June 26, 200817 yr It's not his fault our staff is full of minor leaguers. Nolasco, Olsen, Hendrickson, Andrew Miller, Doug Waechter, Justin Miller, Kevin Gregg, Pinto and Kensing are not minor leaguers. "Full of minor leaguers" is wildly exaggerating the makeup of the staff.
June 26, 200817 yr I keep wondering why the pitching coach continues to get a free pass in these discussions or generally in the media. He seems to me to be the common denominator among these underachievers. i thought mark wiley has done a good job this year the staff has improved in the last year our bullpen is a little snake bitten since we had lee gardner would eat innings for the penn they are missing him It is? Fooled me. Well last year 2007 Team ERA: 4.94 This Year: 4.61 Our Starters ERA last year: 5.58 Dead last compaired to this year where it is at 5.06 a whole half run better then last year our bullpen last year 4.02 this year 3.90 our bullpen and our starting staff has improved you say our defense got better? well thats Unearned runs therefore wouldnt matter our staff has gotten better from last year.
June 26, 200817 yr hellooooo we all know mark herndrickson was sos or bad pitcher when came here he DIDNOT pitch well with Dodgers ((( here thing i find out about herndrickson ))He immediately joined the Dodgers' starting rotation, but ineffectiveness caused him to be moved to the ((bullpen)) for the end of the season, where he was more effective. His final 2006 numbers with the Dodgers were 2-7, 4.68 ERA in 18 appearances, 12 as a starter. In 2007, he was both a starter and a reliever for the Dodgers, showing more effectiveness out of the ((bullpen.))
June 26, 200817 yr i havent read every post in this thread so sorry if this has been covered someone said at the beginning of the thread that we cant cut hendrickson cos hes eating innings well excuse me but he has completed 6 innings or more in only 6 out of 17 starts - only 3 since the start of may pretty poor imo
June 26, 200817 yr what find out about him that he have same problem with Dodgers and he sent to bullpen look at above post what i find out about him he was not good as starter so he send to bullpen that could happen here very very soon as we get other pitcher from DL
June 26, 200817 yr You're completely ignoring a sober Scott Olsen and a healthy Ricky Nolasco, which without those two would blow a hole in those numbers. Not to mention it isn't about stats. Stats don't play the game, ballplayers do, and at the rate the bullpen is going right now (read meltdown), absent an infusion of new pitchers, will not even approach what the bullpen contributed last season. BTW I said nothing about the defense getting better but for what it's worth walking the bases full and then having an error behind you that plates two ignores the fact you just walked the bases full. Please, don't try to blame a mediocre defense for the crumbling bullpen we have or the fact we have three starters who are contributing and a pitching coach who isn't. If you don't look at Lindstrom and Tankersley being sent down as utter failures of the pitching coach I don't know what to tell you. I came into this season believing Wiley would be an asset to the team, a major upgrade, a good teacher, but he hasn't been. He's done two things i give him credit for, speeding Olsen up and calming Andrew Miller down but beyond that his contribution just hasn't been there.
June 26, 200817 yr BTW... Anyone think Waechter being extended today is a sign of a role swap between him and Hendrickson?
June 26, 200817 yr BTW... Anyone think Waechter being extended today is a sign of a role swap between him and Hendrickson? I am open for anything.
June 26, 200817 yr Isn't JJ set to return on the 4 of July? thats what i read last time in an article about him
June 26, 200817 yr It's not his fault our staff is full of minor leaguers. Nolasco, Olsen, Hendrickson, Andrew Miller, Doug Waechter, Justin Miller, Kevin Gregg, Pinto and Kensing are not minor leaguers. "Full of minor leaguers" is wildly exaggerating the makeup of the staff. Hendrickson = Piece of crap Kevin Gregg = Piece of crap Andrew Miller = Still young and probably should have had more time in the minors Kensing = Piece of crap Waechter = Serviceable as a long reliever Olsen = inconsistent Nolasco = inconsistent (getting better) Justin Miller = w/e Pinto = Not bad I guess I did exaggerate by calling them "minor leaguers"... they mainly just suck.
