It all depends on the rest of the rotation. If everyone else pitches well, you can be as patient with Miller as you want and still be in contention. But at the same time, you can't have a guy learning at the major league level while sacrificing a possible run at the playoffs.

It all depends on the rest of the rotation. If everyone else pitches well, you can be as patient with Miller as you want and still be in contention. But at the same time, you can't have a guy learning at the major league level while sacrificing a possible run at the playoffs.

 

 

Amen.

 

If Sanchez comes back dealing (and his rehab assignments are going well), and JJ and Volstad are lights-out...then peace out, Miller. Go develop where you're supposed to develop.

Bad outing, but even worse the timing. We were supposed to go out with a bang and take all four games, instead we get blown out just before the ASB.

One last time before I boarded my plane this afternoon I checked how the Fish were doing.

 

1-0, off to a good start.

 

Six hours later, there's not much to say. I missed it, I saw the box score. I guess it would an understatement to say Miller didn't have his best day. I'm tempted to ask how it happened but you know a) it doesn't matter and b) I won't sleep as well if I know...

 

It would have been nice to win but you know we came back big time from the mess in Colorado. 2-3 in San Diego, 3-4 in LA. A winning record for the first half (+ a few). I'll take it.

I cant wait till Volstad has his first bad game and we get 18 threads about a demotion :banghead .. not everyone is Dontrelle Willis and can be a cy young candidate there first full year pitching..Miller has had amazing games ( see May..parts of June) he has had some god awful games too ( see his ERA) but he's better then Tucker, Hendrickson, insert journyman starter or green as grass AA, A player....let him work it out...and if he has to be moved for Sanchez and Volstad stays a stud...then send him down....but lets move him for the right reasons and when were ready..not because he has a very bad game every now and then...

I cant wait till Volstad has his first bad game and we get 18 threads about a demotion :banghead .. not everyone is Dontrelle Willis and can be a cy young candidate there first full year pitching..Miller has had amazing games ( see May..parts of June) he has had some god awful games too ( see his ERA) but he's better then Tucker, Hendrickson, insert journyman starter or green as grass AA, A player....let him work it out...and if he has to be moved for Sanchez and Volstad stays a stud...then send him down....but lets move him for the right reasons and when were ready..not because he has a very bad game every now and then...

 

...And this is exactly why I said in the other thread the Marlins could user another starting pitcher, and people thought I was crazy. You can't rely on either Miller or Volstad to help guide the team to the playoffs. They are going to struggle at times and cost key games. I am well aware there aren't very many viable alternatives. If the team is 10 games under .500, I say let the kids play and learn, but, at the moment, they actually have a chance at doing something special. You can't simply let these guys "work it out" in a possible playoff run. You do realize how much it could hurt this team, right?

 

As far as hurting people's feelings or shaking confidence.....if people get their confidence shaken over demotions, being pulled in games, etc, I really don't want players like that on my team. That is what I respect about guys like Hanley the most....always confident in their abilities.

I cant wait till Volstad has his first bad game and we get 18 threads about a demotion :banghead .. not everyone is Dontrelle Willis and can be a cy young candidate there first full year pitching..Miller has had amazing games ( see May..parts of June) he has had some god awful games too ( see his ERA) but he's better then Tucker, Hendrickson, insert journyman starter or green as grass AA, A player....let him work it out...and if he has to be moved for Sanchez and Volstad stays a stud...then send him down....but lets move him for the right reasons and when were ready..not because he has a very bad game every now and then...

 

...And this is exactly why I said in the other thread the Marlins could user another starting pitcher, and people thought I was crazy. You can't rely on either Miller or Volstad to help guide the team to the playoffs. They are going to struggle at times and cost key games. I am well aware there aren't very many viable alternatives. If the team is 10 games under .500, I say let the kids play and learn, but, at the moment, they actually have a chance at doing something special. You can't simply let these guys "work it out" in a possible playoff run. You do realize how much it could hurt this team, right?

 

As far as hurting people's feelings or shaking confidence.....if people get their confidence shaken over demotions, being pulled in games, etc, I really don't want players like that on my team. That is what I respect about guys like Hanley the most....always confident in their abilities.

