17 hours ago, rmc523 said:

I think he wanted a 4th year all along, and that that was also a sticking point.....but we offered him both only 3 years + way under what he was asking.  I think if we had offered 3 at close to the AAV he wanted early on in free agency, he may have re-signed and forgone the 4th year, if he truly liked being here as reported.  But instead we lowballed him throughout extension talks and free agency, and they act surprised when he signs elsewhere.  Even if we got close to the Mets number, I don't blame him for going somewhere else when we strung him along so long.  Sure, we're trying to get the best deal for the team, but you can't nickel and dime so much, as it's going to rub players the wrong way.

But the good news is, his defense radically dropped last year so if the Marlins did sign him, we'd all be pissed as they effectively signed a left fielder (with many young LF types in AAA with good enough promise for 2023) and they'd *still* need a center fielder (or two)... as well as some infield upgrades (SS, maybe 1B, etc.). He certainly can still hit though and if it's an A or B choice, I think we'd all prefer Marte in LF versus Garcia in RF and Soler DH for roughly the same dollars, but that's just choosing the best of bad decisions. It's just still the right decision to pass on Marte, even if they made what it looks like an even worse decision with Garcia/Soler.

End of the day, I think we're past the point of rehashing all the failures. These bozos need to get a CF and SS, and their SP is so insanely valuable in a world Zach Eflin gets 3/$40 from the Rays (the Rays!!!), one of them should net something good if not awesome and they have payroll/other smaller trade assets (namely Salas/Cappe/Watson) to get something done.

Also speaking of nickel and diming, I just noticed Cabrera and Garrett each have 168 days of service time. Say what you will about tinkering with service time, but effectively on paper that's great for the organization to maintain 6 full years of control with them (even if both Super 2s). This is no coincidence they didn't get 1 more start to get them that full year of control. They are fucking loaded here: 6+ (Cabrera, Garret, Eury, Eder, Meyer, Fulton, Sixto), 5 (Sandy), 4 (Rogers, Luzardo), and 2 (Pablo). CF and SS (and/or radical 1B upgrade) or bust.

 

Marlins GM Kim Ng has "checked in" to a hotel for the winter meetings.

 

[Wait do those even happen anymore?]

I think "checked in on" is an Ng term for butt dialing their agent

 

Contreras would be interesting. They could probably play him 50/50 at C and 1B/DH. That would solve the whole, whose going to spell Cooper 40+ games at 1B issue, and give him another 20+ at DH so he's at 140 game starter or so. Houston is thinking of playing him in LF so opens some possibilities. 

Of course then who is still playing CF and is SS being upgraded? Contreras is going to be expensive so how much is Bruce spending? Seems like a move you make if payroll is $110-120m and not under $90m. Guess we'll see.

2 minutes ago, SonOfJack said:

 

I mean insert any of the four SS and Nimmo here

3 hours ago, MarlinsLou said:

But the good news is, his defense radically dropped last year so if the Marlins did sign him, we'd all be pissed as they effectively signed a left fielder (with many young LF types in AAA with good enough promise for 2023) and they'd *still* need a center fielder (or two)... as well as some infield upgrades (SS, maybe 1B, etc.). He certainly can still hit though and if it's an A or B choice, I think we'd all prefer Marte in LF versus Garcia in RF and Soler DH for roughly the same dollars, but that's just choosing the best of bad decisions. It's just still the right decision to pass on Marte, even if they made what it looks like an even worse decision with Garcia/Soler.

End of the day, I think we're past the point of rehashing all the failures. These bozos need to get a CF and SS, and their SP is so insanely valuable in a world Zach Eflin gets 3/$40 from the Rays (the Rays!!!), one of them should net something good if not awesome and they have payroll/other smaller trade assets (namely Salas/Cappe/Watson) to get something done.

Also speaking of nickel and diming, I just noticed Cabrera and Garrett each have 168 days of service time. Say what you will about tinkering with service time, but effectively on paper that's great for the organization to maintain 6 full years of control with them (even if both Super 2s). This is no coincidence they didn't get 1 more start to get them that full year of control. They are fucking loaded here: 6+ (Cabrera, Garret, Eury, Eder, Meyer, Fulton, Sixto), 5 (Sandy), 4 (Rogers, Luzardo), and 2 (Pablo). CF and SS (and/or radical 1B upgrade) or bust.

Right, Marte wasn't specifically the point, it was more an example of how they're "in" on a guy, but not really "in it to win it".  Which I get, you want to sign the guy at your price, or as close to it as you can, but there's also the "we tried (but not really)" approach that we always seem to take.

