The front office has absolutely failed this team

[Admin]

But as I said already, Gaby and Morrison weren't ready to take over for him. That's why they shoehorned Cantu into first. They didn't have a real first baseman in-house to take over in 2009, which shows that they pretty much had seen enough. And I don't even see how McPherson's name could be dropped here. Clearly the Marlins FO saw nothing in him and didn't even consider giving him a starting job (or any other team for that matter). It was only a fringe minority of people here who thought he was going to become anything. Not to mention that I don't even think he played baseball in 2009 due to injury. He wasn't an in-house option for anyone.

[FutureGM]

So can someone explain to me why two players with previous MLB starting experience (Sean West and RVH) were left to rot while we threw some kid in the fire when we're still in contention? Also, why was Nate Robertson allowed to stick with the team longer than Volstad? Volstad's numbers were better than Nate's.

[BafflingBeerman]

So can someone explain to me why two players with previous MLB starting experience (Sean West and RVH) were left to rot while we threw some kid in the fire when we're still in contention? Also, why was Nate Robertson allowed to stick with the team longer than Volstad? Volstad's numbers were better than Nate's.

 

 

Isn't West coming back from injury? He may be having some solid starts, but you don't want to rush him back and up when he is still young.

[EricWiener]

What we needed to do this past off season and didn't, is what we need to do this off season: pay for bullpen guys.

 

The team is spending $50m+ for a team with no shot. Because the bullpen is total crap.

[BroncoBob27]

What we needed to do this past off season and didn't, is what we need to do this off season: pay for bullpen guys.

 

The team is spending $50m+ for a team with no shot. Because the bullpen is total crap.

 

 

Opening Day payroll was just a tad under $47.5 mil. With the way season ticket sales have been going, I fully expect payroll to rise to above $55 mil next season, despite what all the "experts" will be saying when Oct/Nov rolls around. With all but a couple of position players gone next season that leaves $$$ to spend on pitching.

 

The pen has been a let down this year. But so has the offensive and defensive play of a number of our players. Our SPs could go deeper and our pen would look alot better if we weren't giving teams 4 or 5 outs an inning. Not to mention having a hitting coach for the past few seasons that thought it a good idea to consistently lead MLB in K's.

 

Read comments from Beinfest and the FO on how they are going about building a team going into the new pond, including 2011. There's really not much reading between the lines required.

[TrustN61]

The team as a whole really hasn't been that good this year. Yes, Uggla is finally heating up, CC came back to his old self after a sluggish start, and Gaby has played well. JJ has been great and Ricky has at times. But this is no playoff team. They just aren't. Yes, the bullpen has struggled but blame it on the FO? This makes no sense. They are working with a payroll. Honestly, I wonder how much of this bullpen talk would matter if Hanley was having a better year. Once again, like beating a dead horse, the FO is working with minimal payroll. What do you expect?? The depth of the YANKEES??!?! I question whether you are a real fan if you think this FO has "failed" us. We could be the Pirates or Royals. Then you'd have something to bitch about.

[HitDaCycle]

The bottom line is that the Marlins will always be one of the cheapest teams in baseball and we will always see this mediocrity. I'm sure next year there will be some major changes or maybe just minor but honestly, I don't expect much changes in the end. Maybe some day in the future, but not right now. I'm looking forward to seeing what happens with the new stadium, to see if this actually has any real effect on the team, but I doubt it. So I'm going to continue rooting for the underdogs as I've always have. I'm going to keep supporting the Marlins and watching the games. And most likely, keep developing an ulcer because of it. I rather not expect too much out of them because, let's face it, our division is pretty tough. By not expecting too much, I hope that I can be surprised as I was in 2003 and in 1997.

 

As of last night, the marlins did something we had hoped they'd do..score runs. They came back from a big hole and tied it. Unfortunately, we lost in the end (let's face it we aren't great at close/tied games) but that could've happened to any team really. That's one of the advantages of being the home team. So unfortunately, after all the walkoffs the Marlins were apart last week, we were at the brunt of one last night. It happens. Sanabia looked awful, yes but he has been pretty good his last few starts...overall, it was a tough loss but I've seen worse losses. How about getting beat 10-0 for example? At least we tried and came very close to winning.

