At a time when Bobby Valentine has begun the process of talking with teams about a possible return as a manager in Major League Baseball, sources say he is in communication with the Florida Marlins about a possible position with that team -- less than eight months after Marlins manager Fredi Gonzalez received a two-year extension.

 

Gonzalez, 45, has managed the Marlins the last two seasons after replacing Joe Girardi, and Florida has contended in both years. Gonzalez was named The Sporting News Manager of the Year in 2008. Gonzalez agreed to a two-year extension with the Marlins in spring training, and he is signed through the 2011 season.

 

However, there has been concern on the coaching staff this week after they were told that no decision has been made about whether to bring them back for 2010. Jeffrey Loria, the Marlins' owner, is meeting with club executives after the end of the regular season.

 

Valentine, 59, has managed the Texas Rangers for eight seasons and the Mets from 1996-2002, and over the last six seasons he has managed the Chiba Lotte Marines. Valentine recently returned to ESPN as a baseball analyst. He is a possible candidate for openings with both the Cleveland Indians and Washington.

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=4529494

 

Thoughts on this guy?

Not interested, but then again I'm sure the Marlins don't care what I say about it.

Bobby Valentine is a great manager, but I am against this if this was Loria's idea. The last time we had a manager he specifically sought out we ended up firing him. Loria needs to let the baseball men do their jobs.

It sounds like Valentine has been in touch with a number of teams and the Marlins fall within that group, although who knows what Gonzalez' contract says about the possibility of him going to Atlanta where his family still lives now that Cox has made his final decision on retirement after the 2010 season. I find it hard to believe though that Fredi would leave the team that gave him his first managerial chance in was it 1992 or 93, and his chance to be one of thirty managers in MLB, to manage a division competitor *and arch rival*, even with the recognition that blood is thicker than water and his family comes first.

 

Secondly, I can't see Bobby Valentine taking a job as second banana to anyone but maybe he would, again to me it's a stretch. If I were Fredi I wouldn't want Bobby second-guessing every move I made behind my back to the media after every game. One of the things that makes Valentine a great manager is his ego and I just can't see him keeping that in check long.

are you people high? He'd not be on Fredi's coaching staff, obviously he'd be a replacement for Fredi.

 

And I'd be ALL for it. A legit manager with legit credentials. By all accounts he's a great x's and o's manager. It'd give him credibility with the players. I don't think anyone could have gotten much more these last 2 years no matter who was running the ship, but it's time to turn the corner and adding a World Series experienced manager would be great. He's also a big name and would help get attention down here and around the country.

It sounds like Valentine has been in touch with a number of teams and the Marlins fall within that group, although who knows what Gonzalez' contract says about the possibility of him going to Atlanta where his family still lives now that Cox has made his final decision on retirement after the 2010 season. I find it hard to believe though that Fredi would leave the team that gave him his first managerial chance in was it 1992 or 93, and his chance to be one of thirty managers in MLB, to manage a division competitor *and arch rival*, even with the recognition that blood is thicker than water and his family comes first.

 

Secondly, I can't see Bobby Valentine taking a job as second banana to anyone but maybe he would, again to me it's a stretch. If I were Fredi I wouldn't want Bobby second-guessing every move I made behind my back to the media after every game. One of the things that makes Valentine a great manager is his ego and I just can't see him keeping that in check long.

 

 

Ummm, I think you're not reading this right. It seems as if the rumor is that Valentine would come in to manage.

It sounds like Valentine has been in touch with a number of teams and the Marlins fall within that group, although who knows what Gonzalez' contract says about the possibility of him going to Atlanta where his family still lives now that Cox has made his final decision on retirement after the 2010 season. I find it hard to believe though that Fredi would leave the team that gave him his first managerial chance in was it 1992 or 93, and his chance to be one of thirty managers in MLB, to manage a division competitor *and arch rival*, even with the recognition that blood is thicker than water and his family comes first.

