mystikol87

Hey, she looks better than Jessica Simpson... :lol (that one's for you, Puma) I heard about these on Sedano's show but hadn't seen them yet; they are hysterical. FWIW IMO, Danica is attractive, but certainly not smoking hot.

Wait, so are there any good advantages to having VIP passes? I got my two, but I wasn't planning on going for the reasons (long lines, etc.) stated above........does having a VIP pass change any of this? Only in theory, until last season when everyone had VIP passes. LOL. We haven't owned season tickets in a couple of years, but they sent 2 VIP passes to my parents anyway, who subsequently passed them on to me.

I pretty much agree with what Erik has already mentioned. I don't see how all the other NL East teams have become weaker, if anything our division has become more competitive. The Phillies, as the reigning champs, really didn't have much to improve. Their rotation is amazing with Hamels (which I still find funny the Marlins never lost against him) and Moyer. They have great offensive numbers and their bullpen was good. The only asset they lost was Burrell which they replaced with Ibanez who actually had better offensive stats last season (except maybe HRs). The Mets area of concern last season was their bullpen which they've fixed (at least theoretically) with K-Rod as closer and Putz as set-up. You might argue that they are still the same team but you'd be wrong. How can they sign K-Rod and Putz to remedy their tattered bullpen which gave up God knows how many leads last season (I read somewhere that by Sept they'd blown 29 games), and still be the same team? The Nats have taken steps to improve as well. Most notable to us as Marlins fans is the acquisition of Scotty O and Willingham. They added Terrell Young in the Rule of Five (though he's probably starting in the minors) and they signed Daniel Cabrera. To be honest, Cabrera kind of sucks but I'm assuming the Nats have plans for him or see something in him others don't. I've also read rumors of the Nats interested in Orlando Hudson but take that with a grain of salt. What some need to take into consideration is that the Nats have done what is within their means to acquire great players but there is nothing they can do if players don't want to play for the team. They tried to acquire Teixiera but were turned down. They also signed their star Zimmerman to a one year deal. The Braves have added Kawakami, Derek Lowe and Javier Vasquez. They also added a back up catcher in Dave Ross. They might not have improved to what some would like but I do think that Lowe actually improves their rotation and, although Vasquez did struggle last year, he was fairly decent in 2007. I know absolutely nothing about Kawakami. I'm not sure I'd call the Phillies rotation amazing, but I pretty much agree with most of your other stuff. Also, assuming Washington won't compete for the division title, we don't really care how much they improved, except for Wild Card purposes. If they've improved, they'll be better against the Phillies, Braves, and Mets, as well, and not just against us. Obviously we loathe improvements to the Mets and Phils, both of whom will be very competitive next year, and I guess we'd have to throw the Braves in there, although I don't see them really threateing to take the NL East crown.

Wait, so are there any good advantages to having VIP passes? I got my two, but I wasn't planning on going for the reasons (long lines, etc.) stated above........does having a VIP pass change any of this?

In one of those, amazing, stunning, bizarre coincidences, I've managed to arrange for the second year running, our family vacation from jolly old England to your glorious and completely lovely United States of America and the wonderful state of Florida to coincide with the opening week at Dolphin Stadium. Incredible coincidence, dontcha think? Last year we were in Orlando (so it was a bit of a trek down to Miami for Opening Day '08) but this year we're in Lauderdale-by-the-Sea, less than twenty miles from Dolphin Stadium - another, amazing coincidence! The thing is, if I go to all six games (we are there for a fortnight) I am sure my wife might become slightly suspicious that we seem to spend the first two weeks in April every year within driving distance of Miami, so I'm limiting myself to two. So I'm asking the question: Which Mets game should I go to? Friday, Saturday or Sunday? Or does it matter? Appreciate any advice, my yankee buddies. I think it's awesome that you love the Marlins, and what a crazy coincedence......however, please don't call ever call me a yankee.

A new retractable roof stadium will keep out the rain and blistering sun, but it won't necessarily keep players in the organization any longer. That's not at all what Samson said. He just said that they won't only buy out a guy's arbitration years. This has nothing to do with keeping guys or even signing more guys to long-term deals. It doesn't even have anything to do with how high the payroll gets. Agreed. More frustrating reporting that makes the organization look unfairly bad. This is the kind of crap that turns off and loses some of the more casual fans [who might not be able to properly interpret what the article/David Samson is saying].

