CoastieMike Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 What the fuck? Really!??? http://www.cnn.com/2016/06/12/us/orlando-shooter-omar-mateen/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 I hope all of those friends of friends end up being ok @Dr Beinfest and @Nny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Beinfest Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 What I don't understand is how did the FBI/CIA not see anything wrong with him purchasing weapons? He has been interviewed 3 times within the last 4 years for other events that occurred to see what he knew and if he was part of it. How was there not a giant red flag when he purchased the guns? Especially because he obtained them legally. How did that happen? The only way I can rationalize this is by imagining that the list of people they interview on a yearly basis is incredibly large, and that chances are they had no solid evidence to suggest he was a legitimate threat. I don't mean to suggest they didn't fuck up -- I really don't know if they did, or if they legitimately had nothing on him. But, before last night, this guy could've just been another name on a very long list. He wasn't currently under surveillance. Eventually they can't keep tracking someone if they don't have anything on him. The system isn't perfect, unfortunately. Wouldn't know a good response to better it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoastieMike Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 The only way I can rationalize this is by imagining that the list of people they interview on a yearly basis is incredibly large, and that chances are they had no solid evidence to suggest he was a legitimate threat. I don't mean to suggest they didn't fuck up -- I really don't know if they did, or if they legitimately had nothing on him. But, before last night, this guy could've just been another name on a very long list. He wasn't currently under surveillance. Eventually they can't keep tracking someone if they don't have anything on him. The system isn't perfect, unfortunately. Wouldn't know a good response to better it. I mean yeah you can't track a list of 100 names on a daily basis. But to purchase an assault rifle one day and a hand gun not to long after should draw a red flag if his name is indeed on the list. His name had to have gone through some sort of verification if everything is indicting it was obtain legally. Not to racially profile, but just as a precautionary because of prior events. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Das Texan Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 Ok, understood, so what do you think? We should stop allowing assault rifles to be sold to anyone and everyone? Yes. Allow them to only be used by military and used at licensed shooting facilities. The public cant handle them, so you take it away. There is nothing in amendment two that doesnt allow government to limit possession of certain weapons. You can still bear other types of firearms as is your Constitutional right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Beinfest Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 I mean yeah you can't track a list of 100 names on a daily basis. But to purchase an assault rifle one day and a hand gun not to long after should draw a red flag if his name is indeed on the list. His name had to have gone through some sort of verification if everything is indicting it was obtain legally. Not to racially profile, but just as a precautionary because of prior events. It's probably well over 1000. And remember, monitoring these people requires assets. Funds. Something I've taken a note of is that if a terrorist wants to make an attack, he will. Ban guns, and he'll still get a gun or weapon (see Paris and Brussels). Don't ban guns, and you get this case anyways. And the rate of cowboy saviors who kill the gunmen with their concealed weapon is tarnished by the fact that at a night club next week, a concealed carry ends up being a murder weapon due to an argument. In my opinion, control or lack thereof of weapons won't change anything. It's a combined effort of everything that's needed. Some control. Some maintained relaxation. Most importantly, intel. His name wasn't on a list. It was on a list once upon a time, but it wasn't when he bought the weapons. He was "released" from surveillance. Case closed on him. Innocent until proven guilty. If they can't prove him guilty, they have to let him go. Perhaps they need more intelligence assets. I don't know why they indeed cut him from their list as a non threat. We'd have to see the reason first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Das Texan Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 It's probably well over 1000. And remember, monitoring these people requires assets. Funds. Something I've taken a note of is that if a terrorist wants to make an attack, he will. Ban guns, and he'll still get a gun or weapon (see Paris and Brussels). Don't ban guns, and you get this case anyways. And the rate of cowboy saviors who kill the gunmen with their concealed weapon is tarnished by the fact that at a night club next week, a concealed carry ends up being a murder weapon due to an argument. In my opinion, control or lack thereof of weapons won't change anything. It's a combined effort of everything that's needed. Some control. Some maintained relaxation. Most importantly, intel. His name wasn't on a list. It was on a list once upon a time, but it wasn't when he bought the weapons. He was "released" from surveillance. Case closed on him. Innocent until proven guilty. If they can't prove him guilty, they have to let him go. Perhaps they need more intelligence assets. I don't know why they indeed cut him from their list as a non threat. We'd have to see the reason first. Short term no, because there are already so many of the assault rifles in existence. Long term, it will. Ask Canada or the UK or most of Europe (except Paris and Brussels, Brussels has shit for intelligence). Can you just ban assault rifles and then put your head in the sand? no. Can you ban assault rifles as part of a larger program that is aimed at protecting its citizens (from a government perspective) yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Beinfest Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 Short term no, because there are already so many of the assault rifles in existence. Long term, it will. Ask Canada or the UK or most of Europe (except Paris and Brussels, Brussels has shit for intelligence). Can you just ban assault