 

Secondly, I can't see Bobby Valentine taking a job as second banana to anyone but maybe he would, again to me it's a stretch. If I were Fredi I wouldn't want Bobby second-guessing every move I made behind my back to the media after every game. One of the things that makes Valentine a great manager is his ego and I just can't see him keeping that in check long.

 

 

Ummm, I think you're not reading this right. It seems as if the rumor is that Valentine would come in to manage.

 

That's how I would read it as well. Valentine can get a managers job whenever he wants one. He wouldn't be coming here to coach 3rd base. My two cents: DO IT. I don't think managers make a huge difference, but Valentine is an upgrade over Fredi.

I seriously doubt that the Marlins will replace Fredi with Valentine. Don't get your hopes up.

I'm not sure he'd picked the Marlins over other teams...it depends who is interested, I guess.

Crap I was rootng for Erick to get the managerial job if they decided to let Fredi go. I wonder if being in Japan has changed the way Bobby manages and coaches. I really don't care that much who our manager is. I wonder how many wins and losses you can actually account a manger for? It's gotta be pretty low.

 

I'll always remember Valentine dressing up in the mets dug out after getting tossed.

Fredi has a 243-242 record as Marlins manager. Extremely mediocre...

maybe we can sign a few Japanese players too?

I don't really think changing the manager is the primary issue at this point.

 

From my perspective it has been the front office that has been inhibiting the success of the Marlins as of late. It wasn't Gonzalez who got nothing in return for Josh Willingham and made the decision to start Bonifacio everyday. It's not Gonzalez's fault that Volstad, West, and Miller severely underperformed this season and the Marlins had no fallbacks. It's not Gonzalez's fault that the front office doesn't buy out arbitration for certain players.

 

I am becoming increasingly dissatisfied with Loria, Beinfest, Hill, et al even ignoring the payroll issues.

I think Washington might be his only spot besides the Marlins; if they are hearing Cleveland, Washington and Florida.

 

I think John Farrel will end up in Cleveland.

Fredi has two years left on his contract and the Marlins I suspect are not going to be willing to eat any or all of that (there is no guarantee were Fredi to be replaced he would win the Braves job) to bring in Valentine to manage and you have to think Valentine knows the situation here or he wouldn't have allegedly contacted the Fish. The only way it works financially considering Valentine isn't going to work for chump change, in fact he would probably demand significantly more than Fredi, would be if he spent a season working in some capacity other than manager until the job opened up. But even then would he rather be here or Atlanta for himself or one of the other openings right now - after all a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush as the saying goes - I just don't see how the pieces fit together in a real world scenario. If you are serious about signing Valentine you need a cashflow scenario that allows you to sign JJ long term and at the same time expose yourself to the liability of paying Fredi for two years AND probably paying Valentine double what Fredi is currently making (so the net effect would be to potentially triple the cost of your manager) not to mention probably a complete rollover in coaches and Bobby bringing in his guys at much more money than the current guys are costing you.

 

The more I think about it the less sense it makes. In some ways, since Marlins dollars are moreorless finite and the need to compensate players moving from annual minimums to arbitration is real you are saying in effect to trade the signing of Valentine and his staff for literally every arbitration eligible player on the team not named Johnson, Nolasco (and Ramirez), and that would include those eligible after this season and next.

 

In the most basic terms the team, unless there is another true firesale ala 2006 the Fish can't afford JJ AND Valentine (and co.) while keeping some semblance of the team together. So you wind up rebuilding from scratch with Bobby running the show. Not a pretty or realistic picture.

I don't really think changing the manager is the primary issue at this point.

 

From my perspective it has been the front office that has been inhibiting the success of the Marlins as of late. It wasn't Gonzalez who got nothing in return for Josh Willingham and made the decision to start Bonifacio everyday. It's not Gonzalez's fault that Volstad, West, and Miller severely underperformed this season and the Marlins had no fallbacks. It's not Gonzalez's fault that the front office doesn't buy out arbitration for certain players.

