3 minutes ago, TaiwanMarlins said:

 

We’ve heard that before…

4 minutes ago, TaiwanMarlins said:

 

Mish also said no way we trade Duvall to the Braves, that was fun.

If Craig says it's gonna happen, then expect the Marlins to do nothing.

KIM GET SOME HITTERS

Who the hell are they even targeting that it was worth letting Candelario go to a team on our heels?

5 minutes ago, Entendu said:

Who the hell are they even targeting that it was worth letting Candelario go to a team on our heels?

Has to be a bad defending doesn’t take BBs hits 55%gbs 2B out there somewhere 

Just read that the Marlins want Gleybar Torres but aren't willing to give up Cabrera or Garrett to get him..

Should have traded Cabrera before tonight's game..

23 minutes ago, SirFishFan said:

Just read that the Marlins want Gleybar Torres but aren't willing to give up Cabrera or Garrett to get him..

Should have traded Cabrera before tonight's game..

I would never trade Garrett for Torres. Even Ed is debatable.

1 minute ago, Valid said:

I would never trade Garrett for Torres. Even Ed is debatable.

Like, straight up?

3 minutes ago, Erick said:

Like, straight up?

Yes. Gleyber Torres is not good.

1 minute ago, Valid said:

Yes. Gleyber Torres is not good.

He would be an upgrade for us offensively and he’s only 26. 

Edward Cabrera has actually never been good, and Braxton Garrett’s ceiling…I’m not sure what it is, I would say #3 at best. 

I get the appeal of our pitching, but a 1 for 1 deal, I feel like most people would take Torres. It would be similar to when we traded Pablo for Arraez, need for need deal (that I think we ended up winning, really). 

Just now, Erick said:

He would be an upgrade for us offensively and he’s only 26. 

Edward Cabrera has actually never been good, and Braxton Garrett’s ceiling…I’m not sure what it is, I would say #3 at best. 

I get the appeal of our pitching, but a 1 for 1 deal, I feel like most people would take Torres. It would be similar to when we traded Pablo for Arraez, need for need deal (that I think we ended up winning, really). 

Tons of guys would be an upgrade for us offensively because our offense is horrendous. Doesn't mean those guys are actually any good.

Torres has been average to below average for four years now. I don't think he's just going to magically turn it around. It's not like I'm high on Cabrera at this point, but at least he still has a chance.

I also think comparing the Arraez deal to a potential Torres deal is apples to oranges because Arraez was actually really good in Minnesota. The dude won a batting title last year. Torres, on the other hand, has not been good since 2019. He is also pretty bad defensively. The Yankees are considering off-loading him for a reason.

On top of that, it's not like we have a deep starting rotation at the moment. Trading Braxton would leave a pretty big hole.

4 minutes ago, Erick said:

He would be an upgrade for us offensively and he’s only 26. 

Edward Cabrera has actually never been good, and Braxton Garrett’s ceiling…I’m not sure what it is, I would say #3 at best. 

I get the appeal of our pitching, but a 1 for 1 deal, I feel like most people would take Torres. It would be similar to when we traded Pablo for Arraez, need for need deal (that I think we ended up winning, really). 

At this point, we'd be an upgrade for this team offensively.

3 hours ago, rmc523 said:

Is there a discount for the combo, or is it one of those "combos" that doesn't really give a discount?

'discount' 😉

The entire market sucks. Idk what the heck Kim is going to do if anything. And if nothing, Candelario seemed worth it alone getting Seguras fat ass back to clubhouse spread during games. 

Torres is having a good year offensively and has shown a lot of improvement, maybe I’m looking at the wrong things. 

His K% has dropped from around 22% to 13%, which is pretty huge. 

Most of his baseball savant page is currently in the red, suggesting he’s hit into some bad luck (luck aside, he’s been an above average hitter anyway). xBA of .274, xSLG .457. That’s bad?

He’s not my #1 choice, but saying no way we should trade a pitcher for him is a bit much. 

He’s also not that terrible defensively. The overall metrics don’t paint a great picture because of his work at SS. If you stick him at 2B, he’s fine depending on the metric used. He’s been +3 DRS at 2B, -24 at SS. He absolutely should never play SS, but I’m assuming the Marlins would play him at 2B, and probably move Arraez to 1B. 

Edited August 1, 20233 yr by Erick

2 hours ago, mystikol87 said:

Good thing he's got so much credibility

Here’s a question:

Are the Marlins a better team with Cabrera gone and with Torres added on.

Or are they a better team with their current lineup and Cabrera in the rotation?