With the Braves, you have to mention Tommy Hanson. He may not start the year in the majors, but he will probably be up soon. Young guys are prone to have their problems, but he looks like he can be a beast very soon.

In the whole Barry Jackson column there is only one thing even remotely new, that Wiley is a revamping Miller's delivery. The rest is a mindless rewrite of the off-season like people have been hibernating or something. I think most of us (I know I'm often surprised) think the regular fan doesn't keep up on this stuff, but perhaps surprisingly, they do. They may not know Ceda's stats (but if they're from the DR, they know he's one of theirs) or followed Gibbons in the VWL but they know Kevin Gregg is gone for a guy who's supposed to have a lot of upside, or that guy from the Orioles signed with us. And the lead...don't get me started. This is the most ridiculous part, by far. I expect ESPN and the rest of the world to be clueless idiots about our team, but when your hometown reporter makes the same moronic types of comments, it's just extremely disappointing. This guy is a joke, but saying that is more old news than these "columns" he writes.

Cantu's stats are way too low. What makes you think he is going to hurt the team this year? He put up great numbers last season and he's just reaching the prime of his career. I also think it's pushing it to say that Cody is one of the best outfielders in the NL. And what's up with the back of the rotation's innings progressively getting lower? I'm guessing they expect both Anibal and maybe one or two more pitchers to get injured during the season. Even if he only pitched an average of five innings per start, his total would still exceed 89 innings by far. Why would they project Volstad to have such a high ERA too? I don't think Cantu's stats are way too low. If you look at his entire career: he's batted .275/.317/.460. PECOTA incorporates all the data (even dating back to his minor league career). The problem with Cantu isn't so much his bat (at least at 3B). But he's one of the worst defensive infielders in all of baseball. If you move him to 1B, his bat becomes below average relative to the rest of the league. If you leave him at 3B, his defense costs more runs than his offense is worth. As for Volstad, I don't know. PECOTA tends to be very conservative with young pitchers since many of them don't ever successfully make the transition to a major league rotation. It definitely takes into account groundball tendencies, and accurately weights them based on their actual run-impact. This is why if we had any chance to get a Jonathan Sanchez type, even if we had to throw in another MiLB arm (not West/Thompson/Ceda/Tucker though) we should have jumped on it. And this is also why I think SF allegedly backed away from the deal. I love Cantu, but he's not spectacular, and if he regresses to the mean without improving his defense, he'll be fortunate to be considered even slightly above-average as far as corner IF's are concerned.

The video touched more on the strong core of players that Florida has. I'll admit that I've been worried about this upcoming season, because of how competitive the NL East will be, but after watching that video, I have no fear now. I am confident in this team and what it can do. The sky is the limit. And although the 2009 season is going to be a tough one, I have 100% confidence that the Marlins will challenge for the NL East Title. ? I actually feel we have a lot better chance this year compared to last year because of how much less competition we have compared to last year. Although the mets have improved their bullpen, i feel they will regret trading Heilman, and haven't improved their rotation, and add to that that there outfield has many question marks. The Atlanta Braves are falling off fast and aren't even a threat anymore, the Nationals are the Nationals, the Marlins punching bag. And then there are the phillies. They are still the Phillies, and i see them winning the division. But remember that they lost Burrell, and their starting rotation still has as many question marks as last season's rotation. The marlins have improved their bullpen, and have kept the key components of last years team. I really feel this is our best year to win it all since our chances in 2005. The Mets got JJ Putz when they traded Heilman, and that is a huge gain for them. Their rotation has a lot of question marks, I agree. Still, they and the Braves may still have a couple of signings left in them. I feel kinda bad for the Nats - they try to open their wallets but no one wants to play for them. I guess they have to build through the draft like other teams in that position before them. I mean, it's pretty obvious that this is our best chance since 2005; the question is whether we have a good chance? I think we have a very reasonable one. But 2006 we were supposed to be terrible and the success we did have was a shock, but we still didn't compete for the division. We regressed in '07, and last year we weren't supposed to have any chance of being in it in September. Most projected us either battling with the Nats or in the cellar as I recall.

