Btw, regarding the original topic, this has a lot more to do with the fans than the ownership.

 

All you need to know was that the Marlins were ranked 28th in attendance, at just 16,290 per game...in 2003.

 

Say what you want about Loria never showing a devotion to winning to his fans...(which I believe is wrong, considering he HAS paid for some free agents...more than past owners)...but the bottom line is, the fans haven't shown consistent interest in the franchise, either.

 

And the Marlins have been competitive even after the "so-called fire-sale" in '05.

 

 

Higher expectations = More season tickets.

 

 

2003 = World Series Champions

2003 attendance = well below average, until the playoffs began.

 

 

I can guarantee you that if we are predicted to contend for the Championship next year, we will sell way more than 5,000 season tickets.

 

 

...which proves my point b/c that's what I'd call fairweather fans.

REAL fans come win or lose.

 

Ask Cub fans if they care about "the weather." Ask Cub fans if they wouldn't love to have the 2 World Series Titles the Marlins got in a 6 year span. Then tell those same Cub fans..."thanks." B/c if not for the series with them, the attendance figures would look even more pathetic.

 

It's not a knock on us (on this board)...it's just a fact. The Marlins fanbase, in general, isn't big.

 

 

What I'm trying to say, is that if we are predicted to have a good season, which we haven't been in a while, then we would sell season tickets.

 

I dont care if a team wins the World Series, they wont sky high attendance unless they sell season tickets.

 

A perfect example would be this year's Tigers. They were predicted to be World Series Champs by many people. They turned out to be a pretty bad team.

 

Why do they still get a crowd of over 30,000 per night though? Because they already bought season tickets.

You just completely ignored the point...and basically ignored your original statement.

 

Let me get this straight...the Dodgers aren't winning b/c everyone else in the Dodger lineup (aside from Manny) has hit .264, since he got there. Yet...the Marlins would still be playoff contenders b/c everyone else besides Manny would be batting .240, since the All-Star Break. :confused

 

Makes no sense.

 

 

First of all, if you take Hermida out, who is batting .177, then the average would be higer.

 

Second of all, do you think it could have hurt us? You dont think we could have been a better team if we had aquired him?

 

Third of all, the Dodgers are 15-16 since they traded for Manny. Im pretty sure they would be somewhere around 12-19 or maybe even 11-20 if they didn't pick him up.

You just completely ignored the point...and basically ignored your original statement.

 

Let me get this straight...the Dodgers aren't winning b/c everyone else in the Dodger lineup (aside from Manny) has hit .264, since he got there. Yet...the Marlins would still be playoff contenders b/c everyone else besides Manny would be batting .240, since the All-Star Break. :confused

 

Makes no sense.

 

 

First of all, if you take Hermida out, who is batting .177, then the average would be higer.

 

Second of all, do you think it could have hurt us? You dont think we could have been a better team if we had aquired him?

 

Third of all, the Dodgers are 15-16 since they traded for Manny. Im pretty sure they would be somewhere around 12-19 or maybe even 11-20 if they didn't pick him up.

 

Obviously...it would've made us better.

Yet, as you said...you gave the Dodgers 4-5 more wins, with Manny? Well, with 4-5 more wins here...we'd STILL be in 3rd place, knowing that Manny would soon leave, if we didn't make the playoffs.

You just completely ignored the point...and basically ignored your original statement.

 

Let me get this straight...the Dodgers aren't winning b/c everyone else in the Dodger lineup (aside from Manny) has hit .264, since he got there. Yet...the Marlins would still be playoff contenders b/c everyone else besides Manny would be batting .240, since the All-Star Break. :confused

 

Makes no sense.

 

 

First of all, if you take Hermida out, who is batting .177, then the average would be higer.

 

Second of all, do you think it could have hurt us? You dont think we could have been a better team if we had aquired him?

 

Third of all, the Dodgers are 15-16 since they traded for Manny. Im pretty sure they would be somewhere around 12-19 or maybe even 11-20 if they didn't pick him up.

 

Obviously...it would've made us better.

Yet, as you said...you gave the Dodgers 4-5 more wins, with Manny? Well, with 4-5 more wins here...we'd STILL be in 3rd place, knowing that Manny would soon leave, if we didn't make the playoffs.

