Javy is flat out AWFUL! Nate R. > Javy and that is AWFUL to write! I love my Marlins but we are coming back down to earth... Probably will get "broomed" by Philly.

we're not a playoff team if vazquez and volstad are starting 40% of our games. both have been horrible, but volstad probably has a slightly better chance of getting his act together. vazquez...stick a fork in him. the back end of the rotation is holding this team back.

 

 

Both have not been horrible just one. Putting Vazquez and Volstad together is wrong. Volstad had the usually good bullpen give up all 3 of his inherited runners when probably 1 should have scored. This has not happened to Vazquez. And the normally reliable Gaby messed up a double play grounder allowing 2 "earned" runs to score. This has not happened to Vazquez. Volstads era should be around 4.6 instead of 5.7 Not great but not like Vazquez 6.88 which is almost all of his own doing. Also of his 6 starts just 1 bad pitch to Berkman (3 run home run) removed and his era is down from this 4.6 to a very respectable 3.8 .Vazquez has had many bad pitches. .Volstad is pitching much better than his era Vazquez is not. Volstads defense is stellar. Vazquez ?

Translation: "He's our guy!"

 

 

Exactly. The Marlins will cut their losses eventually with him if he keeps this up. Unfortunately he will also given a long rope to hang himself with as have past "our guys".

we're not a playoff team if vazquez and volstad are starting 40% of our games. both have been horrible, but volstad probably has a slightly better chance of getting his act together. vazquez...stick a fork in him. the back end of the rotation is holding this team back.

 

 

This.

Still waiting for your answer, Hurricane....

I really think the Marlins made a huge mistake in not looking at Vazquez's badly declining velocity from 2009-onward before making a decision. It's a big reason why he was bad last year, and still bad this year.

Obviously they "looked at" that, but they must have thought he could overcome it somehow.

Vazquez problem is his inability to locate his pitches.

Also, for all the talk of the lost velocity, there's very little talk about his lost control.

 

Obviously, it sucks to be an extreme flyball pitcher with horrible K rates, but when you start walking people that just creates a complete mess.

 

Vazquez used to have great control; unfortunately, he's lost that, as well.

I wish Vazquez would just retire and save this club 4M or so. I think it's time that he comes to terms with the fact that he's done and that he's basically taking the team's money and making it worse at the same time.

 

 

He doesn't even look upset when he has a bad inning/outing. It's like if he knows he has nothing left and this will be his last year so he is like F it I am getting my 7 Mil either way. :mad

 

I like you as a poster, but I disagree with this, I have seen his displeasure on the mound more than once (he obviously has had more displeasure than others because he hasn't been pitching well) the ball that was hit to right field that went off Stanton's glove and over the wall for a HR, he threw his hands up in the air as if to say wtf, there is one other occasion he showed displeasure on the mound to but I can't remember it.

 

Bottom line is, and this is how i will always feel when you don't have it anymore do the team a favor and retire, as a secondary Mariners fan when Griffey struggled at the beginning his last year I posted in forums hoping he would just respect the team and retire. I suppose it is harder than it sounds though, quitting a game you love so much,

 

E.g. Think of the movie "Obsessed" and combine it with Brett Favre.

He has been bad but the funny part is he still has plenty of time to turn it around and do well or just good enough to keep the Marlins in the game whenever he starts.

Remember what happened with Volstad after a trip to the minors last year, maybe Javi needs that minor league time aswell?

He has been bad but the funny part is he still has plenty of time to turn it around and do well or just good enough to keep the Marlins in the game whenever he starts.

Remember what happened with Volstad after a trip to the minors last year, maybe Javi needs that minor league time aswell?

 

 

Javy cannot be demoted to the minors without his consent and I highly doubt he would consent to that.

He has been bad but the funny part is he still has plenty of time to turn it around and do well or just good enough to keep the Marlins in the game whenever he starts.

Remember what happened with Volstad after a trip to the minors last year, maybe Javi needs that minor league time aswell?

 

 

Javy cannot be demoted to the minors without his consent and I highly doubt he would consent to that.

