint. Any extra cash goes into payroll. That will be the same in the new ballpark. If we have more cash, higher payroll." http://articles.sun-...-Admin-beinfest Samson 2011: Samson said the payroll, which has risen from $48 million to $58 million, “will go up� next year “but we don’t know how much.� http://www.miamihera...ng-florida.html Beinfest 2011: If the National League doesn't already have enough problems with the Marlins, wait until next year when they are scheduled to move into a new ballpark with a retractable roof. Finally, they expect to have respectable attendance and a competitive payroll. "We're not going to change our model," Beinfest says, "but we think it's going to be a game-changer for us." http://www.usatoday....beat26_ST_U.htm
July 13, 201115 yr Never mind CJ Wilson is giving up runs galore in the ASG. Bedard, ftw. CJ WIlson could give up 15 runs in the ASG and I'd still take him over Bedard. That's nice do you actually have reasons or? Bedard has a lower career ERA and has played on poor offensive teams as well, the only knock on him is he has been injured. Which I am guessing thats what your reasoning is, or actually no I'm not going to guess I'll just wait for a response.
July 13, 201115 yr Never mind CJ Wilson is giving up runs galore in the ASG. Bedard, ftw. CJ WIlson could give up 15 runs in the ASG and I'd still take him over Bedard. That's nice do you actually have reasons or? Bedard has a lower career ERA and has played on poor offensive teams as well, the only knock on him is he has been injured. Which I am guessing thats what your reasoning is, or actually no I'm not going to guess I'll just wait for a response. I see you're already adjusting to the way discussions work on these forums.
July 13, 201115 yr are the Marlins really going to start having a major league payroll next year? I mean, I know they spent 7mil on Vazquez this year, but I don't believe this team will shell out big money. The average MLB payroll is about 80 million. They have consistently said they expect to be an average payroll team in the new park. Do you have a link? Here are a few: Loria 2008: "You all know how much I love winning and how dedicated I am to the team and to the city," Loria said. "I've stepped up when I've had to step up before and I will do it in the future, but we've got to get close to getting into that stadium." http://articles.sun-...anley-ramirez/2 Loria 2008: "Down the road, absolutely," Loria said of a bump in payroll. "I think that's what we've been categorized as -- a middle-market team. It's all going to be a function of the revenues that we generate. If we have a bigger base than we anticipate, then that will go back into payroll." http://florida.marli...t=.jsp&c_id=fla Loria 2009: "Eventually, when we're situated in the new stadium, revenues will be spent on increasing the payroll," Loria said. http://www.usatoday....-approval_N.htm Samson 2006: We don’t let our people here call Miami a small-market team. The Florida Marlins are not a small-market team. We’re a low-revenue team and we’ve got to cure that. One way to cure this is to make sure we play in a place that’s a baseball-only facility with a roof that has air conditioning so people will want to come and enjoy a night out no matter what the weather is. http://www.bizofbase...id=38&Itemid=35 Samson 2009: "Our expenses will always match our revenue. Certainly with the increased revenues we expect from the new ballpark, we would expect to be certainly a middle-of-the-pack industry average payroll but only time will tell." http://www.sportsbus...park-Opens.aspx Samson 2009: "This is not a small-market team," Samson said. "It has been a low-revenue team. Miami and its surrounding counties to me are at least a mid- to above-average market. If we can get the revenue that should go along with that size market, then we certainly should be at least in the mid-range." http://www.wsvn.com/...ports/MI111768/ Samson 2010: "Our business is that our payroll … we don't make any money any year from a cash standpoint. Any extra cash goes into payroll. That will be the same in the new ballpark. If we have more cash, higher payroll." http://articles.sun-...-Admin-beinfest Samson 2011: Samson said the payroll, which has risen from $48 million to $58 million, “will go up� next year “but we don’t know how much.� http://www.miamihera...ng-florida.html Beinfest 2011: If the National League doesn't already have enough problems with the Marlins, wait until next year when they are scheduled to move into a new ballpark with a retractable roof. Finally, they expect to have respectable attendance and a competitive payroll. "We're not going to change our model," Beinfest says, "but we think it's going to be a game-changer for us." http://www.usatoday....beat26_ST_U.htm Anything in there about having a league average payroll?
July 13, 201115 yr There is a difference between saying that payroll will increase with revenue and saying that payroll will be league average (or at the median).