 

 

Three games back is way different than eight games back.

You just completely ignored the point...and basically ignored your original statement.

 

Let me get this straight...the Dodgers aren't winning b/c everyone else in the Dodger lineup (aside from Manny) has hit .264, since he got there. Yet...the Marlins would still be playoff contenders b/c everyone else besides Manny would be batting .240, since the All-Star Break. :confused

 

Makes no sense.

 

 

First of all, if you take Hermida out, who is batting .177, then the average would be higer.

 

Second of all, do you think it could have hurt us? You dont think we could have been a better team if we had aquired him?

 

Third of all, the Dodgers are 15-16 since they traded for Manny. Im pretty sure they would be somewhere around 12-19 or maybe even 11-20 if they didn't pick him up.

 

Obviously...it would've made us better.

Yet, as you said...you gave the Dodgers 4-5 more wins, with Manny? Well, with 4-5 more wins here...we'd STILL be in 3rd place, knowing that Manny would soon leave, if we didn't make the playoffs.

 

 

Three games back is way different than eight games back.

 

Erick please don't try and say we wouldn't be better without Manny, because clearly Manny makes us a better team, but I think the more important trade that we backed out of that costed us was George Sherrill and the Brian Fuentes deals, if we would've followed through with those Gregg wouldn't have blown those games and we'd still be in contention

You just completely ignored the point...and basically ignored your original statement.

 

Let me get this straight...the Dodgers aren't winning b/c everyone else in the Dodger lineup (aside from Manny) has hit .264, since he got there. Yet...the Marlins would still be playoff contenders b/c everyone else besides Manny would be batting .240, since the All-Star Break. :confused

 

Makes no sense.

 

 

First of all, if you take Hermida out, who is batting .177, then the average would be higer.

 

Second of all, do you think it could have hurt us? You dont think we could have been a better team if we had aquired him?

 

Third of all, the Dodgers are 15-16 since they traded for Manny. Im pretty sure they would be somewhere around 12-19 or maybe even 11-20 if they didn't pick him up.

 

Obviously...it would've made us better.

Yet, as you said...you gave the Dodgers 4-5 more wins, with Manny? Well, with 4-5 more wins here...we'd STILL be in 3rd place, knowing that Manny would soon leave, if we didn't make the playoffs.

 

 

Three games back is way different than eight games back.

 

Erick please don't try and say we wouldn't be better without Manny, because clearly Manny makes us a better team, but I think the more important trade that we backed out of that costed us was George Sherrill and the Brian Fuentes deals, if we would've followed through with those Gregg wouldn't have blown those games and we'd still be in contention

 

I'm not delusional. We would be better by 2, 3, maybe even 4 games had Manny been acquired. Would it have been worth it? We'll never know...actually, we probably will if the young players pan out, in the long-term here.

 

As for the Sherrill / Fuentes deals...there's a reason why they weren't traded. Asking price = too high for a reliever...

I dont want to beat a dead horse because this has been going on for a while. However, the marlins have not only the worst fan base in all of the MLB, but today probably shows that its the worst in all of sports. 600 freaking people for a game!

 

 

I love the marlins and have defended the weak crowds, but today is ridiculous. Hopefully a better location and new stadium will start to change things.

Let me just say this....

 

if this game were being played at the OB site I might have had a chance to make it...

 

 

I work/live in downtown and could have taken a halfday to catch the 3 hour game (or maybe get there a little late and take 2 hours). A lot of fans live in south dade and for me to drive to DS in the middle of the work week to just get stuck in 4:30pm traffic heading south on 95 is not worth it and I consider myself a fan of the team.

Let me just say this....

 

if this game were being played at the OB site I might have had a chance to make it...

 

 

I work/live in downtown and could have taken a halfday to catch the 3 hour game (or maybe get there a little late and take 2 hours). A lot of fans live in south dade and for me to drive to DS in the middle of the work week to just get stuck in 4:30pm traffic heading south on 95 is not worth it and I consider myself a fan of the team.