 

In any case, I don't expect much from the Marlins' FO. I just hope next year's a better year. We have Stanton and Logan now and hopefully this will make us a bit better in the coming years. Stanton needs to stop striking out so much, I'm really hoping he will eventually adjust and get better. Logan looked good last night and that's a good indication of what's to come. And Donnie Murphy still continues to surprise me. Coming off the bench (let's face it, pinch hitting and being a bench-player is tough especially for a rookie) and able to contribute like he has done so far is pretty good. Now if Hanley can get out of his slump already...we will be a much better team! 2011 will be interesting.

[rgkeller]

What we needed to do this past off season and didn't, is what we need to do this off season: pay for bullpen guys.

 

The team is spending $50m+ for a team with no shot. Because the bullpen is total crap.

 

 

Opening Day payroll was just a tad under $47.5 mil. With the way season ticket sales have been going, I fully expect payroll to rise to above $55 mil next season, despite what all the "experts" will be saying when Oct/Nov rolls around. With all but a couple of position players gone next season that leaves $$$ to spend on pitching.

 

The pen has been a let down this year. But so has the offensive and defensive play of a number of our players. Our SPs could go deeper and our pen would look alot better if we weren't giving teams 4 or 5 outs an inning. Not to mention having a hitting coach for the past few seasons that thought it a good idea to consistently lead MLB in K's.

 

Read comments from Beinfest and the FO on how they are going about building a team going into the new pond, including 2011. There's really not much reading between the lines required.

 

If the Marlins keep Uggla, Nunez, Anibal, Nolasco and Paulino, the budget for the rest of the bullpen next year will be the same old $4 which means Hensley (Arb 1) and six minimum salaries.

[rgkeller]

The bottom line is that the Marlins will always be one of the cheapest teams in baseball and we will always see this mediocrity. I'm sure next year there will be some major changes or maybe just minor but honestly, I don't expect much changes in the end. Maybe some day in the future, but not right now. I'm looking forward to seeing what happens with the new stadium, to see if this actually has any real effect on the team, but I doubt it. So I'm going to continue rooting for the underdogs as I've always have. I'm going to keep supporting the Marlins and watching the games. And most likely, keep developing an ulcer because of it. I rather not expect too much out of them because, let's face it, our division is pretty tough. By not expecting too much, I hope that I can be surprised as I was in 2003 and in 1997.

 

As of last night, the marlins did something we had hoped they'd do..score runs. They came back from a big hole and tied it. Unfortunately, we lost in the end (let's face it we aren't great at close/tied games) but that could've happened to any team really. That's one of the advantages of being the home team. So unfortunately, after all the walkoffs the Marlins were apart last week, we were at the brunt of one last night. It happens. Sanabia looked awful, yes but he has been pretty good his last few starts...overall, it was a tough loss but I've seen worse losses. How about getting beat 10-0 for example? At least we tried and came very close to winning.

 

In any case, I don't expect much from the Marlins' FO. I just hope next year's a better year. We have Stanton and Logan now and hopefully this will make us a bit better in the coming years. Stanton needs to stop striking out so much, I'm really hoping he will eventually adjust and get better. Logan looked good last night and that's a good indication of what's to come. And Donnie Murphy still continues to surprise me. Coming off the bench (let's face it, pinch hitting and being a bench-player is tough especially for a rookie) and able to contribute like he has done so far is pretty good. Now if Hanley can get out of his slump already...we will be a much better team! 2011 will be interesting.

 

 

Murphy is no rookie.

 

He is cheap for one more year.

[bobbob1313]

I bet Sirspud buys all of the ticket stubs from games the Marlins lose and puts them in a giant pool and swims around in them like Scrooge McDuck. Has the guy ever said anything positive about this team or franchise?

[MiamiLifer247]

The FO always seem to "roll the dice" when putting together the bullpen over the winter and into ST by signing guys coming off major surgeries & other teams scraps that clear waivers...

 

last couple of years the FO has gotten lucky, this year is almost a total bust (excluding Clay/Leo)... it's like their drinking out of Pinto's old watter bottle and caught whatever he had!

 

can't wait for them to get back in town, I'll be in the batters box section again for the philies series!

[mystikol87]

So can someone explain to me why two players with previous MLB starting experience (Sean West and RVH) were left to rot while we threw some kid in the fire when we're still in contention? Also, why was Nate Robertson allowed to stick with the team longer than Volstad? Volstad's numbers were better than Nate's.

 

 

West missed some time with injuries. And RVH has a 4.68 ERA in AAA, and that includes a tremendous outing last night. He hasn't been very consistent.