July 13, 201115 yr Never mind CJ Wilson is giving up runs galore in the ASG. Bedard, ftw. CJ WIlson could give up 15 runs in the ASG and I'd still take him over Bedard. That's nice do you actually have reasons or? Bedard has a lower career ERA and has played on poor offensive teams as well, the only knock on him is he has been injured. Which I am guessing thats what your reasoning is, or actually no I'm not going to guess I'll just wait for a response. Right now Wilson > Bedard
July 13, 201115 yr are the Marlins really going to start having a major league payroll next year? I mean, I know they spent 7mil on Vazquez this year, but I don't believe this team will shell out big money. The average MLB payroll is about 80 million. They have consistently said they expect to be an average payroll team in the new park. Do you have a link? Here are a few: Loria 2008: "You all know how much I love winning and how dedicated I am to the team and to the city," Loria said. "I've stepped up when I've had to step up before and I will do it in the future, but we've got to get close to getting into that stadium." http://articles.sun-...anley-ramirez/2 Loria 2008: "Down the road, absolutely," Loria said of a bump in payroll. "I think that's what we've been categorized as -- a middle-market team. It's all going to be a function of the revenues that we generate. If we have a bigger base than we anticipate, then that will go back into payroll." http://florida.marli...t=.jsp&c_id=fla Loria 2009: "Eventually, when we're situated in the new stadium, revenues will be spent on increasing the payroll," Loria said. http://www.usatoday....-approval_N.htm Samson 2006: We don’t let our people here call Miami a small-market team. The Florida Marlins are not a small-market team. We’re a low-revenue team and we’ve got to cure that. One way to cure this is to make sure we play in a place that’s a baseball-only facility with a roof that has air conditioning so people will want to come and enjoy a night out no matter what the weather is. http://www.bizofbase...id=38&Itemid=35 Samson 2009: "Our expenses will always match our revenue. Certainly with the increased revenues we expect from the new ballpark, we would expect to be certainly a middle-of-the-pack industry average payroll but only time will tell." http://www.sportsbus...park-Opens.aspx Samson 2009: "This is not a small-market team," Samson said. "It has been a low-revenue team. Miami and its surrounding counties to me are at least a mid- to above-average market. If we can get the revenue that should go along with that size market, then we certainly should be at least in the mid-range." http://www.wsvn.com/...ports/MI111768/ Samson 2010: "Our business is that our payroll … we don't make any money any year from a cash standpoint. Any extra cash goes into payroll. That will be the same in the new ballpark. If we have more cash, higher payroll." http://articles.sun-...-Admin-beinfest Samson 2011: Samson said the payroll, which has risen from $48 million to $58 million, “will go up� next year “but we don’t know how much.� http://www.miamihera...ng-florida.html Beinfest 2011: If the National League doesn't already have enough problems with the Marlins, wait until next year when they are scheduled to move into a new ballpark with a retractable roof. Finally, they expect to have respectable attendance and a competitive payroll. "We're not going to change our model," Beinfest says, "but we think it's going to be a game-changer for us." http://www.usatoday....beat26_ST_U.htm Anything in there about having a league average payroll? Yes, there is. You have to read it to find it, though.
July 13, 201115 yr Never mind CJ Wilson is giving up runs galore in the ASG. Bedard, ftw. CJ WIlson could give up 15 runs in the ASG and I'd still take him over Bedard. That's nice do you actually have reasons or? Bedard has a lower career ERA and has played on poor offensive teams as well, the only knock on him is he has been injured. Which I am guessing thats what your reasoning is, or actually no I'm not going to guess I'll just wait for a response. Right now Wilson > Bedard Wrong. Bedard has a better ERA and WHIP this year. He plays on the Mariners not the Rangers thats the difference, remember don't judge a pitcher on wins it's a very overrated stat. Bedard > Wilson Please back up your opinions people.
July 13, 201115 yr Wrong. Bedard has a better ERA and WHIP this year. He plays on the Mariners not the Rangers thats the difference, remember don't judge a pitcher on wins it's a very overrated stat. Bedard > Wilson Please back up your opinions people. CJ Wilson's home park is MUCH tougher on pitchers than Bedard's. Comparing pitchers in two different parks isn't as bad as judging them on wins, but it's not very good. Because of that, CJ Wilson has a 130 ERA+ compared to Bedard's 125 ERA+. Wilson has a 136 ERA+ over the last 3 seasons at ~400 IP, compared to 130 ERA+ over ~250 IP for Bedard over 4 seasons. Wilson is also 2 years younger. Personally, I'm not sure I'd want to sign either of them as FAs, because they're both on the wrong side of 30. But I'll go with the guy with less injuries who isn't pitching in a major pitcher's park who is 2 years younger.