June 26, 200817 yr You do realize the Rays rotation contains player aged 26, 25, 24, 24, and 24? And yet they're one of the best rotations in baseball. Smart drafting & trading, and a bit of luck. But still, an organization that did their homework. Beinfest is not looking so smart these days.
June 26, 200817 yr I keep wondering why the pitching coach continues to get a free pass in these discussions or generally in the media. He seems to me to be the common denominator among these underachievers. {{{{APPLAUSE}}}} :thumbup
June 26, 200817 yr It's not his fault our staff is full of minor leaguers. Nolasco, Olsen, Hendrickson, Andrew Miller, Doug Waechter, Justin Miller, Kevin Gregg, Pinto and Kensing are not minor leaguers. "Full of minor leaguers" is wildly exaggerating the makeup of the staff. Hendrickson = Piece of crap Kevin Gregg = Piece of crap Andrew Miller = Still young and probably should have had more time in the minors Kensing = Piece of crap Waechter = Serviceable as a long reliever Olsen = inconsistent Nolasco = inconsistent (getting better) Justin Miller = w/e Pinto = Not bad I guess I did exaggerate by calling them "minor leaguers"... they mainly just suck. Hendrickson is a piece of crap well be lucky if we get 2 cheeseburgers and fries for him Gregg- Gets it done but scres the sh*t outt people doing it Miller- hella lot beter than at the beginig of season gonna be good next season Kensing- set up man one of our better relivers work on control with slider is all he needs Wachter should start instead of mh not worth spelling his name but he is our best outta the pen Scotty O- Ace Ace baby give him 4 runs hell give u a W Nolasco- most improved pitcher so far good curve nd cut fastball J Millier- ok inconsistant but mostly reliable Pinto- does good until fielders fuyck it up but needs to work on his changeup and control we got good pichers if there on a good night but our losings all about not getting the ofense satrted 1 or 2 runs isnt gonna cut it we are contenders especially with the adition of JJ Anibal and captain Mitre
June 26, 200817 yr You do realize the Rays rotation contains player aged 26, 25, 24, 24, and 24? And yet they're one of the best rotations in baseball. Smart drafting & trading, and a bit of luck. But still, an organization that did their homework. Beinfest is not looking so smart these days. Ye beinfest looks like hes getting althhiemers or sumthin. watch hes gonna trade mh for arroyo who let 10 runs 11 hits in the first inning but the rays could be a way better team if they did trade josh hamilton
June 26, 200817 yr I keep wondering why the pitching coach continues to get a free pass in these discussions or generally in the media. He seems to me to be the common denominator among these underachievers. i thought mark wiley has done a good job this year the staff has improved in the last year our bullpen is a little snake bitten since we had lee gardner would eat innings for the penn they are missing him It is? Fooled me. Well last year 2007 Team ERA: 4.94 This Year: 4.61 Our Starters ERA last year: 5.58 Dead last compaired to this year where it is at 5.06 a whole half run better then last year our bullpen last year 4.02 this year 3.90 our bullpen and our starting staff has improved you say our defense got better? well thats Unearned runs therefore wouldnt matter our staff has gotten better from last year. Its really unfair to asses using the full year of 2007, with the dead arms at the end of the year coming into that equation. To be totally honest we can't fairly assess the pitching staff until the end of the season. Of course this is what you get, when you try to get lighting in a bottle with a MLB journeyman. Beinfest thinks he's gonna strike gold every time since he did it a couple of times with closers. Its looking more & more like he got lucky, instead of being smart. His FA decisions the last couple of years haven't totally worked out. Gonzalez is looking decent, but even he has caught "Marlin-itis" the last week or so. Boone was a disaster, and I think the team was better off without him after he left. He screwed up letting Helms go, and now that he is back, most of that magic is gone. He's not the same Helms we had in 2006. What's the answer ? I don't know, but right now this franchise is just drifting and doesn't seem to have a plan for the future. I see a Marlins team that seems to have an MO to make the maximum profit so those monies can be put towards the team's contribution for the new stadium. And if the stadium doesn't go through they will have monies saved to gird them through a move out of South Fla, and playing in a Minor League stadium for a few years. TB has a plan, and they are on target to make the playoffs and remain a contendter in a much tougher division than we play in. They have real plans for a new stadium and look to be in the much better ownership position, with an ownership that wants to win, instead of one that is more interested in a bottom line 1st, win if we can and players that "have to outperform their contracts", even though they have minimum pay contracts. It really sucks to be a Marlins fan right now. :banghead
