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Marlins, WTF?!


hovertical
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Since we've all been throwing our thoughts out there after the recent bizarre decisions made by both the FO and Don - do we honestly believe they are doing something as drastic as trying to deliberately lose this season?  Do we want to believe the FO is refusing to make the necessary moves just to save $$$ or do we still think they just want the team to continue playing as-is and see what "sticks"?  How safe is Don's job at this point?  Eric Duncan's? 

Do we still believe in the "it's a marathon, not a sprint!"  mantra with the recent spate of moves, and/or lack thereof? 

What about the recent injuries? - seems like a week ago we were happy to have Jazz and Alfaro back and looking forward to Marte returning and being almost up to full strength and then within a stretch of what, 5 days? - feels like half the team sustains an injury of some sort? Bad luck? Poor conditioning? Guys being taken out for other reasons or just Don being weird and resting hot hitters? C.O.L.?

I'd also like to hear if anyone is onboard in general and mostly pleased with how the team has handled this season?  I promise I'm not looking for a fight - it seems we're all very unhappy these days with how the games are managed and the silent treatment from the Marlins brass so I'm genuinely interested if someone has a different take than what we see on the pre and post-game threads every day. 

 

So yeah, Marlins, WTF?!

 

Edited by hovertical
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The front office has been abysmal with the roster management. Injuries happen to every team, but other teams seem to know how to make roster moves to put a 26-man roster on the field daily. This team is happy to play two or even three men down and put a catcher in LF. Don't even get me started on the Jesus Sanchez thing. Keeping him in AAA when he was on fire and we needed offense, made zero sense.

Don Mattingly makes some really dumb decisions as well. Like yesterday he planned to have Duvall DH and Cooper play RF. Why? It also made zero sense. Why was Leon the DH when Duvall got scratched? If Alfaro got hurt, we would've had to burn the DH spot and have our pitchers hit for the remainder of the game. I just don't get Don's thinking often.

We're right in this but it feels like our manager and front office works against us sometimes.

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13 minutes ago, SonOfJack said:

The front office has been abysmal with the roster management. Injuries happen to every team, but other teams seem to know how make roster moves to put a 26-man roster on the field daily. This team is happy to play two or even three men down and put a catcher in LF. Don't even get me started on the Jesus Sanchez thing. Keeping him in AAA when he was on fire and we needed offense, made zero sense.

Don Mattingly makes some really dumb decisions as well. Like yesterday he planned to have Duvall DH and Cooper play RF. Why? It also made zero sense. Why was Leon the DH when Duvall got scratched? If Alfaro got hurt, we would've had to burn the DH spot and have our pitchers hit for the remainder of the game. I just don't get Don's thinking often.

We're right in this but it feels like our manager and front office works against us sometimes.

Do you feel then that the FO wants the team to lose this season? Or is it more that they're refusing to budge off of their 'rebuild plan' from a few years ago even though they found success early? Or is it just another cheapskate ownership group? Or do you have a different/hybrid theory?

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4 minutes ago, hovertical said:

Do you feel then that the FO wants the team to lose this season? Or is it more that they're refusing to budge off of their 'rebuild plan' from a few years ago even though they found success early? Or is it just another cheapskate ownership group? Or do you have a different/hybrid theory?

The Sanchez thing has to be about service time and therefore money. So I think that shows a bit of a problem spending money. 
 

Other than that, could be some incompetence.  I doubt they are intentionally trying to lose. 

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They are just waiting for Sixto, Bleday, Meyer and maybe J Sanchez, Burdick.

The Marlins have done a decent job finding older stopgaps like Marte, Aguilar, Cooper, Duvall, etc. to keep us competitive.

Now we just have to hold on a little bit longer before we are truly rolling.

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I have to raise another question too - I know she's been around the game a long time, and also that she likely doesn't have 100%/full autonomy, but do some of these bizarre moves and non-moves potentially have to do with Ng being a first year GM?

