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2021 Trade Deadline Thread


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4 hours ago, Vic D said:

Yeah just feel like some are really jumping the gun with this starting pitching "depth". Hardly any of it is proven. Trying to trade Pablo or Sandy? Like what? Why?

Gonna have to eventually 

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I'd be in for trading Aguilar or Cooper, if anyone is willing to give us anything for Brinson please do it

Can see some bullpen arms being traded-Garcia, Floro or Curtiss

Duvall should be able to get a decent return and I'd throw in Panik in a deal if it can bring back a bigger return 

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This team has proven it can actually develop starting pitching which is why I'm OK with - and hell, I'm even advocating for - the idea of trading Pablo. I've been saying it since last offseason began, even. And his value has only increased this year.

We don't have much depth in the middle infield or third base (or catcher) which is why I suggested trading him for a good shortstop or third baseman who is close. On that side of the infield, only Dunand or Brigman are close. And they're allergic to the idea of bringing up Brigman for some reason, but maybe (hopefully) after the deadline. ... maybe.

We really need some bats and we're eventually going to have to trade from some of this pitching. That includes trading away at least one established guy. Pablo isn't going to help us anymore this year. He might not even help us next year at the rate this offense is going. So may as well get something good for him while his value is at its highest.

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14 minutes ago, Michael said:

This team has proven it can actually develop starting pitching which is why I'm OK with - and hell, I'm even advocating for - the idea of trading Pablo. I've been saying it since last offseason began, even. And his value has only increased this year.

We don't have much depth in the middle infield or third base (or catcher) which is why I suggested trading him for a good shortstop or third baseman who is close. On that side of the infield, only Dunand or Brigman are close. And they're allergic to the idea of bringing up Brigman for some reason, but maybe (hopefully) after the deadline. ... maybe.

We really need some bats and we're eventually going to have to trade from some of this pitching. That includes trading away at least one established guy. Pablo isn't going to help us anymore this year. He might not even help us next year at the rate this offense is going. So may as well get something good for him while his value is at its highest.

Yep. If they can get some serious MLB ready help in the lineup for Pablo I'm all for it too. His value has never been higher and I do not trust this team to spend and bring in a high priced FA to plug in so yeah you trade from strength which is starting pitching. As you said, they've proven to be able to develop starting pitching so make that move if you have to. They aren't going to get any lineup help trading anything else from this team aside from some fringe prospects maybe or a future bp arm.

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12 hours ago, hovertical said:

I kinda don't trust Sixto ever amounting to much of anything after watching him get hit hard for most of the 2nd half of his season last year and when you combine that with his seemingly endless injuries and/or poor conditioning issues. 

I mean he's 23 with electric stuff and only threw 39 innings last year (and was, for the most part, really solid). Isn't it a little too early to say we don't trust him?

As for all of the "trade Pablo" talk, do you people realize how rare it is to have this type of starting pitching? All we need is a semi-competent offense and we'll be in legitimate contention for years to come. People said his value had never been higher last year either, and look what happened: it has only increased. Maybe the dude is just really freaking good and we shouldn't trade him for a prospect?

Only way I'm even considering moving Pablo is if we get a proven major-league bat in return. Otherwise, hell no.

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4 minutes ago, Valid said:

As for all of the "trade Pablo" talk, do you people realize how rare it is to have this type of starting pitching? All we need is a semi-competent offense and we'll be in legitimate contention for years to come. People said his value had never been higher last year either, and look what happened: it has only increased. Maybe the dude is just really freaking good and we shouldn't trade him for a prospect?

That's fine and completely reasonable.

The problem is - where is the competent offense? This team doesn't seem to want to spend (see the Marte extension talks ...) and the hitting development has been absolutely awful. It's amazing how we went from "two pitchers away" (lol) to "we have too many pitchers and no bats."