June 26, 200817 yr Author I keep wondering why the pitching coach continues to get a free pass in these discussions or generally in the media. He seems to me to be the common denominator among these underachievers. i thought mark wiley has done a good job this year the staff has improved in the last year our bullpen is a little snake bitten since we had lee gardner would eat innings for the penn they are missing him It is? Fooled me. Well last year 2007 Team ERA: 4.94 This Year: 4.61 Our Starters ERA last year: 5.58 Dead last compaired to this year where it is at 5.06 a whole half run better then last year our bullpen last year 4.02 this year 3.90 our bullpen and our starting staff has improved you say our defense got better? well thats Unearned runs therefore wouldnt matter our staff has gotten better from last year. Its really unfair to asses using the full year of 2007, with the dead arms at the end of the year coming into that equation. To be totally honest we can't fairly assess the pitching staff until the end of the season. Of course this is what you get, when you try to get lighting in a bottle with a MLB journeyman. Beinfest thinks he's gonna strike gold every time since he did it a couple of times with closers. Its looking more & more like he got lucky, instead of being smart. His FA decisions the last couple of years haven't totally worked out. Gonzalez is looking decent, but even he has caught "Marlin-itis" the last week or so. Boone was a disaster, and I think the team was better off without him after he left. He screwed up letting Helms go, and now that he is back, most of that magic is gone. He's not the same Helms we had in 2006. What's the answer ? I don't know, but right now this franchise is just drifting and doesn't seem to have a plan for the future. I see a Marlins team that seems to have an MO to make the maximum profit so those monies can be put towards the team's contribution for the new stadium. And if the stadium doesn't go through they will have monies saved to gird them through a move out of South Fla, and playing in a Minor League stadium for a few years. TB has a plan, and they are on target to make the playoffs and remain a contendter in a much tougher division than we play in. They have real plans for a new stadium and look to be in the much better ownership position, with an ownership that wants to win, instead of one that is more interested in a bottom line 1st, win if we can and players that "have to outperform their contracts", even though they have minimum pay contracts. It really sucks to be a Marlins fan right now. :banghead It is really frustrating right now. This team could not capitalize on a major losing streak by the Phillies, the marlins were once 10 games over .500 and now hope to stay around .500 by the end of the weekend with a tough Arizona staff taking the mound while the Marlins bats are going cold
June 26, 200817 yr I keep wondering why the pitching coach continues to get a free pass in these discussions or generally in the media. He seems to me to be the common denominator among these underachievers. i thought mark wiley has done a good job this year the staff has improved in the last year our bullpen is a little snake bitten since we had lee gardner would eat innings for the penn they are missing him It is? Fooled me. Well last year 2007 Team ERA: 4.94 This Year: 4.61 Our Starters ERA last year: 5.58 Dead last compaired to this year where it is at 5.06 a whole half run better then last year our bullpen last year 4.02 this year 3.90 our bullpen and our starting staff has improved you say our defense got better? well thats Unearned runs therefore wouldnt matter our staff has gotten better from last year. Its really unfair to asses using the full year of 2007, with the dead arms at the end of the year coming into that equation. To be totally honest we can't fairly assess the pitching staff until the end of the season. Of course this is what you get, when you try to get lighting in a bottle with a MLB journeyman. Beinfest thinks he's gonna strike gold every time since he did it a couple of times with closers. Its looking more & more like he got lucky, instead of being smart. His FA decisions the last couple of years haven't totally worked out. Gonzalez is looking decent, but even he has caught "Marlin-itis" the last week or so. Boone was a disaster, and I think the team was better off without