 

 

I am very aware that keeping Miller up on the big club could hurt...I'm saying he'll hurt the team a lot less then Hendrickson or Tucker will. Tucker obviously isn't ready yet, his secondary pitches aren't consistent at all. Miller gets inconsistent at times with them too but keeps the team in the game 7 times out 10 normally. I think Volstad is a stud and will be a future ace...not sold on him not hurting us this year either....

 

 

The true argument here is who do we send down....Miller or Volstad....Nolasco/Olsen/JJ/Sanchez are givens....it's up to the two to battle it out...they'll prolly get 3 starts a piece before a call is made and Sanchez is back. I like Miller...I like Volstad more..but you cant judge anyone off of 1 start...after 4 starts you can better judge which move may be the better one.

Everlong204 is right. It will come down to Volstad and Miller. Hopefully Miller stays. He is the better pitcher of the 2 and deserves to stay.

I wonder how this will affect Miller psychologically, considering how he's the only one on the rotation that's struggling ... Maybe he feels left out ...

Everlong204 is right. It will come down to Volstad and Miller. Hopefully Miller stays. He is the better pitcher of the 2 and deserves to stay.

Good lord are you related to him? He screwed the pooch today and has been really inconsistent. He needs to kick it up or get kicked out of the rotation.

Let MH start some games and send Miller down. Call him up (September maybe) if he shows improvement in the minors.

 

 

Wow. This is plain silly. Almost everyone to a man on the board wanted Mark out of the rotation. You get your wish, and now that Andrew has had a few rough 1st innnings you're calling for Mark back? Good Grief.

 

No it's really not plain silly. By leaving this kid up here in the majors we're killing him.

 

Like someone already said, no one cares if MH sucks and is forever traumatized. We don't care because he has no value to us. He is essentially worthless, a quick fix type player. Miller on the other hand is a potential cornerstone piece. By leaving him up here we're killing his confidence at a pretty young age. That's why in my opinion, if he is equal to or just a little better than MH, you let MH have these starts. Send Miller down for a little bit (a place where he has never spent a significant amount of time) and let him work on some things... let him regain his confidence.

 

A healthy Anibal Sanchez makes all this much easier so i'll hope for that right now.

Everlong204 is right. It will come down to Volstad and Miller. Hopefully Miller stays. He is the better pitcher of the 2 and deserves to stay.

Good lord are you related to him? He screwed the pooch today and has been really inconsistent. He needs to kick it up or get kicked out of the rotation.

 

I'm not related to him. Yes, this start was TERRIBLE, but you cant ignore the great starts he had. And he has from now till sanchez returns to pick it up. and IMO he deserves it more to stay with the marlins than volstad does. He's been here longer and had more than one good start.

Three good starts in his last ten, He's standing next in line to Hendrickson in the what have you done for me lately line, just ahead of Ryan Tucker.

Everlong204 is right. It will come down to Volstad and Miller. Hopefully Miller stays. He is the better pitcher of the 2 and deserves to stay.

Good lord are you related to him? He screwed the pooch today and has been really inconsistent. He needs to kick it up or get kicked out of the rotation.

 

I'm not related to him. Yes, this start was TERRIBLE, but you cant ignore the great starts he had. And he has from now till sanchez returns to pick it up. and IMO he deserves it more to stay with the marlins than volstad does. He's been here longer and had more than one good start.

 

In sports, it doesn't matter what you do the first half of a season if you stink it up the second half. I'm not making any predictions here...for all we know, guys like Johnson could start having a horrible time pitching. Then what do you do? There's a LOT of questions with the pitching staff...and not a lot they can do except see how it plays out. Because you better hope that at least 2 of the 3 (Miller, Volstad, and Johnson) pitch well because you can't rely on just Nolasco and Olsen the rest of the way. A lot of people seem to think Johnson is a given to perform in the second half. I'm not so sure about that yet.

Well look on the bright side.We wouldn't have won even with a solid outing from Miller.

