Well I guess I'll throw my two cents about this trade...I don't like it. Are there better offers out there? YES!!!, but people are forgeting that for the Marlins to maximize AJ value he has to agree to sign a long term deal with the team he's going to. It appear the ONLY team he's willing to give up his free agency for is the O's, so the fish are in a tough position. I don't think keeping AJ is an opition he's become a distraction to the team(simliar to Nomar last year for Boston). So I can't really blame them if they take this deal

 

As for Lowell being included, well I think what scouts are saying about Lowell's bat speed might have truth to it. IMO though its a money move more than anything. I dont get it if they want to move Lowell, then trade him seperate from AJ. The White Sox and Twins are interested I'm sure you can get quality in return.

 

bottomline is I'm not thrilled over this trade, but I understand why there doing it.

the blue jays think they can sign him send him there for chacin, gross, batista.

How about AJ to the Rockies for Jeff Francis and Brian Fuentes lol

Lowell for Lohse is not very good. Lohse allows way too many hits (More hits than IP every year he's played). However, it is about the money- getting Lowell off the books and moving Cabs to 3rd.

 

As for AJ, Chacin is the guy I want. However, AJ will not sign a long term deal in crappy Toronto. So like Teal Shadow said, the O's are our only option. We get Penn, Julio, and Bigbie for AJ and Juan. I think we could get more than that for AJ but who knows. Would the Yanks trade us Sheff, Pavano and money? lol For Juan and AJ? Doubt it.

 

When we make the trade our team will look like this:

 

C-Lo Duca

1B-Delgado

2B-Castillo

SS-Gonzalez

3B-Cabrera

OF-Pierre

OF-Hermida

OF-Bigbie/Conine

Bench-L.Harris, D.Easley, C.Aguila, M.Treanor, Bigbie/Conine

 

SP1-Willis

SP2-Beckett

SP3-Olsen

SP4-Lohse/Valdez

SP5-Vargas/Penn

 

Bullpen- G.Mota, J.Julio, T.Jones, A.Alfonseca, J.Mecir, V.DeLosSantos, Bump/Spooney

 

One thing which would easily improve us is our pen. With Alfonseca, Spooney, and Julio- our pen would be stud. We can send Messenger, Resop, and hopefully Bump down.

How about AJ to the Rockies for Jeff Francis and Brian Fuentes lol

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Man, we've said over and over- The ONLY team AJ will sign with is Baltimore.

 

It looks like a done deal. If we dont trade him now then he will just sign with Baltimore at the end of the year. Gotta get something for him...

Lowell for Lohse is not very good. Lohse allows way too many hits (More hits than IP every year he's played). However, it is about the money- getting Lowell off the books and moving Cabs to 3rd.

 

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The Twins won't do any deal for Lowell unless the Marlins pick up some of his contract.

remember, AJ's boy(Brad Arnsberg) is in Toronto.... that in itself could keep that deal alive

SP1-Willis

SP2-Beckett

SP3-Olsen

SP4-Lohse/Valdez

SP5-Vargas/Penn

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That starting rotation is scary... to anybody but the other 29 teams in baseball!!! Olsen is a freaking rookie as well as Vargas. Valdez or Lohse, which one is the worse pitcher ? Take your pick... You don't win the division, less alone anything, with two rookies and two pitchers with a lifetime ERA over 5. PLEASE!!!

remember, AJ's boy(Brad Arnsberg) is in Toronto.... that in itself could keep that deal alive

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I was about to add that

 

Baltimore isn't the only team he'll sign with

I could see him signing with Blue Jays, O's, BoSox or yankees perhaps.

 

Maybe even the white sox could be possible. I like their deal options they are offering better then anyone but the jays

what about lowell to TB with cash for huff? One player not doing well for another possible?

Anyone who tells you Baltimore is the ONLY team he'll sign with is full of it. He wants to test the FA market after the season anyway, so clearly there are a lot of destinations he'd be fine with.

 

I can't find a single person on this board who likes this proposal.

 

I think it's probably the worst of any of the rumored deals I've read about up to this point. Beinfest can't seriously think this helps the team.

This Orioles trade looks awful. Kline and Julio aren't great, Penn isn't going to be able to pitch this year for us most likely, and Bigbie is their worst outfielder.

 

The Blue Jays trade, where we get Chacin (who can start immediately), Brandon League (can spot-start or come out of the bullpen), and Gabe Gross (future starting OFer) would be much better, IMO.

How about AJ to the Rockies for Jeff Francis and Brian Fuentes lol

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Man, we've said over and over- The ONLY team AJ will sign with is Baltimore.