him after he left. He screwed up letting Helms go, and now that he is back, most of that magic is gone. He's not the same Helms we had in 2006. What's the answer ? I don't know, but right now this franchise is just drifting and doesn't seem to have a plan for the future. I see a Marlins team that seems to have an MO to make the maximum profit so those monies can be put towards the team's contribution for the new stadium. And if the stadium doesn't go through they will have monies saved to gird them through a move out of South Fla, and playing in a Minor League stadium for a few years. TB has a plan, and they are on target to make the playoffs and remain a contendter in a much tougher division than we play in. They have real plans for a new stadium and look to be in the much better ownership position, with an ownership that wants to win, instead of one that is more interested in a bottom line 1st, win if we can and players that "have to outperform their contracts", even though they have minimum pay contracts. It really sucks to be a Marlins fan right now. :banghead No we have a future plan but its when the new stadium opens in 2011 Skipwoth C 1b Sanchez 2bUggla SS HANLEY 3b Domiguez LF whoever CF Maybin Rf Hermida Rotation Olsen Miller JJ Volstad Nolasco Bulpen Jeff Allison Mitre De la cruz Tankersley Lindstrom Kensing Pinto Anibal Bench Mcfearson Alfredo- HOPEFULLY Then fill 2 more spot with a catcher and fielder THATS OUR FUTURE AND THE FUTURE LOOKS BRIGHT
June 26, 200817 yr You do realize the Rays rotation contains player aged 26, 25, 24, 24, and 24? And yet they're one of the best rotations in baseball. Smart drafting & trading, and a bit of luck. But still, an organization that did their homework. Beinfest is not looking so smart these days. Ye beinfest looks like hes getting althhiemers or sumthin. watch hes gonna trade mh for arroyo who let 10 runs 11 hits in the first inning but the rays could be a way better team if they did trade josh hamilton They would be scary good with Hamilton, but at least they traded their drug addict and got something for him. We keep our druggie Allison in hiding, in single A and not on the 40 man roster. We could have drafted Conor Jackson or Chad Billingsley (both drafted after Allison) and think how much better either one would have made this roster. Admin Beinfest really screwed up more than he's hit on 1st rounders. His drafts have really been pretty piss-poor.
June 26, 200817 yr I keep wondering why the pitching coach continues to get a free pass in these discussions or generally in the media. He seems to me to be the common denominator among these underachievers. i thought mark wiley has done a good job this year the staff has improved in the last year our bullpen is a little snake bitten since we had lee gardner would eat innings for the penn they are missing him It is? Fooled me. Well last year 2007 Team ERA: 4.94 This Year: 4.61 Our Starters ERA last year: 5.58 Dead last compaired to this year where it is at 5.06 a whole half run better then last year our bullpen last year 4.02 this year 3.90 our bullpen and our starting staff has improved you say our defense got better? well thats Unearned runs therefore wouldnt matter our staff has gotten better from last year. Its really unfair to asses using the full year of 2007, with the dead arms at the end of the year coming into that equation. To be totally honest we can't fairly assess the pitching staff until the end of the season. Of course this is what you get, when you try to get lighting in a bottle with a MLB journeyman. Beinfest thinks he's gonna strike gold every time since he did it a couple of times with closers. Its looking more & more like he got lucky, instead of being smart. His FA decisions the last couple of years haven't totally worked out. Gonzalez is looking decent, but even he has caught "Marlin-itis" the last week or so. Boone was a disaster, and I think the team was better off without him after he left. He screwed up letting Helms go, and now that he is back, most of that magic is gone. He's not the same Helms we had in 2006. What's the answer ? I don't know, but right now this franchise is just drifting and doesn't seem to have a plan for the future. I see a Marlins team that seems to have an MO to make the maximum profit so those monies can be put towards the team's contribution for the new stadium. And if the stadium doesn't go through they will have monies saved to gird them through a move out of South Fla, and playing in a Minor League stadium for a few years. TB has a plan, and they are on target to make the playoffs and remain a contendter in a much tougher division than we play in. They have real plans for a new stadium and look to be in the much better ownership position, with an ownership that