July 13, 201115 yr Never mind CJ Wilson is giving up runs galore in the ASG. Bedard, ftw. CJ WIlson could give up 15 runs in the ASG and I'd still take him over Bedard. That's nice do you actually have reasons or? Bedard has a lower career ERA and has played on poor offensive teams as well, the only knock on him is he has been injured. Which I am guessing thats what your reasoning is, or actually no I'm not going to guess I'll just wait for a response. Right now Wilson > Bedard Wrong. Bedard has a better ERA and WHIP this year. He plays on the Mariners not the Rangers thats the difference, remember don't judge a pitcher on wins it's a very overrated stat. Bedard > Wilson Please back up your opinions people. Wilson is younger (albeit by 2 years) Wilson has more strikeouts (albeit walks more) True Bedard has a better ERA and WHIP but also has 4 fewer starts than Wilson. And yeah there is the injury thing.
July 13, 201115 yr Anything in there about having a league average payroll? You asked for a link. I gave you 9. And not just links, but the money quotes in the articles that give the full flavor of what their whole spending philosophy has been for many years, and what they have been explicitly saying for many years about what they expect payroll to be in the new park. And you can't be bothered to read 9 short quotes averaging about 2 lines each? :banghead Let me simplify the onerous task of reading 18 lines of text with two quotes from Samson in 2009: Certainly with the increased revenues we expect from the new ballpark, we would expect to be certainly a middle-of-the-pack industry average payroll but only time will tell. http://www.sportsbus...park-Opens.aspx If we can get the revenue that should go along with that size market, then we certainly should be at least in the mid-range. http://www.wsvn.com/...ports/MI111768/
July 13, 201115 yr Anything in there about having a league average payroll? You asked for a link. I gave you 9. And not just links, but the money quotes in the articles that give the full flavor of what their whole spending philosophy has been for many years, and what they have been explicitly saying for many years about what they expect payroll to be in the new park. And you can't be bothered to read 9 short quotes averaging about 2 lines each? :banghead Let me simplify the onerous task of reading 18 lines of text with two quotes from Samson in 2009: Certainly with the increased revenues we expect from the new ballpark, we would expect to be certainly a middle-of-the-pack industry average payroll but only time will tell. http://www.sportsbus...park-Opens.aspx If we can get the revenue that should go along with that size market, then we certainly should be at least in the mid-range. http://www.wsvn.com/...ports/MI111768/ But did he literally say the words "League Aver--" ah f*** it.
July 13, 201115 yr Anything in there about having a league average payroll? You asked for a link. I gave you 9. And not just links, but the money quotes in the articles that give the full flavor of what their whole spending philosophy has been for many years, and what they have been explicitly saying for many years about what they expect payroll to be in the new park. And you can't be bothered to read 9 short quotes averaging about 2 lines each? :banghead Let me simplify the onerous task of reading 18 lines of text with two quotes from Samson in 2009: Certainly with the increased revenues we expect from the new ballpark, we would expect to be certainly a middle-of-the-pack industry average payroll but only time will tell. http://www.sportsbus...park-Opens.aspx If we can get the revenue that should go along with that size market, then we certainly should be at least in the mid-range. http://www.wsvn.com/...ports/MI111768/ Don't Loria / Samson payroll comments from 2011 supercede their payroll comments from 2009? I say yes. In February 2011 Loria said the 2012 payroll wouldn't be determined until after the 2011 season.
July 13, 201115 yr Anything in there about having a league average payroll? You asked for a link. I gave you 9. And not just links, but the money quotes in the articles that give the full flavor of what their whole spending philosophy has been for many years, and what they have been explicitly saying for many years about what they expect payroll to be in the new park. And you can't be bothered to read 9 short quotes averaging about 2 lines each? :banghead Let me simplify the onerous task of reading 18 lines of text with two quotes from Samson in 2009: Certainly with the increased revenues we expect from the new ballpark, we would expect to be certainly a middle-of-the-pack industry average payroll but only time will tell. http://www.sportsbus...park-Opens.aspx If we can get the revenue that should go along with that size market, then we certainly should be at least in the mid-range. http://www.wsvn.com/...ports/MI111768/ But did he literally say the words "League Aver--" ah f*** it. This is all cracking me up.
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