Really hope I'm proven wrong on the "not wanting to spend" bit over the next eight months because I do not want to go into 2022 with a lesser offense (since Marte won't be here and we can't entirely trust the prospects).

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There should only be 4 players on the active roster that are unavailable: Jazz, Sandy, Pablo, and Rogers. Blows my mind how many people here continue to think we should hold on to the likes of Cooper/Aguilar/Anderson like they're keystone building blocks. Outside of Jazz and Marte, this offense has been cobbled together with guys who would be hitting in the bottom half of the lineup or coming off the bench for most other teams. Continuing to hold onto these below average 30-year-olds, and expecting them to become more than what we've seen the past 2-3 years is idiotic. If we can get anything of value, ship them off. The realistic window for contention is 3 years from now. 

 

 

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1 hour ago, sgleason02 said:

There should only be 4 players on the active roster that are unavailable: Jazz, Sandy, Pablo, and Rogers. Blows my mind how many people here continue to think we should hold on to the likes of Cooper/Aguilar/Anderson like they're keystone building blocks. Outside of Jazz and Marte, this offense has been cobbled together with guys who would be hitting in the bottom half of the lineup or coming off the bench for most other teams. Continuing to hold onto these below average 30-year-olds, and expecting them to become more than what we've seen the past 2-3 years is idiotic. If we can get anything of value, ship them off. The realistic window for contention is 3 years from now. 

 

 

Cooper and Aguilar are both OPSing over .800 and are on pace for a 2+ WAR seasons. You don't get rid of those guys when you have them under control for multiple seasons. They're not superstars, but if everyone hit like them this team would be in first. I don't think this team needs to do much else than sign a few players and wait for some of the better position player prospects to come up.

If the pitching staff gets crowded, then you trade an SP for an equivalent position player.

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21 minutes ago, Entendu said:

Cooper and Aguilar are both OPSing over .800 and are on pace for a 2+ WAR seasons. You don't get rid of those guys when you have them under control for multiple seasons. They're not superstars, but if everyone hit like them this team would be in first. I don't think this team needs to do much else than sign a few players and wait for some of the better position player prospects to come up.

If the pitching staff gets crowded, then you trade an SP for an equivalent position player.

I agree with everything you’re saying although with Pablo, he’s reached his max value and his numbers aren’t sustainable.  I’m also a bit concerned for him when the new mound rules take effect next year. 

The difference between Sandy and Pablo is that Sandy can sustain a 3.00 ERA with slumps because he has better stuff.  Pablo is a pitcher’s pitcher if he slumps or they figure it out, he will be a middle rotation piece.  That’s not bad, but he has ace value right now with a surplus of pitchers who will be ready next year.

This could be a bit of a reach, but Pablo as a pitcher is like Cooper as a hitter.  If Coop didn’t slump the first 2 months he would have All Star numbers that would look as impressive as Pablo’s.  Cooper would be our Mike Trout (a bad example). That’s how we are viewing Pablo right now, when he’s somewhere in the middle.  

 

 

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2 hours ago, Entendu said:

Cooper and Aguilar are both OPSing over .800 and are on pace for a 2+ WAR seasons. You don't get rid of those guys when you have them under control for multiple seasons. They're not superstars, but if everyone hit like them this team would be in first. I don't think this team needs to do much else than sign a few players and wait for some of the better position player prospects to come up.

If the pitching staff gets crowded, then you trade an SP for an equivalent position player.

This is exactly what I’m talking about. Both have EXTREME home/away splits, and both are below average defensively. Yet here we are, forcing two guys that should be platooning with one another, into full time roles. And not only that, we’re trying to cherry pick stats to make them look like a better ball player than they are. Take into consideration that they’re blocking two of the more MLB-ready prospects in the organization, and it’s obvious that they both should be traded.

