Out of the Past

We're trading Cabrera for economic, not baseball, reasons. I'd love to be so clueless. Christ, dude. Seriously, you've been annoying as hell the last few days. This is all about money and I can't believe anyone would argue otherwise. With that said, if Beinfest finds a retarded GM to deal with then we can come out ahead but even if he does it doesn't change the motivation behind the deal.. money.

The Marlins have a better hitting team than the Mets.

2007: Cabrera, 24, 150 OPS+ Wright, 24, 150 OPS+ and Wright's defense is much better, and he actually brings something with his stolen base prowess (34/5) God forbid that I may at one point have made a mention that I liked Wright better, which I don't even remember making The fact is Wright had the better year and Wright has been improving while Cabrera has not.

No thanks, i love Mike Lowell but w/o the Monster he wouldn't have those numbers... Well, Dolphin Stadium is one of if not the most similar hitting park to Fenway in Lowell's case. That's why he had so much success here, too, IMO. I mean, how many Lowell homers snuck over the Teal Tower or in the corner? How many doubles bounced off the Tower or couldn't be chased into the deap gaps? Granted, Fenway is even better for him, but this isn't a bad place for a righty dead-pull hitter. Just eyeballign his stats it looks like the gap between his home / away slip with the Red Sox is smaller than what it was with the Marlins. I wouldn't want him because of the cost but just agreeing with you.

Yes, I'm sure age has a lot to do with it but given that Teixeira, Uggla, Crisp, Howard and Utley are all about 27 or 28 I would think that Teixeira, Howard and Utley would be rated higher than Uggla and Crisp because they're much better players. Crisp is in a whole different league from these guys. With Chico and Lincecum, Lincecum is better, younger and has a much higher ceiling so I would think he would be rated higher. There's some strange stuff in there.

I don't know how they rate players but I can't imagine I would agree with a grading system that somehow puts Crisp, Uggla and Chico in the same bucket as Teixeira, Utley, Lincecum and Howard.

FIU up 16-10 early in the 4th. I hope they win. Robert Marve got arrested last night on a misdeamenor.

Where do you get past DER stats? And I don't think DER is the best defensive measure considering it is affected quite a bit by pitching. DER has limitations but what would you say is better to measure team defense? Use this link and then just change it to what you're looking for. For some reason whenever I went to mlb.com's stat page I would go around in circles looking for the historical team stats so one time I was lucky to find it and just saved link: http://mlb.mlb.com/stats/historical/team_s...mp;sortByStat=R

save the 2003 Marlins, none of the past 7 world series champions featured elite defense. If you go with DER which is probably the best stat to measure team defense then I think the '07 Red Sox, the '05 White Sox, the '04 Red Sox and the '02 Angels would disagree with you and if you go back further then the '01 DBacks, the '00 Yankees, the '99 Yankees and the '98 Yankees would also disagree with you. DER Rankings: =========== '07 Red Sox - 2nd in the AL '05 White Sox - 2nd in the AL '04 Red Sox - 4th in the AL '02 Angels - 1st in the AL '01 DBacks - 3rd in the NL '00 Yankees - 4th in the AL '99 Yankees - 3rd in the AL '98 Yankees - 1st in the AL

The link wouldn't work but now that you agree that "defense doesn't really matter" was said we can move on. Do you think Fredi should get a bonus or a contract extension for cutting back on defensive drills? Yeah it was said once, and all other times it was you putting those words into others' mouths. If one person says it and then several others agree with him would you say that one person said it or that several said it? I would say that several said it or, if you prefer just the technical, that several believe it. Others have also diminished the improtance of defense without using the "defense doesn't really mater" phrase.

Barry Jackson wrote about this.

The link wouldn't work but now that you agree that "defense doesn't really matter" was said we can move on. Do you think Fredi should get a bonus or a contract extension for cutting back on defensive drills?

"Defense doesn't really matter" was said. I'm not in the "pitching, speed and defense" crowd. If you have a guys that have inherent weaknesses the solution is hard work. Fredi's solution for our defensive issues was to cut back on defensive work. In my opinion this makes Fredi an idiot and I blame him for most of our players regressing defensively. So many of our guys didn't regress because of bad luck or just because.

