On 10/19/2023 at 10:00 PM, UpperDeckFishTank said:

"Word is all of Manager of the Year candidate Skip Schumaker, the coaching staff and players are upset"

https://nypost.com/2023/10/19/marlins-inexplicable-kim-ng-decision-left-team-in-shambles/

I just read this article now, four days late, and boy it sure reads differently now. Heyman should take this crap down. 

On 10/20/2023 at 8:42 PM, UpperDeckFishTank said:

To know Sherman had this in mind I dont know how he could celebrate with Kim and Skip in Pittsburgh when they clinched. I dont know how can join the party that night, then stab them in the back. I watched every game this year either live or on bally app replay and I dont imagine watching nearly as much next year. I was excited about this year but I have not much feelings anymore for the team. I feel whenever something good begins to happen here the rich greedy fucks will just fuck it up so they can buy some new mansions and yachts. I remember everyone hating Loria when he was here and would do anything to get a new owner but now everyone will realize it will only get worse.

Sorry but this entire post is ridiculous.

First of all, it's not "backstabbing"; it's business. Sherman and Ng aren't friends; he was her employer and she was his employee. If the two sides can't come to an agreement and choose to part ways, it's a business decision; not "backstabbing." This happens in the business world all the time, and whether we like it or not, baseball is a business.

Additionally, already saying you don't plan on watching the team next season and that you don't have feelings for the team anymore when this year's playoffs haven't even ended yet is silly. How do you know the Marlins aren't going to hire a GM that ends up being far better than Kim? How do you know Sherman doesn't actually have a better plan in view? We already saw the report that Sherman wanted someone else to oversee scouting, which is entirely understandable and demonstrates that he does, in fact, want to improve the team.

Sticking with the team through all of the firesales they've had and then bolting just because they let Kim Ng walk is just weird. You're entitled to your opinion of course, but it just doesn't make much sense to me.

Edited October 23, 20232 yr by Valid

Larry Beinfest our beloved championship GM traded Miggy maybe wouldve been the 1st Marlins in the Hall of Fame for a bunch of shitty prospects, only Andrew Miller was worth anything and that was some 10 years after he left the Marlins. There was no backlash for this 'scouting' issue then. He got Urbina for Adrian Gonzalez. I think if Kim made those trades people would have the pitchforks burning her at the stake.

I don't think they will find a better GM. Every GM has flaws, every team has flaws, every player has flaws. If every successful person was let go or low balled because of their flaws, then we would have no team. As Skip said in the last press conference, he is a work in progress. Skip is still improving, and Kim Ng as team operations and GM was still improving. I do understand baseball is a business but in business there is also relationships, trust, and chemistry and I think we had that at the highest degree with Skip and Kim. Of course they can both improve, but why is it ok to just let anyone go cuz of their flaws. Yes our drafts suck but our scouting has been good. I dont think u can say scouting whiffed on Eury. Cabrera as well. I dont think u can say we whiffed on scouting Luzardo who was ditched by the As. The Marlins SCOUTING saw something in him and it WORKED. So to say the scouting has been abysmal isn't the whole story.

1 hour ago, UpperDeckFishTank said:

Larry Beinfest our beloved championship GM traded Miggy maybe wouldve been the 1st Marlins in the Hall of Fame for a bunch of shitty prospects, only Andrew Miller was worth anything and that was some 10 years after he left the Marlins. There was no backlash for this 'scouting' issue then. He got Urbina for Adrian Gonzalez. I think if Kim made those trades people would have the pitchforks burning her at the stake.

Easy to be a GM with hindsight.

At the time, Miller and Maybin were I believe the top 2 prospects in Detroit's system. I am sure Beinfest didn't want to trade Cabrera, but ownership forced him. He got a somewhat decent return on paper when it happened. It of course didn't pan out though.

As for the Urbina trade, they don't make the playoffs or therefore win the WS without Urbina so that trade was an automatic W.

BTW there were "Fire Beinfest" threads in his time, we also had "Fire Hill" threads. 

26 minutes ago, Admin said:

Easy to be a GM with hindsight.

