53 minutes ago, Valid said:

I'm less concerned about the career body of work and more concerned about his injury history.

It seems like he has harnessed his control this year, which was always his biggest problem. He has frontline stuff if he can keep the walks down.

yeah, it's always been his giant IF......this is the only time he's done that with any consistency. Smart move would be to sell on him if they can get a bidding war going as he'd be one of the biggest SPs available at the deadline (would also be a good BP guy probably for the playoffs when starters get brought in to help in games)

you don’t fucking trade good pitching, man! That is what wins ball games! Remember back when they had a literal all star team on the offensive side (Stanton, yelich, Ozuna, JT, Dee Gordon etc) and would still lose games every night 8-7, 10-6. it’s a hell of a lot easier to find a dude who can hit .265 with 15 homers than it is to find a guy who can give you six STRONG innings every time out. And you can win games 4-2, 3-1 all year if ALL your starters are top of the rotation type arms.

what they need to do this deadline is to take on good players with a large contract that their current team(s) want to get rid of and get out there in the offseason and finally have that “Jason Werth” signing. Enough is fucking enough already. This delusion that people will come to the stadium to see AAAA players with fake names is asinine. Sign some guys that fans know and can get excited about!

1 hour ago, marlinsmaniac said:

you don’t fucking trade good pitching, man! That is what wins ball games! Remember back when they had a literal all star team on the offensive side (Stanton, yelich, Ozuna, JT, Dee Gordon etc) and would still lose games every night 8-7, 10-6. it’s a hell of a lot easier to find a dude who can hit .265 with 15 homers than it is to find a guy who can give you six STRONG innings every time out. And you can win games 4-2, 3-1 all year if ALL your starters are top of the rotation type arms.

what they need to do this deadline is to take on good players with a large contract that their current team(s) want to get rid of and get out there in the offseason and finally have that “Jason Werth” signing. Enough is fucking enough already. This delusion that people will come to the stadium to see AAAA players with fake names is asinine. Sign some guys that fans know and can get excited about!

Case in point, the 2023 team was dead last in offense in the NL and made the playoffs on strong pitching as well as due to some fluky good hitting in leverage in the first half.

2 hours ago, FishFan95 said:

Case in point, the 2023 team was dead last in offense in the NL and made the playoffs on strong pitching as well as due to some fluky good hitting in leverage in the first half.

100%

Those early 2010’s giants teams that won multiple titles did it on the back of their pitching and defense. They had a couple of hitters but nothing incredible. They definitely weren’t offensive juggernauts. But when you have peak Lincecum, Cain, and Bumgardner coming at you 1/2/3 you’re pretty much fucked. This offense is nowhere good enough to carry the team and there’s no pitching in the minors other than possibly White. DEFINITELY don’t trade a dude you brought up through the system as your “future”.

4 hours ago, marlinsmaniac said:

100%

Those early 2010’s giants teams that won multiple titles did it on the back of their pitching and defense. They had a couple of hitters but nothing incredible. They definitely weren’t offensive juggernauts. But when you have peak Lincecum, Cain, and Bumgardner coming at you 1/2/3 you’re pretty much fucked. This offense is nowhere good enough to carry the team and there’s no pitching in the minors other than possibly White. DEFINITELY don’t trade a dude you brought up through the system as your “future”.

We might have the deepest pitching depth in the minors in all of baseball. They might be a few years away but the pitching and defense is exactly what they are emphasizing for the future. Thomas White, Mazur, Snelling, Dax, Josh White, Ekness, Belgrave all at AA or better. Noble, Dishmey, Liomar, Milbrandt, May, Payne, Shepardson, the list goes on and on. That's not even mentioning the guys in FCL and DSL that are absolute units.

We also have four guys on the cusp of the majors in AAA that will be upgrades both offensively and defensively. Marsee, Mack, Acosta, and Pauley. That's not even mentioning DDLS. All have been hitting at high levels the past month or months.

Rome wasn't built in a day. You have to build the foundation before you build the house.

16 hours ago, marlinsmaniac said:

you don’t fucking trade good pitching, man! That is what wins ball games! Remember back when they had a literal all star team on the offensive side (Stanton, yelich, Ozuna, JT, Dee Gordon etc) and would still lose games every night 8-7, 10-6. it’s a hell of a lot easier to find a dude who can hit .265 with 15 homers than it is to find a guy who can give you six STRONG innings every time out. And you can win games 4-2, 3-1 all year if ALL your starters are top of the rotation type arms.

what they need to do this deadline is to take on good players with a large contract that their current team(s) want to get rid of and get out there in the offseason and finally have that “Jason Werth” signing. Enough is fucking enough already. This delusion that people will come to the stadium to see AAAA players with fake names is asinine. Sign some guys that fans know and can get excited about!