 

 

i understand man...i am actually sad they are leaving, why? because I live 10 minutes from DS. i go to at least 1 home game when they come, i love this team so much win or lose...it will hurt me to see them go cuz it will be harder to get there...i plan on going to UM 4 years from now for pre med and to play some baseball so hopefully going there won't be a problem. i might be willing to move there with the family, thats how much devotion i have for this team. hopefully they can win at least one more world series before they leave DS.....

Comparing our attendance to the Cubs is a bit unfair. Chicago has a HUGE fanbase built from over 100 years of baseball. There are two baseball teams in the city...again, HUGE market. Plus, most of the people at Cubs games aren't really baseball fans. The Cubs are more than a baseball team, they are a spectacle, they are a landmark...a huge part of Chicago.

You just completely ignored the point...and basically ignored your original statement.

 

Let me get this straight...the Dodgers aren't winning b/c everyone else in the Dodger lineup (aside from Manny) has hit .264, since he got there. Yet...the Marlins would still be playoff contenders b/c everyone else besides Manny would be batting .240, since the All-Star Break. :confused

 

Makes no sense.

 

 

First of all, if you take Hermida out, who is batting .177, then the average would be higer.

 

Second of all, do you think it could have hurt us? You dont think we could have been a better team if we had aquired him?

 

Third of all, the Dodgers are 15-16 since they traded for Manny. Im pretty sure they would be somewhere around 12-19 or maybe even 11-20 if they didn't pick him up.

 

Obviously...it would've made us better.

Yet, as you said...you gave the Dodgers 4-5 more wins, with Manny? Well, with 4-5 more wins here...we'd STILL be in 3rd place, knowing that Manny would soon leave, if we didn't make the playoffs.

 

 

Three games back is way different than eight games back.

 

Erick please don't try and say we wouldn't be better without Manny, because clearly Manny makes us a better team, but I think the more important trade that we backed out of that costed us was George Sherrill and the Brian Fuentes deals, if we would've followed through with those Gregg wouldn't have blown those games and we'd still be in contention

 

Giving up Michael Stanton (and Hermida) for 2 months of Manny would not be worth it. And considering what is going on in LA, it's debatable to suggest the Marlins would even be a better team with Manny.

I love the marlins and have defended the weak crowds, but today is ridiculous.

 

Did you not hear about the crowd of about 400 they had last year for a Nats game? Yesterday wasn't even our worst crowd ever. Anyway, pointing out the Marlins have poor attendance is like pointing out the sky is blue.

It's no shock that the Marlins have the worst fans in baseball.

No we don't. We have a small fan base, but to say that the fans they have are "the worst in baseball" is completely wrong.

 

I disagree. And not just because of this game or the Nats game last year. Yea, we have some pretty good fans that find excuses of why they have to go to the games. but for the most part our fans won't go unless it is the place to be seen. The play offs, for example. Super Saturdays is another, although not quite so much. The rest just find excuses of why they can't go to the games. But ya gotta admit, some of those excuses are pretty funny.

 

Earlier this year we had a 3 game series with the D'Backs. We had the best win/loss records in MLB at the time. That equaled crappy attendance numbers.

 

Earlier this year Jr was here looking for that big HR number. That equaled crappy attendance numbers. Of course if you talk to people now you would think there were about 100,000 at that last game.

 

Yea, school is in progress. People have to work. Day game during the heat of summer (something I have already complained about with the scheduling). But we have over 4 million people in the tri-county area and only 600 show up. I know that everybody in South Florida isn't in school or working on a Wed afternoon. And the 200 section has some pretty cheap seats that are in the shade.

 

Be emabarrassed and ashamed. But don't try to brush off what others say about our fan base. We suck. It's true. And it does make for some pretty funny commentary. But who are the ones complaining the loudest about those jokes? The ones watching the games in front of their TVs.

who cares? 11 thousand tickets were sold only 600 showed up big deal

 

I'm really surprised at that total. 5000 season tickets and not all of them are full season. But alot of tickets were "prize" tickets. A friend of mine gave me 3 tickets to this game that he had won, which I then gave to a member of this forum. (I had my own tickets already.) I would bet alot of tix were "sold" that way.

