July 22, 200817 yr Honestly, I think a Conine-type player would be perfect. Someone to take Jacobs' plays who may be less of a power threat, but has a clue at the plate. Hopefully wouldn't be too costly, in terms of prospects. Playing Luis Gonzalez at 1B would work. He can't be much worse defensively than Jacobs and his plate approach would be a huge bonus for the lineup. I know Gonzalez used to play some 1B. Is there any indication he can't do it any more?
July 22, 200817 yr I keep reminding myself we traded three players for Urbina and two washed out, and the third, while now an excellent major leaguer took another year and a half or two to establish himself in MLB. I still think we need a situational bat in the lineup somewhere (that's Fredi's job not mine) as well, which neither Hermida nor Jacobs provides, and since his comeback add Willingham to that list (although I'd reserve judgment there) but Hanley and Uggla and to a degree Ross aren't going to stop doing what they do. Cantu is the closest we have but I'm not sure he's more a contact hitter than a situational one, but I have to say it's become obvious that perhaps behind Gonzo, game smart he's the best guy out there. 100% agreed. Although closer is a question mark, my biggest concern is that our hitters lack situational skills. At times the lineup seems so "pitchable," and I think that hurts us if we get to the playoffs and see top notch veteran pitchers. Jacobs, IMO, is just an absolute joke of a hitter...I don't see his value except for the 3 weeks or so that he's scorching hot. Other than that he's God awful and really hurts the team in more ways than one. Uggla and Ross are what they are (free swingers), but at least they have somewhat of a clue and they are giving you power at traditionally non-power positions. Hermida in theory should be that type of hitter, but who the hell knows what's up with him. He is a real enigma, and he just doesn't appear to worried about becoming a better player. Willingham is a good situational hitter, as is Cantu. We need to have another guy that in the lineup that doesn't just close his eyes and try to throw his back out with every swing. Honestly, I think a Conine-type player would be perfect. Someone to take Jacobs' plays who may be less of a power threat, but has a clue at the plate. Hopefully wouldn't be too costly, in terms of prospects. That's Xavier Nady...but he's one of the better hitters on the market. Erick I know we have cody but do you believe in any way we may acquire mclouth as well? Also I wouldn't mine having holliday on the team lol. i've always liked him but i know theirs 99% chance we won't
July 22, 200817 yr Gaby Sanchez is another option, doing very well in AA, although that doesn't do jack for or defense since Cantu would have to stay at third and from what I've read, Gaby's not gonna be much better than Jake with the glove. Nny I think if you do some research you'll find Gaby in 42 games at 1B has 2 erros a .995 FP and more in 3 years 195 games at 1B 16 erros a .991 FP. I think must better than Jacobs
July 22, 200817 yr I keep reminding myself we traded three players for Urbina and two washed out, and the third, while now an excellent major leaguer took another year and a half or two to establish himself in MLB. I still think we need a situational bat in the lineup somewhere (that's Fredi's job not mine) as well, which neither Hermida nor Jacobs provides, and since his comeback add Willingham to that list (although I'd reserve judgment there) but Hanley and Uggla and to a degree Ross aren't going to stop doing what they do. Cantu is the closest we have but I'm not sure he's more a contact hitter than a situational one, but I have to say it's become obvious that perhaps behind Gonzo, game smart he's the best guy out there. 100% agreed. Although closer is a question mark, my biggest concern is that our hitters lack situational skills. At times the lineup seems so "pitchable," and I think that hurts us if we get to the playoffs and see top notch veteran pitchers. Jacobs, IMO, is just an absolute joke of a hitter...I don't see his value except for the 3 weeks or so that he's scorching hot. Other than that he's God awful and really hurts the team in more ways than one. Uggla and Ross are what they are (free swingers), but at least they have somewhat of a clue and they are giving you power at traditionally non-power positions. Hermida in theory should be that type of hitter, but who the hell knows what's up with him. He is a real enigma, and he just doesn't appear to worried about becoming a better player. Willingham is a good situational hitter, as is Cantu. We need to have another guy that in the lineup that doesn't just close his eyes and try to throw his back out with every swing. Honestly, I think a Conine-type player would be perfect. Someone to take Jacobs' plays who may be less of a power threat, but has a clue at the plate. Hopefully wouldn't be too costly, in terms of prospects. That's Xavier Nady...but he's one of the better hitters on the market. Erick I know we have cody but do you believe in any way we may acquire mclouth as well? Also I wouldn't mine having holliday on the team lol. i've always liked him but i know theirs 99% chance we won't Not so long ago, there was a rumor of McLouth coming over here for Willingham, and 2 minor leaguers. I'd actually rather have Nady; I think he's a better fit. Holliday is worth too much.