Hahaha, you're forgetting the critical part:

we don't have an owner that operates like a real owner would, trying to spend like you're talking about. It's only about the bottom line and how much profit that can be made without any sort of long term investment or vision for the fanbase other than how many people can be traded away to not earn too much, hoping that everything clicks perfectly.

10 hours ago, TheMarlinsProject said:

We might have the deepest pitching depth in the minors in all of baseball. They might be a few years away but the pitching and defense is exactly what they are emphasizing for the future. Thomas White, Mazur, Snelling, Dax, Josh White, Ekness, Belgrave all at AA or better. Noble, Dishmey, Liomar, Milbrandt, May, Payne, Shepardson, the list goes on and on. That's not even mentioning the guys in FCL and DSL that are absolute units.

We also have four guys on the cusp of the majors in AAA that will be upgrades both offensively and defensively. Marsee, Mack, Acosta, and Pauley. That's not even mentioning DDLS. All have been hitting at high levels the past month or months.

Rome wasn't built in a day. You have to build the foundation before you build the house.

Brother I’ve been waiting on Rome for 20 years. These boys ain’t trying to build Rome, they’re trying to build Wichita Kansas and they can’t even do that.

and all those “prospects” ain’t shit till they come up and produce. And the organize shown that they can’t develop anything except pitching and even that is at the expense of their Elbow, Shoulder, or both.

It isn’t normal for a team to go 20 years being trash, other teams rebuild and it pays off it’s in 2-3 seasons. This is the only team that rebuilds their rebuilds in the middle of the rebuild and then forget what they were doing in the first place.

15 hours ago, TheMarlinsProject said:

We might have the deepest pitching depth in the minors in all of baseball. They might be a few years away but the pitching and defense is exactly what they are emphasizing for the future. Thomas White, Mazur, Snelling, Dax, Josh White, Ekness, Belgrave all at AA or better. Noble, Dishmey, Liomar, Milbrandt, May, Payne, Shepardson, the list goes on and on. That's not even mentioning the guys in FCL and DSL that are absolute units.

We also have four guys on the cusp of the majors in AAA that will be upgrades both offensively and defensively. Marsee, Mack, Acosta, and Pauley. That's not even mentioning DDLS. All have been hitting at high levels the past month or months.

Rome wasn't built in a day. You have to build the foundation before you build the house.

why isn't our farm ranked even in the top 10 if it's so deep ? Do we even have a top 25 prospect? - I want to say last time i saw Thomas White was at around 40th or so and that was our best. If it's just a bunch of depth guys then they're dead in the water because Bruce will never sign any star FA's.

On 7/10/2025 at 3:57 PM, marlinsmaniac said:

you don’t fucking trade good pitching, man! That is what wins ball games! Remember back when they had a literal all star team on the offensive side (Stanton, yelich, Ozuna, JT, Dee Gordon etc) and would still lose games every night 8-7, 10-6. it’s a hell of a lot easier to find a dude who can hit .265 with 15 homers than it is to find a guy who can give you six STRONG innings every time out. And you can win games 4-2, 3-1 all year if ALL your starters are top of the rotation type arms.

what they need to do this deadline is to take on good players with a large contract that their current team(s) want to get rid of and get out there in the offseason and finally have that “Jason Werth” signing. Enough is fucking enough already. This delusion that people will come to the stadium to see AAAA players with fake names is asinine. Sign some guys that fans know and can get excited about!

Definitely agree with your overall premise, but the reason why some want Cabrera traded is because he was sooo up and down his first four years and had a lot of injuries. Right now he is pitching lights out, but will it last? The Marlins can probably reap a HUGE return for him. He might even be the best pitcher on the market if the Marlins do decide to trade him.

As for signing players, we all know that isn't going to happen so long as Bruce is running the show. Heck, even Loria would go out and sign guys once in a while when he felt like we were close. I just don't see it happening under Bruce.

