Eury to begin season on IL, miss at least several weeks

[Admin]

 

[Michael]

Just limiting his innings for the World Series run, all good.

[Admin]

27 minutes ago, Michael said:

Just limiting his innings for the World Series run, all good.

Is that a 5k for charity?

[Michael]

2 minutes ago, Admin said:

5k

Bruce just fainted. Never speak of that much money.

[rmc523]

Don't worry.  He'll be on the IL all year, and they'll wait until August 14th to announce he's getting TJ so he can be out all of next year too....

[hovertical]

12 minutes ago, rmc523 said:

Don't worry.  He'll be on the IL all year, and they'll wait until August 14th to announce he's getting TJ so he can be out all of next year too....

You get it.

 

[rmc523]

2 hours ago, hovertical said:

You get it.

 

It’s the Marlins training staff.  They always seem to drastically misdiagnose things.

[marlinsmaniac]

I grew up with dudes throwing 200+ innings and complete games and RARELY would you hear of Tommy John surgeries. The Marlins seem to always want to baby their arms to “protect” them but it like half of their pitchers have had Tommy John or some major shoulder surgery in the past 5 years. Let them pitch!!

[hovertical]

24 minutes ago, rmc523 said:

It’s the Marlins training staff.  They always seem to drastically misdiagnose things.

if it's sore now, even if he does pitch, he'll eventually need TJ surgery.  with Sandy out already and that absolute shit show of a starting rotation, you honestly may as well just quit before the season even starts and just do whatever.  Thanks Bruce for being proactive and getting your latest hire to sign some of the cheaper vet options out there that have been signing. 

 

We also know Bendix is itching to move Lizard too - so that really leaves an incredibly gross rotation. 

[Michael]

33 minutes ago, marlinsmaniac said:

I grew up with dudes throwing 200+ innings and complete games and RARELY would you hear of Tommy John surgeries. The Marlins seem to always want to baby their arms to “protect” them but it like half of their pitchers have had Tommy John or some major shoulder surgery in the past 5 years. Let them pitch!!

It's similar to weight-lifting and running. Do it more often carefully, the longer you can do it.

 

Just start throwing and build up a ton til you can throw a hundred pitches without effort.

[hovertical]

2 minutes ago, Michael said:

It's similar to weight-lifting and running. Do it more often carefully, the longer you can do it.

 

Just start throwing and build up a ton til you can throw a hundred pitches without effort.

i'd counter with the fact these guys have already been pitching for years and years though too.  I could see just flat out exhaustion happening with the higher inning count but personally I believe it's more of a byproduct of how hard everyone throws now and the stress placed on those tendons and ligaments instead of needing to "build up".  You see the injuries in guys who have been able to pitch in the bigs without limit get injured seemingly as often as guys who are on innings limits.  The limiting thing doesn't seem to help very much in the end. Guys end up injured either way. 

[Michael]

15 minutes ago, hovertical said:

i'd counter with the fact these guys have already been pitching for years and years though too.  I could see just flat out exhaustion happening with the higher inning count but personally I believe it's more of a byproduct of how hard everyone throws now and the stress placed on those tendons and ligaments instead of needing to "build up".  You see the injuries in guys who have been able to pitch in the bigs without limit get injured seemingly as often as guys who are on innings limits.  The limiting thing doesn't seem to help very much in the end. Guys end up injured either way. 

Right but they throw a lot for a season, then get told to stop. Then build back up. Then throw a lot for a season. Then get told to stop.

If you do it year round, rarely ever going 100%, longevity extends a bunch. So, you're right on the guys throwing so hard these days leading to injuries as well. The stop-start of it all, however, can add to it much more.

[mystikol87]

1 hour ago, marlinsmaniac said:

I grew up with dudes throwing 200+ innings and complete games and RARELY would you hear of Tommy John surgeries. The Marlins seem to always want to baby their arms to “protect” them but it like half of their pitchers have had Tommy John or some major shoulder surgery in the past 5 years. Let them pitch!!

I imagine if guys tore their rotator cuff in the past, they just disappeared from the game, so there’s a survivorship bias at play. Look at Koufax. He basically had to just retire from his elbow issues.

[Michael]

40 minutes ago, mystikol87 said:

I imagine if guys tore their rotator cuff in the past, they just disappeared from the game, so there’s a survivorship bias at play. Look at Koufax. He basically had to just retire from his elbow issues.

