41 minutes ago, SilverBullet said:

And Pittsburgh is zero competition for Miami. If they really tried they would have gotten Santana. This team ain't spending shit. 

Even more hilarious is that he would have been the "big get" for them this offseason. Yep, we're gonna just keep hearing how the team was unlucky the whole time lol. Fantastic.

11 minutes ago, hovertical said:

Even more hilarious is that he would have been the "big get" for them this offseason. Yep, we're gonna just keep hearing how the team was unlucky the whole time lol. Fantastic.

You know what kills me about the unlucky thing? They CAN say that and then still add to the team and that would be the right thing to do. Saying their unlucky and doing nothing doesn't work. But admit that there were injuries but then do more to prevent against that because injuries are still gonna happen. The problem isn't the injuries, the problem is not having a plan for when the injuries come. 

1 hour ago, SilverBullet said:

You know what kills me about the unlucky thing? They CAN say that and then still add to the team and that would be the right thing to do. Saying their unlucky and doing nothing doesn't work. But admit that there were injuries but then do more to prevent against that because injuries are still gonna happen. The problem isn't the injuries, the problem is not having a plan for when the injuries come. 

Not being able to beat out Pittsburgh to get another of "their guys" is pretty hilarious though. 

That said, wtf are they still targeting trash like this?  He hasn't had a good season for a few years now.  And not only targeting a player like this but willing to burn prospects on someone like this??!  I mean I guess he hit lefties last year OK (not so the previous 2 years though) this would have been another waste of roster space imo.

The cheapness is on Brucey but crap like this is on Ng in thinking someone like this is what the Marlins need. 

30 minutes ago, hovertical said:

Not being able to beat out Pittsburgh to get another of "their guys" is pretty hilarious though. 

That said, wtf are they still targeting trash like this?  He hasn't had a good season for a few years now.  And not only targeting a player like this but willing to burn prospects on someone like this??!  I mean I guess he hit lefties last year OK (not so the previous 2 years though) this would have been another waste of roster space imo.

The cheapness is on Brucey but crap like this is on Ng in thinking someone like this is what the Marlins need. 

He's a terrible fit and they would be recreating a triple DH scenario. I don't think this is a beat out Pittsburgh scenario. He's only valuable for this team if he would take a well below market deal giving the Marlins leverage to then trade Cooper who would generate some interest given how cheap he is and he is pretty good when he's healthy.

I like the idea of a cheap 1B/OF type who can help Cooper (and sending Sanchez to AAA), but these bozos really need to identify CF first, optimistically a SS second, and then they can start luxury acquisitions to upgrade. It's very early, but hopefully they learned they need to go out and get their guys now as other teams are already doing that, and not get boxed into making a panic Soler signing late as literally no one is left because you didn't pull the trigger. We can hope.

16 minutes ago, MarlinsLou said:

He's a terrible fit and they would be recreating a triple DH scenario.

Yeah that's my opinion - why even bother wasting time (and eventually the limited money) here until the more pressing issues are fixed.

Mish says they were in on Abreu and he considered signing here and that it shows they are willing to add to the payroll.

A reminder that all of this offseason news can be viewed so differently based on how it's worded. 

How could the Marlins be in on the $60 million Jose Abreu but gain no traction on the $6 million Santana? 

5 minutes ago, SilverBullet said:

Mish says they were in on Abreu and he considered signing here and that it shows they are willing to add to the payroll.

A reminder that all of this offseason news can be viewed so differently based on how it's worded. 

How could the Marlins be in on the $60 million Jose Abreu but gain no traction on the $6 million Santana? 

Ng: "We like you Jose, would you be willing to play in Miami?"

Abreu: "Sure, make my agent an offer and I'll take a look at it"

Ng: "6 million per for 3 years"

**click**

Ng: "Jose?  Are you there? oh well, I tried"

 

That's how they can be "in on" someone like Abreu.

 

39 minutes ago, SilverBullet said:

Mish says they were in on Abreu and he considered signing here and that it shows they are willing to add to the payroll.

A reminder that all of this offseason news can be viewed so differently based on how it's worded. 

How could the Marlins be in on the $60 million Jose Abreu but gain no traction on the $6 million Santana? 