Say what you want about Jeter, but his frustrations here were completely valid. He wanted to sign some notable players, but Bruce simply wouldn't give him the budget for it. This team SHOULD be set up pretty well for the future, but if the Marlins aren't willing to add pieces, the chances of them actually making a run are slim to none. Maybe they have a 2023 type season where they sneak into the playoffs, but they'll run into a team that actually has a well-rounded team thanks to actually spending money and they'll lose.

Funny thing is, even if the Marlins do trade Cabrera and receive some really good prospects in return, they'll just end up trading them again in five years, so what's the point? The clock has probably already started on Agustin Ramirez lol.

3 hours ago, hovertical said:

why isn't our farm ranked even in the top 10 if it's so deep ? Do we even have a top 25 prospect? - I want to say last time i saw Thomas White was at around 40th or so and that was our best. If it's just a bunch of depth guys then they're dead in the water because Bruce will never sign any star FA's.

I think we've gone from 26th to the 14th to 16th range. A lot of the rookie level pitchers won't develop but with the sheer numbers (remember 10 years ago we didn't have any viable rookie players, so we've made progress) but if a couple do they could be huge. The last top 10 overall guy we had was Eury and we have like 7 or 8 guys with his potential right now.

We also completely suck at drafting. Our first round picks going back to 2000, and in particular top 10 picks, are absolutely atrocious. Bust after bust. Have to improve in that area.

Our hitting development has been horrific as well. We have traded for a lot of our bat prospects and invested in a lot of the areas we need to in order to improve that aspect.

Most free agents signings are a waste of resources and have a negative impact due to their age. Unless we are in on a guy like Soto or a guy in or nearing his prime, it's pointless. We want to avoid long, bad contracts like Willy Adames or Anthony Santander even though the casual fans cry when we don't sign them (or Avisail or Chen for that matter). The free agency argument is pointless while Sherman owns the team anyway since he won't spend the money. That is out of our control and beating a dead horse anyway.

Here's our top ten picks going back to 2000:

Kyle Skipworth

Andrew Heaney

Colin Moran

Tyler F'in Kolek

JJ Bleday

Max Meyer

Jacob Berry

Pretty epic fail there.

Guess the Cabrera trade rumors are moot now. He is hurt, elbow.

On 7/10/2025 at 9:02 AM, hovertical said:

with as good as he's been of late he should demand a hefty ransom if someone wants to trade for him. We've ALWAYS known the pure stuff can be incredible from him but this is the only time he's had an extended period where he's been living up to his potential. I'm hesitant to trust him and keep him going forward though because he's just been so underwhelming for his tenure here.

If we trade him - this hot stretch won't have been a mirage and he'll dominate for years to come.

If we keep him - he'll need TJ surgery or regress to what he always was or both lol.

Those will be the two outcomes. They should listen to offers though and seriously consider moving him if they can extract a blue chip prospect from someone in exchange. His career body of work says this is not him.

You just had to say something didn't you?

13 hours ago, Valid said:

You just had to say something didn't you?

doesn't take a crystal ball to know all our pitchers will need TJ surgery at some juncture - Sandy, Eury, (probably) Cabrera, JJ, Jose - basically anyone who can throw a nice speedball

1 hour ago, hovertical said:

doesn't take a crystal ball to know all our pitchers will need TJ surgery at some juncture - Sandy, Eury, (probably) Cabrera, JJ, Jose - basically anyone who can throw a nice speedball

To be fair, JJ was almost definitely Girardi's fault lol.

51 minutes ago, Valid said:

To be fair, JJ was almost definitely Girardi's fault lol.

the ol' rain delay argument. it's just a thing that all our good/great pitchers seem to have TJ surgery. there's also almost always a comment like Eddy made about "oh it's nothing, it's just some soreness"

10 day IL

60 day IL

then finally says "well, looks like i need TJ surgery" near end of season

out all of 2026

54 minutes ago, hovertical said:

the ol' rain delay argument. it's just a thing that all our good/great pitchers seem to have TJ surgery. there's also almost always a comment like Eddy made about "oh it's nothing, it's just some soreness"

10 day IL

60 day IL

then finally says "well, looks like i need TJ surgery" near end of season

out all of 2026

I mean I agree with your overall premise, but I don't think it's wrong to say that Girardi's decision to bring JJ back after a long delay definitely caused it. Would he have had TJ at some point down the line anyway? Maybe, but that was a direct result of the rain delay.