 

I am becoming increasingly dissatisfied with Loria, Beinfest, Hill, et al even ignoring the payroll issues.

 

 

I agree 100%. Gonzalez did about as well as could be expecedt with the players the front-office provided him.

A few additional thoughts:

 

Last time Valentine was a manager in MLB he was fired after failing with a $95 million payroll (2002) and was being paid $2 million a year.

 

Valentine was being paid $3.9 million dollars (not yen) in Japan.

 

Valentine has signed with ESPN. The last time and it is believed this time, ESPN put in a penalty clause in his contract should he leave the network for a job in baseball.

 

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseball/2009/09/23/2009-09-23_bobby_valentine.html

 

"If he comes to ESPN, it may be under circumstances similar to those in 2003. That's when ESPN put a "protection" clause in Bobby V.'s contact.

 

Back then, ESPN suits set a precedent for hiring a manager-in-waiting. As part of the three-year offer negotiated with Valentine, network executives insisted that Valentine pay a monetary penalty if he bolted for a manager's job."

 

Since this was written it has been reported he has been signed by ESPN and one would assume with similar language. Valentine begins on October 16th.

 

The point is Bobby V. would cost a lot of money to sign, money the Marlins don't have. I still think this is like the "Ramirez is going to be traded to the Red Sox" bullsh*t where Theo calls and asks, the Marlins say no, and only the first part is reported as "Marlins talking with Red Sox about trading Hanley to Boston".

 

Then of course you have Dave Hyde diving in this morning with no facts just because it gives him a chance to bash the Marlins and Jeffrey Loria with headline "Is Loria crazy?", implying in his comments that it isn't a question of whether Loria is crazy or not, it's a matter of how crazy he is.

 

from the Sun-Sentinel:

 

"How crazy is Marlins owner Jeffrey Loria? We might find out. Fredi Gonzalez won 84 games last year and potentially 88 this year with four of the top five starters missing stars either to injury or slumps that sent them to the iminors. And he might be fired in favor of Bobby Valentine, according to an ESPN report."

 

http://weblogs.sun-sentinel.com/sports/columnists/hyde/blog/2009/10/_hyde_five_1_firsttime.html

 

Just more of the same from one the last and worst media whores in South Florida. *On the last day of the season.*

SI JonHeyman Reports: Marlins loria "dissatisfied'' missing playoffs. gonzalez in jeopardy despite 87-74. valentine "in talks''

I think loria should be more concerned with locking up JJ than considering Valentine

I don't really think changing the manager is the primary issue at this point.

 

From my perspective it has been the front office that has been inhibiting the success of the Marlins as of late. It wasn't Gonzalez who got nothing in return for Josh Willingham and made the decision to start Bonifacio everyday. It's not Gonzalez's fault that Volstad, West, and Miller severely underperformed this season and the Marlins had no fallbacks. It's not Gonzalez's fault that the front office doesn't buy out arbitration for certain players.

 

I am becoming increasingly dissatisfied with Loria, Beinfest, Hill, et al even ignoring the payroll issues.

 

 

Why the heck would you blame Beinfest? Show me another GM who could put together a team with 80+ wins and a payroll lower than 40 million. Such a person does not exist.

SI JonHeyman Reports: Marlins loria "dissatisfied'' missing playoffs. gonzalez in jeopardy despite 87-74. valentine "in talks''

 

 

Ugh I hate this team sometimes

SI JonHeyman Reports: Marlins loria "dissatisfied'' missing playoffs. gonzalez in jeopardy despite 87-74. valentine "in talks''

 

 

He wasn't reporting it, he was reporting that "sources" said it. and you did the same thing by leaving out that he was quoting "ESPN" in regards to Valentine in talks...