All Black Marlin Hat, you took my opening post for exactly for what I wanted people to take from it. Thank you for clearing it up for some on this board. I never said Miller didn't have great stuff or that they had great hits off him. The number of walks is unacceptable and if you read his facial expressions after each pitch in that first inning, it's clear he is frustrated and had no confidence in his pitches. I stated that I believe he is not ready to pitch at this level and needs time in the minors to develop. Getting shelled in the first inning of every start will not help his confidence. When Mitre comes back, this is what I believe will happen. Plus what the hell does making this point have anything to do with being a fairweather fan? Honestly, take a chill pill.

anibal sanchez threw 5.2 scoreless today...i imagine two more starts and hell be back and then miller who i do think will do very well will go down. when he can be a consistant strike thrower he will be the guy we saw in may all year

When Anibal comes back, our rotation will consist of the following:

 

Two guys coming off of major surgery

A rookie

A pitcher who has never come close to throwing 200 innings in a season, minors or majors

A pitcher who has had velocity issues this season

 

Miller may be sent down when Anibal is ready, but I hope he can work on things quickly, because we'll probably need him in the rotation again before the year is over.

Miller over Volstad?

 

What is this blasphemy?

 

Our choice is between a guy who everyone claims will be godlike but at the moment is like a kitten vs the person who's 2-0 with a .80something ERA, whom also shut down the Yankees AFTER being told he was being sent down after a powerful spring.

 

The only thing that could possibly stop Volstad now is some unknown left fielder sliding into him and tearing his ankle to pieces.

Right on. By my count, 5 have been terrible, but regardless, it hasn't been all season by any measurement.

 

I gave him a break on the game where 3 unearned runs were scored with 2 outs on 2 errors.

Miller over Volstad?

 

What is this blasphemy?

 

Our choice is between a guy who everyone claims will be godlike but at the moment is like a kitten vs the person who's 2-0 with a .80something ERA, whom also shut down the Yankees AFTER being told he was being sent down after a powerful spring.

 

The only thing that could possibly stop Volstad now is some unknown left fielder sliding into him and tearing his ankle to pieces.

 

and when volstad has his rookie struggles, your gonna start a thread saying we should release him. Please man it was one start calm down.

They won't blow his last option year for a month and a half in AA, where he'll undoubtedly dominate anyways. He's too good for AA and our AAA is useless. This is what we have to do...

I cant wait till Volstad has his first bad game and we get 18 threads about a demotion :banghead .. not everyone is Dontrelle Willis and can be a cy young candidate there first full year pitching..Miller has had amazing games ( see May..parts of June) he has had some god awful games too ( see his ERA) but he's better then Tucker, Hendrickson, insert journyman starter or green as grass AA, A player....let him work it out...and if he has to be moved for Sanchez and Volstad stays a stud...then send him down....but lets move him for the right reasons and when were ready..not because he has a very bad game every now and then...

 

Thank you. Miller has already shown flashes of dominance at this level. He's also shown some flashes of Mark Hendrickson.

But unless we have a much better pitcher to repalce him with, we might as well let him take his bumps now. Going down to the minors to dominate overmatched hitters isn't going to help him. If we send him down it had better be because we have too many good pitchers up here-not because he needs to "gain his confidence" in the minors.

I see two issues with Miller, both of which can be cured at this level or the minors ........ the first is the occasional tendency to lose his control and start walking batters ......... the 2nd is more concerning to me and that is he really seems to struggle pitching out of the stretch, his control seems to get a lot worse and it becomes kind of a snowball .......... his #s with RISP are terrible, which is why he seems to have that one bad inning syndrome

 

and that is what's so frustrating - he can be dominate for 5 innings and then give up 5 runs in the 6th inning, which makes it easy to forget how foolish he made everyone look over the first 5

 

he's shown flashes of pure dominance and I don't think rough patches have hurt his confidence at all

 

the fact right now is that he's a back end starter on this team with a young & emerging staff - if you look around the league at other #4 & #5 starters he matches up fairly well, but just differently - many teams are happy when their #5 starter goes 6 innings giving up 3 runs, leaves them in a position to win if the pen comes through ....... if the guy gives up 5 runs it's tougher

 

with miller he seems like he's either going to go out there and control the game or get rocked - he's not consistently average by any stretch - but i think if you look at the % of quality starts from him to others in his role he fits in favorably

 

besides, at this point there isn't anyone else who's ready who could/should fill his role ............ i'd like to see him walk less and work his way out of a jam every now and again ..... however, right now he's a back end starter who over 10 starts will put the team in a position to win 4-6 times

They won't blow his last option year for a month and a half in AA, where he'll undoubtedly dominate anyways. He's too good for AA and our AAA is useless. This is what we have to do...

Why not blow the option year? If we save it with the thinking being we might have to use it again next year, then maybe he's not the top pitching prospect we thought.