That is it! They K for 7 innings to get to the bullpen. I think Godfather Hotcorner did that "wear down the SP" idea better *looks for it* The problem is that you assume Amezaga leading off will usually make out #1. Disrespecting the most versatile utility player in baseball as usual. See for yourself, here's the log from him leading off in a recent game. Pitch 1: Ball Pitch 2: Strike Pitch 3: Ball Pitch 4: Strike Pitch 5: Ball Pitch 6: Foul Pitch 7: Foul Pitch 8: Foul Pitch 9: Foul Pitch 10: Foul Pitch 11: Foul Pitch 12: Foul Pitch 13: Foul Pitch 14: Foul Pitch 15: Foul .... .... Pitch 30: Foul (coach's visit to the mound) .... .... Pitch 50: Foul (Rich Waltz hyperventilates and passes out) .... .... Pitch 75: Foul (bullpen warming) .... .... .... Pitch 97: Ground ball to 3B. Amezaga races out to 3rd to field his own ball, fires to 1B where Amezaga is covering. The ball and Amezaga reach at the exact same instant, and upon attempting to tag himself out the laws of physics are stretched and the opposing team sucked into a black hole. And that was just in his first AB. From this piece of art that is posting history http://www.marlinsbaseball.com/forums/inde...Lineup&st=0 LOLOLOL I remember that. But I wasn't a member yet when he wrote that - I must have seen it in some "best of" forum or something.

http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/reds...ek_sox_agr.html By Tony Massarotti and Chad Finn, Globe staff The prolonged negotiations between Jason Varitek and the Red Sox have been resolved, with the catcher agreeing to a contract that will keep him with the club for a 13th season -- and perhaps beyond. Varitek, the popular Red Sox captain who is often praised for his game-calling and intangibles but is coming off by far his worst offensive season, came to terms on a one-year contract with a mutual second-year option, Red Sox officials confirmed this afternoon. Varitek, who turns 37 on April 11, will earn $5 million in 2009, according to baseball sources, with the club holding a $5 million option for 2010. If the Red Sox do not pick up that option, Varitek has the choice of remaining with the club on a $3 million deal. In '10, he can earn another $2 million in incentives based on playing time, beginning at 80 games started. The incentives apply to the player option only. Today's news brings a conclusion to a stalemate that had dragged on since Varitek filed for free agency Oct. 31. Varitek, who batted .220 with 13 home runs and 43 RBIs in the regular season and .118 in the postseason in 2008, found interest from other clubs to be scarce, particularly after he and agent Scott Boras rejected the Red Sox' offer of arbitration. If a team signs a Type A free-agent (which Varitek was) that was offered arbitration, it must surrender a first-round draft pick to his former team as compensation. Last Friday, the Red Sox sent Varitek and Boras a team letter that effectively served as an ultimatum. According to a baseball source earlier this week, the Sox composed the letter to Varitek last Thursday, Jan. 22, and sent it to the player and his agent by registered mail. According to another baseball source yesterday, the letter was delivered to the player and his agent at 8:30 a.m. Friday, Jan. 23, and gave the player one week to reply, a precise deadline the team intended to enforce at a moment when negotiations appeared most tense. Varitek, Boras and the Red Sox hammered out the deal earlier today, likely beyond the deadline. By including the incentives, the Red Sox subtly tweaked the offer previously presented to Varitek. He had the ability to select either a guaranteed one-year deal for $5 million or a one-year deal with a dual option, the latter of which contained a $5 million club option for 2010 or a $3 million player option, but without the potential to earn an additional $2 million. Some reports have them still interested in Jarrod Saltalamachia. I would assume that would lessen their chances of trading Max (to us)?

Maybin single Maybin steals 2nd Baker walks Hanley 3 run HR Wonder how often we will see this in 09..... I'm thinking Maybin singles, Baker hit and run, Hanley 3-run Homer. I am thinking Maybin grounds out Baker K's Hanley K's next inning Uggla K's Hermida K's looking. Since they did a good job of that last year I LOL'ed. Hey, at least at that point the pitcher has thrown at least 15 pitches..........maybe he's getting tired!

I know (for me) Abreu is the wrong guy to be on this team and part of me feels the same way about Dunn for two reasons - money and defense. Part of me wants his bat and his OBP so I'm conflicted but in the end in my mind passing on both won't make the difference between making the playoffs or not. I agree on passing on Abreu. I'm confident he won't out produce Hermida. But Dunn would change this team dramatically. I agree with passing on Abreu as well, although I wouldn't say I'm confident that Hermida will outproduce him......still, Dunn will absolutely change this team a good bit. Sure, his defense is poor, but he wouldn't be that debilitating at first base (according to what others have reported his numbers say), and he would be replacing Gaby in the potential lineup. That's a MASSIVE upgrade.

