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DFA Junichi Tazawa


Erick
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Ziegler isn’t much better. Both of these guys have no business being on this team in a rebuilding year.  DFA them both and let Claw or Streck close.

 

Ziegler might be worth something minimal at the trade deadline, but Tazawa isn’t worth a turd.

 

 

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the 2 single dumbest signings relative to our expectations for what they would be in marlins history.

 

Maybe. I think they were just reflective of Loria "going for it" when he shouldn't have been "going for it." Then again, that might be exactly what you were getting at. 

 

 

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Maybe. I think they were just reflective of Loria "going for it" when he shouldn't have been "going for it." Then again, that might be exactly what you were getting at. 

 

Loria agreed to pay money for the team to try to be competitive last year.  They go out and get Tazawa and Ziegler.  I refuse to blame that on Loria. 

 

 

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Loria agreed to pay money for the team to try to be competitive last year.  They go out and get Tazawa and Ziegler.  I refuse to blame that on Loria. 

 

There was an article explaining how this all went down. Ultimately it did all come down to Loria and his directions. He wanted them to go big after a super bullpen with Kenley Jansen, Chapman, and/or Melancon... when those options fell through the next level was Tazawa and Ziegler and the Marlins got both. Even if Loria didn't specifically say who to get, the directive to get them came from him, I'm still putting this one on Loria. 

 

 

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There was an article explaining how this all went down. Ultimately it did all come down to Loria and his directions. He wanted them to go big after a super bullpen with Kenley Jansen, Chapman, and/or Melancon... when those options fell through the next level was Tazawa and Ziegler and the Marlins got both. Even if Loria didn't specifically say who to get, the directive to get them came from him, I'm still putting this one on Loria. 

 

the sad part is they believed adding these two made the bullpen "great" lol

 

 

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These are important details and you can’t pick and choose which ones to run with.  OK great, Loria wanted to spend money.  But there has to be a point where the owner needs to pull back on a “spend at all costs” directive if the market isn’t bearing any worthwhile players.  Was he in there demanding free agents even after the productive major leaguers had all signed elsewhere?  You need all the ingredients.  You need an owner willing to spend, baseball operations that know how to identify the talent, and willing participants that want to come.  We get all the hearsay, but what it boils down to is a front office wide malfunction that spent too much money on bad players.  Loria is partly to blame.  Baseball Operations is partly to blame.  You can’t blame players for not wanting to come here, nor can you blame players for taking contracts offered to them.  I like a good Tazawa joke as much as the next guy, but of course he’s going to take contract offers until they stop coming in.

 

 

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Loria agreed to pay money for the team to try to be competitive last year.  They go out and get Tazawa and Ziegler.  I refuse to blame that on Loria. 

 

i do.  spending money foolishly on guys who were clearly bad signings at the time for multi year deals for the sake of spending money is the absolute epitome of bad ownership.

 

 

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he'll be gone soon.  it's a sunk cost at this point.  Ziegler can go to for all i care.   the 2 single dumbest signings relative to our expectations for what they would be in marlins history.

 

But not Chen, though. 

 

 

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And you better believe that Tazawa is still only around because he's making $7 million. Jeter would rather pay him millions to lose baseball games than pay him to pitch in the minor leagues for some other team.

 

Tazawa has been so atrocious lately though that it's hard to imagine Jeter keeping this up for much longer.

 

Cutting Tazawa ASAP would make a strong statement to the rest of the team. Just as they're generally winning more, in a year that's step 1 of a rebuild, one of the worst yet most expensive guys gets cut? To me that tells the players that losing is unacceptable even in a year that could be seen as tanking. 

 

 

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What made Loria one of the worst owners in MLB history for me was not that he was so cheap, but rather that when he did spend money, he spent it like a total jackass. It's like he either had no understanding or gave no shits about market value. It's astonishing to me that somebody so inept could ever become so wealthy. The Marlins easily could have made the playoffs multiple times since 2003 despite the low payroll had Loria just backed off a bit.

 

As pointed out already here, one of the major problems was Loria's tendency to decide that he wanted to "go for it" (despite in many instances it being obvious that there were too many holes to be filled to make the team a legitimate contender).

 

The Pudge signing worked out, but mostly because he hadn't gotten the multi-year offer he was seeking in FA. It was a total low-risk move for Loria and it was successful in large part because Dave Dombrowski had built such a solid core. I suppose the Delgado signing wasn't so bad either because he ultimately did put together 4 solid seasons.

 

But as Loria inched closer to the new ballpark Miami Marlins era, he made some dumbass decisions. He basically signed Buck just because he was available and coming off a career year (that obviously wouldn't be repeated). Most savvy MLB teams know that wasn't the most prudent signing, but Loria went ahead anyway and did it because he desperately wanted to compete. He didn't stop and think that many of these desperate signings would increase financial burden and sink the franchise like as stone.

 

This pretty much started when he through tons of money at Pujols, Reyes, Wilson, Buehrle, and Bell. He went after those guys mostly because they were the biggest, most expensive names out there and never really thought about their real market value and financial constraints going forward. Of course he also didn't think about the holes in the roster and what the Marlins actually needed. the Buehrle signing wasn't terrible but there were obvious red flags with Pujols, Reyes, and Bell that Loria totally ignored.

 

The tipping point was basically when Loria through tons of money at guys like Chen, Ziegler, and Tazawa. Again, totally desperate moves. His whole fantasy of having a "super pen" just because he noticed the prominent roles that guys like Chapman and Miller played in the postseason, was laughable because he seemed to think that it would compensate for glaring holes in starting pitching.