Either one of two things:

a.) They lowballed Abreu and offered him something like 3/40 or 2/30;

or

b.) They were only willing to bring on Santana if he signed for almost nothing (which is entirely understandable considering he has OPSed under .700 in each of the last three seasons; I personally think $6 million is a lot for him).

I guess both scenarios could be true, too.

Edited November 29, 20223 yr by Valid

10 hours ago, SonOfJack said:

“The Marlins, apparently reluctant to spend big in free agency, continue to explore trades for offensive help. They inquired about free agent first baseman Carlos Santana, but that gained no traction before he signed a one-year, 6.7 million deal with Pittsburgh last week.”

Read more at: https://www.miamiherald.com/sports/spt-columns-blogs/barry-jackson/article266875271.html#storylink=cpy

Why would we want to sign him anyway?  He's not good.

9 hours ago, SilverBullet said:

You know what kills me about the unlucky thing? They CAN say that and then still add to the team and that would be the right thing to do. Saying their unlucky and doing nothing doesn't work. But admit that there were injuries but then do more to prevent against that because injuries are still gonna happen. The problem isn't the injuries, the problem is not having a plan for when the injuries come. 

Right, I don't disagree that health (and some luck) played a role in the poor play, but if all they're doing is counting for a healthy roster and better luck to bring them into contention, then they're delusional. They went into the season with glaring holes, yet still expected to compete. I expected around a .500 team at best, and with health they might get around there, but that's not enough.

 

DO MORE.

Mish says they went after Abreu but didn't really try for Santana. That would be a good sign if true. 

13 minutes ago, SilverBullet said:

Mish says they went after Abreu but didn't really try for Santana. That would be a good sign if true. 

I just wonder how legitimately they pursued him. Were they even in the ballpark with their offer? Or did they offer something like 2/30 just to say "well we tried?" Not that I necessarily wanted them to go 3/60 on a guy that turns 36 in two months, but I'm just curious as to how those negotiations actually went.

21 minutes ago, Valid said:

I just wonder how legitimately they pursued him. Were they even in the ballpark with their offer? Or did they offer something like 2/30 just to say "well we tried?" Not that I necessarily wanted them to go 3/60 on a guy that turns 36 in two months, but I'm just curious as to how those negotiations actually went.

I'm wondering if that 3rd year was what really did it. Still, I don't see them offering 20mil per anyway for Abreu (and I would prefer that money get used on a freaking CF or SS anyway.

Abreu is Cuban, you know they value that here, maybe that made them try a little harder on Abreu. 

13 minutes ago, SilverBullet said:

Abreu is Cuban, you know they value that here, maybe that made them try a little harder on Abreu. 

I know that's what they value but really, he won't put any extra fans in the stands if the team sucks like last year.  Winning will bring 'em though.  Some day we'll be treated to owners who understand that.

Marlins should sign Bob Abreu as special hitting instructor.

Donnie Baseball goes to Toronto.

5 minutes ago, Bret Hart said:

Donnie Baseball goes to Toronto.

Weird fit for Donnie it seems but I can see why the Jays would want him, especially as bench coach. 

23 minutes ago, Bret Hart said:

Donnie Baseball goes to Toronto.

Donnie will reunite with Anthony Bass, Adam Cimber, Yimi Garcia, Zach Pop and Trevor Richards.

 

Yep.

1 hour ago, SirFishFan said:

Marlins should sign Bob Abreu as special hitting instructor.

I actually would not mind that at all.

Wow, I can't believe he took a bench coach job.

9 minutes ago, Entendu said:

Wow, I can't believe he took a bench coach job.

"Manager in waiting". Wouldn't shock me if he has the job mid-season if Blue Jays struggle in first half. I know they gave their guy a 3-year deal recently but he also shouldn't get too comfy IMO.

24 minutes ago, SonOfJack said:

"Manager in waiting". Wouldn't shock me if he has the job mid-season if Blue Jays struggle in first half. I know they gave their guy a 3-year deal recently but he also shouldn't get too comfy IMO.

Right, same team that fired Montoyo when the Jays were doing great. 

20 hours ago, Valid said:

I just wonder how legitimately they pursued him. Were they even in the ballpark with their offer? Or did they offer something like 2/30 just to say "well we tried?" Not that I necessarily wanted them to go 3/60 on a guy that turns 36 in two months, but I'm just curious as to how those negotiations actually went.