This was a better one that Hanley hit. http://florida.marlins.mlb.com/media/video...97&c_id=fla According to HitTracker, this was the longest HR hit by a Marlin last season, with a True Distance of 475 feet. Also according to them, this was the hardest hit HR last season, when Hermida hit this one out at 121.1 MPH. http://florida.marlins.mlb.com/media/video...76&c_id=fla Damn, Hermida smoked that.

If we still think that Andrew Miller is gonna be our fifth starter, then we have room for Hill. Neither one is a lock to do well next year and in all likelihood, neither will. But Rich Hill has actually had some great stretches in the major leagues while Miller...hasn't. It's really no contest. Miller throws hard but thats it. They both have control/command issues but Hill's curveball is much harder to hit than Miller's fastball, which is rarely ever as good as advertised. Hill's 3.92 ERA two years ago is nothing to be ashamed of and he is actually capable of better than that. Rotoworld is right when they say he could be the next Cliff Lee. I'm a Cubs fan almost as much as I am a Marlins fan and they really have no idea how to treat players in their system (see: Felix Pie, Corey Patterson, Matt Mertun, Sean Marshall, any pitching prospect besides Carlos Zambrano, every guy that they've drafted in the last 5 years). Rich Hill is a head case who must be treated properly but I strongly believe that Mark Wiley could get the best out of him. Rich Hill has a ceiling as a number 2 or 3, and he has actually matched that before. His curveball, when mixed in with the rest of his pitches, is almost entirely unhittable. There's no reason why the Marlins shouldn't offer at least a B level prospect to get Hill. If healthy, Miller is absolutely in the starting rotation to being the year. I cannot see any way in which they start Rich Hill over a healthy Miller. Miller's only 23. And as for the great stretches, in May 2008 Miller pitched 29.2 innings, with 22 hits, 28 Ks and 10 walks, and a 2.43 ERA. Rich Hill has had some excellent months, as well, but he'll be 29 on opening day, and I can't him getting first crack after the bigtime troubles he had last year. There can be more chances for Miller down the road. The reality is that he is likely to miss significant ST time and be late to start the year- why not have him get some AAA work which he badly needs anyway. He has failed to develop at all as a pitcher when organizations have tried the have him learn at the major league level approach; why not try something different. I realize that you said if healthy, but the reality is that he is likely not going to be. At any rate, Hill has had more than just one month's worth of good starts and if you had watched him when he was on you would realize how absolutely dominating and dynamic he can be. Hill had a year and a half worth of good starts with some dominant stretches, while Miller has one month while he never pitched at any other time like a guy who belonged in the majors. There's a tremendous difference in there. Let's look at it this way- Rich Hill has a career ERA of 4.37 while Miller's is 5.80. Sure, Miller is 23 and can develop, but putting him in AAA this year does not prevent him from further developing when he has less than 15 career minor league starts. At the same time, having him pitch in the majors again despite his struggles the last two years there does not mean he is going to magically develop this year. It's simply good organizational management to start some of your younger players in the minors while guys with arguably less talent (which I don't even think Hill is, FTR) start the year in the majors. The reason is that it allows the team to have reinforcements waiting in the form of the younger players. When guys get injured, they can be called up at no loss to the franchise. Starting the young player in the majors while waiving the guy with no options likely gives you very little fallback options. This is why year after year, smarter teams start their top prospects in AAA rather than pushing them up to the majors. Even the Rays started Evan Longoria in the minors last year in order to avoid having to DFA Willy Aybar, who ended up playing an important supporting role in the Rays season. You make many good points. It would still surprise to see the Marlins put a healthy Miller in AAA in favor of another guy, but that doesn't mean it wouldn't be a good idea. It looks, oddly enough, like the Orioles are the frontrunners to get Rich Hill. Those 2 teams making another trade is weird.

