On 8/18/2023 at 12:50 PM, rmc523 said:

And in typical Marlins fashion, he'll finally completely forget how to hit the second he puts on the uniform lol

He's already starting to show signs of it, too. He has a .312 OBP this season. Yeah the power is still there, but the dip in walks is alarming given that he has always been a solid OBP guy (not to mention the fact that he used to be a consistent .300 hitter and hasn't even really sniffed .300 since 2019). So naturally, he'll come to the Marlins and his power will disappear, as well.

Edited August 19, 20233 yr by Valid

2 hours ago, Entendu said:

Fight fight fight fight

Me after the fight:

Ban ban ban ban

On 8/18/2023 at 1:03 AM, Rydawg said:

Alcantara, Luzardo, Cabrera, Weathers, Eury, and Meyer are all former top 100 prospects.  Garrett and Rogers are both high first round picks.  Rogers might have even been a top 100 prospect for a minute also. That really means nothing. 

All of these guys are really talented and their only issue has been their work load.  That will not be as big of an issue next year. A healthy Rogers and Meyer should really help us next year.

The only two pitchers that have really struggled at the MLB level are Weathers and Cabrera and they are both still young.  I trust Mel to get the most out of them.

i'm going to channel my inner @MarlinsLou here

 

 

I find it crazy you're listing Weathers, Cabrera, Meyer, Rogers, as all signs we have "great depth" and thus it's not a position of need to acquire a good #3 SP.

Weathers has been TERRIBLE for nearly his entire professional career. 

Cabrera walks WAY too many people and has yet to show ANY consistency (aside from walking a ton of guys consistently)

Rogers had not pitched well since the first half of his rookie year and has either pitched terribly or has been injured since

Meyer, for those of you who forgot how he looked during his brief stint looked VERY hittable (and that was taking into account batters hadn't even seen his stuff yet) and then he had TJ so he'll still be incredibly mediocre along with most certainly being on a very limited innings program.

Sandy has been very average or poor for most of the season. He's gotten a bit better lately but he at no point has consistently resembled the clear cut #1 we saw the previous two seasons and he's pitched a LOT of innings so hopefully he won't get injured but he has certainly thrown a ton of innings the last 3 seasons.  He's still the one i'd worry the least about here.

Lizard has kinda had the wheels fall off a bit recently plus a dip in velo.  Is he merely tired or will we find out he'll need TJ surgery again too (you think i'm being dramatic but we're Marlins fans so we know that's our destiny in the end).

Eury will also likely be on an innings limit still next season too.

 

Sandy, Braxton, Lizard and Eury are a good 1-4 in theory but again, that's also reliant on the good version of Sandy coming back, Braxton proving he's not a fluke this season, Lizard's dip in velo just being tired, and Eury making progress and also not being too limited in his innings. 

At least one of those guys will be injured mostly for a good portion of the season too.  It's just what happens to nearly every team.  This is why if you're a contending team you almost ALWAYS try to get another good starter in the offseason.  A vet is also usually a little bit easier to read in terms of injury history as their bodies have been going through the MLB seasons for years and if their injury history is pretty clean the odds are much more in your favor of getting a full season from them versus some kid who's a wildcard and has never had to endure a lengthy season. 

Also, you thought we had great depth in SP at the start of THIS season.  How did that work out for us? Could we desperately use a good #3 vet SP in there right now? Sure could. 

You can never, EVER, have enough quality SP depth. 

9 minutes ago, Michael said:

Me after the fight:

Ban ban ban ban

1 minute ago, hovertical said:

i'm going to channel my inner @MarlinsLou here

 

 

I find it crazy you're listing Weathers, Cabrera, Meyer, Rogers, as all signs we have "great depth" and thus it's not a position of need to acquire a good #3 SP.

Weathers has been TERRIBLE for nearly his entire professional career. 

Cabrera walks WAY too many people and has yet to show ANY consistency (aside from walking a ton of guys consistently)

Rogers had not pitched well since the first half of his rookie year and has either pitched terribly or has been injured since

Meyer, for those of you who forgot how he looked during his brief stint looked VERY hittable (and that was taking into account batters hadn't even seen his stuff yet) and then he had TJ so he'll still be incredibly mediocre along with most certainly being on a very limited innings program.

Sandy has been very average or poor for most of the season. He's gotten a bit better lately but he at no point has consistently resembled the clear cut #1 we saw the previous two seasons and he's pitched a LOT of innings so hopefully he won't get injured but he has certainly thrown a ton of innings the last 3 seasons.  He's still the one i'd worry the least about here.

Lizard has kinda had the wheels fall off a bit recently plus a dip in velo.  Is he merely tired or will we find out he'll need TJ surgery again too (you think i'm being dramatic but we're Marlins fans so we know that's our destiny in the end).

Eury will also likely be on an innings limit still next season too.