Yeah, how many times over the years have we heard we're "in" on a player, and then figures are revealed, and we're always 10-15M short of everyone and not close....but hey, we "tried!!".....same thing that happened with Marte....they lowballed him to death for months, and waited until the Mets backed up the Brinks truck to then put out an offer that would've gotten the deal done initially if they'd been close to it from the start.

 

20 hours ago, SilverBullet said:

Abreu is Cuban, you know they value that here, maybe that made them try a little harder on Abreu. 

I think they vastly overvalue this component of considering guys to sign.

We always hear about us in on Cuban player so-and-so.  At the end of the day, who cares where the guys are from, just get good players.  Not to bring up that "o" word that gives the OP ticks, but its the same discussion as when Kim was hired.  If you have 2 equal players, and 1 is Cuban, one is not, sure go for it.  But don't target/sign all these Cuban players just because they're from Cuba.....additionally, don't "try harder" on a player just because he's Cuban.  Try harder on ANY player you need.

Pandering to a particular demographic isn't going to do anything if the team still sucks.  Everyone wants to watch a WINNER.  Nobody wants to watch a LOSER, regardless of where you're from.

2 hours ago, rmc523 said:

Yeah, how many times over the years have we heard we're "in" on a player, and then figures are revealed, and we're always 10-15M short of everyone and not close....but hey, we "tried!!".....same thing that happened with Marte....they lowballed him to death for months, and waited until the Mets backed up the Brinks truck to then put out an offer that would've gotten the deal done initially if they'd been close to it from the start.

The whole Marte saga REALLY pissed me off. Bringing him back was a complete no-brainer and the price was also right and he could freaking play CF and anytime you can trade a guy for a premium arm and then bring him right back during the offseason it's a huge win. 

They've effed up with that TWICE now.  They could have pretty easily had BOTH JT and Marte on this team and we'd have likely been muuuuuuuuuuuuch closer to a playoff spot if not in the playoffs. But the lineup would be in much better shape overall and would even have a nice speed boost for the rule changes this upcoming season and for not much more than what they're paying the turd twins they signed last year.

 

Edit:  I am also putting most of the blame for not bringing back Marte on Kim too since they clearly had the funds to waste on Garcia they could have easily flipped that money towards bringing back Marte (who also could have been had for only a 3yr deal too instead of a 4th year if memory serves). I place the blame mostly on Ng because she apparently was focused on Abreu and, to a lesser extent, Santana apparently so she clearly has no fuckin' clue on how to eval roster needs and that extends back to previous years before her "clock started" - same shit with the piss poor roster managing in-season. That's all her.

Edited November 30, 20223 yr by hovertical

22 hours ago, hovertical said:

The whole Marte saga REALLY pissed me off. Bringing him back was a complete no-brainer and the price was also right and he could freaking play CF and anytime you can trade a guy for a premium arm and then bring him right back during the offseason it's a huge win. 

They've effed up with that TWICE now.  They could have pretty easily had BOTH JT and Marte on this team and we'd have likely been muuuuuuuuuuuuch closer to a playoff spot if not in the playoffs. But the lineup would be in much better shape overall and would even have a nice speed boost for the rule changes this upcoming season and for not much more than what they're paying the turd twins they signed last year.

 

Edit:  I am also putting most of the blame for not bringing back Marte on Kim too since they clearly had the funds to waste on Garcia they could have easily flipped that money towards bringing back Marte (who also could have been had for only a 3yr deal too instead of a 4th year if memory serves). I place the blame mostly on Ng because she apparently was focused on Abreu and, to a lesser extent, Santana apparently so she clearly has no fuckin' clue on how to eval roster needs and that extends back to previous years before her "clock started" - same shit with the piss poor roster managing in-season. That's all her.

I think he wanted a 4th year all along, and that that was also a sticking point.....but we offered him both only 3 years + way under what he was asking.  I think if we had offered 3 at close to the AAV he wanted early on in free agency, he may have re-signed and forgone the 4th year, if he truly liked being here as reported.  But instead we lowballed him throughout extension talks and free agency, and they act surprised when he signs elsewhere.  Even if we got close to the Mets number, I don't blame him for going somewhere else when we strung him along so long.  Sure, we're trying to get the best deal for the team, but you can't nickel and dime so much, as it's going to rub players the wrong way.