 

Arthritis in his elbow more-so than structural issues like we get these days.

 

And yeah, before we had these surgeries, these guys were just done.

[marlinsmaniac]

1 hour ago, mystikol87 said:

I imagine if guys tore their rotator cuff in the past, they just disappeared from the game, so there’s a survivorship bias at play. Look at Koufax. He basically had to just retire from his elbow issues.

Yeah but it’s been the opposite, players in their 40’s were much more common 20 years ago and now for the most part dudes are 33/34 and retired. I remember watching baseball in the 90’s and you would see guys that debuted in the late 70’s still pitching. 
 

[Michael]

19 minutes ago, marlinsmaniac said:

Yeah but it’s been the opposite, players in their 40’s were much more common 20 years ago and now for the most part dudes are 33/34 and retired. I remember watching baseball in the 90’s and you would see guys that debuted in the late 70’s still pitching. 

Hell, Nolan Ryan was still going! lol. Of course, he is a major, MAJOR outlier. But ya know what he did? Lots of weight training, lots of throwing. His elbow survived almost 5,400 innings. 27 seasons!

 

29, really, once you include the minor league seasons. lol.

[SilverBullet]

Yea I'm definitely in the camp of this is probably gonna lead to TJ surgery eventually buuuut when you look at how it went down with Sandy and with Max Meyer, those two had their surgery almost immediately after getting hurt and evaluated so part of me thinks there has to be a difference with Eury that he's not already going in for surgery. 

Slight chance this one really isn't that bad?

[SilverBullet]

With so many young pitchers getting TJ and so many getting it even earlier in their careers I had a thought...

Could TJ surgery eventually become something that everyone just gets as a pre planned and preventative surgery before an injury occurs? Like work it into your schedule of your early career. Get drafted and go right into surgery so that we get it and the recovery out of the way and we can know ahead of time when you'll be ready to pitch. Instead of it being a surprise that shuts someone down as they prepare for their 2nd or 3rd season. 

It'll be like getting circumcised!

 

 

 

[SilverBullet]

13 hours ago, Michael said:

If you do it year round, rarely ever going 100%, longevity extends a bunch.

This reminds me of how I masturbate.

[Admin]

8 minutes ago, SilverBullet said:

It'll be like getting circumcised!

But there's been times players have needed a 2nd or even 3rd Tommy John surgery anyway.

Has anyone ever needed a second circumcision? I'd google it but I really don't want to.

[Admin]

6 minutes ago, SilverBullet said:

This reminds me of how I masturbate.

Why do you stop before 100% when masturbating? 

[hovertical]

8 minutes ago, SilverBullet said:

This reminds me of how I masturbate.

[Das Texan]

15 hours ago, marlinsmaniac said:

I grew up with dudes throwing 200+ innings and complete games and RARELY would you hear of Tommy John surgeries. The Marlins seem to always want to baby their arms to “protect” them but it like half of their pitchers have had Tommy John or some major shoulder surgery in the past 5 years. Let them pitch!!

100% a byproduct of going max effort with every pitch as opposed to in the past when you'd rarely go max effort on EVERY pitch because of these very reasons.

The rise of advanced analytics and scouting caring mostly about velocity in youth arms is a direct reflection of where we are wtih pitcher injury.

[Das Texan]

11 hours ago, Michael said:

Hell, Nolan Ryan was still going! lol. Of course, he is a major, MAJOR outlier. But ya know what he did? Lots of weight training, lots of throwing. His elbow survived almost 5,400 innings. 27 seasons!

 

29, really, once you include the minor league seasons. lol.

Mr. Ryan was a gift sent to us from the gods though, so he honestly doesnt count. 

[pollythewog]

39 minutes ago, SilverBullet said:

With so many young pitchers getting TJ and so many getting it even earlier in their careers I had a thought...

Could TJ surgery eventually become something that everyone just gets as a pre planned and preventative surgery before an injury occurs? Like work it into your schedule of your early career. Get drafted and go right into surgery so that we get it and the recovery out of the way and we can know ahead of time when you'll be ready to pitch. Instead of it being a surprise that shuts someone down as they prepare for their 2nd or 3rd season. 

It'll be like getting circumcised!

 

 

 

I don’t have the stats in front of me but after your first TJ it’s only a matter of time before the 2nd (like 400-600ip max).