January 17, 20188 yr Hey @fish20, I found this quote that sided with you and, in the interest of fairness, I'll post it. It's from the guy in charge of getting tenants for the garages and he's basically saying what you said. Wait, are you him??? [ATTACH]1714._xfImport[/ATTACH] To me, the garage tenant problem is all on the city and can't be put on the team even with the team's lack of success not helping... but I will acknowledge that the baseball schedule and the surrounding community hasn't helped much either.
January 17, 20188 yr Hey @fish20, I found this quote that sided with you and, in the interest of fairness, I'll post it. It's from the guy in charge of getting tenants for the garages and he's basically saying what you said. Wait, are you him??? [ATTACH]1714[/ATTACH] wasnt me, but it's right on. It makes no business sense to put a bar or something in there while the team is like this and the area surrounding the ballpark is the same. The area just sucks. I know it has cultural significance down here, but when i go to games i leave right away and if im going out ill go somewhere in brickell rather than staying in that area.
January 17, 20188 yr Quotes from Samson in 2013 when asked why there were only a couple businesses open in the garages... [ATTACH]1712[/ATTACH] [ATTACH]1713[/ATTACH] Just for the sake of debate to counter that, I wouldnt want David samson's help with anything business management related either.
January 17, 20188 yr Just for the sake of debate to counter that, I wouldnt want David samson's help with anything business management related either. Lol good one.
January 17, 20188 yr Just for the sake of debate to counter that, I wouldnt want David samson's help with anything business management related either. David Samson did swindle Miami into building a ballpark for his Jeff's shit franchise. Whatever that's worth.
January 17, 20188 yr David Samson did swindle Miami into building a ballpark for his Jeff's shit franchise. Whatever that's worth. Very true. He's actually probably not the worst partner if you want an annoying businessman who knows how to con people.
January 17, 20188 yr The Astros begin to win games after three consecutive over 100 loses seasons,this team have no consecutive over 100 loses seasons in their relatively short history even always had losing season,so I doubt how many people would keep staying here after three to five consecutive over 100 loses seasons.
January 17, 20188 yr I doubt how many people would keep staying here after three to five consecutive over 100 loses seasons You really think it'll be 5 consecutive 100 loss seasons?
January 17, 20188 yr Finishing in the middle, as they've been doing, doesn't get you draft picks like Correa, Springer, and Bregman Nothing can get you those guys in the draft, they've all already been drafted by the Astros.
January 17, 20188 yr The Marlins need more 100 loss seasons during the rebuilding years. Finishing in the middle, as they've been doing, doesn't get you draft picks like Correa, Springer, and Bregman. To be fair Springer was 11th, even if the other guys were top 2. The Marlins last 6 primary picks are: Heaney-9 overall Moran-6 Kolek-2 Naylor-12 Garret-7 Rogers-12 Garret, Rogers, and Kolek may still turn into something, but that is a a lot of draft capital and not much to show at the moment. Heaney did turn into a few good Dee years and I suppose Neidert, but Moran and Naylor are simply wasted high value picks they didn't even get any real value for in trades. Kolek has been a downright disaster and probably one of the worst top picks in the last few decades. I don't think the win/loss matters for where they pick in the draft. Those are high enough picks where you should have something. Astros did mess up two of their four first or second overall picks (Appel, Aiken) so while they hit big on Correa and Bregman, it's still not a guarantee no matter where you draft. Just saying. A lot more went into the Astros besides tanking for picks. Top to bottom drafting, use of international free agency money, smart trades to drum up some value, key free agent acquisitions. Across the board operational improvements. This is why the Marlins need to continue clearing house, get more prospects, keep Yelich and Realmuto, and see what October 2018 looks like. They could get another 15+ guys trading out the remainder of the team between now and July 31st, and that's adding literally 30+ players from when Phelps/Ramos first got traded. Who knows what they will have when all is said and done.
January 17, 20188 yr The Marlins need more 100 loss seasons during the rebuilding years. Finishing in the middle, as they've been doing, doesn't get you draft picks like Correa, Springer, and Bregman. Springer was the 11th pick, but the point is well taken. Schwarber, Almora, Bryant, Ian Happ, and Javy Baez were all top 10 picks for the Cubs in their rebuild. It helps when you dont consistently go under slot value because your owner is a cheap ass. this rebuild will be pointless and I will crush this ownership if they dont take proactive steps to make this rebuild as effective as possible. If the new ownership sits on their international money and cheaps out on the draft like Loria, then they should be removed. Edit- didnt see Lou just said the same thing about springer.