rifles and then put your head in the sand? no. Can you ban assault rifles as part of a larger program that is aimed at protecting its citizens (from a government perspective) yes. Well, my point was to suggest intel is the most important thing to thwart mass shootings in specific. And also to suggest there's the false idea that gun rights or gun restrictions will stop someone from attempting one of these massacres, with or without a gun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Das Texan Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 Well, my point was to suggest intel is the most important thing to thwart mass shootings in specific. And also to suggest there's the false idea that gun rights or gun restrictions will stop someone from attempting one of these massacres, with or without a gun. Assault rifles are the common thing to EVERY mass shooting recently in this country. So you kinda fix the problem. Putting your head in the sand and just saying, well arm yourselves which is what the GOP/NRA seem to only care about solves dick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AeroFishOne Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 Certain groups like the Civil Liberties groups would be outraged if the government did everything in its power to watch those suspected. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dim Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 Spent the past few years in Orlando so I know about Pulse and the area where it all happened. Nobody that I personally know was there (although the "friend of a friend" thing applies and I have friends who are close with the LGBT community here so I'm sure I've met and talked with people affected) but the whole situation is just awful to hear about. One thing I do wish is that news stations not name the killer and give his backstory. It's horrible how after every incident the murderer gets "glamorized" while the victims are just listed as a number mostly. Obviously gun control is still a problem and a lot of work needs to be done still, but please just stop naming these poor excuses for human beings that do things like this to people they don't even know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaiwanMarlins Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 In Taiwan,only a few bad guys and police got the guns,so I really couldn't image how terrible the threaten of guns in the everywhere like America. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloridaMarlinsForever Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 I bet he was hired by the government to do this, promised money and security for his family, then they drugged him, sent him to do his mission and then killed him. All for what? Well to slowly kill free speech. Next if you say anything bad against gays you will be put on a terrorist watch list Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Vince0926 Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 I have a cousin who is gay and my immediate family don't communicate with him. In our minds he is an embarrassment because of that. But this is OUR opinion. But to each their own. Again as long as I'm left alone and vice versa I don't care. the shooter was a sick person. I don't feel bad that these people were gay but I do feel bad these were human lives. Being human is above having preferential opinions on people in general. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Vince0926 Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 Damn Vince. Geez. I don't agree with neither the gay or Muslim radical lifestyle. but human life trumps all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pollythewog Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 I don't agree with neither the gay or Muslim radical lifestyle. but human life trumps all. wut? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nny Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 You act like your family's actions have no affect on your cousin. I feel very bad that he had to go through that, and I hope he's found happiness despite his family's bigotry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Vince0926 Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 You act like your family's actions have no affect on your cousin. I feel very bad that he had to go through that, and I hope he's found happiness despite his family's bigotry My family's actions don't have any affect on him. And I'm sure he has. But whatever. As long as I keep paying my bills and being there for my immediate family that should be my top concern Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Vince0926 Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 wut? Human life is more important than the way a person chooses to live. The guy should have minded his own business and killing innocent people will not solve anything for this religions beliefs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Vince0926 Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 Let's not turn this into a Vince is a moron thread. He's demonstrated that he is plenty of times and will continue doing so in every thread he participates in. Let's try and stick to Orlando. I am a moron because of my opinions. Okay. What the hell do you know? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Vince0926 Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 Yes. Shut up seriously. Just because I don't agree with your stand doesn't mean that you're right either. My opinion is that this guy was an idiot who did horrible things. Am I wrong for thinking this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Vince0926 Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 Fuck off Vince this isn't about you. Never said it was. It's about innocent people. Are you this much of a prick in person? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Vince0926 Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 Crazy long lines to donate blood in Orlando today. Always happens after something like this. Love it. I bet you love it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Vince0926 Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 So peaceful. Quiet , you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Entendu Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 I don't agree with neither the gay or Muslim radical lifestyle. but human life trumps all. And Donald Trump will trump the radicals. Make America Great Again! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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