2 minutes ago, SirFishFan said:

Here’s a question:

Are the Marlins a better team with Cabrera gone and with Torres added on.

Or are they a better team with their current lineup and Cabrera in the rotation?

So we’re replacing Cooper instead of Segura? 

3 minutes ago, SirFishFan said:

Here’s a question:

Are the Marlins a better team with Cabrera gone and with Torres added on.

Or are they a better team with their current lineup and Cabrera in the rotation?

I don’t see how the answer to this question is Cabrera. 

Cabrera could definitely develop into a good SP because I like his stuff, but he’s actually a part of the problem for us right now with the lack of innings he provides. He shouldn’t even be in our rotation right now.

1 minute ago, WillyumKeef said:

So we’re replacing Cooper instead of Segura? 

Let’s replace all of them. 

15 minutes ago, Erick said:

Torres is having a good year offensively and has shown a lot of improvement, maybe I’m looking at the wrong things. 

His K% has dropped from around 22% to 13%, which is pretty huge. 

Most of his baseball savant page is currently in the red, suggesting he’s hit into some bad luck (luck aside, he’s been an above average hitter anyway). xBA of .274, xSLG .457. That’s bad?

He’s not my #1 choice, but saying no way we should trade a pitcher for him is a bit much. 

He’s also not that terrible defensively. The overall metrics don’t paint a great picture because of his work at SS. If you stick him at 2B, he’s fine depending on the metric used. He’s been +3 DRS at 2B, -24 at SS. He absolutely should never play SS, but I’m assuming the Marlins would play him at 2B, and probably move Arraez to 1B. 

He is slashing .258/.322/.426 in an incredibly hitter friendly park. Not sure how that's a good year.

We can quote his peripherals all we want, but at some point, you need to look at the actual results. It's not like this is a one-off year where he is having some bad luck; this has been the case for four years now, and for what it's worth, he actually had good luck last year (.315 BABIP) and his lifetime BABIP is .297. This year it's .265, but again, he hasn't been good since 2019.

His OPSes from 2020 through this season have been .724, .697, .761 and .748. League average OPS is what, typically between .730 and .750? So he has really been nothing better than an average hitter since his 38 homer season in 2019. And yes, his K rate is down, but his walk rate still isn't very good.

He has had two above average seasons at second base: 2021, which was an incredibly small sample size of 169 innings (and he was just barely above average) and last season. This year, he has been below average, and he was far below average in 2018 and 2019 (he didn't play there at all in 2020).

So no, he isn't very good defensively.

Trading Garrett one-for-one for him would be pretty bad because it would leave us with a pretty big hole in our rotation. Maybe I could be talked into trading Ed for him, but Garrett is a no-go for me. The Yankees themselves are starved for offense. If Torres is really any good, why would the Yankees want to trade him for a pitcher? Keep in mind: I see Torres play all the time. I'm in NJ.

I think part of the problem here is that this team is just so bad offensively that anyone who is average looks like a world-beater.

Edited August 1, 20233 yr by Valid

11 minutes ago, SirFishFan said:

Here’s a question:

Are the Marlins a better team with Cabrera gone and with Torres added on.

Or are they a better team with their current lineup and Cabrera in the rotation?

Recency bias is a thing, but I’ll take Torres vs Cabrera if that was the offer. I really hope they’d put him at 2B and then put Arraez at 3B if he’s not terrible there. Cooper >>>> Segura

This is starting to give me flashbacks of last year (I think it was last year, I don’t remember) when at the deadline the Marlins and Yanks were about to trade Pablo Lopez for Aaron Hicks.

I’m glad they didn’t go through with that trade because Arraez was a 1000x better trade for Pablo. 😂

11 minutes ago, mystikol87 said:

Recency bias is a thing, but I’ll take Torres vs Cabrera if that was the offer. I really hope they’d put him at 2B and then put Arraez at 3B if he’s not terrible there. Cooper >>>> Segura

I get it. Of course after tonight’s game most of us would trade Cabrera for Jose Salas or even a whole case of Salsa, but I mean on a big picture perspective.. even if Cabrera was pitching good.. if he were to leave the team would the whole team be better off with adding Torres to the starting lineup or worse off without having him in the starting rotation?

I would say that if Torres coming here would get Segura out of the lineup then overall it would make the Marlins a better team even if they lost Cabrera.

If acquiring Torres would still keep Segura in the lineup and maybe have Castano or Hoeing take Cabrera’s place.. it wouldn’t really be any better, even if Cabrera wasn’t pitching really good in that scenario.

Edited August 1, 20233 yr by SirFishFan