January 18, 20188 yr I'm not saying it makes an incredible difference for a rebuilding club, but occasionally a draft class will have 1-2 no-brainer, can't miss types. Of course the draft is still a crapshoot to a high degree, but there is still a slight strategic advantage to embracing the better draft position. And I still agree that there is still good talent to be had in the middle, but I think there is unquestionably a slight edge if you draft in the top three. My point here is that a team like the Marlins who are obviously rebuilding are wise to simply accept the shitty 100 loss seasons. The draft position is only one benefit of not spending money on mediocre free agents to secure a 79 win season instead of a 100 loss season. 79 win seasons are pretty dangerous for small market teams. the 79 season thing is part of the reason we've been muddled in mediocrity for nearly a decade. Only time we've been near the top where there should be cant miss guys we've missed spectacularly. Good news is the plan is for us to be right near the top for at least the next 2 years. The ironic thing about the astros is out of all those guys they hit on and given how well they've drafted, they completely whiffed on 2 number 1 overall picks, although Aiken was more injury risk than terrible pick.
January 18, 20188 yr To be fair Springer was 11th, even if the other guys were top 2. The Marlins last 6 primary picks are: Heaney-9 overall Moran-6 Kolek-2 Naylor-12 Garret-7 Rogers-12 Garret, Rogers, and Kolek may still turn into something, but that is a a lot of draft capital and not much to show at the moment. Heaney did turn into a few good Dee years and I suppose Neidert, but Moran and Naylor are simply wasted high value picks they didn't even get any real value for in trades. Kolek has been a downright disaster and probably one of the worst top picks in the last few decades. I don't think the win/loss matters for where they pick in the draft. Those are high enough picks where you should have something. Astros did mess up two of their four first or second overall picks (Appel, Aiken) so while they hit big on Correa and Bregman, it's still not a guarantee no matter where you draft. Just saying. A lot more went into the Astros besides tanking for picks. Top to bottom drafting, use of international free agency money, smart trades to drum up some value, key free agent acquisitions. Across the board operational improvements. This is why the Marlins need to continue clearing house, get more prospects, keep Yelich and Realmuto, and see what October 2018 looks like. They could get another 15+ guys trading out the remainder of the team between now and July 31st, and that's adding literally 30+ players from when Phelps/Ramos first got traded. Who knows what they will have when all is said and done. Cant really count the Aiken pick. He did turn into Bregman. I'd be willing to bet the Astros have some good prospects from picking top of rounds 2-10 those years also.
January 18, 20188 yr I'm not saying it makes an incredible difference for a rebuilding club, but occasionally a draft class will have 1-2 no-brainer, can't miss types. Of course the draft is still a crapshoot to a high degree, but there is still a slight strategic advantage to embracing the better draft position. And I still agree that there is still good talent to be had in the middle, but I think there is unquestionably a slight edge if you draft in the top three. My point here is that a team like the Marlins who are obviously rebuilding are wise to simply accept the shitty 100 loss seasons. The draft position is only one benefit of not spending money on mediocre free agents to secure a 79 win season instead of a 100 loss season. 79 win seasons are pretty dangerous for small market teams. Yea, of course. We're on the same page here. I'm full on Philadelphia 76ersing this situation - except the Marlins have an advantage where they actually have two good young pieces with Yelich and Realmuto which they can hold onto for 1-1.5 years before making a decision on trading them to see if they did strike gold acquiring Guzman/Alcantara/Neidert/Sierra/Rogers/etc.
January 18, 20188 yr Cant really count the Aiken pick. He did turn into Bregman. I'd be willing to bet the Astros have some good prospects from picking top of rounds 2-10 those years also. 2011 - Springer(1) 2012 - Correa(1), McCulllers (1s) 2013 - Nothing 2014 - D. Fischer (1s), AJ Reed (2). J. Davis (3) 2015 - Bregman(1), K. Tucker (1), D. Cameron (1s) They got a superstar SS, three very good players, and potentially another guy or two breaks out, likely K. Tucker. This is hitting on 4-6 guys in 5 drafts, although they are super super high end. This is why it's a top to bottom situation. Altuve was an international free agent, they got Devenski, Peacock, W. Harris, Musgrove, Marwin, and others in super cheap trades. They did well moving Folty (Gattis), Velasquez (Giles), Cossart (Marisnick, and Moran who helped turned into G. Cole), Abreu/Guzman (McCann) in larger trades. The previous regime hit the lottery with a 2009 7th round pick who is a Cy Young calibre pitcher. Morton, Reddick, Gurriel, etc. all worked out in free agency. Verlander was amazing. It's just top to bottom domination where everything contributed to their success. It's not just the draft even if they got 4-5 key players from 2011-2015. This is why the Marlins really need to max out Straily/Bour/Castro/Barraclough/Prado/Ziegler/Dietrich/whoever. The Astros equivalent of those guys brought them players like Devenski, Peacock, Musgrove, Gattis, Giles, etc. Not their super core players, but that's a strong supporting cast that was developed trading the Jed Lowries and JA Happs of the world.
