fauowls44

Matthias looked good out there tonight. I hope he gets a longer look at. What did the rest of you think? oh and PANTHERS WIN! I was only able to watch the 1st 2 periods and had to listen to the 3rd, but I thought Matthias looked great. He skates well, he's big, wasn't afraid to shoot the puck or go to the net. He's going to be a stud. Not sure how long they keep him up this season, but he certainly looked like he belonged out there. Plus, that was a huge win for the Panthers. Only 4 points out of 1st place. If we can just get on a winning streak, the southeast is there for the taking. Oh, and how awesome is David Booth? The team has been up and down so far this year, but I love the development of the young players like Booth and Kreps in addition to Weiss, Horton, Jbo, etc. with Matthias and Frolik on the way. This should be a playoff team for years to come...hopefully starting this season. Gotta keep it going tonight!

The reason it's can't be Tuesday is the "four day rule". explain? I believe the "four day" rule is a commission rule that says the commissioners have to have 4 buisness days to review an issue that is coming before them. If they are not given that amount of time, any commissioner can envoke the rule and postpone it from being heard.

How about we contact the county commissioners and let them know that they shouldn't be influenced by one man with money to burn. Let them know that the jobs created by the ballpark and other projects will help low income families and new infrastructure can help revitalize communities. Can someone post the commissioners' contact info? I know it's been posted before...

I wonder what this guy's motivation is here. He must be upset he is being left out somehow because I fail to see how this concerns him...especially the Marlins stadium portion of this deal. The stadium is something that both the city and county want to see happen. It will be a boost to the OB site and the surrounding neighborhoods. In fact, the majority of the citizens around the OB seem to be very supportive. This guy is a car salesman. He'd screw anyone over to make a good deal selling a car. All of a sudden we are supposed to think he is so concerned about the poor? This guy is likely worth billions. The money he is spending on this ad campaign could help a lot of people. I suppose he'd rather spend his millions trying to spreading his political agenda then donating that money to the hungry.

Whatever...I would hope that just because this one car salesman, no matter how powerful or well connected, doesn't approve of these projects, that would be enough to kill the deal, which has already been voted on and approved by the city and county. Sounds like the Mayor and others are still behind the stadium plan. At this point, isn't this deal basically up to the Marlins and City and County commissioners anyway? The city and county both seem to support the stadium based on all previous votes. If this had to go up before a public vote, this type of negative campaigning would seem to be more of a concern. I could be wrong, but I guess we'll find out by Thursday.

his stats are okay i still think there are better because if he was up to par they would win more Sure, like Garnett was winning anything in Minnesota? Now he has Pierce and Ray Allen. Right now Wade has guys like Luke Jackson, Earl Barron, and Chris Quinn. Lebron is definetly one of the top 2 or 3 best players in the game and right now they are on the fringe of a playoff spot and under .500. Kobe's regarded as the best player in the league (no argument, he's awesome) but what has his team's done in the past three years? I'll be honest, I hate watching this Heat team. There's so little talent and Shaq, Zo, Williams, and Dorrell now hurt is taking it from bad to beyond terrible. That doesn't mean Wade isn't a top ten player in the league, it means he needs help like every other superstar. Sigh, when I said this (almost exactly, except for Luke Jackson of course, replace him with Penny) before the season I was bashed and got sh*t like, those guys are the bottom of the bench, we've got Ricky Davis, Dorrell Wright and U!!!! Come on. You look at the Heat's "healthy" roster, and you could have said that it's not a championship caliber team, but nobody could have predicted that they would have been the worst team in the East. If you did predict that, well, congrats. Either way, I'm at the point where I'm looking at this season as a good thing. This team needed a re-tooling and boy are they going to get one. They'll likely have a high draft pick. They have Williams and Davis coming off the books. I'm hoping that they find a way to package Haslem and Blount and clear even more salary. It's a bad team, but can potentially be fixed quickly.

his stats are okay i still think there are better because if he was up to par they would win more Sure, like Garnett was winning anything in Minnesota? Now he has Pierce and Ray Allen. Right now Wade has guys like Luke Jackson, Earl Barron, and Chris Quinn. Lebron is definetly one of the top 2 or 3 best players in the game and right now they are on the fringe of a playoff spot and under .500. Kobe's regarded as the best player in the league (no argument, he's awesome) but what has his team's done in the past three years? I'll be honest, I hate watching this Heat team. There's so little talent and Shaq, Zo, Williams, and Dorrell now hurt is taking it from bad to beyond terrible. That doesn't mean Wade isn't a top ten player in the league, it means he needs help like every other superstar.