27 minutes ago, SonOfJack said:

 

If you really think about it this is so obvious for so many reasons but apparently Bruce Sherman is the only one who doesn't see it. 

Also, at what point does he make that big signing to "prove" that he's serious about winning? This should be that signing. And it's also likely a safer bet than many others such as Pujols in 2012.

39 minutes ago, SonOfJack said:

 

Morosi should be our GM because he's thinking exactly the right thing here but holy crap Harold Reynolds flat out laughed at this suggestion. Shows you what people think of the Marlins. Sherman should hear this clip and sign the guy just to stick it to Harold.

1 hour ago, SilverBullet said:

Morosi should be our GM because he's thinking exactly the right thing here but holy crap Harold Reynolds flat out laughed at this suggestion. Shows you what people think of the Marlins. Sherman should hear this clip and sign the guy just to stick it to Harold.

maybe Jeter could speak up again and say "see, that's why i peaced out" and force another "i'll show you" signing like last year.  Problem is the Marlins would probably spend it on trash again.

Is Kim monitoring the situation with Xander?

24 minutes ago, SonOfJack said:

Is Kim monitoring the situation with Xander?

she's checked out.......errrrr i mean checked in

36 minutes ago, SonOfJack said:

Is Kim monitoring the situation with Xander?

She's just waiting on them to call.

2 hours ago, SilverBullet said:

If you really think about it this is so obvious for so many reasons but apparently Bruce Sherman is the only one who doesn't see it. 

Also, at what point does he make that big signing to "prove" that he's serious about winning? This should be that signing. And it's also likely a safer bet than many others such as Pujols in 2012.

I mean, it was painfully obvious we needed a CF last year too, and should've done the big signing move last year (Correa) or the year before (JT) too, but as you said, apparently Bruce doesn't see it.

3 hours ago, rmc523 said:

Right, Marte wasn't specifically the point, it was more an example of how they're "in" on a guy, but not really "in it to win it".  Which I get, you want to sign the guy at your price, or as close to it as you can, but there's also the "we tried (but not really)" approach that we always seem to take.

This is my issue, as well. I actually didn't want them to go four years on Marte. I think by Year 3, that's going to be a pretty bad deal (or at best a mediocre one). But how many times are we going to hear "Marlins are interested in Player X" followed by "we made an offer to Player X, but he chose to go elsewhere?" If they are really making competitive offers all the time, at some point, they would land someone. So where are the results?

I have long been one of the biggest optimists on this forum, but it's getting to a point where it's hard to believe anything that comes out of the FO's mouths anymore.

1 minute ago, Valid said:

 

I have long been one of the biggest optimists on this forum, but it's getting to a point where it's hard to believe anything that comes out of the FO's mouths anymore.

49 minutes ago, Valid said:

If they are really making competitive offers all the time

They aren't

This team is tits

42 minutes ago, Entendu said:

This team is tits

But i like tits. So now I'm torn. 

20 hours ago, Valid said:

This is my issue, as well. I actually didn't want them to go four years on Marte. I think by Year 3, that's going to be a pretty bad deal (or at best a mediocre one). But how many times are we going to hear "Marlins are interested in Player X" followed by "we made an offer to Player X, but he chose to go elsewhere?" If they are really making competitive offers all the time, at some point, they would land someone. So where are the results?

I have long been one of the biggest optimists on this forum, but it's getting to a point where it's hard to believe anything that comes out of the FO's mouths anymore.

Yes. When the Rays are signing their star prospects for $200m, giving middle rotation starters $40m, and baseball press is saying they are very much in on Nimmo (same press does not suggest same for Marlins), Bruce needs to look in the mirror and asses what he is trying to do here. As it's not running a business or developing a fan base with how this team is being operated. 

He gets till spring training, but it sure would be nice for them to make that "Werth" acquisition now to set the entire offseason tone. That will help everything. Future negotiations with players on the fence of talking to Miami, potential buyouts (Luzardo?) as the young guys will see the team is legitimately trying to win, ticketing office and social media needs *anything* to help them, etc. It's time to operate as the 25th poorest team instead of 28th-30th poorest. This is not a large ask after years of effectively doing nothing and if he won't do it to try and create a 3-4 year window around Sandy and Jazz, he should sell the team to someone who will.

Never gonna happen.  I expect a very quiet offseason with little to no improvement.

When this fucking asshole sells the team, MLB should get involved and make sure it's sold to someone who FINALLY has money.

 

C'mon Kim.

3 minutes ago, Entendu said:

When this fucking asshole sells the team, MLB should get involved and make sure it's sold to someone who FINALLY has money.

They won't care.