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18 minutes ago, rmc523 said:

I have to raise another question too - I know she's been around the game a long time, and also that she likely doesn't have 100%/full autonomy, but do some of these bizarre moves and non-moves potentially have to do with Ng being a first year GM?

I would love to know the answer to this as well. It could be possiblet that despite her street cred she does make a poor GM. No way to truly know just yet and I'm not judging this soon into the gig.

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1 hour ago, jsprt14 said:

They are just waiting for Sixto, Bleday, Meyer and maybe J Sanchez, Burdick.

The Marlins have done a decent job finding older stopgaps like Marte, Aguilar, Cooper, Duvall, etc. to keep us competitive.

Now we just have to hold on a little bit longer before we are truly rolling.

I know waiting on others to come up and keeping their service time repressed is a thing but they currently have 3 young starters NOW who SHOULD be part of the long term plans (unless they move Pablo perhaps) and that clock is already running. It'll only hurt them unless they want to flip Sandy and Pablo for more prospects and just keep the prospect cycle going and not really just commit and make a run at it. 

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25 minutes ago, hovertical said:

I would love to know the answer to this as well. It could be possiblet that despite her street cred she does make a poor GM. No way to truly know just yet and I'm not judging this soon into the gig.

Yeah, it's early in her tenure obviously, but I guess what I was getting at is - are we seeing her going through growing/learning pains on the job.

41 minutes ago, CyggyMarlin said:

I know it is hindsight, but I really feel that with better FO decisions and a better manager we would be just over .500 right now.  At least 2 or 3 games were lost based on dumb roster moves and Donnie Decisions

100% agree.

19 minutes ago, hovertical said:

I know waiting on others to come up and keeping their service time repressed is a thing but they currently have 3 young starters NOW who SHOULD be part of the long term plans (unless they move Pablo perhaps) and that clock is already running. It'll only hurt them unless they want to flip Sandy and Pablo for more prospects and just keep the prospect cycle going and not really just commit and make a run at it. 

Yeah, that part doesn't make sense either - why waste their time here?

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Just one thing I want to mention.

When I made the "It's a marathon not a sprint!" thread, I was wrote it when the Marlins were 1-5 on the season, and I noticed a few of this forum's members ready to give up on the season and were saying that the Marlins season was over, mentioning trades for Marte and Duvall and discussing 2022 after just 6 games into the new season.

So, I wrote that post, just to offer some perspective, and remind people not to give up or get so crazy after just 6 games of the year.

I wasn't writing that post to offer a strategy for the Marlins FO, which honestly, if the Marlins FO were to take advice from @SirFishFan from marlinsbaseball.com, that would be funny and sad at the same time. 😂

I know you weren't a fan of that post and you have mentioned that several times over the past few weeks, which is completely fine, I don't expect everyone (or anyone) to agree with anything I write on here. Once again, that post was more of a mindset advice for Marlins fans, not advice for how the Marlins should play or how the FO run the team, since honestly us Marlins fans don't have any control of the Marlins managerial moves, but we can not get too upset about it. 

But again, it's just my point of view. 😂

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38 minutes ago, CyggyMarlin said:

I know it is hindsight, but I really feel that with better FO decisions and a better manager we would be just over .500 right now.  At least 2 or 3 games were lost based on dumb roster moves and Donnie Decisions

How much more evidence do we need?  Does Don have to publicly pull off his mask in order for us to see that he is the culprit and is single handily sinking the ship. 

How long did it take for Bender to get the call?  I’ll tell you , way too long. Why? Because Don chose to have him in the minors and was to prideful to admit his mistake.  We had to go through a bullpen collapse before he gave the ok to Bender.  And still, Bender is below Bass in order because Don can’t be wrong. 

Same with Jazz, how Don refused to remove Dickerson from the lead-off spot because Don wanted to flex and put himself over the team. Who subs our best hitter in a 4th inning gm?  