July 22, 200817 yr nadan play first base as well can't he? also rumor on espn that the tigers aren't looking to keep pudge long term and bo sox are after marte
July 22, 200817 yr nadan play first base as well can't he? also rumor on espn that the tigers aren't looking to keep pudge long term and bo sox are after marte Yeah.
July 22, 200817 yr Nady would be excellent, and he's the type of guy that you don't mind giving up prospects for since he could possibly be around for a while. It's a tough move to make for a lot of different reasons (prospects, $$, long term plan, etc), but that is the type of big move I wouldn't mind us making. I think a move like that makes us much better incrementally than, say, a move for Fuentes. I wouldn't mind playing Luis Gonzalez at first either, provided we wouldn't take a huge hit on defense. Then again, how much worse could it be? Whatever we do, I think the faster we get Jacobs off the field the better. He is a flawed player whose flaws are so incompatible with this team. His defense kills us because he can't field balls hit him, and because he doesn't provide a lot of help as a receiver for our infielders' haywire throws. On a team like ours his defense just compounds the problem. At the plate, he is the epitome of swing for the fences type player, but more often than not he misses. On some teams his weakness could be complimented by the strengths of the hitters around him. On this team, he becomes the poster child for a lineup that is as free-swinging as they come. We can easily sacrifice power for better defense and better situational hitting. In some ways I think McPherson would already be up if he weren't such a similar player to Jacobs. I think we all hope that he may be not as extremely free swinging, or not as bad on defense, but he certainly seems to be in the same type player. If he were more disciplined at the plate, even at the expense of power, I have a feeling he would have been up a while ago.
July 22, 200817 yr nadan play first base as well can't he? also rumor on espn that the tigers aren't looking to keep pudge long term and bo sox are after marte the sox coudn't get fuentes and they are on the marte bandwagon, but according to WEEI they are about 4th in line with 12 teams bidding.
July 22, 200817 yr What will it take to acquire Nady and Marte? According to Neal Hutchinson (the GM) for Nady it will take 2 prospects and at least 1 pitching prospect. Marte is open to discussion especially if they are packaged. They may also deal Bay. Bay has been in talks with for a trade with the Mets, Braves and Tampa. I guess Tampa is looking at both Bay and Nady. Also, the deal could be easier if Holliday is back on the market in serious talks.
July 22, 200817 yr What will it take to acquire Nady and Marte? lots of prospects lots of good prospects
July 22, 200817 yr What will it take to acquire Nady and Marte? lots of prospects lots of good prospects According to the GM 2 for Nady and only 1 pitcher right now (prefer 2)... thats not a whole lot.
July 22, 200817 yr Erick I know we have cody but do you believe in any way we may acquire mclouth as well? Also I wouldn't mine having holliday on the team lol. i've always liked him but i know theirs 99% chance we won't Not so long ago, there was a rumor of McLouth coming over here for Willingham, and 2 minor leaguers. I'd actually rather have Nady; I think he's a better fit. Holliday is worth too much. That cant be right, if it was then i fully understand why the pirates have be a barren waste land of good baseball for a long time...... Why trade mclouth? I think mclouth still has a year or two of arbitration left
July 22, 200817 yr I'd love to see if a Jacobs/Raynor/Gaby Hernandez deal would work for Marte/Nady. It would probably take a Tucker or Sean West instead of Gaby to make it work though.
July 22, 200817 yr I'd love to see if a Jacobs/Raynor/Gaby Hernandez deal would work for Marte/Nady. It would probably take a Tucker or Sean West instead of Gaby to make it work though. I still think it is worth it... It gives you talent to go for it and win this year and they will be around for a little bit. I also think you have other good position players and pitchers coming up that it can be done. I would try to save Tucker though since he is major league ready.