 

I suppose I'm stating the obvious here, but if he had only backed off a little and spent some of that money he was throwing at guys like Buck or Chen into international free agency and stocking the minor league system, the team could have been in somewhat decent shape and not the total laughingstock it has become.

 

holy hell we agree on something.  i hate when people call loria cheap.  he was cheap prior to 2012, but after, he was just reckless and downright idiotic.

 

And from whats been reported, just about every single move that he demanded be made was horrific.  Samson went on lebatard and essentially confirmed that he demanded Buck, Saltalamacchia, Chen, Ziegler, and Tazawa, among a few other names im forgetting right now.  Loria wasnt cheap, he was meddlesome and a fucking moron.

 

 

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also, btw, we got beyond lucky we didnt get Pujols and Fielder.  I didnt want Pujols but i foolishly thought Fielder would hold up for the duration of that contract and we got very fucking lucky that they didnt take our money, because that would have been beyond crippling to this franchise.

 

 

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Cutting Tazawa ASAP would make a strong statement to the rest of the team. Just as they're generally winning more, in a year that's step 1 of a rebuild, one of the worst yet most expensive guys gets cut? To me that tells the players that losing is unacceptable even in a year that could be seen as tanking. 

 

would it even be a statement though?  Im obviously very pro what this new ownership group is doing, but i feel like it would be just acknnowledging the obvious rather than a message.  Throwing tazawa out there at this point is embarrassing. I loved what they did in finally acknowledging a much needed rebuild this offseason, i just wish they signed like 2-3 more veteran arms so that we didnt have to choose between tyler cloyd and junichi fucking tazawa, and ziegler for that matter should be gone as well.  All are awful, but we are stuck with them or calling up SP prospects and letting them get innings out of the bullpen when they should be starting in the minors.  Merandy Gonzalez under no circumstances should be up here right now and its unacceptable that he is when a few minor league deals for replacement level veterans would allow him to continue developing in the minors and starting every 5th day until he shows that he cant be a starter long term.

 

 

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ya'll keep forgetting that Chen was one of the top 3 arms available that offseason and a lot of people looked at him being a solid #2 (insert poop joke here) in this rotation. He had performed pretty damn well pitching in the AL East for a few seasons in some very hitter friendly parks - had he continued performing as he had previously - and there really weren't any red flags to say he wouldn't - then this conversation would never be happening. He's an albatross of a contract now for sure though, mostly because he refused to actually just get the damned surgery and be done with it and get on the road to full recovery.  The Saltalamacchia signing wasn't too bad either at the time and while many people didn't expect him to repeat the season he just had, he signed a bit below market value that offseason compared to what some other Catchers got - hell, even Keith Law gave the Marlins props for that signing and that dude HATES Miami.  This club just had a lot of shit luck with their signings even when they actually are prudent in identifying holes that need to be plugged.  I'm not saying that some of the signings aren't utterly retarded like Bell, Tazawa, etc. but hindsight is always 20/20 and it's hard to just look beyond the POS the player ended up being instead of the actual logic behind the signing itself.

 

 

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I think the issue with Loria was not seeing the rebuild from 2013 play out. So they tear down the team in 2013 ridding themselves of those contracts, losing 100 games that year. They improved more in 2014 but instead of building on 2014 and continuing the process they decide to add more stupid contracts at 2015 and start depleting the system to only trade off pieces again at the deadline?

 

 

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ya'll keep forgetting that Chen was one of the top 3 arms available that offseason and a lot of people looked at him being a solid #2 (insert poop joke here) in this rotation. He had performed pretty damn well pitching in the AL East for a few seasons in some very hitter friendly parks - had he continued performing as he had previously - and there really weren't any red flags to say he wouldn't - then this conversation would never be happening. He's an albatross of a contract now for sure though, mostly because he refused to actually just get the damned surgery and be done with it and get on the road to full recovery.  The Saltalamacchia signing wasn't too bad either at the time and while many people didn't expect him to repeat the season he just had, he signed a bit below market value that offseason compared to what some other Catchers got - hell, even Keith Law gave the Marlins props for that signing and that dude HATES Miami.  This club just had a lot of shit luck with their signings even when they actually are prudent in identifying holes that need to be plugged.  I'm not saying that some of the signings aren't utterly retarded like Bell, Tazawa, etc. but hindsight is always 20/20 and it's hard to just look beyond the POS the player ended up being instead of the actual logic behind the signing itself.

 

it's all very complicated. Chen was bad luck, not a bad signing. Pitchers are volatile, and have been for some time. 

 

We dug ourselves into the hole we are in now. Bad signings on relief pitchers. Trading depth and the deadline for rent a players who suck. and here we are. 

 

Between the guys we sent to the padres, the astros, and the Reds, combined with the guys we had on the field last year, there is agood team. But we made those dumb trades, so her we are.

 

 

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it's all very complicated. Chen was bad luck, not a bad signing. Pitchers are volatile, and have been for some time. 

 

We dug ourselves into the hole we are in now. Bad signings on relief pitchers. Trading depth and the deadline for rent a players who suck. and here we are. 

 

Between the guys we sent to the padres, the astros, and the Reds, combined with the guys we had on the field last year, there is agood team. But we made those dumb trades, so her we are.

 

Yup.  The list of guys who would still be under team control that this team signed is absurd.  Barnes, Canha, Desclafani, Heaney, Martes, marisnick, Kike, Paddack, Hatcher, Castillo, naylor, Dayton, Williams, moran.

 

 

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