Sanchez remains down because Don has a feverish man crush for Dickerson.  The service time plays apart in it but I’m sure Don’s pitch to the FO is, we have enough depth.  The truth behind that lie is Dickerson.

 

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11 minutes ago, FishFry said:

How much more evidence do we need?  Does Don have to publicly pull off his mask in order for us to see that he is the culprit and is single handily sinking the ship. 

How long did it take for Bender to get the call?  I’ll tell you , way too long. Why? Because Don chose to have him in the minors and was to prideful to admit his mistake.  We had to go through a bullpen collapse before he gave the ok to Bender.  And still, Bender is below Bass in order because Don can’t be wrong. 

Same with Jazz, how Don refused to remove Dickerson from the lead-off spot because Don wanted to flex and put himself over the team. Who subs our best hitter in a 4th inning gm?  

Sanchez remains down because Don has a feverish man crush for Dickerson.  The service time plays apart in it but I’m sure Don’s pitch to the FO is, we have enough depth.  The truth behind that lie is Dickerson.

 

Pretty sure Don doesn’t have much to do with who’s up and down in the minors and if he does, that’s squarely on the FO office for not having the figurative balls to control the manager. Don gains nothing from attempting to put out a losing team. I’d venture to say very easily that most of the lineup construction and instruction comes from the FO. I’m not holding Don completely unresponsible for some of the dumb in game moves but he has to work with what he’s got.

If they are worried about money,This bullshit we have a plan to win thing won’t work if you continue to push off the fans. We’ve been patient since they took over. We made the playoffs and despite ourselves this season we are still very much in it. The only way your going to start getting fans is winning. You have to show your trying to win and they are showing everyday that they don’t care. 
 

I hold it on the Marlins media for not pushing it more. Other than Mish with a few sarcastic tweets I want to hear some hard pressed questions about our abysmal roster management.  

Edited by AeroFishOne
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1 hour ago, hovertical said:

I know waiting on others to come up and keeping their service time repressed is a thing but they currently have 3 young starters NOW who SHOULD be part of the long term plans (unless they move Pablo perhaps) and that clock is already running. It'll only hurt them unless they want to flip Sandy and Pablo for more prospects and just keep the prospect cycle going and not really just commit and make a run at it. 

They should extend Sandy now. Pablo not as sure about.

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20 minutes ago, AeroFishOne said:

Pretty sure Don doesn’t have much to do with who’s up and down in the minors and if he does, that’s squarely on the FO office for not having the figurative balls to control the manager. Don gains nothing from attempting to put out a losing team. I’d venture to say very easily that most of the lineup construction and instruction comes from the FO. I’m not holding Don completely unresponsible for some of the dumb in game moves but he has to work with what he’s got.

If they are worried about money,This bullshit we have a plan to win thing won’t work if you continue to push off the fans. We’ve been patient since they took over. We made the playoffs and despite ourselves this season we are still very much in it. The only way your going to start getting fans is winning. You have to show your trying to win and they are showing everyday that they don’t care. 
 

I hold it on the Marlins media for not pushing it more. Other than Mish with a few sarcastic tweets I want to hear some hard pressed questions about our abysmal roster management.  

A lot of truth in this.  

However, when a manager pitch hits his best pitcher in a 5th inning gm, down by runs vs division rivals, then it’s hard for me to believe the FO is involved with the lineups.

PH Rogers was dumb, he could get injured for nothing, our best pitcher.  Just PH with a reliever if you must.  

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1 minute ago, FishFry said:

A lot of truth in this.  

However, when a manager pitch hits his best pitcher in a 5th inning gm, down by runs vs division rivals, then it’s hard for me to believe the FO is involved with the lineups.

PH Rogers was dumb, he could get injured for nothing, our best pitcher.  Just PH with a reliever if you must.  

True but could also be a situation where he’s showing the front office that if your not going to give me the players than I’ll go with what we got. I believe that was one of the games that we were down one or two dudes

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90% Don Mattingly, 10% front office.

