musk

It all comes down to beating the teams that we should beat. San Fran? Should beat. Pittsburgh? Should beat. Washington? Should beat. Right there is 9 games and if we can take 6 out of 9 or 7 out of 9, then the Marlins will be in a good position. Its late July with plenty of games left... 869834[/snapback] Yep, Yep, and Yep. Thats why there has been so much negativity (especially from me) because we haven't been beating the teams or even the pitchers we are supposed to be beating.

So since we had a off day yesterday and its going to be a slow post day besides the usual "oh we can do it this year boys" that gets posted 89 times a day i decided to start a little short stop debate. put your marlins baias aside and look at talent and numbers. Taking money and contract status out of the equation tell me why you would/would not pick one of these short stops over alex. (if you have any that i havent listed go ahead and add them. i tried keeping the big names out of here like tejada and renteria because those are obvious choices.) Nomar R. Furcal D. Eckstien C. Izturis i like furcal. He holds the intangebles like speed, range, and a canon for an arm. hes a threat on the basepaths and a decent contact hitter. a good 2 spot hitter. But ever since 2001 alex's errors have been almost been cut in half from 26 to 16. however this year i think hes going to hit the 20 mark again. and hes 7th on the list of most errors in the bigs. he;s have an off year at the plate and you can expect around 20 errors from him a season (while getting 31 in 2003 he made up for it at the plate hitting .292 w/ 15 hrs. an average that alex could only dream of). Yeah i know this post was kind of started a couple of days ago but it wasn't given its proper respect.

Is it really that hard to understand? Are you really so attached to A.J. and Mikey that you'll ignore it? How were were buyers last year when we gave up a good starter and productive firstbaseman for a starting catcher, reliever and defensive specialist; and now this year we're sellers because we're trading a good starter for a platoon player and relievers? A.J.'s trade value has surpassed his on-field value. Coupled with slim possibility he'll resign with us, Loria/Beinfest are trying to cash in on that and add pieces to win this year. 869793[/snapback] The only thing i have to say is this: You're calling the trade of Hee Sop Choi as something that could be percieved as selling. You're laling him a "productive first baseban"? granted, he could be much worse but talk about a guy that will never live up to potential. We needed to unload this guy and get a REAL left handed batter w/ some power (thank you Delgado). I was elated when they got rid of Choi. That bum. Penny was tough to see go but you know how it goes. Other than that I agree w/ your post. Except that my love for Lowell will not let me accept the fact of trading him. But you cant ignore the economics of the game and the trade would help this financialy hog-tied club.

It would be pretty embarassing if we let the Braves win the NL East AGAIN... 869759[/snapback] no it wouldnt. the braves are an amazing franchise with possibly ONE OF the greatest manager-pitching coach combinations in the history of baseball. if they win the division they deserve it. they've had more instrumental injuries than us and were pretty much tied with us when we were 5 or 6 games back of the nats. the difference is that they've been winning games that they are supposed to and we arent. and they've done it w/ rookies as everyday players and quite possibly the most important brave (CJ) on the DL. something the marlins have yet had to do (thank god) This game is played one at a time for the season. Lets take it slowly and see what comes about. I have a "good" feeling. We are a second half team always and should put it together. We have to be close to the record of the 97 and 03 teams right now. 869814[/snapback] in '97 our record was better than this at this point in time. in '97 we were starting to play like we were supposed to coming out of the asb (not saying this team can't do the same). and buy mid-late august we were pretty much in control of the wild card. and we never saw less than 2nd place in the division. 2003 i dont remember as well (dont ask why). but i believe we started our little winning ways before the asb. i think its safe to say that out of the 3 (including 05) successful teams we've had, this season we have played the most inconsistent and worse leading up to and after the ASB.

now tied for first place w/ the braves. this hasnt happened since late may. mets now 4.5 back. amazing. marlins need to start winning now.

Whatever the variation in ability, Carl has had a breakout season, AJ hasnt. AJ has the stuff to be THE ace of any staff in baseball, but whilst Carl was here, he was consistent, something AJ has never been. Carl is a great no 3 starter, just that after last year he was expected to be an ace, which he clearly isnt. 867487[/snapback] almost totally agree. the part about carl being consistent and AJ not wa the best I thought. And yeah, AJ had the stuff to be an ace but he's a "thrower" not a "pitcher" (read La Russa's book for an explination of the 2). Carl is a pitcher. Plus, I would say its harder to throw in the AL. you dont have the pitcher hitting for an easy out so teams are built around slugging. I would say it takes a little more to make up a lineup in the NL because you have the pitcher hitting and you have to play a little more small ball.

yeah i think livan is going to blow that team up. not single handedly but he will help it a lot.

vargas goes down. olsen is a little more proven.