Cabrera MRI results Incoming. Brace for the news

Edited July 13, 2025Jul 13 by TheMarlinsProject

On 7/11/2025 at 6:54 PM, Valid said:

Definitely agree with your overall premise, but the reason why some want Cabrera traded is because he was sooo up and down his first four years and had a lot of injuries. Right now he is pitching lights out, but will it last? The Marlins can probably reap a HUGE return for him. He might even be the best pitcher on the market if the Marlins do decide to trade him.

As for signing players, we all know that isn't going to happen so long as Bruce is running the show. Heck, even Loria would go out and sign guys once in a while when he felt like we were close. I just don't see it happening under Bruce.

Say what you want about Jeter, but his frustrations here were completely valid. He wanted to sign some notable players, but Bruce simply wouldn't give him the budget for it. This team SHOULD be set up pretty well for the future, but if the Marlins aren't willing to add pieces, the chances of them actually making a run are slim to none. Maybe they have a 2023 type season where they sneak into the playoffs, but they'll run into a team that actually has a well-rounded team thanks to actually spending money and they'll lose.

Funny thing is, even if the Marlins do trade Cabrera and receive some really good prospects in return, they'll just end up trading them again in five years, so what's the point? The clock has probably already started on Agustin Ramirez lol.

Yup, I don't think Jeter was any perfect head of the FO, but his frustrations of Bruce not spending as promised seem valid, with him not spending anything.

On 7/12/2025 at 2:28 PM, hovertical said:

the ol' rain delay argument. it's just a thing that all our good/great pitchers seem to have TJ surgery. there's also almost always a comment like Eddy made about "oh it's nothing, it's just some soreness"

10 day IL

60 day IL

then finally says "well, looks like i need TJ surgery" near end of season

out all of 2026

yup, they'll wait until the end of the season to make sure he's out for years.

Cabrera’s MRI supposedly didn’t reveal any structural damage, and they’re not expecting him to miss any starts…….but this is the Marlins, so I’m sure he’s headed to TJ after an obnoxiously prolonged IL stint, while the peddle the “just a few weeks away” for months on end.

Latest On Marlins' Deadline Plans - MLB Trade Rumors

It therefore comes as no surprise that Barry Jackson of The Miami Herald writes that the Fish plan to entertain offers on Sandy Alcantara, Edward Cabrera, Jesús Sánchez and Anthony Bender in the coming weeks. All four players appeared among MLBTR’s list of the top 40 trade candidates earlier this month; Alcantara was in the top spot. Jackson adds that the Marlins are shopping impending free agent starter Cal Quantrill, though he’d have less trade value than the rest of the group.

On 7/17/2025 at 5:44 AM, rmc523 said:

Latest On Marlins' Deadline Plans - MLB Trade Rumors

It therefore comes as no surprise that Barry Jackson of The Miami Herald writes that the Fish plan to entertain offers on Sandy Alcantara, Edward Cabrera, Jesús Sánchez and Anthony Bender in the coming weeks. All four players appeared among MLBTR’s list of the top 40 trade candidates earlier this month; Alcantara was in the top spot. Jackson adds that the Marlins are shopping impending free agent starter Cal Quantrill, though he’d have less trade value than the rest of the group.

Sure. Let 'em go. I don't care about any of these dudes any longer. Sandy has been putrid nearly the entire season and wasn't like his former Cy self even in his last full season so he can go. I don't trust Cabrera although he won't be traded due to his injury anyway. Sanchez and Bender can kick rocks.

So the starters for this weekend will be Sandy, Quantrill, and Junk. 2 guys will likely get 3 starts before the trade deadline, and the other 3 will get just 2. Makes sense to have Sandy and Cal pitch the first 2 since they are shopping them. As for Eddy, it's probably just a matter of giving him more time due to the injury scare.

Honestly, I think that Quantrill is as good as gone. He has been servicible. Won't get a haul, but teams are always looking for pitching.

Not sure about Sandy or Eddy. I have heard that they value Eddy more than Sandy and did so even before Sandy's dreadful first half. I guess it just depends on the asking price and how much the other team is willing to give up.

1 hour ago, FishFan95 said:

Honestly, I think that Quantrill is as good as gone. He has been servicible. Won't get a haul, but teams are always looking for pitching.

Not sure about Sandy or Eddy. I have heard that they value Eddy more than Sandy and did so even before Sandy's dreadful first half. I guess it just depends on the asking price and how much the other team is willing to give up.

"they" meaning the Marlins, or other teams?

If the Marlins, sure because he's cheaper.