If we're talking about how DWade looks on the court this season, its easy, not sure if thats whats going on here though. What's going on, in my opinion, is that he is still recovering from his offseason surgeries and playing on a team where he gets zero help. As for who you'd rather have...I'll give you Kobe and LeBron...But you're crazy if you'd take "garnett, allen, pierce, duncan, davis, nash, stoudamire, marion" over a healthy Wade given his age. Garnett, Allen, and Pierce are great and are great playing together, but neither one of them is a better overall player than Wade. Garnett used to be in that category though. Same with Duncan...a Hall of Famer, but at this point, if given the choice, i'm taking Wade. Davis, Nash, Stoudamire, and Marion...not even close. For just THIS year, you can make the argument for a number of guys, but as he gets healthy, Wade is one of the top 3 players in the NBA.

Theres probably a good 10 players that are better than him, however if you listed them in this thread you would be bashed to hell. Agreed. Please name them. Wade certainly isn't playing his best ball this year coming off of the surgeries and playing on a team lacking in talent, but I'm interested in what 10 players you'd rather have on your team then him.

This is a good thread.

I wish we could pick up another big time scorer. Horton is starting to wake up but it would be nice to add someone else who can get the puck into the net That would be nice. The trade deadline will be interesting. It may not be as active this year with so many teams in the playoff race.

Actually they have 41. That puts them in a tie for second in the division, three points behind Carolina (who is really struggling). Currently they are in 12th in the conference, but only four points out of fourth place in a insanely tight Eastern Conference. If they win the division, they are guarenteed at least the third playoff spot. So yeah, there's a lot of work to do, but they are in a decent position. They have been awesome on the road lately, but can really use some home wins, hopefully they can go on a nice run after tonight's OT win.

According to Fox Sports, Jeff Ireland will be allowed to interview for the GM job tomorrow and obviously, he'll be offered and accept it. Hopefully, that will be followed by a news conference announcing that hire and the firing of Cameron. I'm not usually one to call for the coach's head, but there are few would deserve being let go more than Cam after this year. It was a complete disaster from the start. It wasn't all his fault because of the injuries, but his handling of John Beck alone makes me want him gone. Plus the whole Keith Traylor thing will probably seal his fate.

Here is Sarah Talalay's take from the Sun Sentinel: http://blogs.trb.com/sports/custom/busines...te_no_1350.html Marlins Stadium Update No. 13,502 > Posted by Sarah Talalay at 10:02 AM Although Marlins President David Samson and others had hoped for a vote today by the Miami-Dade County Commission on a ?Baseball Stadium Agreement,? County Commission Chairman Bruno Barreiro has decided to delay the item until the commission?s Jan. 10 meeting. Don?t read anything into the delay: it just means county, city of Miami and Marlins officials are continuing to negotiate the finer points of the agreement commonly referred to as a ?BSA.? Those involved are more optimistic than ever that this will finally be the deal that makes a stadium happen. It?s hard for me to believe I just wrote that ? after all, I?ve been covering this issue ? and countless versions of ballpark plans ? for more than eight years. The basic framework on which the sides are negotiating is a $525 million, 37,000-seat retractable-roof ballpark at the site of the Orange Bowl stadium. The city and county would contribute $370 million from tourist and sports facilities taxes and a general obligation bond county voters approved in 2004 to renovate the Orange Bowl but which commissioners agreed Tuesday to put toward the ballpark project. The Marlins say they will contribute $155 million, which they will privately finance. The deal will be for 30 years and will require the Marlins to cover cost overruns, except in the event that the city or county are responsible for delays. The team will not be able to move until the end of the agreement or whenever the bonds are paid off, whichever is later. If the team is sold during the life of the agreement, the city and county would receive a percentage of the increase in value of the team since the date of the agreement. Yes, the plan is to build at the Orange Bowl because that's the only option available to the team right now. As for whether the team has the money to contribute to the plan, Samson says: ?When we negotiate something we have to be able to stand by what we will negotiate. Obviously you can?t offer something that you don?t think you can do.? If the BSA is approved by both the county and city commissions, then the next few months will be spent creating the final documents that spell out the financing, construction and other elements of the deal. That?s what Samson calls ?turning a 50-page document into a 400-page document.? The plan calls for construction to begin by November 2008 and the ballpark to open by April 2011. The team would be renamed the Miami Marlins by the 2011 season. I know lots of people are upset by a possible name change. Why are you so concerned about it?

No vote today. I guess the idea of finalizing the details in a 24 hour period was too optimistic. Hopefully this delay is just what they say it is, a chance to iron out the fine points of the agreement, and isn't a sign of trouble in anyway. http://www.palmbeachpost.com/marlins/conte...undup_1220.html Stadium meeting set for Jan. 10 Click-2-Listen By CHARLES ELMORE Palm Beach Post Staff Writer Thursday, December 20, 2007 The Marlins will negotiate through the holidays with Miami-Dade County and the city of Miami on a stadium agreement, with the county deferring until Jan. 10 the next public meeting on the deal. The deferral will permit the parties "to finalize negotiations" on a $525 million stadium at the site of the Orange Bowl, Miami-Dade County Commission Chairman Bruno Barreiro said Wednesday. City and county commissions have approved the outlines of a deal.