 

No to this, Volstad is young, Vazquez is not, what would he work on his pitch speed? He is an old vet if he doesn't have it now, he is not going to somehow regain it in the minors, imo. I am not totally against the idea that he could turn it around though, in the majors but I also said this last week. it also sounds like this is the only option Edwin is going to go with right now anyway, is letting him pitch.

The only options with Javy are:

 

a) Let him continue starting games and hope Javy Gets His Groove Back

 

b) Demote him to the bullpen to pitch in long relief if one of our relievers is sidelined with an injury

 

or

 

c) Release him

 

There really aren't any other choices.

Vazquez problem is his inability to locate his pitches.

Also, for all the talk of the lost velocity, there's very little talk about his lost control.

 

Obviously, it sucks to be an extreme flyball pitcher with horrible K rates, but when you start walking people that just creates a complete mess.

 

Vazquez used to have great control; unfortunately, he's lost that, as well.

 

Because one probably has to do with the other.

 

I'm not an expert in Vazquez's mechanics or even pitching mechanics in general, but it seems that often when a pitcher starts to lose velocity, certain adjustments are made to the stride/delivery to mitigate the consequences, which can disrupt the timing/rhythm.

 

I remember that it was reported during spring training that St. Claire found some "flaw" in Vazquez's delivery that he attempted to "correct." For all we know, he made things even worse. Vazquez's control started to go last year in New York, but has fallen off of a cliff this season.

The only options with Javy are:

 

a) Let him continue starting games and hope Javy Gets His Groove Back

 

b) Demote him to the bullpen to pitch in long relief if one of our relievers is sidelined with an injury

 

or

 

c) Release him

 

There really aren't any other choices.

 

Back in 2005 Beinfest gave Leiter 16 starts to get his act together before designated him for assignment, which was in July. I think that he was demoted to the bullpen before the trade, but he didn't pitch much in that role.

 

If Vazquez maintains his current level of performance, I think that he gets another eight or nine starts before he is DFA. At that point things become tricky because he has a full-trade clause, so then they might end up releasing him. I don't see him throwing much out of the pen.

Here's something interesting: in Vazquez's last start he did not have any strikes on a "swing and a miss." In other words, every strike he got was either a called strike or a foul ball. That is really sad.

 

Immediately after the game I looked at the Pitch FX data to check Vazquez's velocity, but I noticed this "zero" for swinging strikes and assumed that all of the data hadn't been entered into the system yet. Well, apparently this was not the case and a recent Fangraphs article confirms that Vazquez did not get one single swinging strike out of 75 pitches.

He has been bad but the funny part is he still has plenty of time to turn it around and do well or just good enough to keep the Marlins in the game whenever he starts.

Remember what happened with Volstad after a trip to the minors last year, maybe Javi needs that minor league time aswell?

 

 

Not sure why it's funny.......:|

Here's something interesting: in Vazquez's last start he did not have any strikes on a "swing and a miss." In other words, every strike he got was either a called strike or a foul ball. That is really sad.

 

Immediately after the game I looked at the Pitch FX data to check Vazquez's velocity, but I noticed this "zero" for swinging strikes and assumed that all of the data hadn't been entered into the system yet. Well, apparently this was not the case and a recent Fangraphs article confirms that Vazquez did not get one single swinging strike out of 75 pitches.

 

 

That's pretty stunning. If that doesn't scream "DFA ME NOW!" then nothing does.

He needs to become Livan basically.

Oddly enough I didn't like the Buck contract but I liked the Javy deal. Right now Buck looks pretty solid as our catcher and the pitching staff seems to be responding to him for the most part and his deal is looking better and better to me while Javy has obviously tanked and seems to be done as a pitcher. I don't like Volstad either but he's young and obviously has a lot more worth than Javy and is probably better than most of our other options (aside from Sanabia who I think is still injured?) I too would like to see Javy given the boot though as whoever comes in can literally be no worse - well they can be but really is there much difference between a 6+era and and something worse? At this point even West would probably do slightly better than Javy - it wouldn't take much! I do believe this year we will see some serious activity around the trade deadline and snag a starter off somebodies team.

I would prefer if we didn't link the 24 year old kid that needs to get his sinker to sink more with the worn out old veteran that has nothing going for him.