 

 

And when Sanabia was severely outperforming his WHIP the last couple of weeks, I didn't hear anyone complaining. Now all of a sudden the soothsayers are out? Give me a break.

[rgkeller]

So can someone explain to me why two players with previous MLB starting experience (Sean West and RVH) were left to rot while we threw some kid in the fire when we're still in contention? Also, why was Nate Robertson allowed to stick with the team longer than Volstad? Volstad's numbers were better than Nate's.

 

 

West missed some time with injuries. And RVH has a 4.68 ERA in AAA, and that includes a tremendous outing last night. He hasn't been very consistent.

 

 

And when Sanabia was severely outperforming his WHIP the last couple of weeks, I didn't hear anyone complaining. Now all of a sudden the soothsayers are out? Give me a break.

 

RVHf is not going to be an effective starter in the bigs.

 

Marlins need to try him as a reliever and let him gin up that fastball without the pacing worries of a starter.

 

If he cannot be a reliever, then release him.

[HitDaCycle]

The bottom line is that the Marlins will always be one of the cheapest teams in baseball and we will always see this mediocrity. I'm sure next year there will be some major changes or maybe just minor but honestly, I don't expect much changes in the end. Maybe some day in the future, but not right now. I'm looking forward to seeing what happens with the new stadium, to see if this actually has any real effect on the team, but I doubt it. So I'm going to continue rooting for the underdogs as I've always have. I'm going to keep supporting the Marlins and watching the games. And most likely, keep developing an ulcer because of it. I rather not expect too much out of them because, let's face it, our division is pretty tough. By not expecting too much, I hope that I can be surprised as I was in 2003 and in 1997.

 

As of last night, the marlins did something we had hoped they'd do..score runs. They came back from a big hole and tied it. Unfortunately, we lost in the end (let's face it we aren't great at close/tied games) but that could've happened to any team really. That's one of the advantages of being the home team. So unfortunately, after all the walkoffs the Marlins were apart last week, we were at the brunt of one last night. It happens. Sanabia looked awful, yes but he has been pretty good his last few starts...overall, it was a tough loss but I've seen worse losses. How about getting beat 10-0 for example? At least we tried and came very close to winning.

 

In any case, I don't expect much from the Marlins' FO. I just hope next year's a better year. We have Stanton and Logan now and hopefully this will make us a bit better in the coming years. Stanton needs to stop striking out so much, I'm really hoping he will eventually adjust and get better. Logan looked good last night and that's a good indication of what's to come. And Donnie Murphy still continues to surprise me. Coming off the bench (let's face it, pinch hitting and being a bench-player is tough especially for a rookie) and able to contribute like he has done so far is pretty good. Now if Hanley can get out of his slump already...we will be a much better team! 2011 will be interesting.

 

 

Murphy is no rookie.

 

He is cheap for one more year.

 

Oh, my bad. Well, at least he's a cheap bench player that can hit heh. Still much of an improvement than earlier on this season.

[Sirspud]

Donnie Murphy will be arbitration-eligible at some point, but unless he's racking up big numbers starting its not like he is going to cost millions. He'll get more expensive, but bench players don't break the bank in arbitration.

[Erick]

The Marlins bullpen stayed this year, for the most part.

 

Badenhop and Meyer had success last year, and those guys sucked this year. What can you do about that? How do you predict that? I don't recall anyone in the offseason saying "sh*t, I'm really worried about Meyer this year in middle relief. He's going to be absolutely horrible." Or..."Badenhop isn't fit to be our long reliever." Even Pinto who had been a part of our pen ended up DFA'd. Jose Veras whom they signed in the offseason showed flashes in a stretch of games this year after coming back up from the minors of what the front office probably expected from him.

 

Bullpens are often unpredictable.

 

Seriously, those guys I previously mentioned...no one expected them to be as bad as they've been.

 

 

Dan Meyer was the only guy returning who we could count on (besides Nunez). Seriously, Badenhop started sucking when thrown into a setup role. He had been fine in long relief. Brian Sanches has faltered as well in a setup role. Pinto always sucked. Veras didn't exactly have a track record of success. The only guy who should have been good was Dan Meyer. That the failure of one guy should topple our entire bullpen early in the season shows just how poor its constitution was.