 

It looks like a done deal. If we dont trade him now then he will just sign with Baltimore at the end of the year. Gotta get something for him...

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Why would you think it looks like a done deal? It's all just rumors at this point. And anyone who says the O's are the only team he'll sign with is full of it.

 

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It IS the only team who he'd sign with that has the three things Beinfest is looking for in return a young starter(Penn), bullpen help(Julio), and a cheap OFer(Bigbie). So YES its the only team, he'd give up his free agency for...remember his wife is playing an important part in this deal too.

 

Here are the teams I've heard he'd sign with the O's, Red Sox, and Yankees thats pretty much it

 

Red Sox package....???, I can tell you they have no bullpen arms, so there missing one piece to the puzzle

 

Yankees- they aren't dealing none of there young talent(ditto for the Red Sox)

 

so were back to the O's

 

the Blue Jays have Arnie thats it...yes AJ going to Toronto for Arnie? no

 

the White Sox aren't going to meet AJ contract demands with a couple of there own looking for a big pay day in the future.

 

its ashame but technically AJ has a no trade clause

It IS the only team who he'd sign with that has the three things Beinfest is looking for in return a young starter(Penn), bullpen help(Julio), and a cheap OFer(Bigbie). So YES its the only team, he'd give up his free agency for...remember his wife is playing an important part in this deal too.

 

Here are the teams I've heard he'd sign with the O's, Red Sox, and Yankees thats better much it

 

Red Sox package....???, I can tell you they have no bullpen arms, so there missing one piece to the puzzle

 

Yankees- they aren't dealing no of there young talent(ditto for the Red Sox)

 

so were back to the O's

 

the Blue Jays have Arine thats it...yes AJ going to Toronto for Arine? no

 

the White Sox aren't going to meet AJ contract demands with a couple of there own looking for a big pay day in the future.

 

its ashame but technically AJ has a no trade clause

 

 

I got to disagree with you on the Red Sox. They have bullpen arms in the minors there are close to ready like Meredith, and Declarman. They also can give us a a young OF like Murphy, or Moss.

 

I'll take Bronson Arroyo, Manny Declarman, and Brandon Moss for Burnett

I posted that on the ESPN Boston board and most fans said they will make this trade. I hope Beinfest just goes for talent and not insist on MLB ready players with little potential. Look what Dave Domborski did with Jeff Weaver and what the Mariners did with Freddy Garcia.

Hey guys. Just thought I'd chime in from Baltimore, here. Believe me when I say this trade proposal is scary on our side as well. Nobody really knows how Burnett and Lowell will transition to the AL. The O's have had some recent failures dealing with NL pitchers (Omar Daal, Mike DeJean, Steve Kline, etc.), so understandably, we're all a bit hesitant to see this happen. For all of you who haven't seen Hayden Penn, I think you'd be pleasantly surprised. He's still just 20 years old, and really held his own during his brief audition with the big club this year. The league began to catch up with him second time around though, which is why he was sent back down. But really, he has great stuff (the changeup is probably his best pitch), and a tremendous amount of poise for someone so young. I was impressed with what I saw. The only downside is he probably won't help you this season. But down the road, I believe the O's could well regret trading him away, unless A.J. gives them good production in return. As for the rest, I have a feeling Kline would be OK coming back to the NL. Remember, he was one of the most dominant lefty relievers in the entire game last year. Bigbie, well, he's still got the "potential" tag. We've been waiting for him to bust out for a full season. He usually hits at a good clip in the second half. It's the first half that's the problem, when at times he looks absolutely lost at the plate. Julio would definitely be a project. He seems to have regressed each season, even though his stuff is electric and logic would dictate that he *should* be a great reliever. Time will tell with him. Ponson, if you guys get him, then I profusely apologize. The guy's a bum, pure and simple. One good season in 2003... a contract year (surprise!), and suddenly he reverts to below-mediocrity. And that's putting it nicely. Bottom line, the jem in this deal would definitely be Penn, whom I'd hate to see go. Everybody else is kind of a mystery. If this deal does happen, I'll be crossing my fingers for the both of us.

That's all well & good TealShadow, but I'm not nearly as interested in a pitching prospect (which we are not exactly short on), as I am in getting a starter who can step into the rotation right now and help. We're getting one prospect in the deal who can't even really be counted on to do anything this season.

 

Keep in mind Alfonseca will be back soon which should give the bullpen a boost. Begbie doesn't help us much either.