To Flamarlins3 comment...none. I'm not THAT old ! lol As for the published versions of events yesterday it's interesting to read the number of factual errors in the stories. The worst was CBS4 (are we surprised?) that had $2 billion in CRA money collected, and then stating over $500 million of that would be spent on a new stadium and even worse (from a reporting standpoint) that $900 milion would be spent on the new port tunnel(the real number is $80 million, the remainder coming from the state and feds). Reuters referred to the the new "downtown stadium". in an other the new parking garage is referred to as a "parking lot". The thing that bothers me about this and why so often I comment on this horrendous reporting is that it is now part of the internet, there for anyone to see and to be quoted as fact for years to come. I noticed that yesterday when I watched the news. I think they're often looking to create controversy no matter what the facts say. My personal favorite of the media reporting this story incorrectly is from SI.com... http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/base...ns.ballpark.ap/ The headline claims that the deal still needs to be approved by the Florida Legislature...which is blatently false. The deal includes no state money. All the article says is that the team has failed to receive state money in the past.

The connections were reset, try using the link again. Thank you! BTW, I just got an interesting screencap posted: http://capefish.blogspot.com/2007/12/count...ay-morning.html good to see some fans there... hope to see him jumping up and down like crazy in a few minutes... That's if they ever stop talking about this housing topic they are on...

Anyone else's webcast just cut off?

The City Commission just passed the "Global Project" thing that was written about in the Herald. I'm not sure what the next step is, but it certainly sounds positive. The vote was 4-1 and the 1 dissenting vote was a commissioner, whose name I can't remember, that was strongly in favor of the stadium but unhappy he had to vote on all of the other aspects.