 

Fact of the matter is, Meyer was the only guy in our bullpen who could be expected to setup. That's why most of us were crying foul the moment this team set foot on the field this year. Bullpens are certainly unpredictable, but when a bullpen is composed nearly entirely of guys who have no track record of late-inning success (minus Meyer & Nunez) its not hard to predict its failure.

 

 

Badenhop wasn't expected to suck as he has. He was a quality long reliever/middle reliever last year.

 

You make way too much out of bullpen roles, as well. You're one of those guys who thinks Leo Nunez doesn't have the mentality to close, even though that whole argument is proven wrong time and time again with several guys (including Leo Nunez this year).

 

Clay Hensley's been our setup guy, and no one expected that from him before the year.

 

You're either a good reliever or you're not a good reliever. You continually bring up the roles way too often. The only time roles matter significantly is for a guy like Taylor Tankersley, who is a LOOGY and only a LOOGY.

 

At the end of the day, if Meyer & Badenhop had performed as expected, we'd have, at least, an average bullpen right now. If not above average. No one could have predicted those two would've sucked this badly. I expected a regression from Meyer, but nowhere near this horrible.

[Sirspud]

So you're saying that we've seen guys like Badenhop have disappointing seasons, yet saying that you're either a good reliever or not and Badenhop should have been good this year and wasn't for some random reason. That random reason was that he was asked to be in a different role than before.

 

Why is it that Bonifacio looks good in spot starts but sucks royally as a full-time starter? You're either a good hitter or you're not.

[Erick]

So you're saying that we've seen guys like Badenhop have disappointing seasons, yet saying that you're either a good reliever or not and Badenhop should have been good this year and wasn't for some random reason. That random reason was that he was asked to be in a different role than before.

 

Why is it that Bonifacio looks good in spot starts but sucks royally as a full-time starter? You're either a good hitter or you're not.

 

 

 

Badenhop was not expected to be the team's setup guy this year. I don't know what you are talking about. He's just struggled this year, but I'd bet Badenhop will probably be just fine in a middle relief role next year. #'s suggest that he's been a bit unlucky this year, and he's also getting even more groundballs this year, believe it or not.

 

For what it's worth, Badenhop was very successful at the beginning of the year before hitting a wall. Most were happy to see him in the 8th inning back in April when he was one of the few relievers getting outs, consistently.

 

As for Bonifacio...that's not surprising. It has nothing to do with roles. It has to do with luck. He looks a bit better now because the sample size is still small. As the sample size increases, he'll show what he's truly worth. What he's truly worth is a lot of nothing.

 

Also, Bonifacio hasn't even looked good this year. He looks like the same guy to me. Don't let the .286 batting average in a whopping 42 at bats fool you. He still has a horrible .286 .OBP (no walks!). He hasn't been good. Maybe he's been good by Bonifacio standards, but that says a whole lot of nothing.

[bobbob1313]

I bet Sirspud buys all of the ticket stubs from games the Marlins lose and puts them in a giant pool and swims around in them like Scrooge McDuck.

 

 

This post was hysterical, why isn't everyone stopping what they are talking about to recognize how great I am?

 

It's gold, Jerry. gold!

[MrMarlinPride]

I bet Sirspud buys all of the ticket stubs from games the Marlins lose and puts them in a giant pool and swims around in them like Scrooge McDuck.

 

 

This post was hysterical, why isn't everyone stopping what they are talking about to recognize how great I am?

 

It's gold, Jerry. gold!

 

So funny :whistle

[Sirspud]

I bet Sirspud buys all of the ticket stubs from games the Marlins lose and puts them in a giant pool and swims around in them like Scrooge McDuck.

 

 

This post was hysterical, why isn't everyone stopping what they are talking about to recognize how great I am?

 

It's gold, Jerry. gold!

 

It's because you've got it all wrong. I hate swimming.

[Entendu]

I bet Sirspud buys all of the ticket stubs from games the Marlins lose and puts them in a giant pool and swims around in them like Scrooge McDuck.

 

 

This post was hysterical, why isn't everyone stopping what they are talking about to recognize how great I am?

 

It's gold, Jerry. gold!

 

 

:o

[fanofthefish]

Boy after reading all these posts in this thread I feel like Andy from Shawshank escaping prison :thumbup

There are points being made on both sides of the argument on the alleged failure by the FO, what I see is, this as is the usual the best team Loria could afford to put out there on the field.

I do question some off the decisions made by the FO, but compared to other teams with similar revenue and fan base I think the Marlins do a way better job than most teams.