The fact that the Florida Marlins are a Mickey Mouse organization doesn't help the fan base, either.

 

You can't trade Miguel Cabrera and expect people to just come out and support the team. This fan base has been betrayed countless times, and I don't think we will see an improvement until our stars stay put. Signing Hanley is a good start, hopefully we'll see more and people will regain interest.

 

Miggy was here for that Nats game last year. And every other home game.

 

You people gotta come up with better excuses than these that are so easy to blow holes in.

 

People in other cities don't have to work or go to school during the week?

 

It was hot yes. But there was a nice breeze going (thanks Hanna) and it was not uncomfortable. And hot to us is a little different than hot to other cities. Just like cold to us is different than cold to other cities. It's what your body is used to.

The last time the management showed that they cared about winning to the fans was during the 2005 season when we signed Delgado, of course he didn't lead us to the playoffs but at least he showed us that he cared. I believe attendance was extremely high that year, all we want is for the FO to show us hope, show us they want to keep a core of players around for a while, and we will show up, i promise u

You're wrong, the attendance dropped from 26th in 2004 to 28th in 2005.

 

 

ouch, I stand corrected, thanks Rab, just showed the marlins haven't had any fans show up to the game since 97, I don't even feel a new stadium will do it. If they wanted to bring fans, they should have built the stadium where the condos are (they weren't there last year) near Panthers arena, they could've attracted Hialiah, Broward, Pompano beach and others that i can't think of currently, all of these are via the turnpike. The marlins just ran out of time and i believe settled for Hialiah, in an area that is a bad nieborhood, I feel there will not be a huge increase in attendence

The OB site is nowhere near Hialeah, it's in Little Havana.

 

And, incase you were wondering, it's a much better neighborhood than where Dolphin Stadium is.

 

Weeeellllll...... I'm still pulling for Hialeah.

 

How often do you drive through that neighborhood around Joe Robbie?? I did once or twice just to blow off some time. The last time was the first Saturday game this year. Forgot they changed the times. The area didn't look all that bad to me. It's not million dollar homes, but it looks like it's middle class with good stores around. Definetly not as bad as some try to make it out to be, or as bad as it was when the place was first built.

 

Point is that you really never do see the neighborhood all that much. At least most people don't. On and off the turnpike. At the very least the main thoroughfares around the stadium. I've been to the OB area. I prefer Joe Robbie.

Giving up Michael Stanton (and Hermida) for 2 months of Manny would not be worth it. And considering what is going on in LA, it's debatable to suggest the Marlins would even be a better team with Manny.

 

dont forget ryan tucker was mentioned to be on the pirates wish list also

Link.

Wow. I wonder if that's only full season tickets or all ticket plans.

 

 

Okay. The way it was explained to me.

 

Full season plan count as one season ticket.

2 of the 41 game plans count as one season ticket.

Any combination of the partial plans that add up to a full season equals one season ticket.

 

In other words...They take the number of games sold through the ticket plans (voucher plans included), divide by 81, and that equals how many season tickets are sold.

 

People that have been to numerous games this year have seen those things in the concession areas where they say sign up for this or that and recieve 2 free tickets to a future Marlins game. (Or something equivalent to that.) Those aren't prime tickets they are giving away. Those are tickets to games the team knows won't be big sellers, such as this game, to boost their attendance numbers.

 

Little tricks all teams use.

The last time the management showed that they cared about winning to the fans was during the 2005 season when we signed Delgado, of course he didn't lead us to the playoffs but at least he showed us that he cared. I believe attendance was extremely high that year, all we want is for the FO to show us hope, show us they want to keep a core of players around for a while, and we will show up, i promise u

You're wrong, the attendance dropped from 26th in 2004 to 28th in 2005.

 

 

ouch, I stand corrected, thanks Rab, just showed the marlins haven't had any fans show up to the game since 97, I don't even feel a new stadium will do it. If they wanted to bring fans, they should have built the stadium where the condos are (they weren't there last year) near Panthers arena, they could've attracted Hialiah, Broward, Pompano beach and others that i can't think of currently, all of these are via the turnpike. The marlins just ran out of time and i believe settled for Hialiah, in an area that is a bad nieborhood, I feel there will not be a huge increase in attendence

The OB site is nowhere near Hialeah, it's in Little Havana.