If we still think that Andrew Miller is gonna be our fifth starter, then we have room for Hill. Neither one is a lock to do well next year and in all likelihood, neither will. But Rich Hill has actually had some great stretches in the major leagues while Miller...hasn't. It's really no contest. Miller throws hard but thats it. They both have control/command issues but Hill's curveball is much harder to hit than Miller's fastball, which is rarely ever as good as advertised. Hill's 3.92 ERA two years ago is nothing to be ashamed of and he is actually capable of better than that. Rotoworld is right when they say he could be the next Cliff Lee. I'm a Cubs fan almost as much as I am a Marlins fan and they really have no idea how to treat players in their system (see: Felix Pie, Corey Patterson, Matt Mertun, Sean Marshall, any pitching prospect besides Carlos Zambrano, every guy that they've drafted in the last 5 years). Rich Hill is a head case who must be treated properly but I strongly believe that Mark Wiley could get the best out of him. Rich Hill has a ceiling as a number 2 or 3, and he has actually matched that before. His curveball, when mixed in with the rest of his pitches, is almost entirely unhittable. There's no reason why the Marlins shouldn't offer at least a B level prospect to get Hill. If healthy, Miller is absolutely in the starting rotation to being the year. I cannot see any way in which they start Rich Hill over a healthy Miller. Miller's only 23. And as for the great stretches, in May 2008 Miller pitched 29.2 innings, with 22 hits, 28 Ks and 10 walks, and a 2.43 ERA. Rich Hill has had some excellent months, as well, but he'll be 29 on opening day, and I can't him getting first crack after the bigtime troubles he had last year.

He's just happy that he has to run less now. I don't know Rabb, all the way out to left field and back every inning...might be a deal-killer. Haha, although the other 81 games he only has to take a few steps until he's in the visitor's dugout. :cool

They traded Cedano because he is out of options and has no place on the 25 man roster. Andino is a worse version. They will have 0 interest in Andino. It's the same reason with Hill - out of options, no place on roster. I'd argue he'd have a tough time breaking our 12 man pitching staff. I'd love to have him stashed in AAA, but situationally speaking, we'd have to give something decent for him, and then just pray he doesn't suck. This is a much bigger risk than Kroenke and Meyer acquisitions. We're not a good fit for Hill, even though we could use another SP around. I was wondering about Rich Hill's options - given that he has none, I also don't think that he's a good fit, although I like his upside and he would improve our SP depth. But he's not worth trading another prospect for while we'd be forced to put him on the ML roster, no matter how he performs, or else lose him on waivers.

I would honestly just go with our fielders that we have right now. Let Sanchez and McPherson battle out for a corner infielder spot. But you have to know that Dunn is 100% to improve this team by a good margin. We might not go after him to save money, but all other things being equal, he'd be a ridiculously good addition. I agree, though I just dont think signing really... anyone is realistic right now, other than our own players. So what Im saying is I would really rather just go with what we have and not plan on anything other than that. But, but, but, but......speculation is fun(ish). We know it ain't gonna happen, but we like the high of getting our hopes up, and we deal with the crapiness (of watching him sign somewhere else) when it actually happens. :mis2

I would honestly just go with our fielders that we have right now. Let Sanchez and McPherson battle out for a corner infielder spot. But you have to know that Dunn is 100% to improve this team by a good margin. We might not go after him to save money, but all other things being equal, he'd be a ridiculously good addition.

I don't want to really get into this, but if you get Dunn you play him at 1B, leave Gaby in AAA, and roll this out opening day: C - Baker (Rabelo) 1B - Dunn (Cantu, Helms) 2B - Uggla (Bonifacio, Amezaga) SS - Hanley (Amezaga, Bonifacio) 3B - Cantu (McPherson, Helms) LF - Hermida (Dunn, Bonifacio) CF - Maybin (Amezaga, Ross) RF - Ross (Hermida, Bonifacio) B - Amezaga, Bonifacio, McPherson, Helms, Rabelo SP - Nolasco, Johnson, Volstad, Anibal RP - Lindstrom, Nunez, Proctor, Pinto, Kensing, Cruz, Kroenke, Meyer AAA - A. Miller (until May 3rd when a routine 5th SP is needed), G. Sanchez, Coghlan, J. Gibbons, Vanden Hurk, Tankersley, Tucker, Trahern, Badenhop, J. Miller, Carroll, Mobley, Doolittle, Hayes AA - West, Morrison, Cousins, Thompson, Leroux, Wood, G. Taylor, Winters, Petersen You take the god dam defensive hit at 1B for a near lock at a .900 OPS. We're ridiculous deep everywhere, except a skeptical catching situation and lack of a 'proven' 6th starting pitcher. Although those may still work out for us. This is never going to happen, but Dunn makes this team scary good. We'd score well over 800 runs with this lineup, with still an improved defense, and a very improved staff if they stay healthy. One note on the 6th SP: we don't even need a 5th SP until May 3rd. I absolutely would like this team to have one, as our current SP depth is a bit thin. However, at least we get by nearly a month of the year before we need Miller (barring injury), so that at least gives us one month before we are at a real risk of having to throw Meyer/Badenhop/Thompson/Vandenhurk/West into the fire. The extra month might not make any of the younger guys in that mix go from unpolished to able ML starter (albeit at the back-end of a rotation), but every little bit helps. I realize this is somewhat unlikely and maybe just a marginal difference, but every little bit helps, and I thought I'd mention another potentially beneficial aspect of our early schedule.