At the time, Miller and Maybin were I believe the top 2 prospects in Detroit's system. I am sure Beinfest didn't want to trade Cabrera, but ownership forced him. He got a decent return on paper when it happened. It of course didn't pan out though.

As for the Urbina trade, they don't make the playoffs or therefore win the WS without Urbina so that trade was an automatic W.

I find it interesting how every flaw Kim had gets magnified 10000x and with other GMs its always 'its the owners fault'.

2 hours ago, UpperDeckFishTank said:

I find it interesting how every flaw Kim had gets magnified 10000x and with other GMs its always 'its the owners fault'.

I find it interesting that every flaw Kim has gets brushed aside and with other GMs its always their fault.

 

2 hours ago, UpperDeckFishTank said:

I find it interesting how every flaw Kim had gets magnified 10000x and with other GMs its always 'its the owners fault'.

There were fire beinfest and fire hill discussions during their times. Easy to find if you care to look. 

2 hours ago, Admin said:

There were fire beinfest and fire hill discussions during their times. Easy to find if you care to look. 

It really was bizarre that so many people consistently just said it was never her fault (unending clock jokes) but would folks would rip on Hill (or even Beinfest to go back further) when we still had shitty owners. 

I kinda like that Bruce seems engaged in wanting to better a very troubling area over the past few years. I would have liked to have seen Kim back for one more season to see if she could improve in her weak spots but if Bruce makes good hires I don't forsee this as being anything but a good thing long term.

 

One very under appreciated thing about Kim - when I was at that rained out muts games, Kim was on the field, in the dugout, on the phone, running around the stadium (I literally ran into her in one of the club areas) and all around really hustling. To me that seemed pretty unique behavior for a GM?

2 minutes ago, pollythewog said:

One very under appreciated thing about Kim - when I was at that rained out muts games, Kim was on the field, in the dugout, on the phone, running around the stadium (I literally ran into her in one of the club areas) and all around really hustling. To me that seemed pretty unique behavior for a GM?

Yeah I noticed that also in pics/videos from the game. I don't know how typical that is.

10 hours ago, UpperDeckFishTank said:

Larry Beinfest our beloved championship GM traded Miggy maybe wouldve been the 1st Marlins in the Hall of Fame for a bunch of shitty prospects, only Andrew Miller was worth anything and that was some 10 years after he left the Marlins. There was no backlash for this 'scouting' issue then. He got Urbina for Adrian Gonzalez. I think if Kim made those trades people would have the pitchforks burning her at the stake.

I don't think they will find a better GM. Every GM has flaws, every team has flaws, every player has flaws. If every successful person was let go or low balled because of their flaws, then we would have no team. As Skip said in the last press conference, he is a work in progress. Skip is still improving, and Kim Ng as team operations and GM was still improving. I do understand baseball is a business but in business there is also relationships, trust, and chemistry and I think we had that at the highest degree with Skip and Kim. Of course they can both improve, but why is it ok to just let anyone go cuz of their flaws. Yes our drafts suck but our scouting has been good. I dont think u can say scouting whiffed on Eury. Cabrera as well. I dont think u can say we whiffed on scouting Luzardo who was ditched by the As. The Marlins SCOUTING saw something in him and it WORKED. So to say the scouting has been abysmal isn't the whole story.

8 hours ago, UpperDeckFishTank said:

I find it interesting how every flaw Kim had gets magnified 10000x and with other GMs its always 'its the owners fault'.

 

I really don't understand what you're getting at here....

 

1) different ownership groups - comparing what GMs under Loria dealt with vs. Sherman is dumb.  Loria knowingly meddled in decisions/made his own trades.

2) Beinfest hasn't had a job in MLB after leaving the Marlins -

3) I'm pretty sure people were upset with the Cabrera trade at the time - just like the Yelich trade - and with the gift of hindsight everyone panned the outcome of the Cabrera and Yelich trades.  That doesn't change that they were thought of as a "good" trades at the time on paper

4) I find it interesting how your defense of her ignores her faults.

Edited October 24, 20232 yr by rmc523

16 hours ago, UpperDeckFishTank said:

our scouting has been good. 