 

Sandy, Braxton, Lizard and Eury are a good 1-4 in theory but again, that's also reliant on the good version of Sandy coming back, Braxton proving he's not a fluke this season, Lizard's dip in velo just being tired, and Eury making progress and also not being too limited in his innings. 

At least one of those guys will be injured mostly for a good portion of the season too.  It's just what happens to nearly every team.  This is why if you're a contending team you almost ALWAYS try to get another good starter in the offseason.  A vet is also usually a little bit easier to read in terms of injury history as their bodies have been going through the MLB seasons for years and if their injury history is pretty clean the odds are much more in your favor of getting a full season from them versus some kid who's a wildcard and has never had to endure a lengthy season. 

Also, you thought we had great depth in SP at the start of THIS season.  How did that work out for us? Could we desperately use a good #3 vet SP in there right now? Sure could. 

You can never, EVER, have enough quality SP depth. 

Meyers has a 6 innings of MLB experience lol.

1 minute ago, Entendu said:

Meyers has a 6 innings of MLB experience lol.

yep, he didn't look all that great in his brief debut  and i know a few of us on here thought he'd be much more of a bp guy in the long term based on what his pitch repertoire.

counting on a kid coming off TJ surgery who's almost never pitched in the bigs is just not wise to consider part of your depth going forward - especially as a SP.  I'd be more lenient with this take if he was expected to be part of the bullpen depth. 

 

6 minutes ago, Entendu said:

Meyers has a 6 innings of MLB experience lol.

6 innings of VERY HITTABLE MLB experience! ... apparently.

11 minutes ago, Michael said:

6 innings of VERY HITTABLE MLB experience! ... apparently.

i said he LOOKED very hittable in his brief mlb experience.....where is that statement incorrect exactly?

and again, he's coming off TJ surgery so he'll be on a very limited innings plan.  that's not exactly a ringing endorsement for starting pitching depth. It's a total unknown. 

but y'all go ahead and just get a bat to improve the offense and ignore starting pitching that's only middle of the pack as it currently stands.

1 hour ago, hovertical said:

i'm going to channel my inner @MarlinsLou here

 

 

I find it crazy you're listing Weathers, Cabrera, Meyer, Rogers, as all signs we have "great depth" and thus it's not a position of need to acquire a good #3 SP.

Weathers has been TERRIBLE for nearly his entire professional career. 

Cabrera walks WAY too many people and has yet to show ANY consistency (aside from walking a ton of guys consistently)

Rogers had not pitched well since the first half of his rookie year and has either pitched terribly or has been injured since

Meyer, for those of you who forgot how he looked during his brief stint looked VERY hittable (and that was taking into account batters hadn't even seen his stuff yet) and then he had TJ so he'll still be incredibly mediocre along with most certainly being on a very limited innings program.

Sandy has been very average or poor for most of the season. He's gotten a bit better lately but he at no point has consistently resembled the clear cut #1 we saw the previous two seasons and he's pitched a LOT of innings so hopefully he won't get injured but he has certainly thrown a ton of innings the last 3 seasons.  He's still the one i'd worry the least about here.

Lizard has kinda had the wheels fall off a bit recently plus a dip in velo.  Is he merely tired or will we find out he'll need TJ surgery again too (you think i'm being dramatic but we're Marlins fans so we know that's our destiny in the end).

Eury will also likely be on an innings limit still next season too.

 

Sandy, Braxton, Lizard and Eury are a good 1-4 in theory but again, that's also reliant on the good version of Sandy coming back, Braxton proving he's not a fluke this season, Lizard's dip in velo just being tired, and Eury making progress and also not being too limited in his innings. 

At least one of those guys will be injured mostly for a good portion of the season too.  It's just what happens to nearly every team.  This is why if you're a contending team you almost ALWAYS try to get another good starter in the offseason.  A vet is also usually a little bit easier to read in terms of injury history as their bodies have been going through the MLB seasons for years and if their injury history is pretty clean the odds are much more in your favor of getting a full season from them versus some kid who's a wildcard and has never had to endure a lengthy season. 

Also, you thought we had great depth in SP at the start of THIS season.  How did that work out for us? Could we desperately use a good #3 vet SP in there right now? Sure could. 

You can never, EVER, have enough quality SP depth. 

I'm not disagreeing with you that we could use some SP depth, but I feel like this same thing could be said about any team in baseball. Injuries, regression and strange, unplanned for variables are factors for all 30 MLB teams. I actually think the Marlins are in better shape than most teams around the league when it comes to quality starting pitching.

Lizard is almost certainly just getting gassed. He's never pitched this much before. It also could be a little bit of hitters learning him, but his stuff is so filthy that I am confident he will be fine.

Braxton was good last year as well, so I don't think it's a fluke. I think he's legitimately good.

Sandy has really started to right the ship lately. Tons of great pitchers go through weird rough patches (look at Verlander in his latter years in Detroit, for example). I think he'll be fine.

Eury is still a kid, but he has looked thoroughly dominant in most of his starts.

If Rogers is our No. 5, that's pretty damn good.