February 2, 20188 yr “Criticism comes with it (the fire sale), I guess.” -Derek Jeter https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/mlb/columnist/bob-nightengale/2018/02/01/his-teflon-aura-gone-derek-jeter-needs-thick-skin-survive-ugly-marlins-winter/1088344001/
February 2, 20188 yr What they are doing is right in a baseball sense, but good god they need to hire a PR man or something. Maybe im giving too much credit to casual fans, but i think if this was explained properly ahead of time and framed in the right way there would be less bad blood. But now that i think of it, just based on the history of the team, maybe there wasnt anything that could have been done to chill the venom spewed toward the new ownership and the fan base just needs to see the reward that will be reaped from these moves.
February 2, 20188 yr Interesting how he says the projections for attendance and profit in 2018 that were released by the Herald are "outdated projections." Does that mean he's tweaked the plan since then? If so, I wonder what it is now. Does he really think attendance will rise in 2018 compared to 2017? Wish we knew the answer to this.
February 2, 20188 yr Selling off the valuable assets is the right baseball move, but as a whole the talent they've gotten back has been underwhelming. Again certainly not terrible, but I think the way they've orchestrated some of these moves is certainly open to criticism. I obviously like a lot of the talent theyve acquired and really have no interest in debating it because its literally just talking in circles until we see them play, but im probably the most positive person about the moves this offseason and even i can admit the PR has been terrible. But i think its reasonable to question how much even the best PR would have helped just given this markets previous ownership wounds. It could obviously have been done so much better from a PR perspective, but would there be a tangible impact in framing it the right way to the general fan? Or would they just see any trade of major players as "oh its just another firesale like we've always had!"
February 2, 20188 yr Interesting how he says the projections for attendance and profit in 2018 that were released by the Herald are "outdated projections." Does that mean he's tweaked the plan since then? If so, I wonder what it is now. Does he really think attendance will rise in 2018 compared to 2017? Wish we knew the answer to this. Ya those were outdated projections. They were from august if i recall correctly from Barry Jackson's pieces. Also, as an interesting aside, Lebatard in yesterdays local hour essentially said that his sources have told him that all this Mas nonsense that he would have done anything significantly different is hindsight nonsense. Essentially said that Mas is now saying he had all this money and would have done things so much differently, and that Loria said the same and then brought Mas' financials to the other owners only to realize he was essentially full of shit about how much money he had.
February 2, 20188 yr Man lay off the guy already. We get it. its alright. I really dont care about his opinion. He knows everything so i just gotta understand that.
February 2, 20188 yr it's just unbelievable how someone could so blatantly be drinking the kool aid and never question any of the moves Jeter has made thus far. in a thread where im literally saying the PR has been terrible. Please do tell me how every one of the prospects we've acquired will turn out oh all knowing one.
February 2, 20188 yr but i think if this was explained properly ahead of time and framed in the right way there would be less bad blood. And it was unequivocally not explained properly ahead of time. Jeter’s - I’m A Living God- smugness got in the way I suppose. I’d estimate 80% of this board thoroughly understands the need for a rebuild but dear God it was handled about as poorly as possible by new ownership. “Things weren’t working” and “just trust us” fell on deaf ears. This fan base has been sodomized over and over again. Having their finger on the pulse of the history of the franchise would have helped. And, yes, the returns have not been overwhelming. Gordon, Stanton, Ozuna and YELICH have brought back two Top 100 prospects. I think this is a .500 team in 2020/2021 and hopefully a playoff team in 2021/2022 but right now this is a giant shit sandwich and we (Marlins fans) all get to take a big bite.
February 2, 20188 yr And it was unequivocally not explained properly ahead of time. Jeter’s - I’m A Living God- smugness got in the way I suppose. I’d estimate 80% of this board thoroughly understands the need for a rebuild but dear God it was handled about as poorly as possible by new ownership. “Things weren’t working” and “just trust us” fell on deaf ears. This fan base has been sodomized over and over again. Having their finger on the pulse of the history of the franchise would have helped. And, yes, the returns have not been overwhelming. Gordon, Stanton, Ozuna and YELICH have brought back two Top 100 prospects. I think this is a .500 team in 2020/2021 and hopefully a playoff team in 2021/2022 but right now this is a giant shit sandwich and we (Marlins fans) all get to take a big bite. inaccurate
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