21 hours ago, pollythewog said:

One very under appreciated thing about Kim - when I was at that rained out muts games, Kim was on the field, in the dugout, on the phone, running around the stadium (I literally ran into her in one of the club areas) and all around really hustling. To me that seemed pretty unique behavior for a GM?

I'm sure other GMs have gotten lost before.

3 hours ago, hovertical said:

I'm sure other GMs have gotten lost before.

Yes, but have they literally ran into @pollythewog, too?

9 minutes ago, mystikol87 said:

Yes, but have they literally ran into @pollythewog, too?

He was stalking her. "ran into". He had his bliNgbliNg shirt on and wanted her to see it

1 hour ago, mystikol87 said:

Yes, but have they literally ran into @pollythewog, too?

No. Because the other GMs are smarter. 

On 10/24/2023 at 7:54 AM, Admin said:

There were fire beinfest and fire hill discussions during their times. Easy to find if you care to look. 

Have we had any Fire Admin threads?

2 hours ago, Michael said:

Have we had any Fire Admin threads?

And then @SonOfJack can take his rightful place as Admin of this site.

Meh -- Not really concerned honestly. She left massive holes that were easily fixable time and time again. Did have a good trade deadline by taking advantage of the stupid White Sox though, I'll give her that. 

On 10/24/2023 at 10:49 AM, pollythewog said:

One very under appreciated thing about Kim - when I was at that rained out muts games, Kim was on the field, in the dugout, on the phone, running around the stadium (I literally ran into her in one of the club areas) and all around really hustling. To me that seemed pretty unique behavior for a GM?

She may have been looking for the bathroom.

But this actually reminds me of the time Jeter was not at the winter meetings even though he was not the GM and people made a big stink about Jeter not being there as if he was supposed to be there.

Seems nothing is naturally to this team, we think it's naturally to retain Ng after a good season but not happen, we think it’s naturally to expect a good 2024 season after a playoffs berth 2023 season but it's uncertain now. 

44 minutes ago, TaiwanMarlins said:

Seems nothing is naturally to this team, we think it's naturally to retain Ng after a good season but not happen, we think it’s naturally to expect a good 2024 season after a playoffs berth 2023 season but it's uncertain now. 

I'd argue it was already uncertain with losing Sandy, potentially Soler and Bell, and the other holes we've already had on top of those issues.

On 10/26/2023 at 12:21 PM, rmc523 said:

I'd argue it was already uncertain with losing Sandy, potentially Soler and Bell, and the other holes we've already had on top of those issues.

Soler and Bell are both incredibly flawed and streaky players.. I think Bell will be back and Soler will be gone.

 

Arraez, Burger, Jazz... that's about all you have going for you on offense. They have a lot of work to do. They desperately need a middle of the order big time bat (or three)

3 hours ago, Iowa said:

Soler and Bell are both incredibly flawed and streaky players.. I think Bell will be back and Soler will be gone.

 

Arraez, Burger, Jazz... that's about all you have going for you on offense. They have a lot of work to do. They desperately need a middle of the order big time bat (or three)

Of which there really aren't any in this years FA class (aside the obvious one which ain't happening).

I agree Bell will be back and Soler will not. 

Need to figure out the front office ASAP though - well before the winter meetings for sure as upgrades will likely come through trades. I wish a GM would be bold and sign someone like say Soler and then immediately trade him for someone who would be more consistent (guy on another team who was also bidding on Soler's services) and just retain part of the salary they just agreed to pay him as part of the trade. Kinda like a hybrid FA process to get the guy you'd really want.

15 hours ago, hovertical said:

Of which there really aren't any in this years FA class (aside the obvious one which ain't happening).

I agree Bell will be back and Soler will not. 

Need to figure out the front office ASAP though - well before the winter meetings for sure as upgrades will likely come through trades. I wish a GM would be bold and sign someone like say Soler and then immediately trade him for someone who would be more consistent (guy on another team who was also bidding on Soler's services) and just retain part of the salary they just agreed to pay him as part of the trade. Kinda like a hybrid FA process to get the guy you'd really want.

If only we'd have had some foresight and signed one of the plethora of big bats last season.... lol