We are on the rise. This team is going to live up to potential very soon. I think its coming together. Great starting pitching and timely hitting=MARLINS WIN. If we can continue that through the end of the month, we are going to be very close to the top of the list. 869043[/snapback] man, your argument should mean something. but unfortunatly you are a gator fan and therefor it means nothing.

and he wants rollins money?? :thumbdown 868915[/snapback] who said he wants? we dont know that. he might want to stay in florida for less. who knows. you def dont. fact is there arent a whole hell of alot better SS out there. he might have some bad swings once in a while but noone says that when he comes through in the clutch. alex is a fantastic player. in fact he is just the type of 8th spot hitter we need. a player who is a free swinger willing to try to hit some s***ty pitches b/c he bats in front of the pitcher. in fact he has even improved on that and has drawn alot more walks and has a better on base percentage then he did last year. i think he is underrated as both and hitter and fielder. of course that is my opinion and you are welcome to disagree :hat 868935[/snapback] dude chill out. it was a harmless one liner. if it had any thought or seriousness to it it would have been much longer. and i never claim to know anything. hell i dont even know my own name sometimes. :confused

i would kill to go to that series. i went to a game last year marlins v redbirds in may. i love busch and since the cardinals are my 2nd favorite team it was win win for me.

Wallpaper Idea: On the white sox forums (soxtalk.com) they have wallpapers where it had that month's schedule and a picture of a really awesome play made as of this season. its pretty cool. heres a link: http://soxtalk.com/images/mayfinished.jpg can anyone do one of these for the marlins. i think its the best wallpaper idea ever because you get the schedule along w/ it.

and he wants rollins money? :thumbdown

i got a question, do the hammerheads play at roger dean stadium? that is one hell of a complex. i went to go see a cardinals spring training game there this past spring. however whoever designed the traffic patter for stadium exit was a complete moron and should be shot in the face repediately.

hah, nice adjetive. crush. well it sucks because i go back to school in august and september is when they are heavy in the division games at home. oh well. I'm just hoping they face the cardinals in the playoffs so i can go watch them in st louis and be the only teal wearing freak there.

I was waiting for some crap for it. thats why i prefaced it w/ "i know im going to get a lot of crap for this". my main argument is that if you relate Mr. Marlin to the most well known marlin and the face of the franchise you could argue wayne because he is probably the best known [ex]"marlin" in franchise history. We could either sit here and post "luis is mr marlin" or "jeff is mr marlin" all day long. that just gets boring.

Neither is Mr. Marlin. Jeff is close because he was the first face of the franchise. If you ask anyone outside of the Marlins market about jeff conine they will probably relate him to the marlins some how. Luis Castillo flys under the radar a lot and he did have a stint in the minors. Since Luis has been w/ the team for so long he is a close #2. I know im going to get a lot of s*** for this but I think Wayne Hyzingua is Mr. Marlin. Anyone outside of the Marlins market will always remember the fire sale and the 1997 World Series. People in south florida remember more of wayne when he owned the team than any manager, coach, or player the team has had. Wayne was the face of the franchise from 93-98. Granted you can argue that Wayne is so well known because he is a billionare and he owns the Dolphins as well. And it is easy to say any owner has had the most influential part in shaping a franchise. So I would say it is a close race between Wayne, Jeff, and Luis. Like I said, Luis flys under the radar. Jeff had 2 seperate stints but was the first star of the team. Wayne will always be remembered by all and known the best by fans, regardless if the memories are negative. No one said Mr. Marlin had to have a positive image.

dude, we're losing games regardless of reasons. no mater what losing games is always a bad situation.

Don't look now but the last time the Marlins won two in a row, they followed it by dropping four in a row. Sorry, but I had to point that out. It seems everyone on this board thinks the Marlins will suddenly start playing amazing and win the division/wildcard whenever they win, but think the season is over if they drop a couple. (especially a certain WildMarlinMan) 868710[/snapback] Yep, and the last time they won 2 in a row one game was in extra innings and their offense struggled. Trust me, I am still the most skeptic and negative person on this board. But you 15 runs in these 2 games hasn't been done in a while. I am searching for something to build hope on. And I've said multiple times that they can only lose 3 games between now and next sunday to even show a glimpse of resergence. I have to give credit where credit is due. These wins are nicee specially with all the trades winds swirling.