 

Magneuris Sierra is on the roster because of the front office. Magneuris Sierra is an everyday player IN THE LEADOFF SPOT because of Don Mattingly. With no options left, Sierra cannot be easily demoted, and he's honestly just fine as a bench player. Has speed, plays good defense.

Isan Diaz making a major league salary is a travesty, but him being an everyday player? That's on Mattingly. I know depth is an issue now, but let Luis Marte play. He's *probably* bad, but we know Isan is *definitely* bad. Dude's entire career has been a slump. 

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23 minutes ago, SongInTheAir said:

90% Don Mattingly, 10% front office.

 

Magneuris Sierra is on the roster because of the front office. Magneuris Sierra is an everyday player IN THE LEADOFF SPOT because of Don Mattingly. With no options left, Sierra cannot be easily demoted, and he's honestly just fine as a bench player. Has speed, plays good defense.

Isan Diaz making a major league salary is a travesty, but him being an everyday player? That's on Mattingly. I know depth is an issue now, but let Luis Marte play. He's *probably* bad, but we know Isan is *definitely* bad. Dude's entire career has been a slump. 

The Isan thing isn’t on Don. 

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6 minutes ago, SongInTheAir said:

Him on the roster isn't, but him in the lineup everyday is. 

No it isn’t, it’s quite possible the front office even prefers to have Isan play every day at this point. 
 

Isan wouldn’t be playing if not for all the injuries.

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3 hours ago, SirFishFan said:

Just one thing I want to mention.

When I made the "It's a marathon not a sprint!" thread, I was wrote it when the Marlins were 1-5 on the season, and I noticed a few of this forum's members ready to give up on the season and were saying that the Marlins season was over, mentioning trades for Marte and Duvall and discussing 2022 after just 6 games into the new season.

So, I wrote that post, just to offer some perspective, and remind people not to give up or get so crazy after just 6 games of the year.

I wasn't writing that post to offer a strategy for the Marlins FO, which honestly, if the Marlins FO were to take advice from @SirFishFan from marlinsbaseball.com, that would be funny and sad at the same time. 😂

I know you weren't a fan of that post and you have mentioned that several times over the past few weeks, which is completely fine, I don't expect everyone (or anyone) to agree with anything I write on here. Once again, that post was more of a mindset advice for Marlins fans, not advice for how the Marlins should play or how the FO run the team, since honestly us Marlins fans don't have any control of the Marlins managerial moves, but we can not get too upset about it. 

But again, it's just my point of view. 😂

I had zero issues with the it's a marathon and not a sprint comment - because it's true, and still is!  I say it more tongue-in-cheek now than anything because it sounds like something the FO or Don would say for lack of moves/odd decisions. 

My main gripe was before the season started I could tell the lineup was going to have a LOT of issues putting runs across save for the occasional outburst and I didn't like that they had a pretty damn good pitching staff in place that is getting wasted.  I completely agree that it's a LOOOOOOOOOOOOOONG season!  100% bud!  But if you're in charge of a MLB team you still need to be on top of your game when it comes to making improvements that were sorely needed and calling up/sending down guys as needed which just hasn't happened all season long now which has lead to some utterly nutso lineups and starting pitchers(!) being used to PH in spots.  A game lost by poor managerial decisions counts as much in April and May as it does in July or August - likewise dropping several series due to completely ignoring team needs and leaving them shorthanded and just not putting them in best position to win is a FO failure at any point during the season.  

That's honestly kinda what I'm getting at.  I don't want you to take it like I'm upset or angry over the marathon comment.  It's just been a terribly disappointing season because one can see would it likely have been amazing so far had the FO and Don been paying attention to the team instead of just letting things ride.  There's still time. a hot 7-8 game stretch and they're once again, right back in it - but the losses are and now injuries are extremely concerning.  I guess we'll see!  I just want some freaking positive press and good fuzzies around the team again.  Last year was such a tease after suffering for so long!

 

❤️

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