Well, if we assume that Cody puts up his ~.800 OPS, and Dunn puts up his ~.900 OPS, after factoring in their defense, it's actually basically a push who is better. Dunn is really, really bad defensively and the reason he's still on the market/won't get much money. In the cases of players like Abreu and Griffey, they're also still bad defensively players, but at least shifting them from RF to LF will allow them to be just below average and only costing a couple of runs, whereas Dunn costs 1-2 wins with his defense. I'd also personally prefer to keep Cody if we do sign somebody, and have him as the 4th OFer/"back up plan". If somebody get injured, if Maybin isn't ready, if Hermida is too cool for school, Cody's a great answer. It'd be awesome to sign someone AND keep Cody - I'd certainly prefer that, and I think everyone would. I'm just worried about the payroll problems. Is Dunn that bad? Wow. I don't have access to +/-, but he must be quite bad if you feel that way. In that case, if he had to trade someone to make room, I'd almost rather it'd be Hermida.......My guess is that he would bring back a better haul than Cody in a trade, and Dunn/Maybin/Ross is a LOT better defensively than Dunn/Maybin/Hermida, which might struggle a good bit. The one thing I would point out is how OBP driven Dunn's OPS is. For their careers: Dunn - .247/.381/.518/.899 Ross - .261/.324/.493/.817 Of the .082 OPS difference, only .025 are due to differences in SLG. If we equalized OBP to .324 for each and added 2 points of SLG to Dunn for each 1 point of OBP given up (roughly the standard ratio)......... Dunn loses 57 OBP points and gains 114 SLG points, giving him a stat line of Dunn - .247/.324/.632/.966, and in that case his OPS would be 149 points higher than Cody's. Now, is Cody's defense still that much better (and Dunn's that much worse) that they are still roughly equal given that difference in offense? I'm not sure how to figure that, but I will add that Cody has less of a track record, while dunn has had an OBP below .386 just once in the last 5 seasons.

? The Marlins make the most sense for my Miami neighbor Pudge if they can manage to scrape together a few nickels from the $40 million in revenue sharing/luxury tax monies they receive. http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/writ...eeagents/1.html

we're currently sitting on 33m if Uggla wins. So we could sign one and still be well below 40m. If the cap is 35m though, they're out of our price range. And if the cap is 33m, well, yeah. However one thing to keep in mind is that money is not just paralleled to one season. Instead of spending 5m on a FA this season, we could instead spend that extra 5mil next season. And with that 5m, we're talking about being able to retain 1-3 players we wouldn't have been able to. This implies that they would be signable for under $7 million for 1 year; I doubt this is possible, especially with Abreu - I can't see his value going from $16 million to well below $7 millions. There were rumors about Dunn getting as little as $5 million a year, so that would fit, but I have no idea how realistic those rumors are. Your point about spending the money is well taken. I feel like we are likely to move Cody after 2009 anyway, though. I'm not sure what his cost for next season projects to, but with decent production I'd have to assume it'll rise over $3 million anyway? Either way, the point is that we could sign an Adam Dunn type, move Cody Ross now while his value is pretty high (he could be even better next year, but he could also have a drop-off), and improve our outfield and farm system right now. If we can get Dunn for $6 million and 1 year, for example, our payroll would rise less than $4 million. I'm not sure what the market for Cody Ross would be, but I would think it should be pretty good. Obviously this would be a gamble that at least one of kids would be ready to start in the OF in 2010 along with Maybin (and Hermida in RF if he has a strong 2009?). But I think we're going to make that gamble either way. I don't see this team hanging on to both Hermida and Ross for 2010 - they'll trade at least one to cut payroll and substitute in Logan Morrison, John Raynor, or someone else not currently in the big leagues to play RF/LF. As to Puma's comments on defense, I could easily live with Dunn's defense in exchange for the consistency he brings with getting on base and hitting for tremendous pop.