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3 hours ago, sgleason02 said:

There should only be 4 players on the active roster that are unavailable: Jazz, Sandy, Pablo, and Rogers. Blows my mind how many people here continue to think we should hold on to the likes of Cooper/Aguilar/Anderson like they're keystone building blocks. Outside of Jazz and Marte, this offense has been cobbled together with guys who would be hitting in the bottom half of the lineup or coming off the bench for most other teams. Continuing to hold onto these below average 30-year-olds, and expecting them to become more than what we've seen the past 2-3 years is idiotic. If we can get anything of value, ship them off. The realistic window for contention is 3 years from now. 

 

 

I’m curious why you included Anderson. No ones beating down the door on 3rd base and I wouldn’t necessarily consider him below average especially over the last few

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45 minutes ago, AeroFishOne said:

I’m curious why you included Anderson. No ones beating down the door on 3rd base and I wouldn’t necessarily consider him below average especially over the last few

Just feel like the general consensus around here is that he’s the best all around hitter on the team. He doesn’t have enough speed to hit lead off. He doesn’t have enough contact to hit 2nd or 3rd on most teams. Not enough power to hit cleanup, so I think most teams would view him more as their #5/#6 hitter in their lineup. His defense is far from elite. And while I realize you can’t have a superstar at every position, I just don’t view him as the franchise building block that many people make him out to be. I think he’s a good baseball player, but that he’s closer to average than superstar.
 

 

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2 minutes ago, sgleason02 said:

Just feel like the general consensus around here is that he’s the best all around hitter on the team. He doesn’t have enough speed to hit lead off. He doesn’t have enough contact to hit 2nd or 3rd on most teams. Not enough power to hit cleanup, so I think most teams would view him more as their #5/#6 hitter in their lineup. His defense is far from elite. And while I realize you can’t have a superstar at every position, I just don’t view him as the franchise building block that many people make him out to be. I think he’s a good baseball player, but that he’s closer to average than superstar.
 

 

Who in the hell is saying Anderson is the best all-around hitter on the team???

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2 hours ago, sgleason02 said:

This is exactly what I’m talking about. Both have EXTREME home/away splits, and both are below average defensively. Yet here we are, forcing two guys that should be platooning with one another, into full time roles. And not only that, we’re trying to cherry pick stats to make them look like a better ball player than they are. Take into consideration that they’re blocking two of the more MLB-ready prospects in the organization, and it’s obvious that they both should be traded.

How am I cherry picking when I referenced the two most all-encompassing stats with which to measure a position player? This is absurd.

Sanchez can play left field, where someone who should actually be traded plays, and who the hell is Aguilar blocking that is knocking down doors?

 

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2 hours ago, sgleason02 said:

Just feel like the general consensus around here is that he’s the best all around hitter on the team. He doesn’t have enough speed to hit lead off. He doesn’t have enough contact to hit 2nd or 3rd on most teams. Not enough power to hit cleanup, so I think most teams would view him more as their #5/#6 hitter in their lineup. His defense is far from elite. And while I realize you can’t have a superstar at every position, I just don’t view him as the franchise building block that many people make him out to be. I think he’s a good baseball player, but that he’s closer to average than superstar.
 

 

An average player at every position in our lineup would make this a first place team.

That would likely give us.... Average run production... With very good pitching. Then we can either buy a superstar position player or wait until the farm produces one

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32 minutes ago, el_gmac said:

Trade Pablo to the Giants for Joey Bart

We would be getting fleeced there. Bart isn't looking like he's going to be super special yet, and you're talking about trading a controlled, effective SP.

Considering the injury issues some guys like Edward Cabrera and now Sixto have been dealing with, I would think the Marlins would be extremely reluctant to trade any of their younger guys right now.

I don't really have an issue trading guys like Aguilar, Cooper, etc. who are not going to be long-term solutions and could potentially provide a return now. Obviously this team is not going anywhere yet.

I do think they need to prioritize younger hitters if they start to trade some of these veterans, as the farm is kind of low on hitters, and the top hitting prospects in the farm aren't really wowing anyone yet this year.

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