July 22, 200817 yr I'd love to see if a Jacobs/Raynor/Gaby Hernandez deal would work for Marte/Nady. It would probably take a Tucker or Sean West instead of Gaby to make it work though. What about guys like Vanden Hurk or Jesus Delgado?
July 22, 200817 yr I'd love to see if a Jacobs/Raynor/Gaby Hernandez deal would work for Marte/Nady. It would probably take a Tucker or Sean West instead of Gaby to make it work though. What about guys like Vanden Hurk or Jesus Delgado? Delgado isn't nearly enough, I doubt he has much value at all. I love Vanden Hurk though and would hate to trade him away, but yea...he might work too.
July 22, 200817 yr the last thing we need is another arbitration eligible player next season (which Nady is) We're very likely either targeting FAs at the end of the year, players that will make the minimum, or players signed to cheap contracts.
July 22, 200817 yr the last thing we need is another arbitration eligible player next season (which Nady is) We're very likely either targeting FAs at the end of the year, players that will make the minimum, or players signed to cheap contracts. Do you know the definitive number of arbitration eligible players we'll have? The other day I read it was 16 but the article was from a Chicago paper so I'm not so sure the writer would really know.
July 23, 200817 yr the last thing we need is another arbitration eligible player next season (which Nady is) We're very likely either targeting FAs at the end of the year, players that will make the minimum, or players signed to cheap contracts. Do you know the definitive number of arbitration eligible players we'll have? The other day I read it was 16 but the article was from a Chicago paper so I'm not so sure the writer would really know. IIRC, last time I counted there was 20 arbitration eligible + contracts signed (i.e. Andrew, Hanley) one second and I'll count again and mark down the players
July 23, 200817 yr First Nady is done for the year. Second, we don't need a bat, at all, we have bats we can't use. Third, we need bullpen help
July 23, 200817 yr 1) Kevin Gregg (Estimation: A LOT, going to be 5th service year, and at which point he can be compared to FAs, if he keeps his ERA low could be as high as 5m+, but probably around 4m) 2) Sergio Mitre (Estimation: ~1.5m, 2nd arb year) 3) Alfredo Amezaga (Estimation: ~1.5-2m, 2nd arb year) 4) Justin Miller (Estimation: ~1-1.2m, 2nd arb year) 5) Matt Treanor (Estimation: ~1m, 2nd arb year) 6) Jorge Cantu (Estimation: 3-4m?, first time actually going to arbitration, although he'll have 4 years of service time after the year) 7) Dallas McPherson (Estmation: 700k-1m, first time going to arbitration although like Cantu, he would have been eligible last year but was non-tendered) 8) Dan Uggla (Estimation: at this pace, like 8m haha) 9) Doug waechter (Estimation: ~1m) 10) Scott Olsen (Estimation: ~2-3m) 11) Josh Willingham (Estiomation: 3-4m) 12) Jeremy Hermida (Estiomation: 2-3m) 13) Mike Jacobs (Estimation: 2-3m) 14) Josh Johnson (estimation: 2-3m) 15) Logan Kensing (estimation: 700k-1m) 16) Joe Nelson (estimation: 700k-1m) 17) Cody ROss (estimation: 2-3m) Possible Super 2's (Can't be positive on these) 18) Ricky Nolsaco (EXTREMELY likely, estimation: 3m) 19) Taylor Tankersley (Very very likely, estimation: 1m) 20) Renyel Pinto (He's at 83 days, so I'm unsure, but if he is, probably 1.2-1.5m) 21) Lee Gardner (very Iffy, estimation: 700k, probably just non tender him if he is) Contracts: Andrew Miller (Unsure exact amount, but probably somewhere between 1.32-1.35m) Hanley Ramirez (5.5m) Plus Helms Buyout: 750k That's around 50m right there, then you have to add players making the minimum (A few more M)
July 23, 200817 yr Thanks. The Chicago guy included Ricky. http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/chi-2...0,4715506.story The Marlins are currently carrying 15 arbitration-eligibles, including infielder Dan Uggla, outfielder Jeremy Hermida and starters Scott Olsen, Josh Johnson and Ricky Nolasco. That could prompt general manager Admin Beinfest to trade first baseman Mike Jacobs or outfielders Cody Ross and Josh Willingham.
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