 

And, incase you were wondering, it's a much better neighborhood than where Dolphin Stadium is.

 

Weeeellllll...... I'm still pulling for Hialeah.

 

How often do you drive through that neighborhood around Joe Robbie?? I did once or twice just to blow off some time. The last time was the first Saturday game this year. Forgot they changed the times. The area didn't look all that bad to me. It's not million dollar homes, but it looks like it's middle class with good stores around. Definetly not as bad as some try to make it out to be, or as bad as it was when the place was first built.

 

Point is that you really never do see the neighborhood all that much. At least most people don't. On and off the turnpike. At the very least the main thoroughfares around the stadium. I've been to the OB area. I prefer Joe Robbie.

It's pretty dangerous around there, in Miami Gardens. The crime rate is high and shootings are a regular occurrence.

The Oin Laundry near the stadium is where I used to hang out with my crew before the games. Friendly folk around there...

The fact that the Florida Marlins are a Mickey Mouse organization doesn't help the fan base, either.

 

You can't trade Miguel Cabrera and expect people to just come out and support the team. This fan base has been betrayed countless times, and I don't think we will see an improvement until our stars stay put. Signing Hanley is a good start, hopefully we'll see more and people will regain interest.

 

Miggy was here for that Nats game last year. And every other home game.

 

You people gotta come up with better excuses than these that are so easy to blow holes in.

 

 

still, that is no way to build a fan base. when you trade your best players year after year the fans lose confidence in the ownership, and low attendance is the direct result.

Let me just say this....

 

if this game were being played at the OB site I might have had a chance to make it...

 

 

I work/live in downtown and could have taken a halfday to catch the 3 hour game (or maybe get there a little late and take 2 hours). A lot of fans live in south dade and for me to drive to DS in the middle of the work week to just get stuck in 4:30pm traffic heading south on 95 is not worth it and I consider myself a fan of the team.

 

I use to live on long island, do you know what it is like going to yankees stadium day or night for a game, try it in rush hour, i still went, you just leave earlier.

The fact that the Florida Marlins are a Mickey Mouse organization doesn't help the fan base, either.

 

You can't trade Miguel Cabrera and expect people to just come out and support the team. This fan base has been betrayed countless times, and I don't think we will see an improvement until our stars stay put. Signing Hanley is a good start, hopefully we'll see more and people will regain interest.

 

Miggy was here for that Nats game last year. And every other home game.

 

You people gotta come up with better excuses than these that are so easy to blow holes in.

 

 

still, that is no way to build a fan base. when you trade your best players year after year the fans lose confidence in the ownership, and low attendance is the direct result.

The Miggie trade was the most necessary trade in the history of the team.

Let me just say this....

 

if this game were being played at the OB site I might have had a chance to make it...

 

 

I work/live in downtown and could have taken a halfday to catch the 3 hour game (or maybe get there a little late and take 2 hours). A lot of fans live in south dade and for me to drive to DS in the middle of the work week to just get stuck in 4:30pm traffic heading south on 95 is not worth it and I consider myself a fan of the team.

 

I use to live on long island, do you know what it is like going to yankees stadium day or night for a game, try it in rush hour, i still went, you just leave earlier.

 

I never understand why people go to a sporting event when they leave early to beat the traffic, regardless of the score. I guess it makes sense if the game is a blowout, but in a close contest the most exciting part of the match is the conclusion. At footall matches over here, as soon as the clock goes to 80 minutes, then a third of the crowd, automatically gets up and leaves even if it is a draw or 1 goal between the teams.

I can't believe the attendance could be that bad at a MLB game. I think the Marlins should move out of South Florida. The fans are too lame down there and they will never generate any money. Being an out of state fan that has only watched the Marlins when they are playing in Pittsburgh, Chicago or Milwaukee, I can honestly say that there are plenty of fans out there because there are always a lot of them showing up to the out of town games.

 

If the organization has any brains, they will give up on this new stadium deal and move the franchise somewhere in the country where people actually appreciate good baseball.