They are NEVER going to get fans back in that park.

 

I couldn't agree with this sentence more. No matter WHAT - fans will never fill that ballpark day in and day out like they do elsewhere. In the big "melting pot" that is South Florida, too many people have other teams they root for, other sports they prefer, other activities they would rather be doing, etc. I can't see ANY scenario where attendance ever improves to a level worthy enough of putting a competitive team on the field year in and year out. Relo?  I can see that. Works for me. They will always be my team, and I don't live in Florida anymore anyway. With our present technology, we can follow our teams easily. Whatever it takes. Business is business. All that being said, I respect Jeter and I believe HE respects the game of baseball. I believe his intentions are solid. I like the move of building from the ground up (yes, this is going to be painful), but I have to agree with you whole-heartedly on the attendance portion of this situation.

 

 

so they don't lose 120 games again. 

 

Considering this has only happened once in MLB history, it may be an overreaction to say it'll not only happen this year but possibly in multiple seasons. Save the drama. I think Jeter fucked up trading everyone away and not getting enough back overall, but 100 -105 losses is probably more accurate.

 

 

@hovertical I can respect your need to get things off your chest.   This is a good place for that.  Keep in mind though this team has never been good.  This has been dissected many times here. Also MLB will never contract a team.  This hasn’t happened since the 1800s.  Relocation is also not likely. Even setting aside the fact that a stadium was recently built MLB just doesn’t move franchises that often.  The Expos were a very extraordinary situation.   Prior to that there were only ten moves ever.  Most of which were motivated by expanding the reach of the league.  The Marlins are here to stay. 

 

 

Good news: Turner DFA’d.

 

Hopefully we never see him again.

 

Edit: We should be able to put that in the Dimelo page. We never want to see Turner again.

 

 

Changeup and fastball are certainly mediocre. 

 

I thought his change-up was pretty good.  His curveball has good bite on it.  His fastball is certainly mediocre which means he needs to have better command of.  I thought he lacked command of his Fastball and that's why he was getting hammered.  He also hung a curve but that happens.  I think the cold weather messed with both Smith and Peters.  We'll see what happens next time out. 

 

 

I thought his change-up was pretty good.  His curveball has good bite on it.  His fastball is certainly mediocre which means he needs to have better command of.  I thought he lacked command of his Fastball and that's why he was getting hammered.  He also hung a curve but that happens.  I think the cold weather messed with both Smith and Peters.  We'll see what happens next time out. 

 

Phillies pitchers have looked pretty good in the same cold weather.

 

 

So yeah, i'm here to spread negativity because again because i've been with the team since their inception and I feel i've earned the right to seriously bitch at them after all these years - plus i'm just one of those people who feel better after just getting it off my chest.  I have a strong feeling the Marlins will either be relo'd or contracted within the next 5-7 years.  What Jeter did to this team was to remove ALL the pieces worth coming to the park for - sorry, there's no top flight prospect on the current team, there's no stud blue chip prospect on the way.  There's literally nothing for the fans to show up for at all.  Hell, there's not even a dude who can top 30 homers this season and they'll probably be hard pressed to have 2 guys top 20 hr's all season long.  There's no flame thrower who can K 12+ on a given night....there's just nothing to watch.  It's the most vanilla collection of players I've ever seen on a team.  Some of you get all  excited over Rojas being given a fulltime job?  why?  because he can play good defense?  someone hold my beer so i can settle in on the off-chance that once every dozen games there might be one play he gets a chance to dazzle with in another 20-1 blowout.  Nah, be boxscore warriors people.  Jeter fucked this team over bad by being part of a group too fucking cheap/poor to be able to withstand a few seasons of monetary losses while they worked on the MOST important part of the team which was their reputation within the skeptical south florida fans.  They blew that chance from the get-go whether it was the firesale, the constant firing/rehiring circus with Conine, et al., and then childish sounding shit like "project wolverine" ffs.  Stanton said it best on his way out, it's always a circus down there and Jeter continues to keep up the antics with his shitshow that's worse than Loria's, as mind-numbingly difficult as that is to believe. They are NEVER going to get fans back in that park. I don't care if they miraculously field a 95 win team for a couple seasons in a row, fans are never going to come back at a rate required to  field a competitive team year in and year out.  If by some miracle the Marlins aren't relo'd or contracted the few remaining fans will now be waiting for the next ownership group to take over, just like we patiently waited for Loria's time to come for all those years. 