 

This was his tweet:

 

sources: #marlins loria "dissatisfied'' missing playoffs. gonzalez in jeopardy despite 87-74. espn: valentine "in talks''

 

then he asks Loria directly, who responds:

 

(next tweet) just asked marlins' owner loria about possible manager change: "i dont really have any comment. I dont talk about rumors.''

 

BTW, Jon Heyman who lives in Broward or PBC (I forget which) was vocally and demonstrably against the Marlins getting a new stadium and has been an advocate of moving or eliminating the franchise. It was in fact also Heyman who spread the rumor about the Marlins in discussions with the Red Sox regarding Ramirez, rumors that were ultimately dispelled by uber-sox insider Peter Gammons.

 

None of which doesn't make any of these "Fredi in trouble" stories untrue but it's worthwhile to monitor who is reporting what and how they've reported on the subject team in the past.

SI JonHeyman Reports: Marlins loria "dissatisfied'' missing playoffs. gonzalez in jeopardy despite 87-74. valentine "in talks''

 

 

The guy dishes out only $37 million in payroll and he's "dissatisfied"!?!?!? What the hell does he expect?

 

Also, if this report is accurate, I think it is obvious that Loria never wanted Gonzalez to be manager and only agreed to do so because the baseball guys told him it was the way to go. Again, I think Loria should let the baseball guys do their jobs.

SI JonHeyman Reports: Marlins loria "dissatisfied'' missing playoffs. gonzalez in jeopardy despite 87-74. valentine "in talks''

 

 

He wasn't reporting it, he was reporting that "sources" said it. and you did the same thing by leaving out that he was quoting "ESPN" in regards to Valentine in talks...

 

This was his tweet:

 

sources: #marlins loria "dissatisfied'' missing playoffs. gonzalez in jeopardy despite 87-74. espn: valentine "in talks''

 

then he asks Loria directly, who responds:

 

(next tweet) just asked marlins' owner loria about possible manager change: "i dont really have any comment. I dont talk about rumors.''

 

BTW, Jon Heyman who lives in Broward or PBC (I forget which) was vocally and demonstrably against the Marlins getting a new stadium and has been an advocate of moving or eliminating the franchise. It was in fact also Heyman who spread the rumor about the Marlins in discussions with the Red Sox regarding Ramirez, rumors that were ultimately dispelled by uber-sox insider Peter Gammons.

 

None of which doesn't make any of these "Fredi in trouble" stories untrue but it's worthwhile to monitor who is reporting what and how they've reported on the subject team in the past.

 

If Loria's response is accurate, then I think they're having talks with Valentine.

 

I am going to be sick if they fire Gonzalez. The truth is that with the team he had Gonzalez overperformed this season.

SI JonHeyman Reports: Marlins loria "dissatisfied'' missing playoffs. gonzalez in jeopardy despite 87-74. valentine "in talks''

 

 

He wasn't reporting it, he was reporting that "sources" said it. and you did the same thing by leaving out that he was quoting "ESPN" in regards to Valentine in talks...

 

This was his tweet:

 

sources: #marlins loria "dissatisfied'' missing playoffs. gonzalez in jeopardy despite 87-74. espn: valentine "in talks''

 

then he asks Loria directly, who responds:

 

(next tweet) just asked marlins' owner loria about possible manager change: "i dont really have any comment. I dont talk about rumors.''

 

BTW, Jon Heyman who lives in Broward or PBC (I forget which) was vocally and demonstrably against the Marlins getting a new stadium and has been an advocate of moving or eliminating the franchise. It was in fact also Heyman who spread the rumor about the Marlins in discussions with the Red Sox regarding Ramirez, rumors that were ultimately dispelled by uber-sox insider Peter Gammons.

 

None of which doesn't make any of these "Fredi in trouble" stories untrue but it's worthwhile to monitor who is reporting what and how they've reported on the subject team in the past.

 

Wow I didn't know that Heyman was so anti-Marlins.