So even though I agree with you that this team could absolutely use more pitching this offseason because things like injuries are basically inevitable, I think that could be said about literally every team (which you kind of alluded to by saying you can never have enough SP depth).

Edited August 19, 20233 yr by Valid

22 minutes ago, Valid said:

. 

So even though I agree with you that this team could absolutely use more pitching this offseason because things like injuries are basically inevitable, I think that could be said about literally every team (which you kind of alluded to by saying you can never have enough SP depth).

Yep if all breaks we'll then what we have should be good enough to keep us in the mix but there are a fair amount of question marks in there - and also yes, I was alluding to never having enough quality starting pitching. I feel like most good teams go into every offseason with that mindset and make an effort to bolster the rotation no matter how good. 

Still in need of another good bat (preferably high obp%/avg type versus more power) and some speed wouldn't hurt (like maybe friggin' Edwards ffs)

But I want that proven good #3 sp which may get even better working with Mel. 

 

3 hours ago, hovertical said:

i'm going to channel my inner @MarlinsLou here

 

 

I find it crazy you're listing Weathers, Cabrera, Meyer, Rogers, as all signs we have "great depth" and thus it's not a position of need to acquire a good #3 SP.

Weathers has been TERRIBLE for nearly his entire professional career. 

Cabrera walks WAY too many people and has yet to show ANY consistency (aside from walking a ton of guys consistently)

Rogers had not pitched well since the first half of his rookie year and has either pitched terribly or has been injured since

Meyer, for those of you who forgot how he looked during his brief stint looked VERY hittable (and that was taking into account batters hadn't even seen his stuff yet) and then he had TJ so he'll still be incredibly mediocre along with most certainly being on a very limited innings program.

Sandy has been very average or poor for most of the season. He's gotten a bit better lately but he at no point has consistently resembled the clear cut #1 we saw the previous two seasons and he's pitched a LOT of innings so hopefully he won't get injured but he has certainly thrown a ton of innings the last 3 seasons.  He's still the one i'd worry the least about here.

Lizard has kinda had the wheels fall off a bit recently plus a dip in velo.  Is he merely tired or will we find out he'll need TJ surgery again too (you think i'm being dramatic but we're Marlins fans so we know that's our destiny in the end).

Eury will also likely be on an innings limit still next season too.

 

Sandy, Braxton, Lizard and Eury are a good 1-4 in theory but again, that's also reliant on the good version of Sandy coming back, Braxton proving he's not a fluke this season, Lizard's dip in velo just being tired, and Eury making progress and also not being too limited in his innings. 

At least one of those guys will be injured mostly for a good portion of the season too.  It's just what happens to nearly every team.  This is why if you're a contending team you almost ALWAYS try to get another good starter in the offseason.  A vet is also usually a little bit easier to read in terms of injury history as their bodies have been going through the MLB seasons for years and if their injury history is pretty clean the odds are much more in your favor of getting a full season from them versus some kid who's a wildcard and has never had to endure a lengthy season. 

Also, you thought we had great depth in SP at the start of THIS season.  How did that work out for us? Could we desperately use a good #3 vet SP in there right now? Sure could. 

You can never, EVER, have enough quality SP depth. 

Completely agree here, the last several years we've gone into seasons saying "we have a ton of SP depth!!" and then 1 or 2 guys get hurt and we need more pitching.  We may be better than other teams, but we still need to ensure we get a vet starter, IMO.

 

1 hour ago, hovertical said:

Yep if all breaks we'll then what we have should be good enough to keep us in the mix but there are a fair amount of question marks in there - and also yes, I was alluding to never having enough quality starting pitching. I feel like most good teams go into every offseason with that mindset and make an effort to bolster the rotation no matter how good. 

Still in need of another good bat (preferably high obp%/avg type versus more power) and some speed wouldn't hurt (like maybe friggin' Edwards ffs)

But I want that proven good #3 sp which may get even better working with Mel. 

 

Yeah, the problem with the last few years is it's always an "if everything goes right...." outlook for the season.

Kim has made some good moves to improve the floor of the team, and we need to keep doing that in the offseason.

8 hours ago, hovertical said:

i said he LOOKED very hittable in his brief mlb experience.....where is that statement incorrect exactly?

You're looking like a very hittable poster lately.

Spoiler

Looove youuuu

 

20 minutes ago, Michael said:

You're looking like a very hittable poster lately.

  Reveal hidden contents

Looove youuuu

 

You can hit on me if you want. I enjoy the attention.

On 8/19/2023 at 9:54 AM, Valid said:

He's already starting to show signs of it, too. He has a .312 OBP this season. Yeah the power is still there, but the dip in walks is alarming given that he has always been a solid OBP guy (not to mention the fact that he used to be a consistent .300 hitter and hasn't even really sniffed .300 since 2019). So naturally, he'll come to the Marlins and his power will disappear, as well.

dude has a .225, 15 HR season in a Marlins uniform written all over him