LeBetard's show is a complete joke and makes the whole sports radio industry look like 3rd grade entertainment. I will listen to that show for 15 minutes and may here 2 minutes of actual sports talk. His show ruins the credibility of 790 as a real sports station. They should have offered Jorge Sedano a ton of money to come and host a show on their station. Its funny to because Just 4 days ago Le Batard wrote this article supporting the marlins: NATS ARE A FLUKE AND WILL BE CAUGHT Source: DAN LE BATARD, Herald Sports Writer At the risk of becoming the fifth superhero in Fantastic Four - ladies and gentlemen, introducing Homer Man! - I still believe the Marlins are going to the playoffs. The recent stretch of stench is not who they are. They've underachieved about as much as they can and are still within a whiff of the wild card. Atlanta? No, that's not the team the Marlins will catch. Washington is.The Nationals are an aberration, a fluke, a statistical anomaly. All season, they have given up ( i cant get the whole thing because you have to pay for it on the hearld website) Oj Mcduffie's is another Joke to radio. How does 790 expect to control the sports market here if they cant even get real hosts on their shows? The only guy worth a damn on that network is Boog. Just like I think the only guy worth a damn on 560 is the guy that comes on at 7 when the marlins have a late west coast game.

I do not..DO NOT..want Rafael Furcal on this team. He is overrated defensively(very very overrated actually), and even in this year, his contract year, he is not hitting all that well. 868515[/snapback] I don't think Furcal is overratted defensively. Regardless of his fielding position. The guy's got range, speed, and a canon. But thats just my opinion. White Sox manager Ozzie Guillen remains a huge fan of Gonzalez, with whom he worked as Marlins third-base coach in 2002-03. That's one reason the Marlins have told people they expect Gonzalez to sign with the White Sox this winter. That sucks, maybe we can sign Uribe? I think that Gonzo will be one of the more persuide FA's by the Marlins. He is a team favorite and a manager favorite. Another sign of greed going over loyalty. Oh yeah Alex, the Sox fans are just like Marlins fans, arond 25-30k average. Ok, Conine will probably end his career as a Marlin. I think he would be stupid not to. But who knows these days. Enc is definetely gone. He's your typical "Its my FA year so I'm going to make sure that I hit the crap out of the ball so I get my payday" player. If Josh Beckett even TRIES to negotiate a high arbitration amount he needs to be kicked in the balls. The guy is so inconsistent and hasn't realy done a damn thing since October 2003 besides sitting on the DL. He wants money? The Marlins should let him go. Josh is a great talent and has great stuff and has the potential of being a great starter in this league. But he hasn't shown that on a consistent basis yet so he doesn't deserve that much more money. Willis and pierre should be easy to negotiate. And when cabrera's time comes up he should be pretty easy to negotiate w/. We'll see though. I think its a good article by Mike. It is something I've been thinking about for a while. I knew that Delgado's contract is going to ballon next year but I didn't know about the arbitration and Lo Duca. We all know that with baseball it is almost impossible to fall in love with teams' players because every year they change. Especially if you are a fan of a small market team like the Marlins. As long as baseball continues to ignore the obvious benifits of a salary cap I feel free agency will continue to ruin small market teams. The fact that we even got a player like Delgado (who won't be staying here much longer becaues of the $$ he makes IMO) is incredible. Our strength for the past 2-3 seasons has been young cheap pitching talent. But we can only ride that wave for so long and it seems like its about to crash on us in the next couple of years. We are one of the few remaining teams that thrives off of their farm system. How many teams out there can just call up 2 rookie AA pitchers to start games and not even skip a beat? That shows that the Marlins scouting department is incredible and their minor league coaches have to be some of the best. And it also has to be noted that the Marlins do not use their minor leaguers as trade bait as many other ball clubs (another characteristic of a smart small market team). If you look at all the small market teams in the majors (diamondbacks, devil rays, rockies are the only ones i can think of) the marlins are the best managed because of their creative use of minor leaguers.

I make these threads because games like the past 2 days help rekindle the LITTLE hope i have. The more we win the more my hope will grow. Right now I am not optimistic about the team, you're right. But these wins still make me happy and I am well aware of the talent and history of the players on this team so a little part of me still watches the games in hope that we can turn it around. I am not committed to being negative about this team. They have to prove to me they deserve my optimism and who knows, maybe after next sunday they will earn it back. lets hope!

We haven't won 2 in a row by such handsome leads in a long time. I'm still not completely optimistic but the next week of games should be very interesting. I still hold what I said, lose only 3 games from here until next sunday and we may be seeing a turnaround. :o also, the nationals just cant seem to win anymore. they are falling pretty hard pretty fast. i have a feeling by the end of this month i will have a lot comments to retract.

You know, if we're selling parts for the future and forgetting about this season and possibly next season, don't be surprised if Delgado demands a trade. He came to the Marlins, over the Mets, because he wanted to win and get into the playoffs. :plain 867254[/snapback] Agree and disagree. I agree that delgado came here to win and if we arent doing that in the next couple of years he'll want out. Disagree because he's getting his money anyways. He's coming towards the end of his career and his next stop will be an AL team as a DH. If he is traded (and im not talking about htis year) it will because we wont be able to pay him. And w/ that my posting time is up. time to go home.

yeah dude. this finally shows some maturity in photoshop. i like it a lot. especially the water effect.