Cause nobody here thinks defense matters. So when someone says defense doesn't really matter according to you what they meant is that defense matters?

it'll improve or something Yeah when you look at how much we regressed, you gotta say we'll be better next year. That, or we're completely f***ed without Perry Hill. One or the other. Anddddd I guess we'll find out next year which it is God we gotta be better next year.... I don't think they'll get better just because. The most blame goes to the idiot manager who doesn't make these guys work. :lol You're too funny sometimes. Over the course of the season there were several articles that discussed a reduction in defensive work compared to the previous season. I think practicing and working hard on your weaknesses is important. Perhaps you don't. But I'll come clean and admit I also think defense matters so I'm probably way out in LF on this.

I think Marlins2003 is right that the Marlins won't be offering to pay for cost overruns. And like fawouls' said, this makes sense as it's the city and county that chose this awful site, not the Marlins. If the Marlins offer $205K or $215K they are being very generous. It makes no sense for the city and county to cover cost overruns. All along the Marlins have agreed to cover the overruns including during the previous version of the OB stadium. This is just another way of reducing their contribution. I seem to recall the Marlins demanding control of project in exchange for cost overruns. The point was to not let the city/county's contractors cash their blank check. All along the Marlins have had control of the construction and nothing that I've read says that this has changed. The only thing that has changed is that in the past the Marlins agreed to cover the overrurns and now it looks as if they're back pedalling on that. For years the one issue with the overruns was Lorias's refusal to get a letter of credit as collateral. IIRC the issue was resolved about three years ago after he put the team as collateral.

Not that it is definitive proof or anything, but hopefully it is a bit of an eye opener to those that feel Cabrera and Ramirez are adequate defensive infielders. And Uggla.

it'll improve or something Yeah when you look at how much we regressed, you gotta say we'll be better next year. That, or we're completely f***ed without Perry Hill. One or the other. Anddddd I guess we'll find out next year which it is God we gotta be better next year.... I don't think they'll get better just because. The most blame goes to the idiot manager who doesn't make these guys work.

A-Rod will be 44 years old at the end of a 12 year deal. They reason they want it to be a 12 year deal is because that is the season he is projected to break the record. So what? I'm saying its crazy. But the reason they are looking for the 12 years is because thats when he should break the record. He should break the HR record in about 6 years. The hits record in about 10 or 11 years.

How does this trade sound? Well yuo're leaving the Dodgers with holes at catcher and starting pitching so maybe we can help them out by sending Treanor and Seddon for Loney and Ethier.

How can we as hard working Americans feel comfortable renewing season tickets for an owner who is just sitting back with his hands open waiting for hand out? Well he does a bit more than that. Last year, for example, he stuffed a $100 bill in his pocket at a rate of once every 73 seconds. That would wear anyone out.

Please go to baseball.reference.com and look up his comparisons list nobody in that offered trade benefits us enough to give up that type of talent. Some of you view those comparisons like it's the bible or somethign like that. I love baseball-refernce but I think those comparisons are the one useless portion of their website. Hanley Ramirez is a nice player lol....That's all he is right? My friend, put Hanley in the 3 hole and his RBI total jumps up easily over 100, not to mention the 29 HR, the 125 R, the 51 SB, the .332 batting average, 48 doubles, a whole bunch less strikeouts, and a better defender with much more potential to become an above average SS defensively or even better like Alex Gonzalez did. Miguel did not lose all the weight, he weighs 250 lbs, and is woeful as a defensive player. He is an amazing hitter but Hanley's numbers this year were better than Miguel's. Hanley is the future of baseball. He is the Adrian Peterson of MLB. He is the super freak who has all the tools. He is the franchise, he is the all around super star that all teams need. the all around force. He is the next Barry Bonds, minus the roids. He is a potential 40/50 guy, he is the potential .330/40 hr/100+rbi/120+r/50+sb guy who can develop into a very solid defensive SS. Are you really gonna argue that? My friend, I didn't say anything about Hanley.

Please go to baseball.reference.com and look up his comparisons list nobody in that offered trade benefits us enough to give up that type of talent. Some of you view those comparisons like it's the bible or somethign like that. I love baseball-refernce but I think those comparisons are the one useless portion of their website.

we got plenty of guys who can take over for Boone Who?

Kemp + Billingsley + Kershaw for Miggy + insert name here Why wouldn't they sign ARod rather than trading for Miguel and this way they get to keep two beasts in Billingsley and Kemp that are making minimum wage for TWO more seasons?