Hey guys. Just thought I'd chime in from Baltimore, here. Believe me when I say this trade proposal is scary on our side as well. Nobody really knows how Burnett and Lowell will transition to the AL. The O's have had some recent failures dealing with NL pitchers (Omar Daal, Mike DeJean, Steve Kline, etc.), so understandably, we're all a bit hesitant to see this happen. For all of you who haven't seen Hayden Penn, I think you'd be pleasantly surprised. He's still just 20 years old, and really held his own during his brief audition with the big club this year. The league began to catch up with him second time around though, which is why he was sent back down. But really, he has great stuff (the changeup is probably his best pitch), and a tremendous amount of poise for someone so young. I was impressed with what I saw. The only downside is he probably won't help you this season. But down the road, I believe the O's could well regret trading him away, unless A.J. gives them good production in return. As for the rest, I have a feeling Kline would be OK coming back to the NL. Remember, he was one of the most dominant lefty relievers in the entire game last year. Bigbie, well, he's still got the "potential" tag. We've been waiting for him to bust out for a full season. He usually hits at a good clip in the second half. It's the first half that's the problem, when at times he looks absolutely lost at the plate. Julio would definitely be a project. He seems to have regressed each season, even though his stuff is electric and logic would dictate that he *should* be a great reliever. Time will tell with him. Ponson, if you guys get him, then I profusely apologize. The guy's a bum, pure and simple. One good season in 2003... a contract year (surprise!), and suddenly he reverts to below-mediocrity. And that's putting it nicely. Bottom line, the jem in this deal would definitely be Penn, whom I'd hate to see go. Everybody else is kind of a mystery. If this deal does happen, I'll be crossing my fingers for the both of us.

 

Don't compare Burnett with the likes of Daal, Kline, Mike Dejean, etc. Compare Burnett to Matt Clement. The only 2 things I like about the trade is we save money if Lowell if included and not Ponson. Penn is the other but we have alot of guys like Penn in the minors already and he has gotten hit hard in his last 3 starts in AA including yesterday. Julio has potential but makes 2.5 million already and will likely get a raise to 3 next year after arbitration and will likely be just a set-up man at best. Bigbie will I think he just sucks and is the worst OF on your team. I rather have Williangham, Aguila, Dillion out there before him. On the downside you guys are getting Lowell and his contract.

thanks for the perspective from an O's fan Adam. :thumbup

That's all well & good TealShadow, but I'm not nearly as interested in a pitching prospect (which we are not exactly short on), as I am in getting a starter who can step into the rotation right now and help. We're getting one prospect in the deal who can't even really be counted on to do anything this season.

 

Keep in mind Alfonseca will be back soon which should give the bullpen a boost. Begbie doesn't help us much either.

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I agree with all your points, which leads me back to the real reason we're most likely going to take this deal...AJ, he's driving this deal

I agree with all your points, which leads me back to the real reason we're most likely going to take this deal...AJ, he's driving this deal

 

How about Boston?

There has to be something more in their minor leagues then we can go for. If you are going to take guys not major league ready? they must have some prospects. Really compared to this deal I would rather just take our chances with what we got now and grab our two draft picks for him.

Fishfan79 Posted Today, 05:44 PM

There has to be something more in their minor leagues then we can go for. If you are going to take guys not major league ready? they must have some prospects. Really compared to this deal I would rather just take our chances with what we got now and grab our two draft picks for him.

 

they have Markakis, Loewen, Maine, and Fortenino(something like that), Finch of the top of my head. If they replaced Bigbie with Maine or Loewen I'll be okay with the trade.

Kline and Bigbie are class acts.... they are really nice guys, plus they will remember me from spring training when I worked for the Os. However, losing Lowell and Burnett and not getting Cabrera in return is pretty bad.

Another Orioles fan here. All of you who are saying that Bigbie is our worst OF couldnt be more wrong. He is our best OF, Matos is great in the field but not as good at the plate and Sosa is AWFUL. Bigbie is also very fast. Penn is only 20 and I think could be a very good pitcher, he had 6 solid starts then got hit hard in his final 2. Baseball America considers Penn to be a future top end starter. Julio scares me when he comes in, I refer to him as the fire starter lol. He doesnt usually have 1-2-3 inning he makes things interesting, but when on top of his game like early this season he is very good. Kline was really good until coming to Baltimore and isnt happy here, I think he would improve going to the NL, not sure how much though. Mike Lowell I think would be a nice addition but risky, I would prefer Encarnacion. Burnett definetly has the stuff to be a top of the line pitcher, he hasnt done it yet though and has had injury problems, and is a FA after the season. My opinion on the deal is that it is very good for the Orioles and a decent deal for the Marlins. There is no way Cabrera will be traded, he can be a dominant pitcher. Someone mentioned Melvin Mora, not sure why, Mora for Burnett wouldnt even happed let alone adding Mora in for Bigbie. Bigbie is a lefty and hits lefties well too.