 

I hope I'm wrong, I hope i'm 100% wrong on all accounts and that somehow multiple players start taking it upon themselves to lead and they somehow accelerate their learning curve and buck the odds and develop into marketable stars. I hope that it happens soon and that by some miracle a buzz develops, that isn't a cloud of mosquitos, and even a paltry15k start showing up night after night.  I hope that Jeter and company realize their mistakes and actually INVEST some money into actual starting players in the next offseason so they don't lose 120 games again.  I hope I'm wrong.  I hope I'll have a reason to actually watch baseball again next year because being down to only watching one sport absolutely sucks.  I hope I'm wrong about everything they've done and I'm just too dense to see it.  I miss my team. 

 

Trust me I undetstand your frustrations.  I was against the firesale and I think I've been pretty clear on how much I loathe Jeter! With that said, it's too soon to accurately judge the talent we got back.  I believe Brinson has a chance to be good.   Isan Diaz and Monte Harrison also have very exciting tools.  Not to mention the power arms that we got in Alcantarra and Guzman.  I don't know if any or all will pan out but my guess is that some will. We just have to be patient.   As for contraction, that's a moot point.   It's not going to happen. Relocation is also not an option.  They have like 24 years left on that stadium lease.  

 

Also, if you build a winning franchise the fans will come.   Those same transplanted fans support the Heat don't they?  If Pat Riley wouldn't have turned the Heat around their attendance would be atrocious as well.   If the Heat can build a loyal fan base so can the Marlins.  

 

 With that said I will always despise Jeter.  There was a different way to rebuild this franchise and he went about it the cheapest way possible.  

 

Hang in there my friend.  Things can only get better going forward.  The Marlins are here to stay and we have to support them.

 

#FuckJeter 

 

 

Phillies pitchers have looked pretty good in the same cold weather.

 

I understand that but they also are more accustomed to that weather, that park and aren't rookies.  We just have to give these young guys more than two or three games to establish themselves. In the end you may be right.  They might all suck.  But, we have nothing to lose at this point by being patient and giving them a chance.

 

 

hoping 2019 #1 is  a projected generational talent... 

 

a ken griffey jr type

 

 

I understand that but they also are more accustomed to that weather, that park and aren't rookies.  We just have to give these young guys more than two or three games to establish themselves. In the end you may be right.  They might all suck.  But, we have nothing to lose at this point by being patient and giving them a chance.

 

For what it’s worth, I don’t think they all suck. I’m just not a big fan of Dillon Peters as a prospect. I do agree that we need to be patient with this group. They’re clearly going to not be good this year, but hopefully better in the future.

 

 

So yeah, i'm here to spread negativity because again because i've been with the team since their inception and I feel i've earned the right to seriously bitch at them after all these years - plus i'm just one of those people who feel better after just getting it off my chest.  I have a strong feeling the Marlins will either be relo'd or contracted within the next 5-7 years.  What Jeter did to this team was to remove ALL the pieces worth coming to the park for - sorry, there's no top flight prospect on the current team, there's no stud blue chip prospect on the way.  There's literally nothing for the fans to show up for at all.  Hell, there's not even a dude who can top 30 homers this season and they'll probably be hard pressed to have 2 guys top 20 hr's all season long.  There's no flame thrower who can K 12+ on a given night....there's just nothing to watch.  It's the most vanilla collection of players I've ever seen on a team.  Some of you get all  excited over Rojas being given a fulltime job?  why?  because he can play good defense?  someone hold my beer so i can settle in on the off-chance that once every dozen games there might be one play he gets a chance to dazzle with in another 20-1 blowout.  Nah, be boxscore warriors people.  Jeter fucked this team over bad by being part of a group too fucking cheap/poor to be able to withstand a few seasons of monetary losses while they worked on the MOST important part of the team which was their reputation within the skeptical south florida fans.  They blew that chance from the get-go whether it was the firesale, the constant firing/rehiring circus with Conine, et al., and then childish sounding shit like "project wolverine" ffs.  Stanton said it best on his way out, it's always a circus down there and Jeter continues to keep up the antics with his shitshow that's worse than Loria's, as mind-numbingly difficult as that is to believe. They are NEVER going to get fans back in that park. I don't care if they miraculously field a 95 win team for a couple seasons in a row, fans are never going to come back at a rate required to  field a competitive team year in and year out.  If by some miracle the Marlins aren't relo'd or contracted the few remaining fans will now be waiting for the next ownership group to take over, just like we patiently waited for Loria's time to come for all those years. 

 

I hope I'm wrong, I hope i'm 100% wrong on all accounts and that somehow multiple players start taking it upon themselves to lead and they somehow accelerate their learning curve and buck the odds and develop into marketable stars. I hope that it happens soon and that by some miracle a buzz develops, that isn't a cloud of mosquitos, and even a paltry15k start showing up night after night.  I hope that Jeter and company realize their mistakes and actually INVEST some money into actual starting players in the next offseason so they don't lose 120 games again.  I hope I'm wrong.  I hope I'll have a reason to actually watch baseball again next year because being down to only watching one sport absolutely sucks.  I hope I'm wrong about everything they've done and I'm just too dense to see it.  I miss my team. 