New article from the Herald. The plan looks like it is now a "Global Works" plan that would also fund the Port Tunnel and Carnival Center among other projects, as well as fund the Marlins ballpark. Could Marlins2003 or any of you "in the know" let us know what all of this means for the Fish? It all sounds good, but I hope the stadium part can stand on it's own. I'd hate for something to happen with a science museaum and the stadium deal fall apart. Here is the link and the article: http://www.miamiherald.com/460/story/342749.html Financing plan would bypass voters MIAMI MAYOR DIAZ REVEALED A PLAN TO BUILD A STADIUM AND TUNNEL -- AND HELP MUSEUMS AND ARTS CENTER. THE FIRST TEST IS THURSDAY. Posted on Thu, Dec. 13, 2007 By Admin LEBOWITZ AND MICHAEL VASQUEZ llebowitz@MiamiHerald.com Part of the new plan proposed by Miami city and county leaders would help the Carnival Center for the Performing Arts pay down its debt. Miami's Omni Community Redevelopment Agency would contribute $400 million over the next couple of decades to help pay bonds that financed the performing arts center's construction. Miami city and county leaders have forged a multibillion-dollar public-works bonanza that could alter the face of the downtown core -- affecting everything from a baseball stadium to a port tunnel to museums. The plan, coming together with rare speed in the world of governmental red tape, envisions a holiday bounty of projects aimed at garnering support from constituencies ranging from sports fans to arts patrons. Announced late Wednesday by Miami Mayor Manny Diaz, the deal would cover everything from a $914 million tunnel leading to the Port of Miami to finally transforming fallow Bicentennial Park into a waterfront jewel with new art and science museums. By also shoring up the shaky finances at the fledgling Carnival Center for the Performing Arts, the plan's framework would free up additional tax monies that could be used to build a $525 million retractable-roof ballpark for the Florida Marlins. ''This is a great opportunity for all of us -- all of us -- to create an incredible legacy for the urban core,'' Diaz said following a long day of negotiating the multi-party pact -- and then selling it to individual commissioners. While Diaz and others in the city embraced the so-called ''global'' agreement with the county, many questions remain. One is whether a deal this complex can actually come to fruition. With so many parts forming the larger whole, it's possible that criticism of one piece of the blueprint could derail others. Secondly, the intricate financing has been crafted in a way to sidestep a potential voter referendum -- which could embolden critics. COMMISSIONS TO VOTE Selling it is key, and the first test comes Thursday when Miami commissioners decide whether to move the multilayered plan forward. County commissioners would then begin their review of key pieces of the ballpark financing and redevelopment plans Dec. 18. The framework -- hashed out over several weeks of behind-the-scenes talks with city and county managers -- centers on expanding the Omni Community Redevelopment Agency to include Bicentennial Park and Watson Island. CRAs are federally mandated special taxing districts that generate extra cash for areas targeted for revitalization. By aiming to expand the key Omni district, Miami leaders envision new infusions of money that would be doled out for multiple big-ticket projects. The biggest beneficiaries of this new Omni CRA would be the Carnival Center for the Performing Arts and a proposed new ballpark for the Marlins at the soon-to-be-demolished Orange Bowl. Diaz said the county would essentially receive up to $400 million in CRA revenue over the next 30 years to cover debt service on the arts center. This will free up somewhere between $160 million and $200 million in tourist taxes from the PAC -- that the county and city could then use for the ballpark in Little Havana. PARKING GARAGE Less certain: whether the will, and the money, exist to build a 6,000-space parking garage and one of Diaz's personal projects -- a 25,000-seat soccer stadium also proposed for the 40-acre Orange Bowl site. By expanding the CRA boundaries over the MacArthur Causeway to Watson Island, the city believes it can also use $50 million in CRA money to pay its share of the $914 million Port of Miami Tunnel over the next 35 years. Florida transportation officials had vowed to move their $457 million share of the tunnel deal to other parts of the state if the city didn't put up its $50 million piece by Monday. ''I can finally see the light at the end of the tunnel, no pun intended,'' said City Commissioner Joe Sanchez, who represents the Orange Bowl area. Miami property owners would also benefit from the expanded Omni CRA, city leaders say. Diaz said the city would pay off its outstanding debt on the troubled Jungle Island construction loans from the expanded CRA instead of general revenues. By expanding the boundaries into Bicentennial Park, the city would also use $68 million in new CRA revenue for the development of Museum Park -- including a planned underground parking garage. The CRA money would not be used to build the museums. OVERTOWN IMPACT Another question mark: whether city officials will be legally permitted to spin another $2 million a year out of the CRA to pay for ongoing capital improvements inside the park. A second, more hard-pressed, special tax district would also benefit under the city-county pact. The Southeast Overtown/Park West CRA, which generates considerably less revenue than the Omni, would be extended to year 2030 and its boundaries expanded to 20th Street on the north and Northwest Seventh Avenue on the west. The city would spend up to $80 million for affordable housing, infrastructure, parks and job programs in the economically depressed Overtown neighborhood, and it would set aside $35 million for the city's struggling streetcar plan. Diaz said Miami planned to adopt a pay-as-you-go approach when spending the CRA money on these big-ticket items over the next 30 years, rather than floating bonds to bankroll the projects. The unstated reason: The projects wouldn't have to face voter approval. In previous years, the city had contemplated issuing CRA bonds that could net perhaps hundreds of millions of dollars up front, to be used on large public-works projects. But the Florida Supreme Court ruled in September that any bond issue local governments do with CRA money needs voter approval. Miami responded by abandoning its bond-issue plans. This plan would sidestep those concerns. DETAILS As in every public project, the key is in the details, and literally hundreds of them still need to be hashed out. First: Does Diaz have the three commission votes to pass the plan when the body meets this morning? ''God willing, [Thursday] we will approve possibly the most exciting -- largest, certainly -- package of projects in city history,'' Diaz said late Wednesday. Commissioner Sanchez said of the ''global'' agreement: "So far, it looks good. . . . It's a win-win situation for everybody.'' Herald staff writers Charles Rabin, Andres Viglucci and Matthew I. Pinzur contributed to this report.

The marlins obviously have a funding mechanism in place or you wouldn't have had this announcement today. Whether it is a loan they have secured, an equity partner or wherever. The tax ramifications are complicated if a loan is involved (unless, say it isn't so MLB stepped up?? just guessing) I'm thnking this because the Marlins make no rent payments under this plan so they must be servicing debt instead. As I said, the other day the PSFT had grown to a point where there was enough money to build three stadiums and if you'll notice the parking garage is back. Keep in mind btw, MLB owns 20% of the profits the Marlins make in the first five years of a new stadium. I'm assuming that the Marlins were familiar with what this plan was going to be prior to the announcement. Hopefully the fact that they know have to pay $155 upfront wasn't just sprung on them tonight...The article kind of makes it sound like it was, but that can't be the case, right?

Is this good news?

Damn, I wanted him back in Florida. Because you enjoy overrated catchers who aren't particulalry good hitters or defenders?

MORGAN ENSBERG That would be awesome. I saw that on mlbtraderumors.com. Clearly he's not even half Miggy, but he does have nice power and if he's given 500 AB's again, he'll be an above league average 3B.

The ESPN winter meetings blog says the Marlins could look at signing Morgan Ensberg if he is non-tendered by the Pads next week. I know he's struggled the last year or so, but I've always been a fan.