wants to win, instead of one that is more interested in a bottom line 1st, win if we can and players that "have to outperform their contracts", even though they have minimum pay contracts. It really sucks to be a Marlins fan right now. :banghead No we have a future plan but its when the new stadium opens in 2011 Skipwoth C 1b Sanchez 2bUggla SS HANLEY 3b Domiguez LF whoever CF Maybin Rf Hermida Rotation Olsen Miller JJ Volstad Nolasco Bulpen Jeff Allison Mitre De la cruz Tankersley Lindstrom Kensing Pinto Anibal Bench Mcfearson Alfredo- HOPEFULLY Then fill 2 more spot with a catcher and fielder THATS OUR FUTURE AND THE FUTURE LOOKS BRIGHT Holy sh*t i forgot put carrol in lf nd we are stacked baby they will be beasts :marlins
June 26, 200817 yr No we have a future plan but its when the new stadium opens in 2011 Skipwoth C 1b Sanchez 2bUggla SS HANLEY 3b Domiguez LF whoever CF Maybin Rf Hermida Rotation Olsen Miller JJ Volstad Nolasco Bulpen Jeff Allison Mitre De la cruz Tankersley Lindstrom Kensing Pinto Anibal Bench Mcfearson Alfredo- HOPEFULLY Then fill 2 more spot with a catcher and fielder THATS OUR FUTURE AND THE FUTURE LOOKS BRIGHT You are joking aren't you ? I am still not convinced that Ramirez is with this team past July 30th. He is a very attractive trade bait right now. He'll be even more attractive if the Braman lawsuit has legs in early July and derails the new stadium. Already one commisioner is threatening to backoff of his vote, and others may follow him. Remember the Ramierez contract isn't affecting the payroll this year, but kicks in next year. I think they move him. They are too used to the $ 20 million payrolls, and just don't care what the fans think, since there is not much of one in the 1st place. If they trade Hanely, wow, the crowds may be 5,000 instead of 6,000 per game. :whistle Uggla will be gone by July 30th next year, since his arbitration starts with 2010 I believe. They have no intentions on paying him $ 4 or 5 million a year so good-bye Danny nice to know ya. Skipworth is a 5 year projection, and if he is here by 2011, he has been rushed. I just don't see it, but you are welcome to be optimistic. My spirit has been broken these past 3 days. I hate losing 5 of 6 games to the Rays. That is just awful.
June 26, 200817 yr No we have a future plan but its when the new stadium opens in 2011 Skipwoth C 1b Sanchez 2bUggla SS HANLEY 3b Domiguez LF whoever CF Maybin Rf Hermida Rotation Olsen Miller JJ Volstad Nolasco Bulpen Jeff Allison Mitre De la cruz Tankersley Lindstrom Kensing Pinto Anibal Bench Mcfearson Alfredo- HOPEFULLY Then fill 2 more spot with a catcher and fielder THATS OUR FUTURE AND THE FUTURE LOOKS BRIGHT You are joking aren't you ? I am still not convinced that Ramirez is with this team past July 30th. He is a very attractive trade bait right now. He'll be even more attractive if the Braman lawsuit has legs in early July and derails the new stadium. Already one commisioner is threatening to backoff of his vote, and others may follow him. Remember the Ramierez contract isn't affecting the payroll this year, but kicks in next year. I think they move him. They are too used to the $ 20 million payrolls, and just don't care what the fans think, since there is not much of one in the 1st place. If they trade Hanely, wow, the crowds may be 5,000 instead of 6,000 per game. :whistle Uggla will be gone by July 30th next year, since his arbitration starts with 2010 I believe. They have no intentions on paying him $ 4 or 5 million a year so good-bye Danny nice to know ya. Skipworth is a 5 year projection, and if he is here by 2011, he has been rushed. I just don't see it, but you are welcome to be optimistic. My spirit has been broken these past 3 days. I hate losing 5 of 6 games to the Rays. That is just awful. Hey a Man Can Dream cant he if this was possible would u like to see this
June 26, 200817 yr i love it how alot of people are defending him....he sucks end of story lol veteran leadership? oh yea he is proving to be a great leader LOL
June 26, 200817 yr My main problem with Hendrickson is that he sucks at pitching and has his whole career.
June 26, 200817 yr You do realize the Rays rotation contains player aged 26, 25, 24, 24, and 24? And yet they're one of the best rotations in baseball. Smart drafting & trading, and a bit of luck. But still, an organization that did their homework. Beinfest is not looking so smart these days. Yeah...and it only took the Rays a good 10 years. Btw...how is Beinfest not looking so smart? 22 million dollar payroll, we're almost half-way through the season, and the team is still over .500. Instead of blaming Beinfest...blame the CHEAP OWNER, Jeffrey Loria...if you actually want to blame someone.
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