 

tldr pls

 

 

Anybody who read all or even most of that deserves some kind of prize.

 

i got through half the first sentence of each paragraph

 

 

Personally, I hope they continue to suck. The worst thing that could actually happen is this minor league team starts winning games thus messing up everything up.

 

Please proceed as planned.

 

 

Personally, I hope they continue to suck. The worst thing that could actually happen is this minor league team starts winning games thus messing up everything up.

 

Please proceed as planned.

 

How could them winning be a bad thing? I hate what Jeter did but I don't see why losing would help. 

 

 

Winning is only bad for this team if it stupidly convinces the front office to deviate from their long term plan... which is what the Loria regime did too often.

 

"Sorta kinda outside the fringes of the wild card race? Let's trade a few top prospects for a rental closer who probably won't make a difference in our record anyways!"

 

 

Winning is only bad for this team if it stupidly convinces the front office to deviate from their long term plan... which is what the Loria regime did too often.

 

"Sorta kinda outside the fringes of the wild card race? Let's trade a few top prospects for a rental closer who probably won't make a difference in our record anyways!"

 

I think the moves could have helped if they had any idea how to pick the right names, unfortunately the team so often chose to acquire guys who had no chance of ever returning to prior form OR were so clearly going to regress to the mean on top of consistently giving away undervalued cost controlled players and prospects.

 

Examples of each:

 

Clearly going to regress to the mean:  Fernando Rodney- fucking absurd acquisition the second it was announced.

 

Never going to return to the form they thought they would:  Latos and Cashner.  Cashner especially was absurd.

 

Undervalued cost controlled players or prospects:  Francis Martes, Kike Hernandez, Austin Barnes, getting lucky that we didnt get rid of Luis Castillo for absolutely nothing, Brad Hand (although i cant really fault them for this one cause i thought there was no chance he could ever become good. 

 

The management style was clearly stupid, but it was also botched so badly by the moves themselves being obviously terrible on top of not being the right long term or short term strategy for the club. 

 

 

I think the moves could have helped if they had any idea how to pick the right names, unfortunately the team so often chose to acquire guys who had no chance of ever returning to prior form OR were so clearly going to regress to the mean on top of consistently giving away undervalued cost controlled players and prospects.

 

Examples of each:

 

Clearly going to regress to the mean:  Fernando Rodney- fucking absurd acquisition the second it was announced.

 

Never going to return to the form they thought they would:  Latos and Cashner.  Cashner especially was absurd.

 

Undervalued cost controlled players or prospects:  Francis Martes, Kike Hernandez, Austin Barnes, getting lucky that we didnt get rid of Luis Castillo for absolutely nothing, Brad Hand (although i cant really fault them for this one cause i thought there was no chance he could ever become good. 

 

The management style was clearly stupid, but it was also botched so badly by the moves themselves being obviously terrible on top of not being the right long term or short term strategy for the club. 

 

Not that I have the time or desire to do this but it almost makes you wanna play "How would the Marlins roster have looked at the end of 2017 had all those dumb moves not been made and had Jose not died?" 

 

 

Not that I have the time or desire to do this but it almost makes you wanna play "How would the Marlins roster have looked at the end of 2017 had all those dumb moves not been made and had Jose not died?" 

 

This crippled the franchise to its knees for a very long time bois...

 

 

Winning is only bad for this team if it stupidly convinces the front office to deviate from their long term plan... which is what the Loria regime did too often.

 

"Sorta kinda outside the fringes of the wild card race? Let's trade a few top prospects for a rental closer who probably won't make a difference in our record anyways!"

 

Yeah but I don't think any sane person thinks they'll win enough to be contenders. Sounded like the law guy wanted 100 losses and would be pissed if they lost 85-90.

 

 

Not that I have the time or desire to do this but it almost makes you wanna play "How would the Marlins roster have looked at the end of 2017 had all those dumb moves not been made and had Jose not died?" 

 

yup.  that and the offseason right before it and right after where we gave big deals to Chen and then guys like Prado, Ziegler and Tazawa.  Jose dying and then handing out those contracts is what really necessitated all the moves we made in the offseason.  Jose's dying was obviously crippling but its also the confluence of shitty and stupid moves in the years leading up to his death and immediately following his death that really led to the rebuild.  Maybe we would have been able to sustain his death if we hadnt completely gutted the farm system in win now moves, and maybe we would have been able to sustain his death not immediately last year but in years to come by not giving stupid contracts to Chen (was the year before but still), Prado, Ziegler, and Tazawa that really was the reason why we had to deal the other guys in order to get our payroll structure under control.